 WiFiIt's In The Air
join:2002-06-06
NiagaraFalls
 ·ikTel Networks
 ·Vonage
 ·Cogeco Cable
| Why did Canadians pay more for the same service? I've had Vonage for 18 months and like it a lot. I had my parents switch and the only issues we had with them were that someone at Vonage changed their 911 address without double checking accuracy, fortunately I have access to administer my parents' account and I found the error and Vonage customer service had it fixed in 24hours, that's too long but at least it was fixed.
My complaint is the high pricing in Canada. We have the same two packages as the US but they charge us more. That was OK when the US dollar was worth 40% more than the Canadian two years ago but everything swung the other way well over one year ago and our dollar was stronger. Only a few months ago did our dollar go back the other way and even today the exchange is only about 10%. We STILL pay 33% more than Americans. We don't get any more service for it and because it is VOIP, it is not subject to crazy hidden communications taxes that all other broadcasters/telcos have to pay to send/receive any form of communication in and/or out of Canada.
So, Vonage, if you want to minimize churn in Canada, try adjusting your rates for Canadians so we pay the same as US customers AND it would be nice if you credited us for the many months we overpaid.
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| Canada Taxes? Local Taxes? That is my thought anyway.
I think it is in part the telcos that is helping to kill them. They complained about the VOIP not paying taxes and now we have to pay taxes over Internet lines that are already taxed. Double taxed!
said by WiFi:My complaint is the high pricing in Canada. We have the same two packages as the US but they charge us more. That was OK when the US dollar was worth 40% more than the Canadian two years ago but everything swung the other way well over one year ago and our dollar was stronger. Only a few months ago did our dollar go back the other way and even today the exchange is only about 10%. We STILL pay 33% more than Americans. We don't get any more service for it and because it is VOIP, it is not subject to crazy hidden communications taxes that all other broadcasters/telcos have to pay to send/receive any form of communication in and/or out of Canada. So, Vonage, if you want to minimize churn in Canada, try adjusting your rates for Canadians so we pay the same as US customers AND it would be nice if you credited us for the many months we overpaid. |
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nitzanPremium,VIP
join:2008-02-27
kudos:2 | reply to WiFi
To their defense - our experience has been that it costs more to provide service to Canadian customers. We do it at the same price precisely to avoid the feelings you describe, but that means we're walking a very fine line where a Canadian customer may result in a net loss if they use their service extensively. I can't blame Vonage for trying to avoid this.
(don't get me wrong, I think Vonage prices are way, way overpriced - but that's a different story)
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Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation |
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WiFiIt's In The Air
join:2002-06-06
NiagaraFalls Reviews:
·ikTel Networks
·Vonage
·Cogeco Cable
| reply to kieranmullen
Nope. We are taxed but AFTER the monthly rate. Vonage does not fall under the regulations of our CRTC and therefore they are not assessed the exhorbitent hidden telecom taxes that the telcos and other comm companies have to pay. The government would LOVE to have Vonage and other non-traditional telecoms (ie VOIP) fall under the regulation and taxes however to do this would automatically set a precendent that the Internet needs to be taxed. The Federal Government won't touch that hot potato. They already tried once and within two weeks the public outcry put that issue to rest.
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Type slowwwwwwer.....I can't keep up! |
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WiFiIt's In The Air
join:2002-06-06
NiagaraFalls Reviews:
·ikTel Networks
·Vonage
·Cogeco Cable
| reply to nitzan
said by nitzan:To their defense - our experience has been that it costs more to provide service to Canadian customers. HOW does it cost more for Vonage to do this when most of their infrastructure is in the US and the ability to provide a TCP/IP based service without hidden taxes? Canada is a CASH COW for Vonage. All I'm saying is that it was OK when the US dollar was worth 30-40% more than the Canadian dollar but that all went the other way about a year ago and here we are still paying 33% more. I understand paying the EQUIVALENT US rate, but for the last year our dollar has been comparatively strong and we're getting ripped off.
We do it at the same price precisely to avoid the feelings you describe, but that means we're walking a very fine line where a Canadian customer may result in a net loss if they use their service extensively.
This argument does not wash. Here's a stat for you. The population of New York City is bigger than the population of Canada. Canadians, even though they are tech savvy, have not taken to VOIP that well. Those that do use it are mostly those that have been sucked in by the cable companies' VOIP services that these firms do not refer to as VOIP, they use some other term like, "digital phone". It confuses the customer. Canadian Vonage customers are very much in the minority. SO, even IF ALL Vonage customers got on the phone at the same time and talked for 10 minutes, I don't think it would even register on Vonage's traffic meter.
(don't get me wrong, I think Vonage prices are way, way overpriced
WHAT??? I pay a LOT less and get a LOT MORE than the telcos or cable companies offer here. My father VERY reluctantly moved to Vonage last year and his phone bill has come down a minumum of 50% not to mention all the extra value added features they never had and don't have to pay extra for.
Here's another stat for you to show you how outdated our over-regulated system here is. In Canada, all landline telcos ARE REQUIRED to charge EXTRA for TOUCH TONE SERVICE!!! This is a rule that came in as a result of the three Canadian telcos in the 60s asking for this to recover the cost of building out touch tone service. Two years ago, the telcos cancelled the service of any subscriber that still refused to use touch tone and our government told the telcos this was reasonable. And yet, if you are a customer of one of them, you STILL pay the mandatory monthly touch tone fee. And to make matters worse, the telcos now have permission to charge THEIR OWN CUSTOMERS a SYSTEM ACCESS FEE. We're not talking cell phones here either.
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nitzanPremium,VIP
join:2008-02-27
kudos:2 | HOW does it cost more for Vonage to do this I don't know about Vonage, but for us it costs almost twice to lease Canadian phone numbers than it does to lease US ones, and termination rates are are about 1.5 times higher.
The infrastructure cost is negligible. It's the access to the PSTN that is the main component of providing service, and in Canada it does cost more to do so - in my experience.
WHAT??? I pay a LOT less and get a LOT MORE than the telcos or cable companies offer here. I'm not comparing Vonage to a telco. I'm comparing Vonage to other VoIP providers. Vonage is probably the most expensive out of any of them.
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Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation |
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WiFiIt's In The Air
join:2002-06-06
NiagaraFalls Reviews:
·ikTel Networks
·Vonage
·Cogeco Cable
1 edit | said by nitzan:it costs almost twice to lease Canadian phone numbers than it does to lease US ones, and termination rates are are about 1.5 times higher. The infrastructure cost is negligible. It's the access to the PSTN that is the main component of providing service, and in Canada it does cost more to do so - in my experience. Ahhh! OK, didn't realized you were coming at it from a telecom buyer position. Yes, I will not disagree with you. You can thank our CRTC for this. This government agency is run by retired telco executives who look out for their old employers and their own pocketbooks (ie being shareholders of these companies) and the CRTC's position is to regulate the marketplace. They let the Big bells walk all over everyone such as a few years ago when competition first came to Canada. The Big Bells did all sorts of nasty things to slow down the competitors. Even today I understand that (yes you are correct) these telcos make it very expensive for competitors to co-locate switches, etc,... with their own. I'd really like to think that I will see the CRTC disbanded in my lifetime. It's one thing I like about the US Gov't, they are not big into controlling the marketplace.
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Type slowwwwwwer.....I can't keep up! |
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nitzanPremium,VIP
join:2008-02-27
kudos:2 | This government agency is run by retired telco executives who look out for their old employers and their own pocketbooks Sounds like a lot of government agencies.  (actually that really should be a  I guess...)
I don't know about the US though... I think it's in better shape than Canada right now - but the way things are going it might not remain that way for long. Network Neutrality (or lack thereof) and all...
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Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation |
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