moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 in Audio/Video Chat http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r21429942 en Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:49:53 EDT Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:49:53 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451912 pfschim : yes it is, and again, thanks for your help. Godo to have the tunes back and my new system working in all respects.

regards]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451912 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 13:14:15 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451666 royphil345 : Your speaker system is a 4 channel system that works by taking full-range audio signals and sending the lower frequencies to the sub via a built-in crossover. A true 4.1 system would have the sub wired directly to a low-frequency output on the source. The result is pretty much the same. Like I said, just don't use any "x.1" settings that send all your low frequencies to a low frequency jack you're not using in your hookup. Stick to the 4-channel or "surround sound" setting.

The jacks on sound cards are often not marked... and the functions of some of them can even change depending on software settings. You can access info for your card on the manufacturer's web site if you're not sure what's what.

You might also want to check the sound settings for Windows and make sure everything looks right. Seems like you got it working though... Nice work! Glad it's working out. :) ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451666 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:24:23 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21446966 pfschim : well, I eventually got this to work. But it was not as clear as I thought it would be.

1st - I pulled the Digital DIN connector, and then used a dual (pair) 1/8 cable to connect the front and rear jacks of the sub to two outputs on the X-Fi (not labeled front and rear BTW, just outs).

In this setting, I first got rear output, but no front.

So, I had to look at it again and realized I had to turn off the "digital only" check box in the creative software control panel.

After messing around with the Creative control panel some more I think I have it now. Can you repeat to me how I'm getting bass signal to the sub ? .. it does sound like its working, it's just not clear to me how. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21446966 Tue, 18 Nov 2008 14:42:24 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21442089 royphil345 : Great! Glad I could help. Should work fine. You might have to play with some settings...

Keep in mind you'll have to change settings for analog output instead of digital. You're going to want to choose a 4 channel or "surround sound" mode instead of a 4.1 mode because there's no direct connection between your sub and the low frequency output on the sound card (which won't be used in your setup). Using a 4.1 setting would just cut the bass frequencies from the front and rear outputs of the sound card to be routed to the low frequency output you won't be using instead and you don't want that.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21442089 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 17:16:49 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21440786 pfschim : hey thanks much, you got it exqctly right on the speaker system.

I still have the front/rear dual 1/8" cable, and will give that a try this afternoon.

I appreciate the assistance

thanks ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21440786 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 13:19:09 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21438923 royphil345 : It looks like you probably have the FPS 2000 model or something very close. The manual is here... »www.cambridgesoundworks.com/pdf/···2000.pdf

I see the problem now. The DIN digital input on your speaker system is designed to be used with older sound cards having a DIN digital output. They probably did run 4 discrete channels of digital audio through that cable, which is why your speaker system has no surround decoder or options to create 4 channel sound from a 2 channel digital input. The newer sound cards seem to use a standard SPDIF digital output instead that is more compatible with standard home theater equipment, but only outputs stereo or surround encoded signals that must be decoded by a sound system or speaker system having a decoder. Yours doesn't work that way.

That DIN digital input on your speaker system seems to be pretty much obsolete these days, but the good news is an analog connection should be no trouble at all.

See page 7 of the manual I linked to for instructions. All you'll need is 2 patch cables with stereo 1/8" (3.5mm) plugs at both ends.

The newer Creative cards should still be able to be set for 4 channel surround in Windows (sometimes just called "surround sound" in menus). Simply connect one of the cables to the main speaker output on the sound card and the "front" input jack on the speakers. The other cable to the jacks for the rear speakers on the sound card and speaker system.

Put all of your speaker cables back the way they should be, set your sound settings for 4 channel surround through the analog outputs and you should be good to go.

Good luck! :)

Let me know if you run into any more trouble.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21438923 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 01:30:23 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21438614 pfschim : The speaker system is a Cambridge Soundworks 4.1 system from about 2000 or so. 4 matched satellites and a ported sub. Not sure if this will help.

FWIW, I am open to the idea of updating my speaker system. Money is not a major consdieration, but I am not interested in a crazy system, just good quality immersive sound.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21438614 Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:33:49 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21435171 royphil345 : The analog connections wouldn't be made to the speaker terminals...

Do you have a model name or number for the speakers? I might be able to come up with a solution if I could find some info about your speaker system on the web.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21435171 Sun, 16 Nov 2008 07:16:42 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21434725 pfschim : I agree with your last point about using the analog outs.

The only issue I have is all the current satellites only have spring clips and not mini jacks. So, I'm not sure how I would wire them up. I wonder if I can get minijacks on one end and wire on the other. I suppose I could just buy some long mini jack cables and strip off one end and assume that the striped wire is red/positive.

another Sunday afternoon project. :uhh: I guess that's one of the perils of doing a full system upgrade/replacement.

thanks for all the input. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21434725 Sun, 16 Nov 2008 00:33:26 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21433675 royphil345 : It sounds like you're talking about getting 4 channels of sound out of stereo music played on Winamp then...

The only thing I can't figure out is how you were getting that before unless your speaker system has a setting to play a stereo source on all the speakers. I thought most multi-channel speakers had such a setting? I still don't know what model speakers you have...

Setting your old Audigy for 4.1 or 5.1 and using a digital hookup only capable of stereo for non-Dolby Digital encoded stereo music shouldn't have even worked though, unless your speakers have a setting to play stereo over all the speakers. In that case, it should still work now. The digital out on either of your sound cards can only output PCM stereo for non Dolby Digital / DTS material, no matter what surround mode is selected on the computer. Nothing should have changed.

It's possible the plug / cable you're using was somehow bridging something and transmitting the same digital signal to different inputs on the speaker system? Maybe the jack on the new card is set up a little differently and that's not working out now? I really doubt you were even getting true surround from true surround sound sources because it sounds like you were decoding with the sound card instead of passing a raw Dolby Digital signal to be decoded by your speaker system if capable. If so, you were only getting stereo out of the digital output, even if you somehow got it to come through all the speakers.

Anyhow... If your speaker system has analog inputs for the different channels... I'd try setting your sound card for 4.1 mode and analog output. Use the appropriate analog cables and analog outputs on your sound card for your hookup. The sound card would then decode any surround and send analog signals to the appropriate channels on your speaker system. I know the Creative cards / software can process 2 channel stereo into 4 channel surround as well using this hookup method. Probably what I'd try... My guess is you'd end up with better sound than you had before and true surround for any surround format, be it EAX for games or Dolby Digital for movies.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21433675 Sat, 15 Nov 2008 19:20:17 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21433531 pfschim : I am using Winamp as the player, and its a known good source for my audio library.

I did see the Windows Media Player DRM issue come up, but I am not using WMP, so that's not the issue.

I don't know if I was getting true "surround", just front and rear outputs. I'm not sure how the Audigy card is different from the X-Fi, but the Audigy would allow me to use both 4.1 and 5.1 settings for my 4.1 speaker set-up. The 5.1 setting was pretty cool because it seemed to "ghost" a center channel that is physically not there. My default on the old XP system was using the Audigy card's 5.1 setting, which gave a very nice wide field sound to my speakers.

I have been looking all over the X-Fi settings and have not seen a control that remedied this situation.

Could it be the speakers, or the configuration of the subs DIN input ?

This is not a huge deal, but I do use this system all the time for playing music while I work, and it's kind of a pain that the newer system has less quality sound than the old one. It's the only remaining issue I have left to tackle in the move from the old system.

Thanks for the input (no pun intended) so far ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21433531 Sat, 15 Nov 2008 18:37:35 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21432236 royphil345 : The only digital formats your speakers can decode are Dolby Digital, DTS, and plain stereo.

From Logitech site:

Supported digital formats:
Dolby Digital
DTS and DTS 96/24
PCM (uncompressed stereo): 44.1 kHz / 16 bit through 96 kHz / 24 bit

If you're getting "surround" from any source besides Dolby Digital or DTS (stereo music or EAX games for instance), it's simply a simulated surround being created by the hardware in the speaker set and perhaps using a particular setting.

The other guy's speakers may or may not have the ability to create simulated surround from stereo. I'm not even sure what formats they can decode because he didn't give the model #. If something's changed as far as getting simullated surround from a stereo source, it may just be a setting on the speakers. If he's having trouble with Dolby Digital, I would suspect a software setting needs to be reset somewhere to allow the surround encoded signal to pass through, either in the player software, sound card software, Creative Audio Console or Windows sound options. He wasn't really specific about the source / format / player he's having problems getting surround out of. If Dolby Digital is set to be decoded by the sound card instead of passed through and decoded externally in the player or any other software... surround will be output through the analog outputs of the sound card and stereo through the digital output.

The best way to get true surround from surround sources that are not Dolby Digital or DTS, sources that can only be decoded by the sound card and not the speaker set, or simulated surround that is created by the sound card / software is using analog connections for all the channels.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21432236 Sat, 15 Nov 2008 12:32:20 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21431654 Dogg : I wouldn't think it would be an analog/digital issue. Only because I'm using the digital coax output from my onboard sound into my Z5500 speakers. ALL sounds are passed through this connection, not just DD or other digital sources.

I would tend to think it is a difference between the two cards, drivers, or simply your source material.
--
Google is your Friend]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21431654 Sat, 15 Nov 2008 09:34:16 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21431507 royphil345 : I thought digital outputs only output PCM stereo, unless passing through a surround format that could be decoded by a decoder in your speaker system like Dolby Digital?

Separate analog connections for the various channels would probably work best for other types of surround (EAX, etc...) decoded by your sound card or surround that is created from 2-channel sound by the Creative card and software. Make sure your audio and sound card settings in Windows and the Creative software are correct for what you're trying to achieve.

Connecting two speakers to one set of terminals cuts the impedance in half and may damage the amplifier.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21431507 Sat, 15 Nov 2008 08:20:43 EDT Re: moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21431289 dvd536 :
said by pfschim See Profile :

I just got a new system - running Vista32, put in a Creative X-Fi card to replace my old systems original Audigy.

I had a decent Cambridge Soundworks 4.1 speaker setup on the old XP based system that worked fine. I used the digital out jack (mini jack out on the Audigy card to a DIN adapter, DIN jack in on the sub unit) That all worked out very nicely.

Now, I used the same mini jack out from the digital out on the X-Fi card, into the same DIN jack on the sub, but I can only get 2.1, not 4.1.

I went ahead and connected the rear speakers into the front speaker clips, so I am getting output, but only in a much more limited stereo field.

Any ideas what went wrong ? I guess I could just go back to the original Audigy card, which had very good output, but you'd think that the newer chip sets in the X-Fi would offer some improvements.

Thanks for any help in advance.
Protected content? that would be vista's DRM degrading protected content!
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When I gez aju zavateh na nalechoo more new yonooz tonigh molinigh - Ken Lee]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21431289 Sat, 15 Nov 2008 04:29:00 EDT moving from 1st gen Audigy to X-Fi Audio Card - lost 4.1 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21429942 pfschim : I just got a new system - running Vista32, put in a Creative X-Fi card to replace my old systems original Audigy.

I had a decent Cambridge Soundworks 4.1 speaker setup on the old XP based system that worked fine. I used the digital out jack (mini jack out on the Audigy card to a DIN adapter, DIN jack in on the sub unit) That all worked out very nicely.

Now, I used the same mini jack out from the digital out on the X-Fi card, into the same DIN jack on the sub, but I can only get 2.1, not 4.1.

I went ahead and connected the rear speakers into the front speaker clips, so I am getting output, but only in a much more limited stereo field.

Any ideas what went wrong ? I guess I could just go back to the original Audigy card, which had very good output, but you'd think that the newer chip sets in the X-Fi would offer some improvements.

Thanks for any help in advance. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21429942 Fri, 14 Nov 2008 20:43:52 EDT