Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? in VOIP Tech Chat

Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? in VOIP Tech Chat http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r21441401 en Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:51:28 EDT Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:51:28 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21498743 ezcallguy : grnvoip.com offers calling credit of $.001 for each minute of toll free traffic that you send. details here:
»www.grnvoip.com/toll_free.html]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21498743 Sat, 29 Nov 2008 19:39:09 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21480578 espaeth : I've been really surprised at how much of a pain it is to find consistent tollfree termination.

I had to pull VT White out of the mix because of the nasty Level(3) issues where calls would be signaled as answered (so no other trunks would be attempted) but the RTP audio would just spew a busy signal. There's a thread about it in the VT forum: »Toll-Free calls not going through I suspect this issue is why ViaTalk might be toying around with other tollfree providers.

FlowRoute consistently sent in CID, but I took them out of service after I had a few conference calls get randomly disconnected.

So now I'm down to:

1) tf.callwithus.com -- send a few SIP packets to Sergey's server then the RTP sessions hand off to O1 Telecom. ANI/CID has been consistent, and call quality has been great. I know there has been concern about abuse of free things, and I hope that doesn't happen because this is a great option right now.

2) tollfreegateway.com -- seemed to work great every test call I made. I've been checking over the last few days and ANI/CID is consistently set. Still have a little bit of uncertainty about the company so they remain my backup option

3) VoicePulse -- hit or miss chance whether accurate ANI/CID will be sent in. As a 3rd string option, if it comes to this I suspect I'll just be happy that the call terminates.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21480578 Tue, 25 Nov 2008 00:34:34 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21480026 PX Eliezer : This issue of ANI and toll-free termination seems to be an issue for various VoIP providers, probably because there is so much overlap in their downstream carriers.

Here's a similar problem reported in the VT forum:

»When calling an 800#, caller ID sent is 916-209-4509]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21480026 Mon, 24 Nov 2008 21:58:02 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454423 espaeth :

said by sokhapkin

:

You can send toll free calls to tf.callwithus.com. Don't register with the server, just send calls to it. Let me know if something is not OK.

Works great -- added it into my dialplan for tollfree.

Thanks!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454423 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 21:11:43 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454032 sokhapkin : SMOP is very simple to somebody, but requires hiring of a programmer to others...
--
»www.callwithus.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454032 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 20:03:30 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21453188 druber : It's a SMOP (Simple Matter Of Programming).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21453188 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 17:12:10 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21453076 nitzan : Already thought of that, actually. ;)

The only problem is that despite claiming to support it- the software we're using unfortunately does not support negative billing (credit) without some code manipulation. I am working on figuring out what needs to be changed to support it though. It shouldn't be that hard, right? (famous last words!)
--
Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21453076 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:49:28 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452904 RockyBB :

said by nitzan

:

It's actually more profitable for us (Future Nine) to terminate a toll-free minute than it is to terminate a domestic pay-as-you-go minute. ;)

Then why not offer some type of usage credit (against outbound call traffic) in return for toll-free traffic from registered customers? Like 2 free outbound minutes for every 10 toll-free minutes. You could be the only carrier to pay customers to use your service! even mazilo

would be stunned.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452904 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:12:32 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452892 nitzan : Definitely. It's not a lot of money (a fraction of a cent per minute) but it's better than nothing. :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452892 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:09:46 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452878 soitgoes2 :

said by nitzan

:

It's actually more profitable for us (Future Nine) to terminate a toll-free minute than it is to terminate a domestic pay-as-you-go minute. ;)

Very interesting.
It sounds like getting that going was a good thing for you.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452878 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:07:07 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452854 nitzan :

said by RockyBB

:

I'm sure that both VTWhite and FlowRoute will be delighted by your post, and are eagerly awaiting a flood of new no-revenue accounts. :D

They probably get paid for those minutes by the CLECs they use to terminate them. It's actually more profitable for us (Future Nine) to terminate a toll-free minute than it is to terminate a domestic pay-as-you-go minute. ;)
--
Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452854 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:02:18 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452774 sokhapkin : CID set on asterisk will be passed as is. CID set in CWU account will not be honored, the gateway forwards calls to TF provider on low level. You don't even need to have an account with CWU to use tf.callwithus.com.
--
»www.callwithus.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452774 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:49:37 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452657 gsar : Will this honor the CID set on the ATA/Asterisk? It would be simpler for me if regular calls after registration (e.g. via sip.callwithus.com) to tollfree numbers routes through this gateway with the CID I have set on my callwithus account. I can then choose to use a premium route using the route selection prefix if I ever need that.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452657 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:31:03 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452203 sokhapkin : You can send toll free calls to tf.callwithus.com. Don't register with the server, just send calls to it. Let me know if something is not OK.
--
»www.callwithus.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452203 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:13:33 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452186 soitgoes2 :

said by RockyBB

:

I'm sure that both VTWhite and FlowRoute will be delighted by your post, and are eagerly awaiting a flood of new no-revenue accounts. :D

a) Maybe they get paid for termination to toll-free numbers.
b) Maybe it will bring additional revenue for paid services.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21452186 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:10:06 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451417 RockyBB : I'm sure that both VTWhite and FlowRoute will be delighted by your post, and are eagerly awaiting a flood of new no-revenue accounts. :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451417 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 11:38:23 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451378 espaeth :

said by RockyBB

:

Geeze, what do you want for free? Tough crowd. BTW, their website (on the "contact" link) shows some phone numbers.

Ironically enough it's the providers that are charging nothing for tollfree termination that seem to be doing a better job than those billing for it.

I actually ended up signing up with both VTWhite and FlowRoute. Both handoff the RTP streams directly to carrier gateways, both send in the correct CID on tollfree calls, and both offer no-charge tollfree termination.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451378 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 11:30:14 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451229 RockyBB :

said by espaeth

:

Thanks for that -- made a few test calls through the service and everything seemed to work flawlessly. The one worry I have with using this service is that there is very little information available about the company doing the termination. It would be nice if there was a ToS, maybe a mailing address, or really any method of contact besides email and AIM.

Geeze, what do you want for free? Tough crowd. BTW, their website (on the "contact" link) shows some phone numbers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21451229 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 11:03:22 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21450073 espaeth :

said by TollFreeGateway :

TollFree Gateway.com runs an open SIP Toll Free termination gateway and actually requires that you send a valid caller id

Thanks for that -- made a few test calls through the service and everything seemed to work flawlessly. The one worry I have with using this service is that there is very little information available about the company doing the termination. It would be nice if there was a ToS, maybe a mailing address, or really any method of contact besides email and AIM.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21450073 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 01:57:44 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21445796 anon :

said by espaeth

:

The problem is, on all outbound toll-free calls the CID is reported as 319-228-9999. (VAN HORNE COOPERATIVE TELEPHONE CO, Cedar Rapids, IA)

Please open a ticket with Callcentric support for them to be able to investigate. Please provide all details. What you're describing must NOT happen with Callcentric toll free termination (this is the only reason to use [highly expensive] tier-1 carriers to deliver toll free calls; otherwise - there are plenty of free (or even "pay back") terminators for toll free calls).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21445796 Tue, 18 Nov 2008 11:33:00 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443987 anon : TollFree Gateway.com runs an open SIP Toll Free termination gateway and actually requires that you send a valid caller id

»www.tollfreegateway.com

on your asterisk box the config would look something like this

exten => _1800XXXXXXX,1,Dial(SIP/sip.tollfreegateway.com/${EXTEN}

FreeSwitch has an option that needs to be turned on in the default configs to use TFGW]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443987 Tue, 18 Nov 2008 07:02:26 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21444414 jimboe : Re: Vitelity

Interesting. They used to pass CID correctly to that MCI 444 TF number 85% of the time..

Seems like they no longer do. With other TF's however (CC's, banks) that I deal with, the CID is properly passsed.

I suppose the provider they use for particular numbers is different. hmm]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21444414 Tue, 18 Nov 2008 01:35:44 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443752 espaeth :

said by PX Eliezer

:

This little phone company has a very big presence:
»www.telcodata.us/telcodata/ratec···state=IA

A lot of phone lines for a little town. :)

One of my coworkers was setup with a provider based out of IA that had a "cash share" where they would cut you in on a fraction of the rural telecom origination rake and a cut of tollfree termination reimbursement. We joked that was his overtime compensation for sitting on "war room" problem audio conference bridges in the middle of the night.

Just to bump the topic, I got VT White configured up this evening and initial testing is looking good. So far 100% accuracy on passed CID to MCI (800-444-4444), 866-MY-ANI-IS, and our test call queue at work. The RTP streams hand off directly to Level(3), and termination rate is 0.0c/min.

I guess I'll leave them in the mix and hope things continue to shake out.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443752 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 22:21:05 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443675 PX Eliezer :

said by espaeth

:

The problem is, on all outbound toll-free calls the CID is reported as 319-228-9999. (VAN HORNE COOPERATIVE TELEPHONE CO, Cedar Rapids, IA)

Yes, as noted, I've seen this name too.

Very interesting.

This little phone company has a very big presence:
»www.telcodata.us/telcodata/ratec···state=IA

From Wikipedia: Van Horne is a city in Benton County, Iowa, United States. The population was 716 at the 2000 census. It is part of the Cedar Rapids Metropolitan Statistical Area.

Edit: Oh, here's some more info on this small phone company:
»www.manta.com/coms2/dnbcompany_hkdpw

Reminds me of the old Peter Sellers movie, "The Mouse That Roared".

---------------------------------------------
A lot of phone lines for a little town! :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443675 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 22:07:02 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443564 espaeth :

said by CallC :

Not true.
Callcentric will always (I mean it - 100%) deliver the caller ID configured on the account (either set via trouble-ticket for numbers not purchased from them or ANY DID the subscriber may set as "outgoing caller ID" via Dash-panel).

For standard PSTN calls, I agree that is the observed behavior. Non-tollfree calls I've placed via CallCentric do pass the correct CID digits.

said by CallC :

Calls to 800-444-4444 (MCI caller-ID autoresponder) will also correctly report your DID.

Surely, Callcentric is out of "free" toll free termination league unless the subscriber has one of unlimited outbound calling plans. But if you really need a 100% RELIABLE termination to US tollfree numbers - this is what Callcentric does.

Since audio conferencing is the bulk of my tollfree use, I'd happily continue to send audio conferencing calls via VoiceStick (or other free TF termination providers) and send my other TF calls via CallCentric. The problem is, on all outbound toll-free calls the CID is reported as 319-228-9999. (VAN HORNE COOPERATIVE TELEPHONE CO, Cedar Rapids, IA)

As I said before, I'm not opposed to pay options. Right now I'm routing standard TollFree out via CallWithUs who charges 0.3c/min on 60 second billing. I'm using them because VoicePulse (my previous first choice) started having both reliability issues with TF termination and stopped consistently sending in CID digits. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443564 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:50:01 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443359 soitgoes2 :

said by PX Eliezer

:

Is it fair to say that for some VoIP providers, they are using multiple companies for downstream termination?

Some probably are.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443359 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:12:21 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443337 PX Eliezer :

said by nitzan

:

Yep- different carriers pass things differently. The only control a VoIP carrier has is, well, who they use for termination.

Is it fair to say that for some VoIP providers, they are using multiple companies for downstream termination? Thus the treatment of ANI/CID can be random depending on how the call gets routed? That's kind of what I was trying to say in my post.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443337 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:08:55 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443149 nitzan : Yep- different carriers pass things differently. The only control a VoIP carrier has is, well, who they use for termination.
--
Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443149 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 20:41:23 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443100 PX Eliezer : I like to often check my ANI with that 800-444-4444 number, and also check my CID (CPN) by calling into a POTS line or cellphone.

One thing that I have found is that even for the SAME VoIP provider, there is no consistency.

On a Monday night, your ANI might be reported as the same as your CID.

On a Tuesday night, your ANI might be reported as being some phone number that belongs to the Van Horne Cooperative Telephone Company of Van Horne, Iowa. (Really). That's happened to me with SEVERAL well-known VoIP providers, by the way.

On a Wednesday night, the ANI might be reported as being from tw telecom (formerly TimeWarner) in Denver.

On a Thursday night, the ANI might be reported as being from Ohio Telecom, a small Ohio CLEC.

-------------------------------------------------

As I said, that sort of pattern has been observed with multiple VoIP providers.

I would think that since VoIP providers use various downstream carriers, that the ANI and CID can vary depending on the procedures of the specific downstream carrier!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21443100 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 20:31:21 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21442959 nitzan :

said by soitgoes2

:

Future Nine seems to pass CID/ANI reliably on toll-free calls I make.

We do pass your CID. We do not support setting your own CID via Asterisk on your end - but will be glad to hardcode it to something of your choice. Will be happy to do it even on a free account (our TF is absolutely free since we get compensated for it).
--
Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21442959 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 20:03:27 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21442499 anon :

said by espaeth

:

CallCentric also isn't passing CID on their outbound calls. (ie, a call to 800-444-4444 will not report your DID#)

Not true.
Callcentric will always (I mean it - 100%) deliver the caller ID configured on the account (either set via trouble-ticket for numbers not purchased from them or ANY DID the subscriber may set as "outgoing caller ID" via Dash-panel).

Calls to 800-444-4444 (MCI caller-ID autoresponder) will also correctly report your DID.

Surely, Callcentric is out of "free" toll free termination league unless the subscriber has one of unlimited outbound calling plans. But if you really need a 100% RELIABLE termination to US tollfree numbers - this is what Callcentric does.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21442499 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 19:39:39 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441710 espaeth :

said by RockyBB

:

how much additional outbound traffic do you have, and how are you sourcing it? if you add up your total outbound and inbound requirements, how many paths and how much are you paying total?

My costs are pretty minimal; I have 4 DIDs:

CallCentric PAYG $1.95
VoiceStick N2N $1
VoiceStick Asterisk Plan $2.99
Vitelity "Unlimited" DID $3.99

Outbound PAYG providers: Voip.ms, VoicePulse, Vitelity, CallWithUs

Most of my outbound calling is direct SIP URI connections, so standard PSTN termination is under 120 minutes/month.

Monthly expenses are rarely over $12-13/mo.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441710 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 16:07:51 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441617 RockyBB : how much additional outbound traffic do you have, and how are you sourcing it? if you add up your total outbound and inbound requirements, how many paths and how much are you paying total?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441617 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:49:59 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441555 espaeth :

said by RockyBB

:

how many minutes per month? do you want ANI or CID to be displayed? how many paths (i.e. simultaneous calls)?

How many minutes depends entirely on cost. Right now I drop my conference call traffic off to VoiceStick because they've been reliable and they're 0c/min for TF termination. All total I terminate 400-1600 minutes/month of tollfree traffic. 2 paths would be all I would need.

The next two options I have been considering are VT White and FlowRoute. Both offer free TF termination.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441555 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:41:12 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441522 espaeth :

said by priller

:

Callcentric will set it for you, via a trouble ticket.

At 0.88c/min for tollfree they aren't my #1 option.

CallCentric also isn't passing CID on their outbound calls. (ie, a call to 800-444-4444 will not report your DID#)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441522 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:36:09 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441509 priller :

said by espaeth

:

CallCentric -- No ability to set CID

Callcentric will set it for you, via a trouble ticket.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441509 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:34:37 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441503 RockyBB : how many minutes per month? do you want ANI or CID to be displayed? how many paths (i.e. simultaneous calls)?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441503 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:33:02 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441491 espaeth : Reasonably close to free would be preferred. Looking for something PAYG with 0.0 - 1c/min for tollfree.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441491 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:30:19 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441401 RockyBB : do you expect this to be a free or close to free service?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441401 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:15:45 EDT Re: Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441396 soitgoes2 : Future Nine seems to pass CID/ANI reliably on toll-free calls I make.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441396 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:14:37 EDT Who provides tollfree termination w/ accurate CID? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441208 espaeth : I've been trying to find a reliable termination provider for tollfree calls where supplied ANI/CID information matches that passed via Asterisk. So far I've been running into a mix of issues with providers that sometimes pass valid CID and sometimes the ANI of the trunk get set to be the CID.

Here's who I've tried:

Voip.ms -- Intermittent, most times reports ANI of trunk
Vitelity -- consistently reports ANI of trunk
VoicePulse -- Intermittent, sometimes reports ANI of trunk
les.net -- stability issues, reports ANI of trunk
CallWithUs -- Light stability issues, but consistently reports accurate CID
CallCentric -- No ability to set CID
VoiceStick -- No ability to set CID, often uses ANI of trunk

Is there anyone else out there who accurately passes CID for tollfree calls?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21441208 Mon, 17 Nov 2008 14:38:56 EDT