Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals in Webmasters and Developers http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r21455855 en Tue, 01 Dec 2009 02:09:12 EDT Tue, 01 Dec 2009 02:09:12 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21508765 FutureMon : Thanks for that link! For the specific city in which I live and work, it shows that I am somewhere around the 38th percentile in earnings for the single category of Computer Software Engineer (Applications)...

- FM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21508765 Mon, 01 Dec 2008 11:52:12 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21507603 chrisretusn : Here is some more data for you to ponder.

Bureau of Labor Statistics Wages by Area and Occupation
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Chris
Living in Paradise!!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21507603 Mon, 01 Dec 2008 06:00:54 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21503669 GeekNJ : I skimmed the thread and here's something to consider. You seem to be in a small company and there's no one representing you other then yourself.

If you feel you deserve an increase and from what I read, you are a valued employee, a discussion point could be what would it cost to replace me? So you don't want to say you're leaving, and asking that question might make them think hard.

With the above, forget the company knowledge/experience you have which can't be found on the street if you left. Mention it, but discuss finding someone that does networking, sysadmin work, DBA, application development and web development. It is usually harder to find those as many folks in the industry are more geared towards one or two specific areas and not a "one man shop". If they could find one person, how much would it cost them? If they needed 2, how much would that cost them?

I'm closer to the higher end of the IT ladder then the lower rungs and there are jobs out there even in this economy. The majority of companies might not be expanding, but folks are still switching jobs and if there aren't head count freezes, people need to be replaced. IT workers are already working at 100% so when someone leaves, if they aren't replaced, project work needs to be deferred and the business side of the company has a tough time dealing with not getting their project work done.

So I would always suggest to folks to keep their resume updated for a few reasons. First is you never know when you might need it because you've been let go. Another is that folks do a tremendous amount of work that over time they don't remember. If you constantly keep it updated with relevant material, you won't forget and you'll be prepared if an opportunities does come around that you might be interested in.

But remember, that if you're happy with what you're doing each day, that is worth a lot. If you got 20% more at another job and were miserable, was it a good decision? It wouldn't be a good decision for me.
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A bit depends on the company and how much they value their talent. The costs of outsourcing can be quite high and result in shoddy work.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21502966 Sat, 29 Nov 2008 23:51:07 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21492379 Kylemaul : ..nm..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21492379 Thu, 27 Nov 2008 09:29:17 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21488265 FutureMon : Times aren't tough. In fact we're bringing 4 new clients online within the next 3 months (equating to tens of thousands of new "customers").

Our current infrastructure can't even handle what we have today, and I'm tasked with a migration effort from Access 2003 over to C#, Sql 2005 and .NET.

- FM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21488265 Wed, 26 Nov 2008 13:14:00 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21488134 JAAulde : Well, that's better anyway. If times are tough for the company that's one thing. If they're spineless it's another. Glad they recognized their spinelessness and moved in a better direction.

Congrats.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21488134 Wed, 26 Nov 2008 12:49:55 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21488097 FutureMon : The owners called me into their office this morning. They wanted to re-address the review. Said they didn't go home with "warm fuzzies" about everything we had discussed and how it came out and that they didn't think I felt very good about it either...and told me I'd be receiving a 3% increase effective immediately, along with a move towards a management role over the next few months coupled with some training classes they want me to take... No real guarantees of promotion though.

They want me to know I'm valued and that they consider me a long term investment in the company. I guess they realized that by flipping me the bird in my review they were risking losing me...

So I feel a little bit better now. 3% is better than 0%... They showed up at my office and asked to talk with me as I was in the process of writing a rebuttal to my review that I was going to give them later today... :o

- FM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21488097 Wed, 26 Nov 2008 12:42:59 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21485184 JAAulde : Yeah...If they pinned their very survival on you and chickened out of showing you any appreciation because of some other crybaby employee, the you definitely don't need to be working there if you can find good work elsewhere.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21485184 Tue, 25 Nov 2008 21:10:07 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21485034 FutureMon : Well the review is over. And I quote "If it weren't for what you've done for us over the last year, we'd be out of business right now".

However, no promotion and no salary increase. They're afraid the I.T. contractor would quit on them if they made me manager...

Time for me to get a little more proactive in my job search.

- FM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21485034 Tue, 25 Nov 2008 20:31:47 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21482910 TheRul : I know you weren't pointing the finger at me. But it was funny damn it!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21482910 Tue, 25 Nov 2008 13:29:58 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21482737 FutureMon :
said by TheRul See Profile :

said by FutureMon See Profile :

said by TheRul See Profile :

Yeah, but you always had an inflated sense of self, as I can see that has increased soo much that you needed a beard! ;)

Good luck with the assement, it looks like they keep you hopping.
My days of self-imposed modesty in the workplace are largely gone. I got tired of being stepped on, outsourced or having my work efforts plagiarized. ;)

- FM
Should I tell Mercury about the Ideas I stole from you, then? ;)

All I have to say about that is, IT's about time!
I wasn't pointing my finger at you... ;) In fact, Mercury was pretty good about that particular issue...it was previous companies where I worked with a lot of H1-B Visa holders... At Citibank, man, you'd better watch your back...but I suppose that's no more. I heard they closed down the Citibank Development Center a few years back...(They prolly outsourced the entire operation to India)

- FM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21482737 Tue, 25 Nov 2008 12:57:22 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21481934 TheRul :
said by FutureMon See Profile :

said by TheRul See Profile :

Yeah, but you always had an inflated sense of self, as I can see that has increased soo much that you needed a beard! ;)

Good luck with the assement, it looks like they keep you hopping.
My days of self-imposed modesty in the workplace are largely gone. I got tired of being stepped on, outsourced or having my work efforts plagiarized. ;)

- FM
Should I tell Mercury about the Ideas I stole from you, then? ;)

All I have to say about that is, IT's about time!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21481934 Tue, 25 Nov 2008 10:43:20 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21479019 FutureMon :
said by TheRul See Profile :

Yeah, but you always had an inflated sense of self, as I can see that has increased soo much that you needed a beard! ;)

Good luck with the assement, it looks like they keep you hopping.
My days of self-imposed modesty in the workplace are largely gone. I got tired of being stepped on, outsourced or having my work efforts plagiarized. ;)

- FM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21479019 Mon, 24 Nov 2008 18:28:01 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21478076 TheRul : Yeah, but you always had an inflated sense of self, as I can see that has increased soo much that you needed a beard! ;)

Good luck with the assement, it looks like they keep you hopping.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21478076 Mon, 24 Nov 2008 15:38:41 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21467167 FutureMon : Well I believe some of the things I do fall into that category because the technology in the company I work for involves managing multiple business entities within a single business model, using enterprise level development platforms to do it. Sql Server 2005, Visual Studio 2003 (ya I know we need to upgrade...lol) and Quickbooks Enterprise Edition. (Don't laugh!)

Each jurisdiction we support has their own rules and regulations to follow and our software must be able to communicate with each of them (inhale their data in various formats, perform their billing for them, and present their data back to them the way they want to see it), all the while maintaining a semblance of a standard business model internally.

Our Collections "partner" uses DB2 on their end, and we are also in the process of building an automated solution to transmit and receive updates between each other when payments are received on either side. So you could say, with our current 15 clients (cities and counties) and one partner (a collection agency), we've got 16 "integrated" solutions that all feed into a single software package on our end. I'd call that enterprise application integration. ;)

- FM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21467167 Sat, 22 Nov 2008 00:40:54 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21466804 Gomez : The numbers don't jive with reality, as that's very geographically diverse as the ratio of cost of living and income varies.. Although there are some sweet spots.

The positions don't jive either.. "Enterprise application integration" huh ?!?! you're Fortune 100 before that position even exists. The vast majority are under fortune 500.. most, far below..

Closest I have is "Application Developer", which is in reality multi-tiered, at junior, mid, senior, manager...

The article does not approach reality.
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]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21466804 Fri, 21 Nov 2008 23:00:04 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21463433 FutureMon : Well I turned in my self assessment today. My review is on Tuesday.

I went through at least 10 different drafts before I came up with the final version.

The first one showed a very angry person who expected a lot out of the review - stemming from various positive and negative personal experiences at the company.

The final one shows a person who is very confident in his accomplisments, knows where he needs to improve, and rather than simply stating the things he disagrees with, it suggests ways to improve them instead.

They've got the weekend and Monday to review it. Hopefully things will go well. And I've got my spreadsheet with the financials on it as backup for when the time comes to discuss any potential increase they may or may not offer up.

The 28% below-average figure I quoted in my original post, if slashed in half, would be about where I expect to land coming out of this review.

Wish me luck!

- FM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21463433 Fri, 21 Nov 2008 13:12:09 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21461982 wapu : I have always been concerned that my salary was lower than what showed up on those surveys. Then I had a co worker who was chosen to take one. He told me he added $15K to the salary portion as a network administrator. His reasoning was that our boss took those surveys into account so if he was able to inflate the average he could see a bigger raise.

I gave him all the arguments about why that was wrong, but as the discussion spread to the rest of the IT staff, I found I was in the minority.

I find negotiating salary terribly difficult. Especially when I can't define my job completely in the categories of salary.com and other surveys like these. Take Enterprise Resource Planning on the Staffers graph. What exactly does that mean? A Large ERP System like SAP or JD Edwards/Peoplesoft/oracle or whatever it is now, is huge and complex. Does that mean you know everything about every module? Are you implementing the ERP System? Developing within it? Integrating outside systems with it? Designing the process flow within the system? I am just not sure what Enterprise Resource Planning means in the surveys.

One interesting thing I read, and I think it was in Information Week, was that the average person making more than $100K/Year moved employers at least 4 times prior to their current position. That was part of my reasoning for leaving the place I was at for 9 years prior to where I am now. I would love to find out if it is true, but have been unsuccessful at find the place I read it.
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~Bill Clinton 2008 DNC]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21461982 Fri, 21 Nov 2008 09:07:15 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21460382 johnnyboyct :
said by cowboyro See Profile :

I could make easily 15k more doing the same job if I wanted to commute ~1.5-2h each way (due to traffic, it's only 40-45 miles). But no thanks, I make enough (above the "average") in a decent place with great benefits and big bonuses ;)
We finally agree on something :P If I commuted to the Stamford / NY are (which is where I get most of the calls for), I could be making a decent amount more, but I drive about 10 miles each way now outside of Hartford :) There is also more people trying for the jobs in the less tech centric areas though, which SOMETIMES will slightly even it out.

I got lucky this time though. Great company, good money, so far a more then fair bonus, another one when I had my baby, and most important, they make you feel appreciated and dont micro manage. Very important in my book.

Its sad though about the managers making so much more. Hes still walking around installing software on individual pcs, let alone installing everything manually on format/new pcs.... :(
--
Connecticut Web Design and Development]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21460382 Thu, 20 Nov 2008 21:46:11 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21458983 FutureMon : But doesn't the fact these are "national" averages automatically reduce the totals by enough to make them useful?

90k in New York
50k in Omaha
75k in California
===
72k nationwide average]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21458983 Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:06:07 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21458375 Jafo232 : Agreed. What they pay in Anchorage will be much different than what they pay in NYC.. Good catch.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21458375 Thu, 20 Nov 2008 15:15:15 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21456078 cowboyro : What the article misses is the distribution of salaries across US. There are quite significant differences on a 50 miles range. I could make easily 15k more doing the same job if I wanted to commute ~1.5-2h each way (due to traffic, it's only 40-45 miles). But no thanks, I make enough (above the "average") in a decent place with great benefits and big bonuses ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21456078 Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:00:10 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21455988 QuaffAPint : Of course those numbers are based on a time of a better economy, so things like bonuses and such don't exist currently for myself.

TOTALLY OT:
Looking at the 'What Managers Make' graph - do all the lines seem to be angling downwards to you? They certainly seem it - I just don't know why they would do that - Some secret plot to make managers feel like they're making less ? :)
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As far as bonuses, the company I work for looks at their profits for the year and the state of the company, and comes up with a total number they can put into bonuses. Then they look at each employee and divide up that money based on time with the company and contribution.

Last year I think I picked up ~$500 bonus before tax and I had only been there 3 months and hadn't yet contributed a lot since I was learning the ropes.

The company also dedicates 10% of its profits to charity and divides that number evenly between the employees allowing them each to choose which charity will receive their part. This is on top of other giving they may do throughout the year, and aside from the CEO/CTO/etc personal giving.

Our benefits are quite good--health insurance premiums paid in full on a high deductible plan, and %50 of the deductible covered by the company via deposits to our HSA. The HSA of is the kind where money collects and earns interest and whatever you don't use can be collected off of at retirement. We've got 401k with excellent company matching. The company will contribute a few thousand dollars per adoption per family per year if we should decide adopt. Etc, etc, etc.

Besides bonuses benefits, and competitive salaries we are also given a $1000/year "personal development supplement". To help us maintain our computer equipment and to round out each employee as a whole person, we can expense up to $1000 per year to the company for things related to home office equipment, hobbies, gym memberships, etc. This $1000 is quite beneficial as it is not taxed (since it is an expense) and helps the company at tax time because it is an operational cost.

I could not ask for a better place to work. We've got a clear vision for the future, we're innovating our product, we're a small size and are truly cared for, and we make good money.
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I have yet to even hear talk of a bonus in my short career (meanwhile, I did find out yesterday that I will not be getting a raise, again, due to an org wide wage freeze).
For my situation, there are no bonuses for profit sharing, project milestone bonuses, training, certification, or even education (earned an advanced degree does not give me a bonuses nor a salary increase) and about 20 workers a year out of 5000 get a personal performance bonus.
Amusing part is that when the pay freeze was announced yesterday, there were 30+ comments on the newspaper article about it saying that we were overpayed and overbenefited. :P
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Geographic Information Science researcher]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21455855 Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:53:52 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21455367 Jafo232 : Yeah, looks right.. Remember, this is an AVERAGE, so many make below it, and many make above it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21455367 Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:13:26 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454231 JAAulde : Looks right to me...I've generally fit around those numbers]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454231 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 20:40:27 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454157 TearAbite : a little more info:

I was a regional I.T. manager for a large company up until just a few months ago - overseeing about 9 employees.

The "legacy" (mainframe) programmers were earning ~$80k

The BEST network admin/desktop support person (Lead) was barely breaking $55k - the others were earning between $33k and $40k

The Regional I.T. manager position paid just under $90k]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454157 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 20:26:58 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454132 cwnorris : I've been out of IT work for a few years, but those numbers look very high to me. When I left in 2006, I was making $45,000/year in Colorado. I was supporting ~100 people by myself, covering basically everything that plugged into any kind of wall socket; intranet (HTML, PHP, MySQL), phone (3Com), LAN/WAN, desktop, lab machines, email (postfix, qpop), firewalls, copiers, printers, projectors, blah blah blah.

Were it me, I would never use salary numbers posted on any website, they always seem to be high. Maybe people state what they wish they made instead of what they do make.

Granted, I've generally worked for small companies, mostly start-ups, and salary was never the most important consideration (actually way down the list, after work environment and location).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454132 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 20:20:29 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454010 TearAbite : those numbers are high based on my experience - and i live in a 'high cost of living area' .]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454010 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 19:57:56 EDT Re: Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21453506 PToN : WOW, i need to ask for a raise...!

I am nowhere near the numbers and i do(like many other around here) everything from systems administration to enterprise systems integration.... :(

I feel bad now... :(

BUT i am just really glad that i have a job during the holidays. It could always be worse so i am happy now, but still will ask for that raise.. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21453506 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 18:25:29 EDT Average Salaries of I.T. Professionals http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21453477 FutureMon : Using the following article as your guide:

»www.informationweek.com/news/man···86500737

How many of you, in positions as related to the article, find yourselves making more or less than the amounts stated.

I'm trying to gauge the industry as a whole with statistics from "real people".

I took the job titles from each category that I perform one or more functions from (there were 5 applying to me), averaged them together, first seperately for each year, and then both years averaged together to come up with a dollar figure, at both manager and staff levels.

I then took those numbers, and using a "percentage of my time spent on activities related to each title", figured the amounts for each category (equalling 100% of my time) and summed them together to reach an annual salary amount equivalent to the work being performed.

What I found was that in my particular scenario, as a manager I am getting paid 29.4% less than what I should be, and in terms of staff level compensation I found that I am getting paid 8.66% less than I should be. And these are averages of averages from 2005 and 2006...

My annual review is coming up, and before I go in with expectations of grandeur, I'd like to see where some of you are.

For instance, there's no way in the world that I could ever expect a 29% increase let alone an 8% one in todays climate, but at the same time I need to gauge the salary levels of my peers and if you're all in the same boat I am, then simply not caring about the result of the review (which should be stellar) and looking for a new gig might be out of the question. ;)

On the other hand, if I'm in a boat by myself and the grass is potentially greener elsewhere, then I may have some leverage to climb a little closer to what I am actually worth.

I'm essentially in a "one man shop" so I figure I'm sort of in a hybrid role between manager and staff, and the categories that apply to me are:

Enterprise application integration
Data mining/warehouse
Application development
Database analysis/development
Web design/development

- FM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21453477 Wed, 19 Nov 2008 18:17:42 EDT