Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos in Comcast Cable TV

Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos in Comcast Cable TV http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r21523002 en Mon, 30 Nov 2009 04:12:04 EDT Mon, 30 Nov 2009 04:12:04 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496783 Franklin :

said by dishrich

said by Franklin

:

but not tape VCRs which are now being made "tuner free"

How about this one that does BOTH - you can record w/the tuner on either the VCR or DVD recorder:

»www2.panasonic.com/consumer-elec···00005702

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496783 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 20:18:38 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22497331 anon : do not buy any panasonic brand dvd recorder they are the worst! get toshiba. i've owned every brand of dvd recorder for my work (broadcast/shooting/editing )]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22497331 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 17:37:53 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496800 Franklin :

said by dishrich

said by Franklin

:

but not tape VCRs which are now being made "tuner free"

How about this one that does BOTH - you can record w/the tuner on either the VCR or DVD recorder:

»www2.panasonic.com/consumer-elec···00005702

I looked into this machine - Its received some pretty bad reviews - such as buggy software and lockups - plus worst of all - It won't record directly from a digital channel to VHS.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496800 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 16:05:16 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496696 Franklin :

said by tvnut :

yeap! Looks like a good one..

As far as VCR goes, Please move into the 21st century!

I will try to find a price for the panasonic model mentioned by dishrich - but I note that it doesn't have S-VHS

As far as moving into the 21st century, I don't consider direct to DVD recorders superior to tape for simple reliable time shifting - However I would be interested in finding a reasonably priced Hard Disk Recorder that didn't require a monthly fee.

Until a few months ago, Magnavox was selling combination 160 GB Hard Disk and DVD recorders for $249.95 - but they have been closed out, apparently because Magnavox is no longer making them, but you can still see the Walmart ad at:

»www.walmart.com/catalog/product.···10104532

Many of Walmart's customers probably don't subscribe to cable - A recorder like this would be almost perfect for such people. - I say almost, because it can't record in high definition. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496696 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 15:49:24 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496247 anon : yeap! Looks like a good one..

As far as VCR goes, Please move into the 21st century!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496247 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 14:21:58 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496186 dishrich :

said by Franklin

:

but not tape VCRs which are now being made "tuner free"

How about this one that does BOTH - you can record w/the tuner on either the VCR or DVD recorder:

»www2.panasonic.com/consumer-elec···00005702]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496186 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 14:11:47 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496010 Franklin :

said by tvnut :

There are MANY DVD-Recorders coming on the market with clear QAM Tuners..I did a search and found several brands that had it. So, that might be the solution to people that bought HDTVs prior to 2008.

Yes - it is possible to find DVD recorders with QAM tuners - but not tape VCRs which are now being made "tuner free" -plus try to find either one that can use a cable card and doesn't require a rental fee like Tivo. - I actually have a DVD recorder and even if it had a QAM tuner I would prefer to use tape because it is simple to use, reliable and easy to erase compared to recordable DVDs.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22496010 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 13:40:46 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494669 PGHammer : If a TV supported CableCARD, they supported QAM/ClearQAM (as that was actually part of the requirements for CableCARD). Also, even of the major brands, ClearQAM is still only common *above* a particular size (usually 40"); look at the major brands in terms of 32" and smaller LCD TVs (even Sony, Toshiba, and LG).

As far as the remote communicating with the STB, consider the STB's remote communicating with the VCR. (Comcast's STB remote *is* a universal model; in fact, Universal used to manufacture them.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494669 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 09:40:00 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494658 bicker : Yes, sorry... missed that thread connection. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494658 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 09:37:08 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494649 anon : Right, but right now in order for their new DTAs to work, they must receive Clear QAM..(Until they change that, I am going to not use the box and just my QAM Tuners.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494649 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 09:35:36 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494622 bicker : Yup; Folks just need to keep in mind that there is no obligation on the part of service providers to provide anything via unencrypted QAM (as long as they offer local broadcast channels via unencrypted analog.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494622 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 09:30:11 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494465 anon : There are MANY DVD-Recorders coming on the market with clear QAM Tuners..I did a search and found several brands that had it. So, that might be the solution to people that bought HDTVs prior to 2008.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494465 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 08:50:28 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494057 bicker : Remember: You are the consumer. If you don't like what is offered, do without. You have all the power. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494057 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 04:12:10 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494044 Franklin : I have never seen a VCR that can use a cable card and DVRs like TIVO require a monthly fee. The cable companies have such a strangle hold on the industry, that it is becoming difficult to even find a VCR with a tuner of any kind. If the cable companies wanted to do so, it would have been easy for them to keep VCRs compatible with the switch to digital, by including timers in every set top box.

Another solution to the problem of programing a VCR would have been to make it easy for older cable ready VCRs to communicate with set top boxes. I have a cable ready JVC S-VHS VCR that has an infrared output that can change the channel on more than 30 brands of set top boxes. - My problem is that neither Motorola nor Pace is on the list, and I have been unable to program my VCR to communicate with either of the units supplied by Comcast.

I resent having to pay a monthly fee to time shift programs - I am hoping to be able to find a VCR with a QAM digital tuner which will be usable to tune in unencrypted channels directly - at least until Comcast gets a waiver, which I hope it never does.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22494044 Thu, 04 Jun 2009 04:00:44 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22491578 ak3883 : It's 2009. The vast majority of LCD TVs have ClearQAM tuners. I would venture to say every model from major brands(Sharp,Panasonic,Toshiba,Samsung,LG,Sony) has a QAM tuner in it. Only in some of the cheapest of cheap sets will you find only ATSC tuners, as req'd by law.

In 2005 there were many more TV's with cablecard slots, and QAM tuners were not as common. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22491578 Wed, 03 Jun 2009 18:42:34 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22490784 PGHammer : Typically, any TV that has ClearQAM support will have one of the following in its documentation:

1. The term "digital-cable ready" or iDCR.
2. CableCARD-ready.

Horribly, most LCD HDTVs don't support ClearQAM (at best, they support ATSC in addition to NTSC) for price reasons. (Typically, ClearQAM/iDCR/CableCARD support was confined to the higher end of the price scale - plasma TVs, larger LCD HDTVs, and projection TVs. That was a decision by the CEA, not the cable companies.) I bought my Philips 42PF7320A/37A plasma in 2005 because it was, at the time, the lowest-price in-stock TV that supported CableCARD. (I almost didn't have enough continuous wall to mount it - it is a bedroom TV.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22490784 Wed, 03 Jun 2009 16:23:03 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22483977 bicker : I think that's a good assumption. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22483977 Tue, 02 Jun 2009 15:07:19 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22483263 anon : Don't think that will happen anytime soon, otherwise, they would have rolled out STB to everyone instead of wasting time making millions of DTAs. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22483263 Tue, 02 Jun 2009 13:19:33 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22481929 bicker : Or when they require expanded basic subscribers to upgrade from DTAs to STBs.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22481929 Tue, 02 Jun 2009 09:03:59 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22481826 anon : so again. long story short, if you have expanded basic right now and you have a QAM tuner TV, then you dont need the stupid box!!! ONLY WHEN THE DTA BOX DOES SOME TYPE OF DECODING WILL YOU QUIT WORKING. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22481826 Tue, 02 Jun 2009 08:34:34 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22481814 anon : well thats fine, cause I dont want the ones that are already encrypyed. What I am saying is that a QAM Tuner TV will be able to pick up anything that the new box will!! If the channels are encrypted, the box will not pick them up anyways!! Plus if you use a QAM tuner, you will pick up the HD Local channels which the Box will not!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22481814 Tue, 02 Jun 2009 08:30:47 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22481549 bicker :

said by eangel88 :

Okay, so the QAM tuner won't make a difference when Comcast starts encrypting these channels. The only thing that will work is either a STB or DTA? Thanks.

A DTA won't even work for encrypted channels. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22481549 Tue, 02 Jun 2009 05:41:25 EDT Re: Complain Vehemently / Get Help / Ignore... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22480148 canalking : So sorry for the delay. Good thing I am not one of those original upset folks....and in fact, posted our problem for suggestions from others more "knowledgeable".

A couple of things happened after the post. First I left a message for someone on another message board, and a Comcast rep must have scanned the message board for complaints, and then emailed me offering assistance. (well appreciated). We even got a phone call from the "executive office". By then, the Comcast technician arrived on the Sunday, and within an hour , had us all hooked up and two tv's working properly. Seems he had to install a digital booster box in our basement. The old booster box was analog and so it no longer worked. Something to that effect. Whatever he did, he took care of the problem perfectly, quickly, and resolved our problem. The boxes work fine now.

My frustration was with the customer service reps in India (the dedicated phone number was provided with the DTA box), that only can tell you how to hook up the box, and then send you a signal to activate it. After doing that four times, and wasting hours of our time, they did not suggest we call for Comcast service. That was their mistake, and they should be retrained to help customers like us who spent 3 days trying to get our system to work. It does no one any good to spend hours trying to activate a box that will not receive a signal due to another problem. All that kind of run around does, is to create unhappy customers. We are inundated with marketing flyers to change cable companies. Dealing with people over the phone that cannot help you and do not know enough to forward your concern to other departments that can help you, makes the entire company look bad. This is simply a training issue and could be addressed for the future. But of course it is cheaper to send everyone to a phone bank in India, where the person, cheerful that they are, basically reads from a script, and after a half hour, just tells the customer to wait until the box gets the signal or it downloads the channels. Neither suggestion worked, nor did the "supervisor" 's suggestions. The delay only mad us angrier and willing to consider changing providers. So if you have any influence with Comcast, tell them to tell their customer reps in India, to pass the caller on to the US Comcast office for service. Dialing the phone number listed with the DTA box will likely lead one to nothing but frustration and delay. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22480148 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 21:27:33 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22480056 anon :

said by bicker

:

Again, in many areas expanded basic channels will be encrypted when broadcast as digital. Chances are, that is the reality that you will encounter: Expect that to be the case. A QAM tuner cannot tune in an encrypted channel unless it supports and carries a CableCARD.

Okay, so the QAM tuner won't make a difference when Comcast starts encrypting these channels. The only thing that will work is either a STB or DTA? Thanks.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22480056 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 21:13:45 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22480046 anon : So if the Channel 1 test isn't valid, how do I know if my TV's have the QAM tuner or not? Do most TV's not have this yet? Thanks.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22480046 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 21:11:49 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479885 bicker : Again, in many areas expanded basic channels will be encrypted when broadcast as digital. Chances are, that is the reality that you will encounter: Expect that to be the case. A QAM tuner cannot tune in an encrypted channel unless it supports and carries a CableCARD.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479885 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 20:38:26 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479664 ClearToLand :

said by eangel88 :

The Comcast rep told me to tune to Channel 1 on my TV. If I can see something on Channel 1, then I don't need the DTA, but if I can't, I do need it. I can't see anything on Channel 1 on any of my TV's, so I guess none of them have the QAM tuner?

It's so unfair when the folks you ASS-U-ME you can trust don't know WTH they're talking about. :uhh:

Only STBs (i.e. DCT-700) know about things like CH. 1 ('OnDemand'). DTAs (i.e. DC-50X) and Clear QAM tuners (i.e. TVs, DVDRs, etc...) won't be 'mapped' for these 'Special Features'.
--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. --George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950) LM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479664 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 19:59:30 EDT Complain Vehemently / Get Help / Ignore... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479580 ClearToLand :

said by canalking

:

Thank you for your advice. I will let you know what happens after the technician shows up on Sunday. If the technician cannot resolve the problem, then we will look into Fios. Mybe a new service provider will help us out.

I wonder what happened in Scotch Plains, NJ on Sunday, 05/17/09... :huh:

[OPINION]

right

somewhere

Fill-in-the-Blank

Kind Souls

words-of-wisdom

problem

Original UPSET Folks

[/OPINION]
--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. --George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950) LM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479580 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 19:42:30 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479567 anon :

said by bicker

said by tvnut :

Ok, so long story short. If you have Expanded Comcast Basic(basically you get 60-70 channels). Then if you have a QAM Tuner TV, then you will not need this stupid box, as all 50+ Channels that move from analog to digital the tv will tune in with its QAM Tuner..

The Comcast rep told me to tune to Channel 1 on my TV. If I can see something on Channel 1, then I don't need the DTA, but if I can't, I do need it. I can't see anything on Channel 1 on any of my TV's, so I guess none of them have the QAM tuner?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479567 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 19:39:50 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479433 bicker :

That is not necessarily the case. In many (perhaps most) areas that will go down this path, expanded basic channels (say the top half of those 60-70 channels) will be encrypted. These channels are already encrypted on QAM here.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479433 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 19:15:49 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479232 ClearToLand :

said by eangel88 :

...Will the RF modulator still work on Ch. 122 (or any channel for that matter) once the DTA's are connected and activated? I'm guessing that it won't, but I don't know for sure, and I don't know the reasons behind it...

I agree with your answer - NO it won't.

The reason, per my reading of various DTA and QAM threads, is that the DTA does 'mapping'. (NOTE: My examples have FAKE numbers.)

While 'Discovery Digital' (not HD) may be received on 80.1 via Clear QAM, the DTA is instructed via 'mapping' to receive it on 200 (there are no SUB-Channels on my DTA). Thus, since Comcast is unaware of YOUR CH. 122, the DTA will (probably) be unaware of it also.
--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. --George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950) LM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22479232 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 18:36:47 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22478686 anon : Ok, so long story short. If you have Expanded Comcast Basic(basically you get 60-70 channels). Then if you have a QAM Tuner TV, then you will not need this stupid box, as all 50+ Channels that move from analog to digital the tv will tune in with its QAM Tuner..

So for me, the box is no effect as I have 4 QAM Tuner DTVs in my home...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22478686 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 16:45:42 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22478405 anon : I have a question about these DTA's. I currently have expanded basic cable coming into 3 TV's in my house. The rest of my house has DirecTV service. I have a RF modulator connected to one of the satellite receivers, and set to cable Ch. 122. This enables the 3 cable TV's to tune to Ch. 122 and receive the satellite channel that is tuned on that receiver.

Will the RF modulator still work on Ch. 122 (or any channel for that matter) once the DTA's are connected and activated? I'm guessing that it won't, but I don't know for sure, and I don't know the reasons behind it. Thanks.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22478405 Mon, 01 Jun 2009 15:57:07 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462364 bicker :

said by Agent 86 :

"Generally, "those high channels" are encrypted, and DTAs aren't allowed to be used for those channels at this time (due to government [over-]regulation)."

The DTAs aren't designed to receive premium channels. They can do "privacy mode" (weak, used for VOD) decryption, but that would only be used for non-premium channels, if it is ever used.

Yup, so in the range the OP mentioned (100-999), probably 100-299, and 500-799 (at least on my system).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462364 Fri, 29 May 2009 07:05:03 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462357 cypherstream : I hear the SiliconDust team is able to pull the digital channel mapping data from the SCTE messages that are broadcast on DTA enabled headends.

»www.silicondust.com/forum/viewto···ight=dta]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462357 Fri, 29 May 2009 07:03:20 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462326 anon : "Generally, "those high channels" are encrypted, and DTAs aren't allowed to be used for those channels at this time (due to government [over-]regulation)."

The DTAs aren't designed to receive premium channels. They can do "privacy mode" (weak, used for VOD) decryption, but that would only be used for non-premium channels, if it is ever used.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462326 Fri, 29 May 2009 06:37:02 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462293 Mike Wolf : Ah ok, thanks.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462293 Fri, 29 May 2009 06:07:54 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462285 bicker : To allow folks to tune in unencrypted digital cable channels (figure, channel 30 to 60 or so, on average), so they can watch them on their analog televisions. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462285 Fri, 29 May 2009 05:59:35 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462272 Mike Wolf : Then whats the point of it again?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462272 Fri, 29 May 2009 05:42:46 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462251 bicker : Generally, "those high channels" are encrypted, and DTAs aren't allowed to be used for those channels at this time (due to government [over-]regulation).

For now, think of DTAs as QAM tuners, that can be enabled or disabled en masse, nothing more.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462251 Fri, 29 May 2009 05:20:12 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462171 Mike Wolf : Hmm, well at least I know what exactly Comcast's letter on the payment center door about these boxes not being available until the fall is referring too. Though I have to wonder what these boxes will allow me to do? Will it allow a customer with digital service the abilty to watch those high channels, 100 - 999 without a digital set top box? Like I said they arent out in my area and this is the first I've heard of this, and I'm an installer....so make of it what you will :o]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22462171 Fri, 29 May 2009 03:56:18 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22398565 PhillyJim :

said by patspub

:

Anyone in Northeast Philly get one of these "DTA's" yet???

I don't think Philly is getting them any time soon.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22398565 Sat, 16 May 2009 14:15:02 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22397668 owlyn :

said by patspub

:

Anyone in Northeast Philly get one of these "DTA's" yet???

I have one (in Bucks). ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22397668 Sat, 16 May 2009 08:34:55 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22396414 patspub : Anyone in Northeast Philly get one of these "DTA's" yet???]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22396414 Fri, 15 May 2009 21:37:26 EDT Re: Divide and Conquer! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22396381 canalking : Thank you for your advice. I will let you know what happens after the technician shows up on Sunday. If the technician cannot resolve the problem, then we will look into Fios. Mybe a new service provider will help us out. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22396381 Fri, 15 May 2009 21:29:35 EDT Divide and Conquer! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22395979 ClearToLand :

said by canalking

:

Having problems with the installation of our dta's. One can only get a few channels, the other one gets none. We have called comcast numerous times to report problem. We even returned orignal dta's to their office and got two new ones. Still cannot receive cable picture...

Divide and Conquer!

Good Luck! :) Let us know what you discover.
--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. --George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950) LM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22395979 Fri, 15 May 2009 19:59:38 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22395915 ClearToLand :

said by bicker

:

...It only gets complicated if you choose to add other devices to your set-up, and in that case it is your decision to do so, and your responsibility to either have or obtain the knowledge necessary. Tech support can help introduce a VCR or DVR into the mix, but only to the extent that you are willing and capable of understanding what they're telling you. If it sounds too complicated, then you either need to learn more, or call on a friend to help you -- or borrow some friends-in-abstentia by presenting your need on an Internet forum, and let the folks there help you understand how to do what you need to. That's why many of us are here in this forum.

It would be great if they did have people standing by at all times to rush out to our homes and hand-hold us through everything. However, we simply don't pay any mass-market supplier enough for any of them to offer that, in any industry. And I don't want to pay one penny extra to support that level of service, since I don't need it. And evidently most customers are like me: They prefer lower prices over lots of extra hand-holding.

One thing that it is very important you understand about DTAs: They take in the multi-channel cable signal, and put out one channel's audio and video. Basically, you lose any features that are provide by your VCR, DVR or television by way of it's tuner. That's not a conspiracy or a crime. There is a federal regulation that specified precisely how to have cable service and still enjoy such features provided by your VCR's, DVR's or television's tuner -- that federal regulation is satisfied by CableCARD. If your VCR, DVR or television doesn't support CableCARD, then you have made a decision to not pay the extra amount necessary to comply with your obligations relevant to the federal regulation, so you won't reap the benefits of the features your VCR's, DVR's or television's tuner offers you, such as watch one channel while recording another. If you have a problem with the law, talk to your Members of Congress. Until the law is changed, however, cable companies have to comply with it, and you have to do your part as well, in order to gain the benefits of the law.

Good explanation bicker.

I'd like to add the following to hopefullly make the last paragraph even clearer for the 'non-techies'.

Technology continues to evolve. Take music. When I was a child, the adults in my family had collections of 78RPM Mono records. As a teen, 45RPM 'Singles' and 33RPM Stereo 'Albums' took over. Then, 8-Tracks, Cassettes, CDs and finally today 'electronic-only' MP3s. You may have a perfectly operating 8-Track in your car, but, it's tough to buy current songs for it.

Onto television. In the USA, television has been using NTSC tuners. When I was a child, our console television tuned only VHF 2-13 and was black & white. When UHF 14-83 came along, you needed to buy an 'adapter' for your VHF-only set - same deal as today - tune the new UHF channel on the adapter and then route it to the old television on VHF Ch 3.

Then came cable. To ease it into our households, the industry came out with 'Cable-Ready' tuners BUILT INTO televisions and VCRs. Maybe the numbers looked the same, but Ch 33 OTA (UHF) was certainly a different frequency than Ch 33 Cable. These 'Cable-Ready' tuners, Ch 2-125, served us a LONG time but now there's DIGITAL and the technology has changed once again.

Only this time, instead of a 'few' VHF-only sets needing to be either 'adapted' or replaced, there are THOUSANDS upon THOUSANDS of NTSC OTA and 'Cable-Ready' tuners in televisions, VCRs, DVDRs, etc... that (suddenly) have become OBSOLETE! :o Everything that you knew PRIOR to ATSC/QAM is now 'out-dated'. And your choices are the same as they were when UHF first appeared - buy an adapter or replace the device. But, due to the advances in technology, what the adapter can accomplish is limited to what the original device anticipated.

My knowledge is limited to ReplayTV and TiVo Series 1, so, that's what I'll explain. Both of those devices came with 'IR Blasters' - simply, the OUTPUT portion of the handheld remote control we've all gotten used to. The BUTTONs are handled by electronics inside the ReplayTV and TiVo. Thus, if I upgrade to Digital Cable and get a Motorola DCT-700 STB, I can tell my ReplayTV 'control the DCT-700 for me'. If your existing NTSC-tuner-equipped device didn't anticipate controlling another SPECIFIC device, YOU have to do it manually (tune your old device to NTSC Ch 3; select the ATSC/QAM channel with the DTA/STB remote control). For example, my ReplayTV DOES NOT know how to control the DC-50X (at this time). Very sad indeed. :(

If that's not satisfactory, well... time to buy a new television, DVDR, etc... ;)
--
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. --George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950) LM]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22395915 Fri, 15 May 2009 19:43:33 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22394845 Paul F : Does the DTA allow you to turn on CC's on your analog TV when watching the SD channels? I am curious because I can not find the CCs in the transport stream user data using CCExtract when I record a show.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22394845 Fri, 15 May 2009 15:18:08 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22392644 owlyn :

said by canalking

:

Having problems with the installation of our dta's. One can only get a few channels, the other one gets none. We have called comcast numerous times to report problem. We even returned orignal dta's to their office and got two new ones. Still cannot receive cable picture. Diagnostic review (Thank you for your code info) shows download has failed, and cannot find dsmcc pid whatever that is. We have asked for technician to come to house and they will come in 3 days. In the meantime we have no cable service on these tv's (although we can take the boxes off and have cable service). Dealing with customer service has been horrible. Basically they can only send a signal to the box which does nothing. Can you tell us if you think the problem is with the box, the wiring in the house, or with Comcast's servers/computers? Our cable is working just fine without the boxes. So sorry we ordered these but we have no choice for the older tv's. Thank you in advance for your assistance. Signed, Frustrated.

Sounds like a signal problem. The cause could be almost anything, but I would suspect the wiring in your house first.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22392644 Fri, 15 May 2009 06:24:43 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22392216 canalking : Having problems with the installation of our dta's. One can only get a few channels, the other one gets none. We have called comcast numerous times to report problem. We even returned orignal dta's to their office and got two new ones. Still cannot receive cable picture. Diagnostic review (Thank you for your code info) shows download has failed, and cannot find dsmcc pid whatever that is. We have asked for technician to come to house and they will come in 3 days. In the meantime we have no cable service on these tv's (although we can take the boxes off and have cable service). Dealing with customer service has been horrible. Basically they can only send a signal to the box which does nothing. Can you tell us if you think the problem is with the box, the wiring in the house, or with Comcast's servers/computers? Our cable is working just fine without the boxes. So sorry we ordered these but we have no choice for the older tv's. Thank you in advance for your assistance. Signed, Frustrated. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22392216 Fri, 15 May 2009 00:26:40 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22258022 bicker : Even better. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22258022 Sat, 18 Apr 2009 13:33:19 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22257783 gpatrick900 : Actually, I am not doing without that station. I hooked up my rabbit ears and an over the air converter box, I got last year. Hooked the box up through the vcr. Get that station without any problems over the air. That station they moved to digital is not far away. I can also record it as well.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22257783 Sat, 18 Apr 2009 12:34:25 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22257445 bicker :

said by gpatrick900

:

I did find out I was partially correct. That comcast can not move a broadcast station to digital unless they move all analog channels to digital and provide a simple dta

Or converter box

said by gpatrick900

:

at low cost. The local over the air broadcast station must stay in clear qam at least for 3 years. Regardless if the station is moved to digital.

Correct.

said by gpatrick900

:

There was one other exception. If they have two PBS stations, they can move one to digital. Which I am not sure is correct.

What it is is that each station gets to designate one and only one signal as its Must Carry signal. The other sub-channels are carried at the MSO's discretion.

said by gpatrick900

:

The reason for the 3 year delay is to give time for technology to catch up.

Correct.

said by gpatrick900

:

I dont know why they dont move a stations like HSN or QVC.

Because those networks are paying MSOs big bucks to stay analog.

said by gpatrick900

:

I might as well disconnect cable if I am going to have to get a box, qam tv. qam dvr. At least until technology catches up where you will not need a box.

Your prerogative. As I've said many times, either accept what is offered or communicate your dissatisfaction with the offering in the most effective way possible: By doing without it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22257445 Sat, 18 Apr 2009 11:07:39 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22257219 gpatrick900 :

said by bicker

:

Or a cable converter box, at low or no cost. And "low" cost is not based on a consumer's personal preference, but based on other factors. Figure that they can charge $3-$5 and still be in compliance.

I did find out I was partially correct. That comcast can not move a broadcast station to digital unless they move all analog channels to digital and provide a simple dta at low cost. The local over the air broadcast station must stay in clear qam at least for 3 years. Regardless if the station is moved to digital.

There was one other exception. If they have two PBS stations, they can move one to digital. Which I am not sure is correct.

The reason for the 3 year delay is to give time for technology to catch up.

I dont know why they dont move a stations like HSN or QVC. If you think about it, it shouldn't be on the limited service pacakage.

I might as well disconnect cable if I am going to have to get a box, qam tv. qam dvr. At least until technology catches up where you will not need a box. I am thinking of going the antenna route. Yes, I know I will need a box there as well but it is smaller.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22257219 Sat, 18 Apr 2009 09:54:53 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22256862 bicker : Or a cable converter box, at low or no cost. And "low" cost is not based on a consumer's personal preference, but based on other factors. Figure that they can charge $3-$5 and still be in compliance.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22256862 Sat, 18 Apr 2009 06:41:49 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22255557 gpatrick900 :

said by bicker

:

Must Carry has nothing to do with this. There is a requirement that MSOs offer some way of getting local broadcast channels on analog televisions. However, the FCC regulation specifically allows them to require you to rent a converter box for that.

Here we go again. Comcast made an agreement with the FCC not to move an analog broadcast station to digital that have the Must carry rule in place. However, the fcc said if they move all the analog channels to digital, then yes they can move the local broadcast station to digital as well if they provide a simple dta at low or no cost.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22255557 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 21:01:25 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22255463 bicker : Must Carry has nothing to do with this. There is a requirement that MSOs offer some way of getting local broadcast channels on analog televisions. However, the FCC regulation specifically allows them to require you to rent a converter box for that. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22255463 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 20:39:09 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22255448 gpatrick900 : Talking to the local offices in Indiana they have no idea about these DTA. It seems like it is over their head. All they want to do is give you a converter box.

What I want to know if this is against the FCC must carry rule or the agreement that Comcast Made with the FCC.

I am on Limited service (Sometimes called very basic)
They moved an over the air channel to digital. Took it off analog cable. To keep getting that station. I would have to get a converter box for each tv. I thought they had to keep analog broadcast stations on for three years from Feb 2009. According to local office it is a must carry station. Unless, they are allowed to drop one PBS stations. The one they dropped is closer to me.

If I understand the agreement, they must drop all analog channels including channels in a higher package before moving any broadcast stations that has a must carry rule in place and provide a simple DTA.

I did read this thread, I was not clear on one point.
Is there a one time or a monthly charge for the DTA?

Also, I was told by a higher up. It is not available for my area yet but will be. I am considering my options. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22255448 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 20:34:23 EDT Re: Purpose of this? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22181792 bicker : DTAs are QAM tuners. Antennas need ATSC tuners. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22181792 Sat, 04 Apr 2009 06:46:58 EDT Re: Purpose of this? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22181162 dishrich :

said by Nate650

:

Hello all, will this work with an antenna

No, & why WOULD you want it to anyway, if you have cc cable anyway??? :huh:
If you want a box for an antenna, get 2 for next to nothing from www.dtv2009.gov ;) ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22181162 Sat, 04 Apr 2009 00:28:25 EDT Purpose of this? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22181126 Nate650 : Hello all, will this work with an antenna or does it have to be hooked up to Comcast service? I tried to use this with an antenna instead of a digital converter box but didn't get any signal, so I'm guessing it's tied to Comcast service? Thanks a lot.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22181126 Sat, 04 Apr 2009 00:17:17 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22099799 bicker : To be fair, your frustration comes mostly from not understanding the situation, and your difficulties come mostly from ramifications of intention, not a "mess".

The fact of the matter is that terrestrial cable companies are switching from analog to digital, so that they can hope to compete with fiber-line and satellite services. This should not be a surprise: Every company wants to compete well in the marketplace, and in the subscription television space, that means having new and better services all the time. Given that there is only one wire going into your home, that means that, over time, services will come, stay for a while, and then be retired. It is now analog cable's time to be retired.

It is very simple unless you make it difficult: Plug the coax into the input of the DTA, and then connect one of the outputs of the DTA to your television (analog or digital).

It only gets complicated if you choose to add other devices to your set-up, and in that case it is your decision to do so, and your responsibility to either have or obtain the knowledge necessary. Tech support can help introduce a VCR or DVR into the mix, but only to the extent that you are willing and capable of understanding what they're telling you. If it sounds too complicated, then you either need to learn more, or call on a friend to help you -- or borrow some friends-in-abstentia by presenting your need on an Internet forum, and let the folks there help you understand how to do what you need to. That's why many of us are here in this forum.

It would be great if they did have people standing by at all times to rush out to our homes and hand-hold us through everything. However, we simply don't pay any mass-market supplier enough for any of them to offer that, in any industry. And I don't want to pay one penny extra to support that level of service, since I don't need it. And evidently most customers are like me: They prefer lower prices over lots of extra hand-holding.

One thing that it is very important you understand about DTAs: They take in the multi-channel cable signal, and put out one channel's audio and video. Basically, you lose any features that are provide by your VCR, DVR or television by way of it's tuner. That's not a conspiracy or a crime. There is a federal regulation that specified precisely how to have cable service and still enjoy such features provided by your VCR's, DVR's or television's tuner -- that federal regulation is satisfied by CableCARD. If your VCR, DVR or television doesn't support CableCARD, then you have made a decision to not pay the extra amount necessary to comply with your obligations relevant to the federal regulation, so you won't reap the benefits of the features your VCR's, DVR's or television's tuner offers you, such as watch one channel while recording another. If you have a problem with the law, talk to your Members of Congress. Until the law is changed, however, cable companies have to comply with it, and you have to do your part as well, in order to gain the benefits of the law.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22099799 Fri, 20 Mar 2009 06:49:43 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22099333 anon : What nobody is telling us, is do we in Washington State need this Digital Transport adapter; if we have digital TV that is less than a year old? This is so frustrating; Comcast sent us a box call "on demand" the only thing it demanded was my temper; the VCR doesn't work, you can't watch anther channel if you do happen to get the VCR to work, and help is out of the question; they are over whelmed and not well trained. They also sent us two small boxes called Digital Transport Adapter boxes; they are for our analog TV's; after fighting with the box for over 12 hours we can use our VCR however, if you chose to tape a show you can forget watching something else. What a mess.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22099333 Fri, 20 Mar 2009 01:00:13 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22080041 cableric : Only if you're trying to connect the DTA to your PC.

ce]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22080041 Mon, 16 Mar 2009 22:20:37 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22054644 RyC : I just picked up a few of these for my TV's. I just want to ask, will this affect the Clear QAM channels in HD that are broadcast over the air? I have a Clear QAM TV tuner in my computer that pretty much exclusively tunes to NBC, FOX, CBS, and CW and I do not want to lose these channels that I can tune to without a box of any sort. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22054644 Wed, 11 Mar 2009 21:22:01 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22053008 ak3883 : I agree, probably not worth it in the long run. Most people are clueless when it comes to finding channels via clearQAM anyway.

I might downgrade to limited basic again this summer, although I do hesitate to a bit more since they have now twice given me 12 months on my promo instead of 6. Currently i just have Digital Classic and 1 HD-DVR for 50/month, which is pretty good. Regular rates that would probably be close to 75,80/month. Once sweeps are over in May, I'll probably just turn in the DVR and downgrade, I just don't watch much during summertime. The way the channels are on my system now, I would still get digital starter channels with a limited basic trap on... they haven't moved them yet to frequencies blocked by the traps. I know they will do that when they remove analongs, which is probably sometime this summer. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22053008 Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:26:16 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22052139 dishrich :

said by ak3883

:

Limited basic subs will get these economy channels w/o paying for them. Not my problem, I'm just saying..

Oh, I guess I confused your "economy ch" w/my "limited" ch - I forgot, because our system JUST got this pkg. Good point, maybe cc will have another type of trap for these instances - considering that they probably do not sell a lot of the "economy pkg", might not be a big deal to get a few "special" traps for these purposes.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22052139 Wed, 11 Mar 2009 14:13:57 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22051898 ak3883 : But say a customer has limited basic, so he gets channels 2-23. They will then get those 20 economy channels, because they cannot be encrypted(in order for DTAs to pick them up) and you are saying they'll be put in the 2-23 range.

Limited basic subs will get these economy channels w/o paying for them. Not my problem, I'm just saying..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22051898 Wed, 11 Mar 2009 13:31:43 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22046003 dishrich :

said by ak3883

:

But what will they do with the digital versions of those 20 or so economy channels?

Simple - they put THOSE digitals in the range of the modem-only traps that knock out limited basic.
eg: on our system, ch 2-23 are our limited basic, & they just removed THREE of the analog versions on 14, 20 & 21, which is more than enough room to put enough QAM's of the limited digitals. The modem-only traps ALSO knock out expanded basic, so no problem there, either.
Not really rocket science...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22046003 Tue, 10 Mar 2009 14:00:49 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22045552 ak3883 : You bring up a good point

Of course come the time when Comcast removes the B2 tier of analog channels, they'll move the digital versions of them into frequencies blocked by the current traps(let's say 30-70 for simplicity here). This is to prevent people who have limited basic(B1) from getting B2 stations on a TV with a QAM tuner. OK makes sense.

But what will they do with the digital versions of those 20 or so economy channels? If they put them in the 30-70 range, and trap customers who have economy, then cable boxes won't be able to tune them since they are trapped. If they don't trap a customer that has economy, then they have access to all of the digital version of the B2 tier.

And if those 20 economy channels are outside the range of the traps, then anyone can get them, including those who subscribe to limited basic B1 tier.

An FCC waiver to enable Privacy mode solves this problem... ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22045552 Tue, 10 Mar 2009 12:43:59 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22035584 bicker : Traps block signals -- they don't discriminate between digital and analog.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22035584 Sun, 08 Mar 2009 15:06:13 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22035389 eegad : I understand how the DTA's allow regular tv's to receive the digital signals that comcast is migrating to. I understand that if I downgrade to the new 'digital economy' package, comcast will put a trap on the line to block the analog channels that I shouldn't be receiving anymore....and the DTA's will then also just be reprogrammed to not receive those channels.

My question is: does that trap block the digital signals or just analog? If the cable is hooked directly to a newer tv with a QAM tuner, will those 'unauthorized' digital channels still be received??

More specifically.... let's say comcast puts a trap for analog stations 30-70. If there is no analog channel 56 on the system, but there are 10 digital channel 56's (56.1, 56.2, etc), does the trap block those digital 56's or can the trap only block an analog 56?

Has anyone here actually changed subscription to 'economy'? Can you confirm one way or the other if clear QAM tuners still receive the unscrambled but now 'unauthorized' digital channels?

(should you wonder, I'd love to downgrade to economy, except for 2 channels that I'd lose - abc family, and weather channel. i have one new sony with qam tuner, and 3 older analog sets (now with DTA's attached). if the sony can still get those 2 channels via its qam, i'll be downgrading. if it can't, then i gotta think about it. :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22035389 Sun, 08 Mar 2009 14:20:58 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21974776 JBrossard :

said by fsiegle1

:

I can confirm that the DTA's RF output is indeed stereo. The regular DCT700 box's RF output is only mono and this is a nice surprise for the DTA.

I've just hooked up my Pace DC50X, and I can not get any stereo audio, the TV doesn't indicate it is a stereo signal, and it sounds like mono. How are you getting stereo audio out of yours?

Edit: The stereo is just different, the seperation isn't the same as it is TV's tuner fed direct. I finally heard some music on the set and I believe it is stereo.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21974776 Wed, 25 Feb 2009 12:35:28 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21967082 JohnInSJ :

said by mda

:

alternately, does someone know of any digital-ready
recorder that will let me record at least six hours of
sd tv on removable media at dvd quality? the hdd/vcr combo
units i've seen will not suffice as they all seem to be
sq vhs, not s-vhs, so you only get dvd quality at the two-
hour speed, and the hdd/dvd-rw units i've seen can only
record for two hours on one dvd. i keep looking for an
hdd/blu-ray re-writable unit, which i assume would
probably do what i want (two hours of hd being equal to
eight hours of sd, more or less), but i have not found any.

thanks-

Depends on how tech savvy you are.

You can get a PC, and a digital tuner card (HD PVR 1600 »www.hauppauge.com/ for example) *and* PVR software (I still use GBPVR gbpvr.com which worked well with comcast and a clear qam tuner )

You'll need to map the clear QAM channels yourself - a 1 time job that sticks until Comcast reshuffles the channels - then you must do it again.

Anywhoo, back to the description

gbpvr will record the pure transport stream with no loss of quality. That would be a few GB for SD/hour, up to 12-16GB/hour for HD, onto the hard drive. You can watch recorded shows directly off the PC, or you can transcode them down to DVD quality and burn them to disk if you wish, at whatever compression you want. A really good compression system can squeeze a 1 hour HD show to 350mb to 1GB depending on the quality.

The PC (we can call that a Home Theater PC or HTPC, which is what you'll be building or buying) should have a good video card in it that has HDMI or DVI out, capable of providing 720p or 1080p to your TV (if you are going HD at the same time) or at least composite out for your SD tv.

All the above is a nightmare to get set up, somewhat less of a nightmare to administer, and a joy to watch.

The alternative is (depending on the speed of your internet connection) to get a PC capable of outputting video to your tv, and using the online video on demand services of the networks and Hulu to view content without the hassle of recording.

If ye be feeling yer jolly roger, arrr.. there is always bittorrent for downloading tv shows already transcoded and denuded of commercials.

Good luck.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21967082 Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:47:45 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21966741 bicker : I've read about block converters being extremely expensive -- like starting in the tens of thousands of dollars. That's all I know.

Regarding recorders: No. There is very little incentive for anyone to make and sell a recorder that meets your specifications. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21966741 Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:27:35 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21965892 mda : i'm in san francisco. just got the letter from comcast
about the analog to digital channel switch. i had assumed
that i had a minimum of three years after june 09 per the
federal regs before i had to deal with finding a substitute
for my three s-vhs vcrs, but i need to record several basic
channels that are going all-digital.

so, i called comcast about the letter and their "new
equipment". i described my situation in detail, asking if
the boxes were a digital qam to analog qam block converter,
so that all i had to do was to program my vcrs and nothing
else, aside from hooking them up. i was clear, i thought, in
explaining that the boxes could not be limited to manual
tuning, and that even a programmable vcr timer like some
ota boxes have was just too easy to screw up, so i did not
want that either. the guy at comcast assured me (ha!) that
these boxes did exactly what i wanted, so i ordered two. i
got the pace dc50x units, looked at the info sheet, and of
course, they were manual tune only, which is worthless for
using with a vcr unless i'm home, i remember to turn on the
tv so i can see the channel the box is tuned to, and then tune
the channel. of course, i still can't use them even if i meet all of
those conditions, as i have three vcrs in one place, and the
dta remotes all use the same ir channel.

so, does anyone know if someone does make a block converter,
one that will just transpose analog 2 to digital 2 and so
on (or will let me program it to do so) similar to what the
old analog-to-analog block converters did, or am i out of
luck?

alternately, does someone know of any digital-ready
recorder that will let me record at least six hours of
sd tv on removable media at dvd quality? the hdd/vcr combo
units i've seen will not suffice as they all seem to be
sq vhs, not s-vhs, so you only get dvd quality at the two-
hour speed, and the hdd/dvd-rw units i've seen can only
record for two hours on one dvd. i keep looking for an
hdd/blu-ray re-writable unit, which i assume would
probably do what i want (two hours of hd being equal to
eight hours of sd, more or less), but i have not found any.

thanks-]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21965892 Mon, 23 Feb 2009 23:08:22 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21885000 Anonymous_ :

said by Da Man

:

480P

it's the same amount of pixels
only 480p60 is EDTV

24, 30 is SDTV]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21885000 Sun, 08 Feb 2009 19:37:22 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21882412 Da Man : 480P=ED
I can't stand dot crawl even with a comb filter so I need S-Video. I can't tell between composite&RF.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21882412 Sun, 08 Feb 2009 08:40:35 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21881939 Anonymous_ :

said by Greg2600

:

While there is no noticeable difference IMO between Component, S-Video, and Composite under Standard Def, there is absolutely a worse picture with RF.

Yes component is way better

as it will offer
480p SDTV]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21881939 Sun, 08 Feb 2009 01:46:51 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21871528 anon : That makes sense. The DTA can't decode the HD stream... Neat that it has the channel map for the HD channels too.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21871528 Fri, 06 Feb 2009 00:49:30 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21870559 sansri88 : Really weird thing happened today.

I was surfing through all my channels on the DTA today, and when I hit WNET-HD it quickly flashed an image from the program currently airing and then went to a black screen.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21870559 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 21:29:01 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21870332 cypherstream : The messages are on all of the clear QAM carriers. The DTA only has one tuner in it to keep things cheap. So if you change channels to something on another QAM, it still has to monitor the stream for lineup or authorization changes.
It's not like a regular box which can keep one tuner locked on an out of bound carrier for messages. That OOB carrier was only about 2mbps shared across all set tops anyway. Not like there's a lot of bandwidth required.

As far as I understand the level that PC QAM tuner's operate do not present the data required for a program to decode a current lineup. Perhaps a lower level device driver or some kind of hack could circumvent this limitation, but then again it may be a hardware issue dependent on the PCI/USB QAM tuner card.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21870332 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 20:48:38 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21869372 plat2on1 :

said by fresnoboy :

BTW, I know a normal TV can't decode this info (it would have been nice if you guys would have stuffed the PSIP info on the clear qam channels so they could, and not need a DTA).

but then motorola and the like would be out of a job making their shitty hardware, and we can't have that can we!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21869372 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 18:09:38 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21869247 anon : BTW, I know a normal TV can't decode this info (it would have been nice if you guys would have stuffed the PSIP info on the clear qam channels so they could, and not need a DTA).

But why can't a PC QAM tuner card or something like and hdhomerun be able to decode the messages and generate a map properly?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21869247 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 17:45:21 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21869236 anon : Are you saying that they are now sending all the SCTE-65 messages that usually go out on the OOB channel as embedded messages on some or all of the clear QAM carriers? What is the standard encapsulation for this? Is this a separate program on the QAM carrier or embedded some some normal QAM video stream?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21869236 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 17:42:45 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21869183 cypherstream : Currently on a Motorola system edge devices remain the same (SEMs). DTAs are controlled through the DAC via two new background services, DTATM (DTA Terminal Manager) and SIGen (System Information Generator) .

DTATM manages DTA provisioning via wirelink commands from the billing system. The DTATM outputs EMMs encapsulated in MPEG Transport Stream packets over UDP/IP. The DTATM is responsible for sending messages to the DTAs, for generating the EMM PID stream, CAT PID stream, and for communicating back to the Business System.

SIGen delivers SCTE-65 messages and CVTs (Code Value Tables) In-Band on designated PIDs to multiple destinations. These messages and CVTs are delivered to SEMs over specific ports.

The SEM in turn injects all of these EMMs and PIDs into every unencrypted channel mux that the DTA will eventually tune. When the DTA is initially connected to plant it goes into hunt mode until it finds its TOQ or Turn On QAM via the necessary CAT & EMM PIDs. Once it has locked on to that table it will be looking to download its service name list (channel map) and receive authorization.

Unfortunately an off the shelf QAM tuner in your modern HDTV will simply ignore all of this information. Hence no simple 1:1 mapping unless using a DTA or full blown cable box... :(]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21869183 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 17:31:38 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868949 andyross :

said by cypherstream

:

Thats great to know fsiegle1! They finally figured out they should put a stereo RF modulator.

Heck even cheapo FM modulators for MP3 players, Sat Radio and IPods send Stereo audio! If what you say is true, it's about time!

For TV, stereo modulation is not quite as simple as FM. TV uses a patented compression method on the difference signal, which raises costs for royalty payments. This was done to give stereo audio nearly the same SNR as mono audio (unlike FM, TV stereo doesn't deteriorate and get noisy as much as the signal gets weaker.)
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multichann···on_sound]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868949 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 16:54:39 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868443 anon : Interesting. They must have used some existing message format to do this. This doesn't help TV's, but folks with QAM tuner cards or the hdhomerun should be able to tune this channels and build a channel map from it and then be able to map channels without manual user involvement.

This could be very handy indeed.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868443 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 15:47:31 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868354 ak3883 : I believe the channel data is stored in a QAM slot. My diagnostic page(s) had a field listed called "start up frequency" or something like that, and had 567mhz listed.

So I think on 567mhz, within that QAM channel's edge data there is some kind of map that tells the DTA what channels are on what freq and what freq/program # it can find those channels on.

You are right it doesn't have an OOB tuner. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868354 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 15:34:31 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868189 anon : Well he said the DTA has no OOB tuner, so I am confused as how to how it builds the channel map. I can't be statically loaded into the box, because if it was they could never channel the mapping which would be disastrous.

And if it is taken home and just plugged in, and has no OOB tuner, the user experience would be pretty poor, as no channels would be mapped until some sort of scan were done. So I am really curious as to how this got implemented.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868189 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 15:08:43 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868156 sansri88 : I don't think it's PSIP, otherwise my TV would have picked it up.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868156 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 15:04:09 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868143 anon : cableric, if the box has no OOB tuner in it, how is the channel mapping done? If there is no OOB tuner, you can't receive the VCT messages.

Is comcast generating PSIP data and inserting it in the inband streams? If so, that would be great, as many TV's use that data for channel mapping too.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21868143 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 15:02:53 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21866407 dishrich :

said by cypherstream

:

Heck even cheapo FM modulators for MP3 players, Sat Radio and IPods send Stereo audio! If what you say is true, it's about time!

But if you stop & think about it - so what? :huh:

The majority of folks that are "A/V'philes" wouldn't even think about using an RF output on ANY type of set-top box in the first place - they ARE going to use some sort of baseband output (composite/S-video & L/R audio) to the display device. The other folks that do NOT have TV's w/A/V inputs, most likely not only do NOT have stereo TV's, but could care less if it WAS in stereo or not.

It would have made MUCH more sense, & would have been cheaper, to just have put 3 measly RCA outs on these boxes - EVERY one of the new OTA digital converters has them, & considering they cost LESS than these comparable cable units, it makes even LESS sense! (but I guess THAT'S why they ARE being used by cable systems... :uhh: ) ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21866407 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 09:56:09 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21866273 cypherstream : Thats great to know fsiegle1! They finally figured out they should put a stereo RF modulator.

Heck even cheapo FM modulators for MP3 players, Sat Radio and IPods send Stereo audio! If what you say is true, it's about time!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21866273 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 09:28:13 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21866202 fsiegle1 :

said by cypherstream

:

Is there any sort of on screen display? I notice an Info button on the remote. Does it simply tell you the time and channel name?

Is the audio from Ch 3/4 RF out still in Mono like current digital boxes, or did they figure out BTSC Stereo encoding like the old analog boxes?

I can confirm that the DTA's RF output is indeed stereo. The regular DCT700 box's RF output is only mono and this is a nice surprise for the DTA.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21866202 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 09:05:45 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21866183 fsiegle1 :

said by ViRGEdx

:

I have some more hidden diagnostics pages. The following pages are accessed by pressing 1-2-3 once you're already in the diagnostic menu.

Hit the Enter button repeatedly to page through the additional channel pages.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21866183 Thu, 05 Feb 2009 08:59:54 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21582998 ViRGEdx :

said by Chaldo

:

Question: This is really getting me confused, Ok I have 4 tvs we use in my house, 1 has a digital box the rest are just hooked with cable. I want to know when the digital migration happens in my area, I will have to get 3 of these DTA's? What I want to know is I hear roomers that newer tvs already switch the signal from digital to analog so you wont need these boxes is that correct? I hear newer Tv's have a advantage somehow, anyone know how?

If your TVs have a CableCard slot, you're fine. If they don't, you'll need a cable box/DTA unless Comcast doesn't get a waiver for privacy mode encryption.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21582998 Mon, 15 Dec 2008 01:31:46 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21581208 Chaldo : Question: This is really getting me confused, Ok I have 4 tvs we use in my house, 1 has a digital box the rest are just hooked with cable. I want to know when the digital migration happens in my area, I will have to get 3 of these DTA's? What I want to know is I hear roomers that newer tvs already switch the signal from digital to analog so you wont need these boxes is that correct? I hear newer Tv's have a advantage somehow, anyone know how? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21581208 Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:55:30 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21578902 Chaldo : I am actually not sure, I called in for a HSI problem, and asked the question since the rep I was talking to was really smart. So I asked him if you knew anything about it he said oh you live in West Bloomfield, I live in Ann arbor and I believe both are cities are down in the list of where they are doing the digital migration next. I asked him are you sure he said they already did it to parts of Detroit, and he's pretty sure my city wont get it for another year or two ( I think hes just making that up ) but yea thats what I heard.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21578902 Sun, 14 Dec 2008 01:43:51 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21576455 Greg2600 :

said by Chaldo

:

I just found out my city in Michigan will get these DTA boxrs around the next year-2 years because we are like last onthe list for this digital migration. I am happy, other then that Detroit is like 2 hours from here and they had it done first, my guess is to piss off everyone stealing cable there haha.

What list?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21576455 Sat, 13 Dec 2008 14:42:17 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21574648 Chaldo : I just found out my city in Michigan will get these DTA boxrs around the next year-2 years because we are like last onthe list for this digital migration. I am happy, other then that Detroit is like 2 hours from here and they had it done first, my guess is to piss off everyone stealing cable there haha.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21574648 Sat, 13 Dec 2008 01:07:34 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21572173 owine : Thanks for the help. We're kind of a small campus so I don't know how we're setup, but hopefully we get to keep all our channels.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21572173 Fri, 12 Dec 2008 16:17:01 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21571148 ak3883 : I think you have nothing to worry about. The school likely would negotiate some kind of deal where just within campus, they keep analog cable. It's probably not a wise idea for a college campus to have to introduce DTAs, risk them getting damaged, etc etc. They would possibly have to distribute them with room keys, or bolt them to the wall, or something. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21571148 Fri, 12 Dec 2008 13:27:06 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21570507 miscDude :

said by AVonGauss

:

I agree with most of what you said except for the quoted part above. While I agree the monthly rental fee is not the huge profit center that most people think that it is, I don't see MSOs trying to get away from the more traditional cable box anytime soon. For them, it is a platform and hence another venue for them to generate revenue (PPV, VOD). I also believe that is what has driven the over-engineering and complexity with OCAP which in turn has resulted in a lukewarm reception of OCAP.

Ah, but with tru2way devices coming out, Your TV becomes that platform enabling access to PPV and VoD, and other 2 way interactive services. They won't be completely getting away from providing the boxes because not everybody will have a tru2way capable device, but they will be able to scale down a bit.

Owine,

Sometimes in situations like that, the college campus may have a deal/contract in place with the MSO to provide cable services to the student. Depending on the way the plant and everything is set up, they could start providing DTA's to the students.... or if the school has it's own node, they could even just set it up to continue broadcasting analog on the campus since they don't need to worry about the bandwidth crunch as much on that campus since noone can get digital services anyways.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21570507 Fri, 12 Dec 2008 11:42:28 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21569020 owine : I am confused how DTAs will affect me. I am a college student on a college campus living in the dorms. Currently we get extended basic (with locals in HD cia QAM) on the dorms. We cannot order cable in the dorms and get digital/HD boxes. If Comcast were to migrate most channels to digital, would I be out of luck and still need a DTA even though my TV has a QAM tuner or would I be able to pick up the channels using my TV's QAM tuner? Any help clearing this up is appreciated.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21569020 Fri, 12 Dec 2008 02:30:20 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21568814 dishrich :

said by cypherstream

:

Well as of today, you can now own a new 500GB MOXI DVR.

That is if you want to spend $799 for it's award winning interface and know that you *own* it.

Yea, I just saw this tonight on a full-page ad in my CES Pre-show Planner I just received. I thought deja-vu - they showed a previous version at LAST years CES & (obviously) NOTHING came of them.

Sorry, sight unseen, I'll pass on this one too, thank you much! :uhh:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21568814 Fri, 12 Dec 2008 00:50:54 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21568475 AVonGauss :

said by miscDude

:

In many ways, the MSO's would like to get rid of (or at least, scale down massively) the need for customers to rent a full-fledge cable box from them. The overhead required in maintaining, repairing, stocking, and staffing the internal support structure for those boxes mean that it is not as large a profit generator as many people may think.

I agree with most of what you said except for the quoted part above. While I agree the monthly rental fee is not the huge profit center that most people think that it is, I don't see MSOs trying to get away from the more traditional cable box anytime soon. For them, it is a platform and hence another venue for them to generate revenue (PPV, VOD). I also believe that is what has driven the over-engineering and complexity with OCAP which in turn has resulted in a lukewarm reception of OCAP.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21568475 Thu, 11 Dec 2008 23:24:08 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21566708 cypherstream : Well as of today, you can now own a new 500GB MOXI DVR.

That is if you want to spend $799 for it's award winning interface and know that you *own* it.
»www.amazon.com/Digeo-Interactive···1GQ8MT8/

Product Description
You've just bought a brand-new HD TV to go with a digital cable subscription. Now it's time to get the most out of it. The Moxi HD DVR is the perfect companion, bringing together content from your digital cable provider, your PC, and the Internet for display on your TV. You'll access it all through the Moxi Menu, the only user interface with HD graphics and an Emmy® Award. Designed to work with a Multi-Stream CableCARD, the Moxi HD DVR goes beyond a 500 GB HD DVR to deliver a music jukebox, photo display, game arcade and news browser, all with no monthly fees. The Moxi Menu gives you the power features you want with an interface that feels familiar after just a few minutes. The one-level menu, with the addition of turbo scroll, makes it easy to find content, and the Mini TV let's you keep an eye on your current show. TV 'Filters' such as HD, News, Kids, Movies, Sports, and Music let you browse just the types of programs you're interested in, and a preview panel makes it easy to see what's on next. In full screen TV, the Flip Bar gives you a mini program guide to browse your other options. The Moxi HD DVR lets you search by Title, by Category, or by Keyword. You can record one show while watching another, or record two shows while playing back a third. Record individual shows or entire series, or first run shows only. You'll find all of your recorded shows in one list for easy access and management. The Moxi HD DVR also turns your TV into an HD photo display and music jukebox. Enjoy photos and music from your PC or access content from Flickr® or Finetune. Associating your PC's playlists with a photo slideshow creates a truly multimedia experience. With SuperTickerTM and MoxiNet, you'll have two ways to browse Internet content like news, sports, financial and entertainment info, weather, and local listings like movie times. You've got your HD TV; now, unleash your HD life with a Moxi HD DVR. For more information, please visit www.moxi.com.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21566708 Thu, 11 Dec 2008 17:51:50 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21564974 miscDude : Ultimately you will probably end up needing some type of box for each TV to receive the full lineup of your cable plan, the form that box takes however may be different than what we see today.

Analog is going away. That's pretty much a given. Cable is also the only pay-tv provider that does not currently require a seperate box for each TV. As the Analog goes away, you will need some type of box.

The current plan is the DTA's will help replace the analog "expanded basic" functionality of your "extra" sets currently in a much cheaper format. Think of this as Comcast equivalent of the OTA boxes you can get coupons for.

Now the box you will need for each TV could be a comcast provided box, a tru2way device, a DTA, A clear-QAM TV, and a current-gen Cablecard device. MSO's are attempting to get away from the RF Traps because they require a truck-roll anytime a service change is made, and they can also cause problems with your service. (Trap goes bad, or gets forgotten about, and you all of a sudden have MAJOR RF issues in your home). RF Traps also aren't precise. While they block completely the channels they are designed to block, they will also have an effect on adjacent channels. In the analog world this wasn't that big a deal because at worst you might see a slightly snowy-er picture on the advancent channel. In the digital systems it could cause major macro-blocking or no picture at all problems on any channel being carried on that RF channel. Plus, RF traps are expensive since they have to be custom ordered by the MSO based off their frequency plan and needs.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21564974 Thu, 11 Dec 2008 12:49:58 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21563019 Chaldo : Yea thanks, just was wondering if you where saying that companies would most likely have you not have a box for every tv because its a hassle or they would?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21563019 Thu, 11 Dec 2008 01:51:08 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21562847 miscDude : There are currently a number of TV's on the market currently with QAM tuners built in to allow them to tune clear-qam stations. Currently, that is what the DTA's are doing, tuning the clear qam stations.

Privacy mode encryption is a really basic encryption method. while I don't know the specifics, think of it as almost a rot-13 type of encryption where things are scrambled just enough to prevent someone from just picking it up, but it's not as tight and secure as the regular encryption used on your current cable box. (currently it's used on things like porn VOD to keep someone from getting porn in the clear)

One of the primary reasons encryption is used is because of demands by content companies that an MSO "protect" their content. As things go digital, there is the fear by the content companies that people would be able to steal too-high a quality copy of thier content. It is also used by the MSO's as a way of creating different service levels without the need for old-school RF traps on a line.

The FCC mandated that cable-co's seperate the security functions of their boxes from the tuning aspects. This is what brought us the cablecard. Today because of the cost, and low adoption rates of cablecards by consumers purchasing cable-card enabled devices, there are very few options available on the market for devices you can purchase and decrypt encrypted cable channels. These days your options are limited to TiVO's and usually higher-end TV's. The biggest problem with the cablecard spec is it did not address the 2-way capabilities of the modern cable plant. As a result, all current cablecard devices are one-way only, which prevents you from getting things like VoD or other interactive services. Tru2Way which is starting to be deployed should remedy this by allowing you to purchase 2-way capable cablecard devices. I've heard of the first DVR's coming sometime during the first quarter 09.

In many ways, the MSO's would like to get rid of (or at least, scale down massively) the need for customers to rent a full-fledge cable box from them. The overhead required in maintaining, repairing, stocking, and staffing the internal support structure for those boxes mean that it is not as large a profit generator as many people may think. Something I like to point out to people is that with a standard def box you tend to pay $6-$9/mo for the box rental fee. That includes your guide information. With a Tivo you pay around $7/mo for their guide. The guide isn't free and there are licensing costs involved to provide it (as well as the macrovision and other royalties that are paid). The monthly costs you pay for the guide to either an MSO or a 3rd party like TiVO tend to be pretty comperable. (And that doesn't get into the attempts to recoup the cost of the equiptment or it's back-end overhead in MSO box rental)

Does this answer some of your questions?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21562847 Thu, 11 Dec 2008 00:45:19 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21562273 Chaldo : Ok a couple questions, I live in Michigan and they are doing this pretty soon, first what is privacy mode? Second I have a honest question I will prob get a answer that I will expect, but If you pay for a digital preferred or a premier (higher) packages, and pay the higher price, Why do they have to charge your min 6.95 for every tv you want to watch it on. I thought you pay the higher price, you should get the extra channels you pay for on every tv maybe a 1-2 dollar charge on the boxes, but why 7? Why not let us buy are own digital boxes like they do HSI modems. To me its all a money game. I also want to know these DTA's ( I will have to get ) so I get 2 free, and pay 1.99 for the extra other tv I have and Im set? So they actually have to activate these (lol) Im going to laugh when I go to work at the liquor store one day in detroit and watch all the customers walk in "YO MAN I WOKE UP TODAY AND MY STOLEN CABLE DON'T WORK NO MORE THEY F'ED US OVER MY MAN" Can't wait.

So yeah Wanted to know why?

edit: one more question, do newer tvs have the power to switch from digital to analog while just plugging in the cable wire? Like do they have DTA's built in or some sort of thing that does this. I would think so, or are they planning in the near future to do this, It would just make things like it is now with no worries. I can also see the cable companies getting greedy and tvs not doing this because now they have a new thing to make money off of, RENT BOXES LOL!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21562273 Wed, 10 Dec 2008 22:31:53 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21561555 ViRGEdx : I have some more hidden diagnostics pages. The following pages are accessed by pressing 1-2-3 once you're already in the diagnostic menu.

The first page, the channel table, could be very interesting as an alternative to needing to hunt for channels whenever Comcast moves something. However I have no idea how to get to the additional pages of it; the channel buttons instead go to the next diagnostic page.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21561555 Wed, 10 Dec 2008 20:30:56 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21555389 AVonGauss : In fairness, it wasn't Kevin Martin's decision - it goes back over a decade ago. The original intent was to create an open market for the STB that would allow consumers to purchase affordable boxes and not pay monthly rental fees. Which, ironically, is one of the challenges cable companies are now facing attempting to go digital - all those customers without a cable box.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21555389 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 20:15:09 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21554708 sansri88 : Kevin Martin needs to gtfo and let these cable companies do what they need to remove analog, add more HD, and keep it not that expensive.

removable security compliance was the worst thing i've seen.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21554708 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 18:09:20 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21554555 cypherstream : When Kevin Martin is out of the FCC, they will probably allow Privacy Mode encryption.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21554555 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 17:38:55 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21554252 rv65 : The DTA doesn't support encryption yet so it those channels will be in Clear QAM. Thats if the FCC grants them a waiver that allows them to turn on the privacy mode. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21554252 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 16:39:55 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21552336 lupus : Currently, I have only expanded basic. I'm also using MythTV with two analog capture cards and an HDHomerun for recording in the clear HD broadcasts on my Mac.

Anyone know if these will still work?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21552336 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 11:00:18 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21537436 cableric :

said by narunetto :

Do you know when Seattle will be going to do this? Also, since everything is supposedly going to be put in the clearQAM then doesnt that mean if you have the lowest package, you might be able to get some of the channels if you have limited basic?

Dec. 15th]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21537436 Sat, 06 Dec 2008 12:00:19 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21536254 anon : Do you know when Seattle will be going to do this? Also, since everything is supposedly going to be put in the clearQAM then doesnt that mean if you have the lowest package, you might be able to get some of the channels if you have limited basic?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21536254 Sat, 06 Dec 2008 01:32:49 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21535040 luckystreich :

said by ViRGEdx

said by Travelfan1

:

VIRGEdx, that's what the package is in NJ:

»NJ: Digital Economy Package - 12/01/08

Nah, that's a good deal smaller than our Digital Starter package. Excluding the Limited Basic channels, I get something like 50 additional channels. Your economy package is much smaller.

So minus the Music choice, could the DTA tune in the other channels in the Digital Economy pkg?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21535040 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:11:10 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534917 sansri88 : No, those are two different tiers.

We also have Digital Starter, but they started offering the Digital Economy as well.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534917 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:44:10 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534852 ViRGEdx :

said by Travelfan1

:

VIRGEdx, that's what the package is in NJ:

»NJ: Digital Economy Package - 12/01/08

Nah, that's a good deal smaller than our Digital Starter package. Excluding the Limited Basic channels, I get something like 50 additional channels. Your economy package is much smaller.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534852 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:34:12 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534584 Travelfan1 : VIRGEdx, that's what the package is in NJ:

»NJ: Digital Economy Package - 12/01/08]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534584 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 18:43:54 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534400 ViRGEdx :

said by luckystreich

:

So if someone had the new Digital Economy package....where you get Basic channels + select Expanded channels (ex. USA, CNN, Fox News, Disney) simulcast digitally....

could you use the DTA for a 2nd or 3rd TV?

Would you be able to receive the Music Choice channels too?

I have no idea as to what the "Digital Economy" package is. Our lowest package is Digital Starter, which is effectively expanded basic + about a dozen more channels. Anyhow, the DTA would be able to receive the Digital Starter lineup, it does not get the music channels however.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534400 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 18:06:32 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534229 luckystreich : So if someone had the new Digital Economy package....where you get Basic channels + select Expanded channels (ex. USA, CNN, Fox News, Disney) simulcast digitally....

could you use the DTA for a 2nd or 3rd TV?

Would you be able to receive the Music Choice channels too?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21534229 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 17:33:55 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21533381 cableric :

I believe this is what you are referring to?

»www.lightreading.com/document.as···site=cdn

Yep. If they don't get the go ahead for P.M. expect trapping on a fairly large scale.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21533381 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 14:51:05 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530920 ViRGEdx :

said by dishrich

:

Whatever - the bottom line is, IF these channels ARE encrypted in ANY way, that requires the use of a authorized converter/receiver/box (ie: NOT a plain QAM tuner), & THESE units are capable of "decrypting" them, then these units ARE, in fact, running an "integrated security system". I don't care if it's addressed/non-addressed/access card/punchcard/internal jumpers/whatever - if this is NOT the case, then why is there all the talk about the digital signals of expanded basic NOW starting to be sent out in clear QAM.

My understanding is that if Comcast can't use the DTA's security module, then they have no choice - if they want to have DTAs they can not encrypt the channels those DTAs are to get. The encryption change out here certainly doesn't seem to be coincidental with the arrival of the DTAs.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530920 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 02:54:54 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530914 AVonGauss :

said by dishrich

:

I don't care if it's addressed/non-addressed/access card/punchcard/internal jumpers/whatever - if this is NOT the case, then why is there all the talk about the digital signals of expanded basic NOW starting to be sent out in clear QAM.

I believe this is what you are referring to?

»www.lightreading.com/document.as···site=cdn]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530914 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 02:53:08 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530840 cableric :

if this is NOT the case, then why is there all the talk about the digital signals of expanded basic NOW starting to be sent out in clear QAM.

I ~~can't~~ won't speak to Comcast's plans...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530840 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 01:58:11 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530804 dishrich :

said by cableric

:

Ahhh, loopholes...there are ALWAYS loopholes.

Well god ONLY knows if there IS one, cc WILL use it.

Comcast isn't stupid.

Well we could also argue about THAT all night, but...

It's not a two way addressable box, it does not, and will not, have any interactive services. Technically speaking there is no Conditional Access built into the box. Privacy Mode is encryption... but depending on how it is defined, it may not be considered CA.

Whatever - the bottom line is, IF these channels ARE encrypted in ANY way, that requires the use of a authorized converter/receiver/box (ie: NOT a plain QAM tuner), & THESE units are capable of "decrypting" them, then these units ARE, in fact, running an "integrated security system". I don't care if it's addressed/non-addressed/access card/punchcard/internal jumpers/whatever - if this is NOT the case, then why is there all the talk about the digital signals of expanded basic NOW starting to be sent out in clear QAM. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530804 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 01:39:19 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530766 cableric :

said by dishrich

said by cypherstream

:

I would imagine it could do privacy mode encryption if told to do so.

Yes they can, but if cc WAS to use it, then they're running afoul of the "no integrated secruity" mandate for cable set-tops. ;)

Ahhh, loopholes...there are ALWAYS loopholes.

Comcast isn't stupid. It's not a two way addressable box, it does not, and will not, have any interactive services. Technically speaking there is no Conditional Access built into the box. Privacy Mode is encryption... but depending on how it is defined, it may not be considered CA.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530766 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 01:25:00 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530573 dishrich :

said by cypherstream

:

I would imagine it could do privacy mode encryption if told to do so.

Yes they can, but if cc WAS to use it, then they're running afoul of the "no integrated secruity" mandate for cable set-tops. ;) ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530573 Fri, 05 Dec 2008 00:25:02 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530206 cypherstream : Nice!

So it can download code modules. I would imagine it could do privacy mode encryption if told to do so. It also knows the time, so maybe one day in the future (with an update)pushing info will tell you the time along with the channel and call letters.

For being able to take code and execute it, I wonder if there actually is enough memory and processing to run even a really simple sort of EPG.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530206 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 23:10:04 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530029 ViRGEdx : It turns out there's a diagnostics page if you hold down the Info button for 6 seconds or so. I apologize once again for the poor quality of the photos.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21530029 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 22:33:16 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21529940 ViRGEdx :

said by Travelfan1

:

virgex >> Back to the RF picture not being up to par with the picture coming out of the other digital box with anything else, other than RF: That's interesting, my experience is very different than yours. I have a Moto 6412 PII HD DVR that's currently connected to a analog TV. I tried all possible connections and I could not notice any difference between RF out or composite. S-Video was the only one that made a difference, so that's what I've been using. Have you tried to connect your analog TV that's connected to the DCT moto full fledge box via RF out? Or, a better question, how is your DCT moto box connected to your TV? I am wondering if the TV brand/model may play a role in the quality of the picture that's displayed using the RF connection.

Before installing the CTA in its final resting spot, I did test it on my older 30" Sony CRT. Compared to the Moto DCH70 using composite, the quality is a bit worse; the picture flutters a bit more if nothing else. It's nothing dramatic, but if you've ever compared an older game console using RF or composite for example, it's the same thing. Like I said, ultimately the image quality isn't anything to write home about.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21529940 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 22:14:54 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21526905 ak3883 : Interesting. Someone else a couple weeks ago said they were installing SDV equipment at the Bensalem headend. Now Sellersville is getting equipment to handle DTAs, cool!

If I ever hear anything from Comcast(I'm in Bensalem) I'll pass it along but I always read about things on this site before Comcast bothers telling us(if at all)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21526905 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 13:10:23 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21526852 anon : Comcast Sellersville office,It it looks like a local office not a Headend.Click on Birds eye for best view.

»maps.live.com/#JnE9eXAuMTE0K1JpZ···NTkzNzU=]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21526852 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 13:02:11 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21526696 pennstatejim : Sellersville is in Bucks County I do believe...So, looks like it might actually be the Bucks County region...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21526696 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 12:37:58 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21526554 cableric :

said by miscDude

:

Philly launched the DTA's??

Interesting, guess that means you guys in Philly may actually get some more HD finally!

Well, Sellersville...don't know where that is in relation to you...
--
Eric
Pace Americas, Inc.

(The views expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the views of Pace Americas, Inc.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21526554 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 12:20:07 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21525516 Travelfan1 : virgex >> Thanks for your replies, they really help.

cableric & miscdude >> Welcome to this forum as full-fledged members!

virgex >> Back to the RF picture not being up to par with the picture coming out of the other digital box with anything else, other than RF: That's interesting, my experience is very different than yours. I have a Moto 6412 PII HD DVR that's currently connected to a analog TV. I tried all possible connections and I could not notice any difference between RF out or composite. S-Video was the only one that made a difference, so that's what I've been using. Have you tried to connect your analog TV that's connected to the DCT moto full fledge box via RF out? Or, a better question, how is your DCT moto box connected to your TV? I am wondering if the TV brand/model may play a role in the quality of the picture that's displayed using the RF connection.
--
COMCAST of New Jersey II(Union) - Dead last in HD channels in NY metro area! Only 26 HD channels, compared to 102 for Fios and over 50 for Directv, Dish, Time Warner and Cablevision!
Verizon DSL]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21525516 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 09:25:48 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21525413 JohnInSJ :

quote:
I should also add that in preparation for this, Comcast ceased encrypting all of the Digital Starter channels. I have heard that the DTAs have a security module, but since it's not a separable module the FCC won't allow its use. As it stands it can only pick up unencryped channels, so it can not pick up any premium channels.

That right there is very interesting! If they would just broadcast clear QAM all the stuff they used to have on the analog side, then a consumer could decide to upgrade to (or just use) a clear qam TV, or even buy a third-party clear QAM tuner box. Or rent one from comcast for $2/mo.

Before I left here in the bay area they were encrypting all channels except for the rebroadcast locals and a few cable access & shopping channels.
--
My place : »www.schettino.us]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21525413 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 08:53:36 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524519 miscDude : Philly launched the DTA's??

Interesting, guess that means you guys in Philly may actually get some more HD finally! ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524519 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 00:19:00 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524478 cableric :

So does that mean they won't work at all on a SA system?

I don't know where SA/CISCO is at with their DNCS and DTA implementation. So far all of the sites I've launched have been Moto. Portland was the first, followed by Philly last week, S.F. in two weeks, and Seattle after that.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524478 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 00:08:55 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524457 miscDude :

said by cableric

said by cypherstream

:

Are there add ons to the Motorola DAC or Scientific Atlanta DNCS, or is there a new DTA controller installed in the headend to manage the set tops?

So does that mean they won't work at all on a SA system?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524457 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 00:04:32 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524445 cableric :

said by cypherstream

:

Are there add ons to the Motorola DAC or Scientific Atlanta DNCS, or is there a new DTA controller installed in the headend to manage the set tops?

The latest DAC Version 3.1.1-17 contains two applications for "controlling" DTAs, these being SiGEN and DTATM. In addition installation of a headend carousel server is required for software updates as these boxes do not utilize legacy out of band.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524445 Thu, 04 Dec 2008 00:01:50 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524370 cypherstream : Yeah sorry for so many questions, there's no real info about this box on Pace website. I'm interested in what it takes to deploy this from the Headend standpoint, not only what additional hardware may be required but what kind of impact it has on the billing system. Some whitepapers or demos on Pace Americas website would be helpful. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524370 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 23:46:48 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524345 miscDude :

said by cableric

said by cypherstream

:

Yeah I wonder how it gets authorized and how the channel map is downloaded?

Interesting Eric. Didn't SA/Cisco get away from inband System Information because of bandwidth and other issues?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524345 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 23:42:22 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524338 cypherstream : Are there add ons to the Motorola DAC or Scientific Atlanta DNCS, or is there a new DTA controller installed in the headend to manage the set tops?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524338 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 23:39:45 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524101 cableric :

The fact that the box acts like it doesn't know anything about those channels you don't get, actually adds to the theory that you have a seperate channel map.

It's a little bit different than a standard STB, the DTA operates off of a separate source_name_list as opposed to a traditional channel map, but the result is the same.

------------
Eric
Pace Americas, Inc.

(The views expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the views of Pace Americas, Inc.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21524101 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 22:49:33 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523998 anon :

said by cypherstream

:

Yeah I wonder how it gets authorized and how the channel map is downloaded?

It's still authorized via the DAC but all messaging occurs in-band as the box does not contain an OOB tuner.

----------
Eric
Pace Americas, Inc.

(The views expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the views of Pace Americas, Inc.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523998 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 22:24:34 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523936 anon : It's one way addressable.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523936 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 22:12:26 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523613 cypherstream : Yeah I wonder how it gets authorized and how the channel map is downloaded? Maybe some simple FSK carrier somewhere, or maybe it does work with the traditional Motorola OOB stream?

It has to get it from somewhere, because you activated the thing, and it knows where to go for each channel.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523613 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 21:09:43 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523545 miscDude :

said by ViRGEdx

onsidering the boxes don't have Iguide, I'd be kind of shocked if they used the same channel map as a regular box.

The channel mapping is exactly the same as with a STB. 500 is the same thing on the STB as it is the DTA.

I was refering more the the back-end channel mapping. They'd probably keep the channels in the same location because of the channel cards that are printed, and contracts with providers.

The fact that the box acts like it doesn't know anything about those channels you don't get, actually adds to the theory that you have a seperate channel map.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523545 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 20:55:16 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523513 ViRGEdx :

Do you get any channels over 100? Like Weatherscan is on 101 here and a few free subchannels like ABC News, ABC Weather, NBC Weather, etc... are in the upper 200's. What about Music Choice? That's unencrypted here. If it does get channels post 100, does it SKIP to them, or do you have to scroll through a bunch of "NOT AUTHORIZED" channels?

It does not get the music channels*, but it does get channels above 100. There's Galavision on 619 for example and Oxygen on 500. I don't have to skip through "Not Authorized" channels and the box won't even let me punch them in; it simply ignores any channel numbers it doesn't get.

onsidering the boxes don't have Iguide, I'd be kind of shocked if they used the same channel map as a regular box.

The channel mapping is exactly the same as with a STB. 500 is the same thing on the STB as it is the DTA.

So do you buy these things or do they have a monthly charge? if so how much per month?

They're rented items, being rented out for free as part of the termination of expanded basic here. I got 2 for free, further ones would be $1.99.

* I should add that they don't appear in the clear with my HDHomeRun either. AFAIK they're just another channel (with an extremely low video bitrate) so they must still be encrypted.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523513 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 20:49:45 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523479 neufuse : So do you buy these things or do they have a monthly charge? if so how much per month?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523479 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 20:44:48 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523461 miscDude : Considering the boxes don't have Iguide, I'd be kind of shocked if they used the same channel map as a regular box.

These things are pretty dumb compared to any other modern definition of a settop box, so likely their channel map information is a pretty basic one with just the expanded basic channels.

Honestly, it makes sense since these things don't have an OOB tuner to grab System information like the channel map from the traditional OOB source, So whatever method they choose to deliver the channel map to the box would have to be compact and unobtrusive to avoid causing problems with the classic boxes on the system.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523461 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 20:40:32 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523402 cypherstream : Thanks for the answers. It's cool that they at least give you a channel number and call sign in a nice font and contrasting color. Hell, that font's better than Motorola's font you see when typing channel numbers in the top center of the screen!

Now only if we could figure out if there's some sort of diagnostic mode...

Do you get any channels over 100? Like Weatherscan is on 101 here and a few free subchannels like ABC News, ABC Weather, NBC Weather, etc... are in the upper 200's. What about Music Choice? That's unencrypted here. If it does get channels post 100, does it SKIP to them, or do you have to scroll through a bunch of "NOT AUTHORIZED" channels?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523402 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 20:29:44 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523315 pennstatejim : Thanks for the information about the DTAs!! It's a great tool. If they went all-digital here, I would probably only need one in our bedroom, since the main TV has a HD/DVR...

Very cool! Thanks!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523315 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 20:16:15 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523002 ViRGEdx : Alright, Q&A time.

First, just so we're clear (since I thought everyone knew what a DTA is, my bad), a DTA is a scaled down cable box stripped of virtually all functionality other than tuning channels - there's no HD, no On Demand, no music channels, etc.

Comcast is going mostly digital in my area, so they're scrapping the expanded basic analog channels(32-71) as of January 14th, leaving just the limited basic analog channels (2-31, and even then some of that is used for digital today). Although I understand some markets have already been given the same treatment (Chicago?) we're the first widescale DTA deployment, as Comcast wants to try these things out here in Oregon before going national.

Being the Luddite that I am, I'm still on expanded basic cable (I had no need for digital beyond picking up the HD locals with my HDHomeRun) so I'm part of the 15% affected by this. Comcast is moving all of its expanded basic customers to the Digital Starter tier, and giving us 3 devices for free for the transition: the 2 DTAs, and a standard STB (I received a Motorola DCH70). As near as I can tell from Comcast's site, new digital customers still only get the first STB for free, so the free DTAs are only for people Comcast needs to move to digital. Clearly something will change in the future, either Comcast will charge me for the DTAs in a year, or include them for free in all of the digital packages.

Additional DTAs can be ordered from Comcast for $1.99 a month. For reference, I have no clue what additional STBs go for (Comcast doesn't list a price on their site), SD DVRs are $8.95, and HD DVRs are $13.95, and apparently you need to upgrade to Digital Preferred to be able to order the DVRs. Package prices are $55.40 for Digital Starter (the same as expanded basic was), $69.35 for Digital Classic, $70.35 for Preferred, and $119.99 for Premier.

I should also add that in preparation for this, Comcast ceased encrypting all of the Digital Starter channels. I have heard that the DTAs have a security module, but since it's not a separable module the FCC won't allow its use. As it stands it can only pick up unencryped channels, so it can not pick up any premium channels. The whole unencrypted thing is fine by me, since this allows me to continue to use my HDHomeRun on my main TV.

Is there any sort of on screen display? I notice an Info button on the remote. Does it simply tell you the time and channel name?

As you can see in the following screenshot, you only get the channel number and the station callsign. The box doesn't appear to keep track of time, and it has no further features (programming guide, etc).

Is the audio from Ch 3/4 RF out still in Mono like current digital boxes, or did they figure out BTSC Stereo encoding like the old analog boxes?

I think it's stereo, but the TVs my DTAs are hooked up to are mono, so I have no quick way to test it.

You can receive all the premium channels right?

No, only unencrypted Digital Starter channels.

One interesting point that you made: You said the picture quality isn't anything to write home about. You made this comment compared to what? Like, say, were you to plug a S-Video out from a regular digital cable box to the same TV, the picture quality would improve?

Compared to being able to use something other than RF.

Hows the channel tune performance. When you quickly push Ch up or down, is it relatively fast? Does it lag or hang up on you?

Tuning performance is pretty poor (I'm new to digital so I have no idea how it compares to other devices, but compared to analog it's poor), I measured it at 2 seconds. There is no lag in trying to flip through channels quickly however, if you switch again while it's tuning a previous channel, it simply stops and moves on to the next one. Basically it doesn't start to tune a channel until you stop flipping channels.

Is this something available for purchase from Comcast or do you still have to rent it, and if so, what's the price difference between this and a STB?

Rental only. I have no idea what renting a STB costs, so I can't give you a price difference. Sorry.

Beyond that, I wouldn't be surprised if there was at least some sort of simple way to authorize these boxes on the cable plant, ether thru a "keep alive" message or some other indirect way they can shut one down

That's more or less on the dot. In spite of only being able to tune unencrypted channels, it did not tune anything until remotely activated. I have no idea what would happen if I tried to move it somewhere else though.

What is Comcast charging/month for the box and what channels does it receive?

Beyond the 2 free DTAs, it would be $1.99 for each additional one. It can receive all of the Digital Starter channels.

Here's my question though, if before you had just basic or expanded analog, not digital, and now get this box, will you get all the non-premium digital channels? Or will you have to be forced into buying expanded digital tier? This box does not de-encrypt so Comcast can't separate those packages anymore, no?

All expanded basic customers are being automatically converted to Digital Starter at the same price. This box can pick up those channels and nothing else (whether the channels that you get with Proffered are "premium" or not, I guess depends on the definition). This box does not currently decrypt anything, so the Digital Starter tier is unencrypted.

Hmmmm... Ya know, I'm thinking someone needs to put together a FAQ that includes some sort of (semi)official terminology to refer to the different box types now.

The worst part is that no one (even Comcast) seems to be able to remember what DTA stands for. Apparently it's Digital Transport Adapter, but we'll see how long that lasts. Personally, I'm all for calling them Luddite Boxes and leaving it at that.

Anyhow, any other questions?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21523002 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 19:29:11 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522797 sansri88 : Definitely true. We would want people to understand the boxes, not to be lost in a myriad of unknown cable terms.

Probably should take this discussion to another thread though, we're going a bit off topic with this.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522797 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 18:53:33 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522774 miscDude :

said by sansri88

:

I'm up for doing that with other people that are more knowledgeable than me (like cypher, cabletool, yourself, etc).

IMHO... someone who isn't as knowledgeable would probably be better to at least start the list. Why? because the goal would be to make it easy to understand, and those of use who know a lot more have a tendency to overthink or make things more complicated then they should be.

Part of the idea is to make it easier for newbies or casual people to know what we are talking about. The last thing we want would be to have more secret techy terms that make it harder for them to understand what's going on.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522774 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 18:48:34 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522757 sansri88 : I'm up for doing that with other people that are more knowledgeable than me (like cypher, cabletool, yourself, etc).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522757 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 18:45:18 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522544 miscDude :

said by Joe12345678

:

It's not the $1 per box it's the $6 - $7 per box plus the digital cable outlet fee and you should be able to buy the basic boxes not pay forever on a $50 box.

A "Standard" cable box costs much more than just $50. Pricing I've heard says that the cablecard (the decryption components) cost more than $50 alone, and that doesn't include the extra hardware needed in a standard box, plus the monthly guide licensing fees the MSO pays for the guide information on your cablebox. These are the boxes you pay $6-7 per box for (plus digital outlet fees....depending upon market).

The DTA's are the $50 "box's" that they are saying you can get 2 free with a digital package that includes a "standard" box, and then pay $1 per extra. I'm also going to assume that the digital outlet fee isn't going to be in effect for the DTAs since technically it's not a digital outlet in the traditional sense.

Hmmmm... Ya know, I'm thinking someone needs to put together a FAQ that includes some sort of (semi)official terminology to refer to the different box types now. With DTA's, Tuning resolvers, "Legacy boxes" (DCT2000s), standard boxes (Non-dvrs), DVRs, Advanced setop boxes, Tru2way/OCAP devices, TiVo's, etc etc etc.... It may not hurt to try and establish some sort of mutually agreed upon terminology so everybody knows exactly what type of box you are refering too. It could help eliminate some confusion for people.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522544 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 18:11:27 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522458 Joe12345678 : It's not the $1 per box it's the $6 - $7 per box plus the digital cable outlet fee and you should be able to buy the basic boxes not pay forever on a $50 box.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522458 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:57:04 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522403 anon :

said by rra

:

It seems that everyone here is confused as to what this device does. Customer's that have cablecard installed on their tv or tivo haven't been able to get SDV (switched digital video) This tuning adapter resolves that.

You still have to pay for the channels. It's only purpose is to provide authorized channels a way to be viewed without a cablebox. This makes cablecards and Tivos functional again.

Why would this device need any output but coax. It goes between the tv and the wall or between the wall and the tivo.

The only reason it has a mac address is prolly for tracking/stocking purposes. You get it for free but I'm sure there's a cost if you lose/damage it.

There is a difference between the DTA (Digital Transport/Tuning Adapter) and the TiVO SDV tuning resolver.

One key difference you will notice out of the box....The Tuning resolver for Tivo's isn't going to include a remote because the TiVO will communicate with it directly when it attempts to tune an SDV stream to allow the resolver to handle the SDV request.

Beyond that, I have yet to hear of any Comcast site's actually deploying SDV, so beyond that test market in NJ that was starting to distribute them in anticipation of a SDV trial (and recently received notice that trial was put on hold because of some FCC decisions), I don't know why Comcast would be still handing these out.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522403 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:47:40 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522376 anon :

said by Greg2600

:

Here's my question though, if before you had just basic or expanded analog, not digital, and now get this box, will you get all the non-premium digital channels? Or will you have to be forced into buying expanded digital tier? This box does not de-encrypt so Comcast can't separate those packages anymore, no?

My understanding is that these DTAs are designed, and marketed to fill that spot for the "extra" TV's a customer has. The idea is that there are a LOT of customers who have digital cable with a regular STB, but may have multiple TV's in the house plugged in to just straight analog to pick up the analog channels. With the Analog reclaimation projects they were doing, they were pissing off a large number of customers who suddenly would see thier bill increase dramatically for those extra boxes for each TV.

Customers who are currently analog only would be served by existing promotions like the Digital Starter (or new Economy services) that provide a single traditional box free for the year and give them access to VoD and music choice, but there was no such "free box" offers for existing Digital Classic/premier/premuim customers who already get the full service digital packages on a TV but actively used 3 or 4 additional TV's with regular analog cable. These DTA's would provide those TV's with the ability to keep those old "analog" channels as they move to digitial.

This is kind of supported by the pricing I've heard on the DTA's where you can get 1 or 2 free with an existing digital package and only maybe $1 for additional boxes.

If you figure your "average" digital customer only maybe has 1 digital outlet in the living room, but takes advantage of the analog cable in the kitchen, kids bedroom (Don't need to give the kids access to skinamax or PPV after all), or master bedroom, This allows them to continue receiving the same basic services with no increase in overall cost, and still allows the MSO to do the bandwidth reclaimation they want/need to do.

The Analog only customers there has been a steady effort to try and get them to at least an entry level digital service for quite awhile, and I don't see that strategy changing. (And with the recent announcements and launching of the Economy tier which includes a standard box, cheaper than your traditional analog expanded basic, that strategy isn't changing, it's just evolving).

Then you get those people with 8 tv's who complain about the analogs going away because they would need 8 boxes vs. the 2 they may have now. I'd say this is probably easily a minority of cable customers, and while they may have a valid argument with having a $60-$100 increase in monthly cost with traditional boxes, The $1 per extra after 2 boxes, that arguement loses a lot of teeth when you are looking at only an additional $4/mo. (if you can afford 8 tvs, $4 ain't gonna kill ya).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522376 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:42:07 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522315 rra : It seems that everyone here is confused as to what this device does. Customer's that have cablecard installed on their tv or tivo haven't been able to get SDV (switched digital video) This tuning adapter resolves that.

You still have to pay for the channels. It's only purpose is to provide authorized channels a way to be viewed without a cablebox. This makes cablecards and Tivos functional again.

Why would this device need any output but coax. It goes between the tv and the wall or between the wall and the tivo.

The only reason it has a mac address is prolly for tracking/stocking purposes. You get it for free but I'm sure there's a cost if you lose/damage it. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522315 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 17:29:02 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522089 Greg2600 : I can say unequivocally that most people only use the RF cables to connect to a TV. Only on HDTV's have they not, because you can't get HD without Component or HDMI. While I see Comcast putting the term "Bedroom" TV into their manual for this device, they are not treating it as such. Clearly the aim is for the many people who have no box whatsoever. In the past, all the providers have had no problem mandating STB's to receive channels, and later moving Premiums to digital to force you into Digital cable more or less. This is to satisfy those you currently have only Analog on one, maybe two TV's.

Here's my question though, if before you had just basic or expanded analog, not digital, and now get this box, will you get all the non-premium digital channels? Or will you have to be forced into buying expanded digital tier? This box does not de-encrypt so Comcast can't separate those packages anymore, no?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21522089 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 16:45:58 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521586 cypherstream : Yeah because internally there should be baseband audio and video feeding an RF modulator. Tap the lines prior to the RF modulator and you may be able to extract a composite signal.

Not impossible, they are just keeping things cheap.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521586 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 15:21:44 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521463 dishrich :

said by Da Man

:

MTS is hard to do at the box from what I read. The analog boxes just took the channel and moved to it Ch 3/4 (no re encoding). 100% digital picture&sound now means RF modulated picture with mono sound.

+1 - of course, they could have put in a stereo mod; YEA, THAT'S going to happen on a box of this caliber...

They would be better off spending .25 to have put in composite A/V jacks - I mean really, if those cheap OTA digital tuners can ALL have them, there is NO reason these shouldn't have, too! ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521463 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 15:02:19 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521217 Da Man : MTS is hard to do at the box from what I read. The analog boxes just took the channel and moved to it Ch 3/4 (no re encoding). 100% digital picture&sound now means RF modulated picture with mono sound. I can get that on YouTube for free.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521217 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 14:14:52 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521108 Greg2600 : No premium channels? That definitely stinks. I wonder if Comcast will also charge their lovely "digital outlet" fee even if the box is free? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521108 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 13:51:53 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521004 ak3883 : Great writeup and pics, thanks!

Basically this thing is a QAM tuner, there is NO encryption used(for now). Any channel that an HDTV with a QAM tuner can pick up all of the channels that this thing does, except this DTA calls them by their old channels, like ch 40 is CNN, not 87-3 or whatever.

They could not put a cableCARD in these because it would be way too expensive. Removable security/conditional access cards are now required if you want to use any form of encryption. This was an FCC mandate back in the summer of 2006. Verizon won an exception by eliminating all of their analog signals, so new STBs that they deplay CAN have integrated security. Comcast applied for an exemption for these DTAs, and the FCC denied their request.

I think it has been said that the first 2 DTAs are free if you subscribe to at least digital starter, or something like that. They are designed for bedroom TVs, or TVs that don't get as much use, that you want to continue to be able to watch cable TV on, but don't use it enough to justify paying the few bucks a month for a regular cable box. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21521004 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 13:29:07 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520753 anon : What is Comcast charging/month for the box and what channels does it receive?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520753 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 12:42:33 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520746 anon : From my understanding about these boxes, they are basically designed to be a cheap QAM tuner that will also apply the traditional channel map. (So instead of getting channel 113.2 you see channel 45 like every other box and traditional analog). They are not really designed and intended to replace the traditional cable box for digital cable, but to instead bridge the gap for old-school "cable ready" TV's as those cable ready analog signals are pulled and replaced by digital versions of the analog lineup. As just a QAM tuner designed to go replace the analog going straight into the back of a TV, don't really think the added output options are really that big a deal.

Some things to note.... No cablecard. because of the price point I do not expect these boxes to decrypt your currently encrypted QAM signals, so your premiums, digital classic, and other advanced teirs don't expect to get on this box. Likely they will just unencrypt the standard "expanded" lineup to allow these boxes to tune them. If they are really paranoid about pirating, I don't know if these boxes are capable of doing the simple "privacy mode" encryption that is currently done on the VOD streams... but that may also require a FCC waiver so it may or may not be activated.

The MAC address is probably there in part because most electronic devices, especcially those connecting to a network, have one these days. Beyond that, I wouldn't be surprised if there was at least some sort of simple way to authorize these boxes on the cable plant, ether thru a "keep alive" message or some other indirect way they can shut one down. Considering the number of stolen cable boxes you see on Ebay, It wouldn't be too much of a jump to assume when these things were designed they included a way to prevent a box from activating or working on a foreign system as a security measure and deterrent.

From what I've heard, the on screen display consists of just the channel number when flipping channels. Since there isn't a front LED display, and no guide, you just receive a simple channel number (and maybe channel call-letter short description deally) to let you know what channel you are on.

As for the shortages issues.... I wouldn't be surprised if that's another reason for the slow roll out so far. Not so much because they have a shortage now, but maybe so they can figure out what kind of demand they might expect in a live system so they can then properly ensure they have enough in stock once they get more agressive. "Let's see.... for every XX number of digital boxes, we had requests for XX number of DTAs. Therefor, we should make sure we have XXXXXX number in inventory and available before we yank these channels."

Theoretical forecasting is one thing.... having some hard data to work with can make that forcasting much more accurate.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520746 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 12:42:03 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520744 svengali84 : Is this something available for purchase from Comcast or do you still have to rent it, and if so, what's the price difference between this and a STB?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520744 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 12:41:19 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520451 pennstatejim : Looks good for the cheap alternative it is to provide for those who don't want the STB on their TV.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520451 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 11:51:41 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520442 plat2on1 : wonder why it has a MAC address]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520442 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 11:50:06 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520425 Greg2600 : cypher, great question on channel changing. Although without the guide to pop up all the time, it must be faster? Also, since there are three different manufacturers, and Comcast already started orders back in July, will there be a delay?

Travelfan1, yeah the PQ must be better than a straight Analog connection, particularly on the 2-11 channels. It's not as good as any kind of AV cable, but if you use a high quality Coax, the RF should be fine. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520425 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 11:46:25 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520023 cypherstream : Another question,
Hows the channel tune performance. When you quickly push Ch up or down, is it relatively fast? Does it lag or hang up on you?

The only problem with the DTA solution is manufacturers are going to have a hell of a time getting enough made and shipped on a timely basis.

There's a huge delay with getting these units in, especially if even only 20% of Comcast's footprint tries to order them. The time waiting for the DTA's to arrive could of been spent swapping out 750 MHz amplifiers with 1 GHz ones.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21520023 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 10:38:40 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519736 Travelfan1 :

said by ViRGEdx

:

...
The DTA only offers RF out, so the image quality isn't anything to write home about.
...
It's all very unimpressive, but if anyone does have a question, I'd be glad to answer it.

Great pictures, thanks for sharing with us.

Re all being very unimpressive, well, the main point was something really cheap that allowed Comcast to free up the analog bandwidth. And this DTA dongle delivers it.

One interesting point that you made: You said the picture quality isn't anything to write home about. You made this comment compared to what? Like, say, were you to plug a S-Video out from a regular digital cable box to the same TV, the picture quality would improve? Or comparing apples to apples, i.e., RF out from the DTA compared to the RF out from regular digital box?

Now, if Comcast "Freedom" area/NYC metro were only to move their... and start moving the non-broadcasting analogs to digital only and give the subscribers the DTA... Yeah, that will happen here around year 2020, maybe 2050... :p
--
COMCAST of New Jersey II(Union) - Dead last in HD channels in NY metro area! Only 26 HD channels, compared to 102 for Fios and over 50 for Directv, Dish, Time Warner and Cablevision!
Verizon DSL]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519736 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 09:40:34 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519621 Greg2600 : Great work on those pictures. FWIW I believe the Cisco and Motorola DTA's also have only RF output. That is definitely unfortunate. While there is no noticeable difference IMO between Component, S-Video, and Composite under Standard Def, there is absolutely a worse picture with RF. Although the ability to receive ALL your digital channels is a huge plus, and the reception is 100 times better than straight analog. You can receive all the premium channels right? I appreciate the IR sender, that's handy! The power supply is very thin, which means it will only take up one spot in a surge protector, also good. If Comcast would commit to pushing these to Northern NJ in the next year, I might stay with them come April.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519621 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 09:14:35 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519614 cypherstream : Is there any sort of on screen display? I notice an Info button on the remote. Does it simply tell you the time and channel name?

Is the audio from Ch 3/4 RF out still in Mono like current digital boxes, or did they figure out BTSC Stereo encoding like the old analog boxes?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519614 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 09:13:18 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519442 Drumtrip :

said by rv65

:

Looks nice, but a composite output should have been added as well. That would have made an improvement.

I think the point of the DTA is if you want/need composite, you should order a normal box]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519442 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 08:14:50 EDT Re: Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519072 rv65 : Looks nice, but a composite output should have been added as well. That would have made an improvement. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21519072 Wed, 03 Dec 2008 02:58:54 EDT Digital Transport Adapter Unboxing Photos http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21518134 ViRGEdx : As far as I know no one has done a proper unboxing of one of the new DTAs, so I've gone ahead and done one with one of the units that arrived today. I've photographed just about everything, so there shouldn't be anything left uncovered. And I apologize in advance for the so-so photo quality, all I had on hand was a Sony Cybershot. These are just a few of the shots, the rest are on the Picasa album I set up.

As for the installation process itself, there's not much to say. I hooked the box up to one of my TVs and programed in the TV codes in to the remote using the included remote manual. The box does not come activated and Comcast's online activation service is not yet operational, so I had to call it in.

This was part of a 3 box installation (2 DTAs and a regular STB) since Comcast is removing the analog expanded basic tier in my area. In this case Comcast had the DTA serial numbers on-hand already, so once I told them what I needed it only took a moment to activate them. Presumably once they start doing this on a national level, the website will be working and this will be even easier.

The DTA itself is a Pace DC50X; I have been told that Motorola is making DTAs too, so I'm surprised that it wasn't a Moto unit. The DTA only offers RF out, so the image quality isn't anything to write home about. Clearly if you have a bigger SD TV, Comcast wants you using a STB.

It's all very unimpressive, but if anyone does have a question, I'd be glad to answer it.

Edit: First Q&A section

Edit 2: We've been EngadgetHDed. I guess this is interesting after all, who knew?

Edit 3: There's a hidden diagnostics mode]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21518134 Tue, 02 Dec 2008 22:15:08 EDT