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My2Cents
@sbcglobal.net
| reply to TCub
Re: RIAA is a joke.
I am not trying to troll here, but you obviously don't know how the music business works. Everyone thinks that the artists will make their money back in ticket sales to concerts. While they do make money to tour (some even pay more than they get), the whole point behind a concert is to "PROMOTE THE SALES OF THE NEW ALBUM". Unless you are an indie band or been in the top 40 for more than 20 years, you do not make any PROFIT from the shows. Think of the money that gets shelled out for merch, gas, transportation, staff, lodging, food, repairs, and other hospitality items. I am going to stop myself from ranting but I'll finish with this..
BANDS DO NOT MAKE ENOUGH MONEY FROM TOURING, THEY DO RELY ON ALBUM SALES.
I love music too but I really hate hearing uninformed people making comments about how bands make money at concerts, they don't know what really goes on..
Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain! | |
TScheisskopf
World News Trust
join:2005-02-13
Belvidere, NJ
 ·Sprint Broadband D..
| reply to TCub
Your understanding of concert economics is flawed. The biggest driver of ticket costs, these days, is show insurance. The premiums for insurance for one show, in one venue, have climbed to the astronomical.They get even higher for bands that are perceived as having "unruly" fans or are "inciteful". Add to that all the other expenses that go into putting on a show(lots of trucks and busses need lots of expensive diesel fuel) and most bands are break-even on shows that take place in arenas and stadiums, when you look at the gate. Where they make their money is merchandising. A lot of cash money moves at the merchandising stalls for big bands, and even after the house and the merchandising contractor take their cut, the band makes a healthy sum, in a lot of cases the only profit they make on the road.
Also, the IRS has cracked down on bands for going out on the road for two years or more and hiring all their crew as contractors. It has been a dodge used on the road for years and the IRS has determined that it has been abused. So that means even more costs to the band.
But let me repeat myself: the single biggest driver for ticket costs is insurance.
And yes, I do know what I am talking about. | |
TCub
Premium
join:2008-09-03
Olmsted Falls, OH
clubs:
 ·Cox HSI
| reply to knightmb
thats the other thing to. how much money does it actually take to produce and get say a Kanye West album. I highly doubt they get that much money off of record sales alone. What really counts is the concert sales.
Think of it like this. A CD costs $15. The store takes a chunck of that, the record label takes a chunck, some goes to actually making the phyical copy of the disk and packaging and transporting, in the end the artist is left with very little. And even if you take 100% of the cost in, thats $15 per fan.
Now look at concerts. Tickets can cost what, at least $50 upwards, per fan. Obviously more people will buy a CD then goto a concert but still, the money adds up quickly and the artist gets more of it (in most cases) | |
TCub
Premium
join:2008-09-03
Olmsted Falls, OH
clubs:
·Cox HSI
| reply to pnh102
I will agree that trent can offord to give his music away because hes already well established. His first album, Pretty Hate Machine, came out in 1988! (Which was recorded in Cleveland!! WHOO!)
A few years ago I get into producing electronic music. It was of an ambient/expiremental sound. All of my songs were released for free on the internet through sites like PureVolume and MySpace. And while I was doing it I networked with tons of other independent artists.
I would say its definitly possible with the tools available to artists today to get your name out there and start playing shows for money.
I have a friend who's brother has been doing solo gigs for years now. Hes recorded a few songs with other local artists but they've never sold any CD's. They have however been on tour and not only played locally at coffee shops and what not but they've also been to other states performing with other bands. He's a pretty mysterious person but he only works one day a week delivering pizza on the slowest night of the week and he can still survive.
My point is hes making money and he isn't selling CD's. In fact I think he could be doing even better if he really promoted himself more on the internet.
It would be very difficult to achieve the level of success that Trent Reznor has off of just going with these indie artist sites alone, but you can make a career out of it without help from a record label. | |
knightmb
Everybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN
 ·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102  :said by TCub :Recently Trent Reznor (Nine Inch Nails) showed that record labels and charging people for your shit music isn't necessary. He released two albums (Ghosts and The Slip) all on line, all for free to download. There's only one problem with this analysis. The fact is, Trent Reznor is now an established artist. 20+ years ago when he was not well known, he needed a label to promote him. While he might be able to earn a living without the need for a label, the fact remains that had he taken his approach when he was starting out, most likely no one would have ever heard of him or NiN. That is a good point, but you have to remember that the recording industry works like a bank. You borrow money, invest in music and advertising. If you succeed, you pay back the loan plus an insane amount of interest, anything left is yours to keep. A lot of bands/artist that don't succeed are left with massive amounts of debt until it is paid back.
So yeah, mega stars have a much better chance than an indie, but at least in today's world, the indie band won't be millions of dollars in debt trying to get the music out. 
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jester121
Premium
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL
 ·surpasshosting
 ·ViaTalk
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102 :The fact is, Trent Reznor is now an established artist. Who?
kidding! | |
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| reply to TCub
said by TCub :Recently Trent Reznor (Nine Inch Nails) showed that record labels and charging people for your shit music isn't necessary. He released two albums (Ghosts and The Slip) all on line, all for free to download. There's only one problem with this analysis.
The fact is, Trent Reznor is now an established artist. 20+ years ago when he was not well known, he needed a label to promote him. While he might be able to earn a living without the need for a label, the fact remains that had he taken his approach when he was starting out, most likely no one would have ever heard of him or NiN.
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Blagojevich / Madoff 2012! | |
TCub
Premium
join:2008-09-03
Olmsted Falls, OH
clubs:
·Cox HSI
| They're not concerned with protecting artists, their out to make money. With all the shit music being produced today no one wants to spend money on it so the alternative is sue everyone.
When it comes to video games and movies, I'll ALWAYS pay and get them legitimately. Even if they're bad, that's my fault for not researching them well enough. I feel movies and games should be paid for because there's a lot of hard work that goes into them. When you pirate movies and games your taking from a lot of people.
However when it comes to music, I say download all you want. If the artist is good you'll go see them in concert and that's where their money is made at. I'm pretty sure they get shit from record sales. Music should be a single artists work unlike a movie or game which has hundreds of people working on it.
Recently Trent Reznor (Nine Inch Nails) showed that record labels and charging people for your shit music isn't necessary. He released two albums (Ghosts and The Slip) all on line, all for free to download. For the more hardcore fans he released physical copies of the Cd's that included some extras to make them worth purchasing. As a result of this release his music is now exposed to more people and more people will probably see in concert now.
The artist gets paid, the fans get to experience the art, without a price. Because honestly, who can put a price on art?
When you go to the art museum you may pay to get in, but you certainly don't pay to view each painting nor to you have any limits in how long you view them.
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And if you go, furious angels will bring you back to me. | |
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