approval from:
fAcEtIOUs 
hottboiinnc
thumbs down from:
hottboiinnc
| It's real simple folks..... ...if you want a seat in first class, buy a first class ticket.
Otherwise, park your cheap a$$ in the back of the plane with the rest of the riff-raff. |
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ronus
join:2003-02-09
Dallas, GA | You must work for Comcast. Otherwise why would you fear competition for Comcast? On another front, does Comcast count their Video on Demand (VOD) downloads toward their 250 GB bandwith limit? Nooooooooooooo. Do they count the bits used in their Digital Voice (Phone) service towards the 250 GB limit? Noooooooooooo. In my opinion, these are anti-competitive measures meant to horn in on the competition. It looks like they want to make money off the competitions downloads. |
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 espaethDigital PlumberPremium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2
 ·Clear Wireless
1 edit | said by ronus:On another front, does Comcast count their Video on Demand (VOD) downloads toward their 250 GB bandwith limit? Nooooooooooooo. VoD uses completely different frequency space from their HSI data service; they are never in contention.
said by ronus:Do they count the bits used in their Digital Voice (Phone) service towards the 250 GB limit? Noooooooooooo. A 64k G.711 channel will eat approximately 80kbps (with overhead) in each direction of the call. If you made a call and left it nailed up 24x7 for an entire 30 day month, that'd still only amount to 52GB of data. When you break it down to reasonable usage, the amount of data consumed by any VoIP service (CDV or 3rd party) is statistically insignificant with regard to the 250GB cap for all but the most extreme (read: rare) scenarios. |
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Reviews:
 ·WOW Internet and..
| reply to ronus
We could go back to- Did Comcast build their own network? Yes. Does Comcast support their own network? Yes. Does Hulu/Netflix build their own network? No. Do they piggy back on someone else? Yes. Does Vonage piggy back on someone else? Yes. Okay see all these yeses of course. So we can go back to Ol' Ed's comments and make the Content Providers and others PAY to be on the network.
And like the other person said- why should a Economy ticket get you first class services? you pay for what you get for. You know signing up with Vonage and everyone else that your Internet depends on the Internet provider. It's not Comcast's fault that you took the cheap way out and are wanting the First Class services and products at the Economy priced ticket.
hey Vonage! Go build your own network or start offering your own DSL with Covad in more cities. |
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 funchordsHelloPremium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Yarmouth Port, MA
kudos:5 | reply to espaeth
said by espaeth:said by ronus:On another front, does Comcast count their Video on Demand (VOD) downloads toward their 250 GB bandwith limit? Nooooooooooooo. VoD uses completely different frequency space from their HSI data service; they are never in contention. True for OnDemand.
FanCast is also VoD and does use -- and count against -- the limits and other management.
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Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon -- KJ7RL
... Should we pay those who are "too big to fail" more money to ensure they stay that way? ... |
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1 edit | reply to hottboiinnc
For the first time ever, i agree with you boy. OMG |
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funchordsHelloPremium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Yarmouth Port, MA
kudos:5 | reply to hottboiinnc
said by hottboiinnc:We could go back to- Did Comcast build their own network? Yes. Does Comcast support their own network? Yes. This makes a better argument for whether Comcast should be forced to allow competitive carriers on its network, not whether the content paying subscribers have requested ought to be delivered to them.
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Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon -- KJ7RL
... Should we pay those who are "too big to fail" more money to ensure they stay that way? ... |
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| reply to ITALIAN926
LOL. TY |
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Reviews:
·WOW Internet and..
| reply to funchords
No that's not the question. Comcast should NOT be forced to allow anyone else on their network. Vonage did not pay to build the network. Google did not build the network. eBay's Skype did not build the network. NetFlix didn't, Amazon didn't. So WHY should they be allowed a first class ticket if they didn't give anything to build it???
Why should Comcast or anyone else be required to open their network to someone else who just wants to lech off it and whine and cry over something? Comcast built their network off private funds. That network belongs to them. NOT to Vonage, Not to you, not to me. It belongs to Comcast Communications. What they do with that network is up to them.
If you want access to it you pay for it. IF you want your services to be first class over that network well YOU PAY for that first class product. NOT some cheap Economy product that relays on the Internet itself. |
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 RARPSL
join:1999-12-08
Suffern, NY | reply to espaeth
said by espaeth:A 64k G.711 channel will eat approximately 80kbps (with overhead) in each direction of the call. If you made a call and left it nailed up 24x7 for an entire 30 day month, that'd still only amount to 52GB of data. When you break it down to reasonable usage, the amount of data consumed by any VoIP service (CDV or 3rd party) is statistically insignificant with regard to the 250GB cap for all but the most extreme (read: rare) scenarios. We are not talking about how much VoIP calls contribute to the 250GB cap but about their being throttled due to the VoIP user's node CURRENTLY being congested and the user's bandwidth being over 70% of their tier's speed limit. When both conditions exist the bandwidth is throttled which will affect not only the non-VoIP activity but the VoIP Session itself. |
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Reviews:
·Comcast
·Charter
1 edit | reply to hottboiinnc
Because, that is the nature of the Internet. There should always be a "best effort" / "non discriminatory" set of bandwidth.
On the other hand, one should also be able to offer (for a fee) a "better than best effort" / "non discriminatory customer" service.
Unfortunately this is very fuzzy (without the warmth). |
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Reviews:
·WOW Internet and..
| Comcast does Best of Effort service. Their DV does NOT touch the Internet nor related to the Internet. so why should they be forced to put it on the internet just because a few people want to wine and cry about it.
And that QOS you talk about it does exist. Its called buy a T1 or greater with a SLA and set your own set of standards but don't cry after it hits the internet. |
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| reply to funchords
said by funchords:FanCast is also VoD and does use -- and count against -- the limits and other management. So if I use Amazon or Fancast, they both count the same. Seems fair, right? If Fancast was not included or only counted half of the bytes, then that'd be different. |
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espaethDigital PlumberPremium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
| reply to RARPSL
said by RARPSL:We are not talking about how much VoIP calls contribute to the 250GB cap but about their being throttled due to the VoIP user's node CURRENTLY being congested and the user's bandwidth being over 70% of their tier's speed limit. When both conditions exist the bandwidth is throttled which will affect not only the non-VoIP activity but the VoIP Session itself. I addressed the quantity argument because the previous poster brought up the cap.
In regards to the prioritization, it's not simply a matter of penalizing VoIP. When the channel is congested connections are going to suffer even if no action is taken. The new prioritization scheme simply limits the amount of impact to fewer people during times of congestion. |
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| reply to funchords
The real question is can I use a competing voice service, and the answer is yes. Seems instead like an attempt to add more taxes for intercarrier compensation. Seems like great timing to add taxes and increase people's bills in this economy. |
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| very true. |
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| reply to hottboiinnc
said by hottboiinnc:We could go back to- Did Comcast build their own network? Yes. Does Comcast support their own network? Yes. Does Hulu/Netflix build their own network? No. Do they piggy back on someone else? Yes. Does Vonage piggy back on someone else? Yes. Okay see all these yeses of course. So we can go back to Ol' Ed's comments and make the Content Providers and others PAY to be on the network. And like the other person said- why should a Economy ticket get you first class services? you pay for what you get for. You know signing up with Vonage and everyone else that your Internet depends on the Internet provider. It's not Comcast's fault that you took the cheap way out and are wanting the First Class services and products at the Economy priced ticket. hey Vonage! Go build your own network or start offering your own DSL with Covad in more cities. You would be right only when referring to the last mile.
Otherwise you don't even begin to have a clue about the internet or telecom in general, and concepts such as peering or even how the internet works (or is supposed to work). |
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| reply to hottboiinnc
said by hottboiinnc:No that's not the question. Comcast should NOT be forced to allow anyone else on their network. Vonage did not pay to build the network. Google did not build the network. eBay's Skype did not build the network. NetFlix didn't, Amazon didn't. So WHY should they be allowed a first class ticket if they didn't give anything to build it??? Why should Comcast or anyone else be required to open their network to someone else who just wants to lech off it and whine and cry over something? Comcast built their network off private funds. That network belongs to them. NOT to Vonage, Not to you, not to me. It belongs to Comcast Communications. What they do with that network is up to them. If you want access to it you pay for it. IF you want your services to be first class over that network well YOU PAY for that first class product. NOT some cheap Economy product that relays on the Internet itself. This is asinine for the very reason that some of the companies you mention do actually own their own networks. Google, for example, owns much of its own fiber, and owns tons more dark fiber that has yet to be lit up.
So in effect, Google owns a lot of the internet. It is essentially providing a FREE search service to most ISPs. Which ISP owns their own search engine that is as even remotely as good as Google's?
The argument for the "walled garden" is bogus, because the very reason people get internet access is to get access to the INTERNET, and a wide variety of open, unfiltered content and services. If it wasn't for the internet, and every website or service over IP that is available, Comcast et al probably wouldn't sell that much internet access, now would it? The days of content only from one provider such as AOL, Compuserve, Playnet, or even your local BBS were pretty much over once the internet took off. Most local BBSes have died off as a result of the internet.
So none of this nonsense about Comcast being able to cripple the internet and boost its services, because without the internet at large, most people would simply skip comcast and run to the nearest provider that offered them what they want. |
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 KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
 ·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to hottboiinnc
said by hottboiinnc:Does Hulu/Netflix build their own network? No. Do they piggy back on someone else? Yes. Does Vonage piggy back on someone else? Yes. Okay see all these yeses of course. So we can go back to Ol' Ed's comments and make the Content Providers and others PAY to be on the network. And like the other person said- why should a Economy ticket get you first class services? So what you're saying is if you pay for HBO, Cinemax, and Showtime, you really shouldn't get them anyway unless you build your own network and stop "piggybacking" on your Service provider's network?
Internet sites and services DO PAY for their usages, thank you very much, just like you do. Man why is this idea so hard to get across? THEY AREN'T GETTING A FREE RIDE. It's not like you can just bang your server "On the Internet" and from then on everything is free while you "Piggyback" on ISP's networks. SheesH!!!
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"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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funchordsHelloPremium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Yarmouth Port, MA
kudos:5 | reply to trentboyea
said by trentboyea:The real question is can I use a competing voice service, and the answer is yes. Seems instead like an attempt to add more taxes for intercarrier compensation. Seems like great timing to add taxes and increase people's bills in this economy. Good and different contribution. Thanks!
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Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon -- KJ7RL
... Should we pay those who are "too big to fail" more money to ensure they stay that way? ... |
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