fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3
1 edit | reply to KrK
Re: What the **** good does it do handing money to large MegaCo This isn't a stimulus package.. it's nothing more than a spending bill full of pet projects.. better yet, it really should be called "America's Ear Marks" bill... all earmarks..
Stimulating broadband? hah!
So.. it keeps some contractors to work.. I guess those people are going to be the key to jumping this economy? If the rest of the people can't "afford" broadband, then what good is building it?
Oh, I know.. maybe it was their first plan to spend 300 million in contraceptives.. or the millions of dollars in re-sodding the DC mall..
A trillion dollar spending spree for the dems... what a way stimulate the economy.
I gave hope to Obama, but sadly, 1 week later it simply looks like a group of dolts who think they know better how to spend everyone else's money.. and the worst part is, it's not with one voice they do it.. it's with many voices who all are speaking a different story.
I sure hope everyone enjoys their 1 trillion dollar broadband. We're not going to see tax breaks as we should.. rather, we that work hard get to fork over, I hear lately, $500 to those that aren't due refunds..
Socialists, be proud! ... this is your moment.
edit: I forgot.. don't forget about the 4 billion that wound up in the hands of executives at Meryl Lynch in bonuses for a failure well done, and, by the man who spent 1.2 million on remodeling his office so he could write those checks.. of course, Meryl didn't pay it, but now B of A needs more money after being slighted by this last minute move.
When is our government going to stop spending money, start cutting back, quit printing black checks and worthless money AND finally go after the people that have it and get it back? If they REALLY want some of our money back, .. um, Haliburton anyone?
People may say things bad about Fox New.. hell, I don't even buy all their nonsense.. BUT, I sure hope they stay on the corruption in government so people get the truth handed out about those living off the high hog of the tax payer. |
|
 morboComplete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000
1 edit | said by fiberguy:A trillion dollar spending spree for the dems... what a way stimulate the economy. you and all other Republicans would have had a point if the last 8 years under Bush and company didn't result in 6 trillion added to the national debt and the record deficits that accompany that debt.
Dems are big spenders? ha! George W. Bush: commander in chief during the biggest increase in government spending ever. how's that for hypocrisy? |
|
|
|
 pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | said by morbo:you and all other Republicans would have had a point if the last 8 years under Bush and company didn't result in 6 trillion added to the national debt and the record deficits that accompany that debt. And the fact that Obama is trying to top this with even more debt is a good thing?
--
Blagojevich / Madoff 2012! |
|
 KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
 ·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to fiberguy
Plus, it's convenient now to lay this all on Obama, facts be damned. Even though he is weeding out a lot of crap, too.
This idea of "Let's just stimulate by spending tons of money on everything" is pretty retarded.
If they want to pump money into the economy, they should either 1) Give it to the consumers, or 2) Spend it on capital infrastructure improvements only. They shouldn't allow various industries to line up to make a huge take for little or no gain to the taxpayer.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
|
|
KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102:And the fact that Obama is trying to top this with even more debt is a good thing? The bailout began well before Obama took office, and is pretty much agreed on by both parties that it must be done to "save the economy."
The devil, of course, is in the details.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
|
|
 Count ZeroMD2BePremium
join:2007-01-18
Warner Robins, GA | reply to KrK
said by KrK:Plus, it's convenient now to lay this all on Obama, facts be damned. Even though he is weeding out a lot of crap, too. This idea of "Let's just stimulate by spending tons of money on everything" is pretty retarded. If they want to pump money into the economy, they should either 1) Give it to the consumers, or 2) Spend it on capital infrastructure improvements only. They shouldn't allow various industries to line up to make a huge take for little or no gain to the taxpayer. We tried #1 last year... didn't work very well. |
|
 DogfatherPremium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
1 edit | reply to pnh102
It took spending us to 120% of GDP worth of debt to get us out of the Great Depression and you're blowing a gasket because our current debt is the same as it was during Clinton and even Ike as a percentage of the GDP?
You free marketeers who got us into this mess in the first place need to get a grip. We tried it your way for 8 years and we saw how it worked out. |
|
DogfatherPremium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
1 edit | reply to Count Zero
#1 is what postponed the meltdown into the late year. |
|
Count ZeroMD2BePremium
join:2007-01-18
Warner Robins, GA | Postponed but did shot to fix since all the money that was spent essentially sent to china. |
|
pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | reply to Dogfather
said by Dogfather:You free marketeers who got us into this mess in the first place need to get a grip. We tried it your way for 8 years and we saw how it worked out. And again, how is what Obama is proposing any different than the last eight years of record deficits and debt?
--
Blagojevich / Madoff 2012! |
|
pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | reply to KrK
said by KrK:The bailout began well before Obama took office, and is pretty much agreed on by both parties that it must be done to "save the economy." True, but I think you and I can agree that this has been a failure (as we knew it would be). The answer clearly isn't more deficit spending.
Watching the GOP push through such socialism was the final nail in the coffin for me. I quit the party shortly after the election because I got sick of watching the GOP act like Democrats. If I want to be represented by a Democrat, I will vote for one.
--
Blagojevich / Madoff 2012! |
|
Pv8man
join:2008-07-24
Hammond, IN | reply to pnh102
because the 1st so called bail out, was just throwing un-accounted for money at major companies trying to protect their interests by using lobbyists. And they were given the money in order to free up some credit for businesses, which they did not do at all. They just took the money and ran.
at LEAST this time, we all get to see exactly how much is going to what purpose, and at least open access conditions are applied to the networks that will be built (as they should be, since we paid for them.) |
|
DogfatherPremium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
3 edits | reply to Count Zero
Actually it went to the banks as people paid down debt. It wasn't big enough to actually "fix" anything. The Great Depression ended as a result of spending the national debt up to 120% of GDP. Only WWII level spending was large enough to end it. Our problems aren't nearly as large as the GP, but it will take much more than a few hundred billion to jump start. |
|
DogfatherPremium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
1 edit | reply to pnh102
The last 8 years was all about actively exporting tech and light manufacturing jobs unchecked, ramping up H1Bs to displace American workers in the US, and Bush-McCain shooting their pro-amnesty mouths off saturating SW states job markets depressing wages and decimating public infrastructure with rampant illegal immigration.
The era of Free-Trade is over and it was a complete failure for American workers and a boom to our emerging enemies like China. It's time for some Fair-Trade. |
|
Count ZeroMD2BePremium
join:2007-01-18
Warner Robins, GA | reply to Dogfather
Yea people who were seriously in debt used that money to forestall their fate, but people who actually spent it were esentially sending that money from uncle Sam to straight to china. |
|
DogfatherPremium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | If they bought Chinese built goods, absolutely, thanks in no small part to the last decade of accelerated job exportation. |
|
fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | reply to morbo
First off, morbo, I am not a Republican so you can get your narrow-minded 2-party system thinking mind out of your liberal back door. You clearly don't pay attention around here or you would know it. I make no bones about being neither republican or democrat.
Second of all, I will take my hat off to you. Apparently you ARE a democrat, based on your own logic (I use that term loosely) applied to your own post, and you think that one-upsmanship is acceptable and responsible form of government huh? So, Bush abused the public troff so it's okay for the dems, in the name of "change" of course, to out spend.. so what next? The Republicans are going to out-do the dems next? Do you EVEN SEE how stupid that sounds? That is SO kindergarten playground B.S. ... and spells out EVERYTHING wrong with government thinking today.
And, to give bush a TINY bit of defense... most of his spending went to the war that he waged in Afghanistan and Iraq. No matter where the war is/was being fought, in case you forgot, lib, we WERE attacked on 9/11 so there was going to be a big chunk of money spent to protect the U.S. ... further, you, like so many bandwagon cheerleaders forget.. the money spent today is not quite far outside of previous war-time spending, adjusted for inflation.
So before you get in here, in my face, with your weak rhetoric with your "yea but".. why don't you do some research, and ... quite frankly, grow up a little. ANYONE that justifies bad behavior by pointing to the other guy and saying "but he did it too".. show great weakness in your own argument, and, you should be embarassed.
... above all else.. YES. Dems are big spenders. You'd have to be blind to see that they are all over the gambit right now looking to raise taxes, in a recession which HISTORICALLY NEVER WORKS! and find things that are not yet taxed.. and tax it!
SOME spending is good, I'll agree, but stimulus from government spending HAS NEVER WORKED outside a war. What this tells you is that the government knows how to spend your money better than you.
Own up bro.. |
|
fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | reply to Dogfather
said by Dogfather:It took spending us to 120% of GDP worth of debt to get us out of the Great Depression and you're blowing a gasket because our current debt is the same as it was during Clinton and even Ike as a percentage of the GDP? Do some homework please. The spending that got us out of the great depression was WAR spending. Is replacing the lawn at the national mall part of a war? Is giving money to another country for abortion/family planning part of a war? .. is it even right or legal? (Don't be so quick to answer yes to that)
You free marketeers who got us into this mess in the first place need to get a grip. We tried it your way for 8 years and we saw how it worked out. "YOU FREE MARKETEERS??" Are you a socialist? ... please tell me where socialism works or has worked.
"We tried it your way for 8 years"... um.. are you SERIOUS with that one? You think the ENTIRE issue goes back only 8 years? Our history goes back far more than 250 years bud.. RIF, google it.
You want one of the biggest failures ever played by the dems? .. you want the nations largest ponzi scheme ever pulled off by the government on the people? .. It's call SOCIAL SECURITY! It's un-sustainable.. period.. end of discussion. SSI benefits as the way they are collected and issued can not be sustained. All BS party arguments aside, the way SSI is collected and distributed to people can't be sustained.. just like MagicJack phone service.
Now, to Clinton.. I don't know where you're getting your numbers, but under Clinton, who had a surplus by the way, he didn't need another digit added t the debt clock.
Seriously, some of you democrats are so high on something right now you can't see reality. It's sick. |
|
morboComplete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000 | dems? libs? b.s. social security arguments?
and you wonder why people think you are a republican. |
|
fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | reply to Dogfather
said by Dogfather:#1 is what postponed the meltdown into the late year. Where do you get this information? From the book of liberal? You think the "stimulus" round 1 postponed the melt-down? STOP WATCHING TV! The first stimulus came FAR before the so-called melt-down of the financial system, which was in September. The stimulus came in the height of $4 and $5 gas prices.. you really want to know where that money went? It wasn't China.. try OPEC. Try to higher food costs. The stimulus round 1 was a joke. Besides, all you did was borrowed money from yourself at a VERY high interest rate with higher future taxes.
Stimulus packages, like these, DO NOT WORK.
You DO realize the WHY of what caused the melt-down, right? It's called THEFT. Our country got ripped off by a few people while regulators were asleep at the wheel. Actually, what pumped up our economy about 2003/2004 was bush's so called tax cuts on the wealthy that he applauds himself for. What really pulled this economy up was people using their houses like ATM machines with relaxed rules and low interest rates.. that so called "stimulus" actually was a train wreck waiting to happen, again, under the disguise of tax cuts on the top end (ie: trickle down which doesn't work) becuase people SPENT MONEY THEY DIDN'T HAVE.. and the crooks gladly let them. So, here's the federal government spending money they too don't have. Do you need a ton of bricks to hit you on the head? Spending money YOU DON'T HAVE doesn't work.. the government giving you money you don't have, nor money THEY don't have, is the same theory and won't work. What DOES work is spending at levels you can afford which means cuts to needless spending, and trust me, the government can most certainly cut spending and not where you'd think.
Gov needs to stop the ear mark spending. They can cut the 150 million parties. (I've NEVER been for them) They can stop buying $5,000 leather chairs for people to sit in, and I don't CARE that it's to "look good".. they can stop taking town cars everywhere they go.. they can stop serving Fillet Mignon to people who work in the white house and government office buildings.. and yes, even for the President. The man makes over $400,000 a year and can afford his own meals like the rest of us, just like every other elected SERVANT of the people.
There is FAR too much partying going on in government and it's time to stop. It's not just at the top end.. there is also abuse at the very lowest end as well that is protected by unions.
There is PLENTY that can change to fix this problem.. and throwing good money (which is really bad money) after bad money isn't going to work.
And, sorry to break the news to people here.. faster broadband speeds deployed to people is not going to stimulate anything, ESPECIALLY with this crowd.. the same crown that admits they want to pay less and less. ANYONE here that puts up a cry for 6 or even 9 billion to get faster speeds in already served areas is themselves asking for a hand out.
Its time to start living with in our means.. EVERYONE.
I don't think you guys realize the seriousness of what we're facing. The United States is NOT incapable of going bankrupt.. at some point, it's going to break becuase we can't take this much longer. And, not IF it does, but when it does, it's not going to be pretty. |
|
