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Pergola - build or have built?I'm needing a free standing pergola on my back porch to add some shade in summer. I met with a company today and here is their quote: 500 sq ft in size all required permits 12 4x4 posts - drilled through concrete and backfilled with new 'crete 2x6 cedar bottom tier (left to right in the pic) 2x6 cedar joists 2 foot OC (front to back) 2x2 cedar top tier 1 foot OC (duh!) The price is $10.8k for them to build OR $5.8k for them to acquire the permits, place the posts and deliver the material to the backyard. Then we would put the lumber on the posts. I have a moderate skills in framing. A buddy was a framer for 10 years and we have another person who grew up on a farm, so he has some skills as well. I think we could do this, especially since the posts will be in place. It would just be a matter of installing each tier. I do want finished edges like is visible in the example. Ours will be stained, not natural. Nails or screws for fasteners? Why? Am I missing something? I would hate to bite off more than I can chew. |
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mityfowl Premium Member join:2000-11-06 Dallas, TX
1 recommendation |
mityfowl
Premium Member
2009-Feb-6 11:53 pm
I think you can do this for 1/2 that price easy. Including new tools. |
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to nocannothave
Unless prices have gone way up, I would recommend getting at least a couple more estimates or try yourself. |
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tobyTroy Mcclure join:2001-11-13 Seattle, WA |
toby
Member
2009-Feb-7 2:09 am
Over $16k for that? You can frame a house in some places for that. Bizarre. |
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IcarusCHAOS RULES Mod join:2000-11-08 Off Center |
to mityfowl
said by mityfowl:I think you can do this for 1/2 that price easy. Including new tools. If you do it yourself. Otherwise at 500sq ft,or 20x25ft,that sounds kinda reasonable for a team to come in and build. Keep in mind that a legit company paying taxes and insurances loses close to 40% of gross to the taxman and govt. |
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to toby
said by toby:Over $16k for that? You can frame a house in some places for that. Bizarre. Oops. $10.8k OR $5.8k. Sorry about that... |
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seederjed Premium Member join:2005-02-28 Norcross, GA |
to nocannothave
You could go w/pressure treated lumber on any non-visable framing, and it would be cheaper. Also you could see if there was any clear ceder in there and substitute tight knot and save a little more. If there is some clear ceder, it's nosurprise the price is 10k+. Clear has shot up exponentially in price lately. If you had them top the posts so they were level, anyone w/ a basic knowledge of framing should be able to put it together fairly easily. Whether you screwor nail, make sure they are stainless. You don't want them reacting w/ the wood and leaving grey streaks on the ceder. |
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horsemouth1Please Clarify My CSP Premium Member join:2002-03-13 canada |
to nocannothave
I use nails,screws and lag bolts in building a pergola. It is a easy 2 man job the hardest part is not falling off the ladder. How long is it? The reason I ask is I think 12 4x4 may not be enough. I built one using 6x6 once[it was 250 sq feet] you may want to look at that for a huge pergola like this. |
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mityfowl Premium Member join:2000-11-06 Dallas, TX
1 recommendation |
to Icarus
Ok. It depends on where you live.
This is sorta the problem in this country: We are are addicted to cheap labor. In all endeavors and industries. |
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to horsemouth1
said by horsemouth1:I use nails,screws and lag bolts in building a pergola. It is a easy 2 man job the hardest part is not falling off the ladder. How long is it? The reason I ask is I think 12 4x4 may not be enough. I built one using 6x6 once[it was 250 sq feet] you may want to look at that for a huge pergola like this. The 4x4 posts layout was decided by the company that gave me a bid. They are going to be placed every 9 feet maximum. |
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horsemouth1Please Clarify My CSP Premium Member join:2002-03-13 canada |
said by nocannothave:said by horsemouth1:I use nails,screws and lag bolts in building a pergola. It is a easy 2 man job the hardest part is not falling off the ladder. How long is it? The reason I ask is I think 12 4x4 may not be enough. I built one using 6x6 once[it was 250 sq feet] you may want to look at that for a huge pergola like this. The 4x4 posts layout was decided by the company that gave me a bid. They are going to be placed every 9 feet maximum. This would be a lot easier if you told me HOW LONG THE PERGOLA IS. |
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08034016 (banned)Hallo lisa Aus Amerika join:2001-08-31 Byron, GA 3 edits |
to nocannothave
That pergola looks cheap get this only $4949 » www.backyardamerica.com/ ··· gola.htmYour pergola should only cost $2000 at most. |
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PacratOld and Cranky MVM join:2001-03-10 Cortland, OH |
to nocannothave
Double the cost of materials to estimate the labor. Cedar is going to be pricey.... but nicer than pressure-treated. |
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IcarusCHAOS RULES Mod join:2000-11-08 Off Center |
to 08034016
He said his is to be 500sg ft,not that dinky little 120sq ft thing you posted minus any labor and prep whilst misquoting the prices. |
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to nocannothave
I would HIGHLY recommend redwood over cedar. Why? You're in a very wet area (Wa) and the redwood will warp much less over time and have less mold growth over time. That is....unless you can afford teak which would be even better in long term durability. There is zero reason to need 3 levels of wood on the top. If someone (YOU) does the math correctly it is easy to adjust the spacing to be even and line up with the ridges in the poly/fibreglass cover and still be correct enough to meet any code. I would use less posts of a larger size (4x6 or 6x6). It will be stronger and cheaper, unless you want weaker and more cost. I'm going to go way out on a limb and assume something along the lines of 20'x25' ???!!??? for the 500sqft you mention ? DO NOT just bolt thru like the pic you provided....use Simpson strong ties (also known as hurricane straps). Build it once and be done, don't be havin' to go back in and upgrade something you didn't do correctly the first time. (the pic you provided will maybe last for 5 years due to the way it's bolted together on the top) |
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said by MineGimme :I would HIGHLY recommend redwood over cedar. Why? You're in a very wet area (Wa) and the redwood will warp much less over time and have less mold growth over time. That is....unless you can afford teak which would be even better in long term durability. There is zero reason to need 3 levels of wood on the top. If someone (YOU) does the math correctly it is easy to adjust the spacing to be even and line up with the ridges in the poly/fibreglass cover and still be correct enough to meet any code. I would use less posts of a larger size (4x6 or 6x6). It will be stronger and cheaper, unless you want weaker and more cost. I'm going to go way out on a limb and assume something along the lines of 20'x25' ???!!??? for the 500sqft you mention ? DO NOT just bolt thru like the pic you provided....use Simpson strong ties (also known as hurricane straps). Build it once and be done, don't be havin' to go back in and upgrade something you didn't do correctly the first time. (the pic you provided will maybe last for 5 years due to the way it's bolted together on the top) The entire state is not as wet as you apparently think. My city had 6 inches of rain last year. Summer temps reach 100 degrees regularly. I think the poly/fiberglass covers are ugly as hell. Thanks for the input! |
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cdruGo Colts MVM join:2003-05-14 Fort Wayne, IN |
to nocannothave
Screws for almost everything. Why? Screws will hold better. Nails will back out over time. You can get away with nails on the top 2x2 for instance, but I strongly recommend screws for the deck. It will take more time and may cost more, but consider pocket screwing the deck from beneath. The fasteners stay out of the weather and you have no nail/screw holes visible from the top of the deck. I had a friend that did that with their porch and it looks very good. Downside though is that replacing a board becomes difficult if you can't get under the deck. |
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horsemouth1Please Clarify My CSP Premium Member join:2002-03-13 canada |
Are we even talking about a deck? |
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08034016 (banned)Hallo lisa Aus Amerika join:2001-08-31 Byron, GA |
to Icarus
said by Icarus:He said his is to be 500sg ft,not that dinky little 120sq ft thing you posted minus any labor and prep whilst misquoting the prices. Excuse me but if he pays anywhere near $4000 for that hes getting fucked, it's cheap junk for the looks of it 20 mph wind will knock it down. |
actions · 2009-Feb-8 9:52 pm · (locked) |
IcarusCHAOS RULES Mod join:2000-11-08 Off Center |
said by 08034016:Excuse me but if he pays anywhere near $4000 for that hes getting fucked, it's cheap junk for the looks of it 20 mph wind will knock it down. Thats not the actual pergola,its a picture....probably DLed off the interweb of a random pergola....for effect...ya know? Hes saying his would be 500sg ft....much larger than the one pictured.....obviously! Pictured one looks 8x12' or so. Materials cost around $5 grand,not unreasonable,labor costs including permits,insurance,taxes,social security and paying the helps labor costs, another $5 grand...also reasonable. Maybe by hiring people who dont legally do business and dont pay permits and taxes etc etc you could do better/cheaper but that would be a scumbag way of doing business. |
actions · 2009-Feb-9 1:04 am · (locked) |
robbin Mod join:2000-09-21 Leander, TX |
to 08034016
said by 08034016:said by Icarus:He said his is to be 500sg ft,not that dinky little 120sq ft thing you posted minus any labor and prep whilst misquoting the prices. Excuse me but if he pays anywhere near $4000 for that hes getting fucked, it's cheap junk for the looks of it 20 mph wind will knock it down. Hmmm -- maybe you didn't read the thread said by nocannothave:12 4x4 posts - drilled through concrete and backfilled with new 'crete Not getting knocked down! It sounds like you don't know it costs to do this type of thing. |
actions · 2009-Feb-9 2:20 am · (locked) |
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said by robbin:Hmmm -- maybe you didn't read the thread Not getting knocked down! It sounds like you don't know it costs to do this type of thing. I'm sorry, I've read your post a few times, but I cannot comprehend what you're attempting to say. I know exactly how much one company says it costs; $10.8k. I'm curious if this something that 2 or 3 guys can tackle. Two with moderate experience and one with loads of it. And no, that is not my pergola. It is an example of what we want built. I wish I could get the exact dimensions, but it's very cold out there. |
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robbin Mod join:2000-09-21 Leander, TX |
I was responding to 08034016 who stated "Excuse me but if he pays anywhere near $4000 for that hes getting fucked, it's cheap junk for the looks of it 20 mph wind will knock it down." I do think that you can build it. Still curious if it only a roof structure or if you are building a deck also (as someone else asked). |
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said by robbin:I was responding to 08034016 who stated "Excuse me but if he pays anywhere near $4000 for that hes getting fucked, it's cheap junk for the looks of it 20 mph wind will knock it down." I do think that you can build it. Still curious if it only a roof structure or if you are building a deck also (as someone else asked). Just a pergola. I found a picture that included a deck and it was the best representation of a 3 tier design I could find. I did not intend for there to be so much confusion. |
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cdruGo Colts MVM join:2003-05-14 Fort Wayne, IN |
cdru
MVM
2009-Feb-9 7:52 am
said by nocannothave:Just a pergola. I found a picture that included a deck and it was the best representation of a 3 tier design I could find. I did not intend for there to be so much confusion. If it's just the pergola and not the deck, then you definitely should be able to do it. For just the pergola, I would think the extra $5k is excessive. What portion of the $5.8k is for materials? For just digging and setting 12 posts, that sounds excessive as well but I don't know what materials would come to. What direction does the back of the house face? If it isn't straight south, the 3rd layer may not provide significant additional shade and increasing the 2nd layer to a 2x8 may be better served, from a functional standpoint. But if you like the 3rd layer for aesthetic reasons, there isn't a problem with it either. |
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SerbtasticYou Know How Many People I Have Buried? Premium Member join:2002-02-24 Stoney Creek, ON |
to nocannothave
Deck (nearly complete) |
I used the plan found here to build my pergola last summer. I did the deck as well, and integrated the pergola in the design. The pergola wasn't especially difficult to build, and I omitted the top tier of 2X4s as I didn't feel they were necessary. This picture shows the almost completed product. I still need to add some fascia boards, a skirt, and finish some staining but I think it turned out pretty nice. |
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jack bGone Fishing MVM join:2000-09-08 Cape Cod |
to nocannothave
If you plan on building something similar to the photo in post #1, I would suggest bolting a ledger board to the house and you can eliminate the vertical support posts along the structure side. |
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I was able to measure the layout today; 18 feet from house to edge of patio and 28 feet along the house axis. |
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08034016 (banned)Hallo lisa Aus Amerika join:2001-08-31 Byron, GA |
08034016 (banned)
Member
2009-Feb-9 10:39 pm
said by nocannothave:I was able to measure the layout today; 18 feet from house to edge of patio and 28 feet along the house axis. I hope that Picture you posted isn't the one that anyone quoted you $10k for if so run. |
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said by 08034016: I hope that Picture you posted isn't the one that anyone quoted you $10k for if so run. It's not. It's for comparison; to show people looking to offer advice on tackling this project what a 3 tier pergola looks like. Not for debate on price, or why is that thing not stained, or whatever other minutiae they can think of. |
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