| reply to RadioDoc
Re: So, the world didn't end How could they not see this coming? The coupon program was supposed to be limited anyway, and people knew this.
These coupons were supposed to help the neediest of people afford an already inexpensive converter box, not give ebay sellers an opportunity for profit. |
|
RadioDoc58ef2c0Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11 | See what coming? That they never fully funded the original number of coupons? Yeah they should definitely seen that coming...they hurled it at themselves when this program was announced long before Obama even announced his candidacy.
Obama will have the opportunity to make his own messes. Trying to blame this on him is rather stupid.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange. |
|
 tschmidtPremium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
kudos:5
 ·Fairpoint Commun..
 ·Hollis Hosting
| reply to RadioDoc
Re: So, the world didn't end said by RadioDoc:That they never fully funded the original number of coupons? I think there are three weaknesses in the transition program.
1) They funded 35 million coupons split between ones anyone can get and ones to qualify you had to state OTA was your only means of getting TV.
I don't have a quarrel with size of the original Coupon Program. What should have happened is funding limit increased as soon as they found out more coupons then expected had been requested. When all is said an done it is likely no more then 35 million coupons will be redeemed. Lots of people who did not need them requested and got coupons.
2) The transition should not have originally been scheduled in winter. February is not a good time to be up on your roof in snow country. Having said that I was against changing the date to June 12 so close to the Feb 17th.
3) The Longley–Rice modeling probabilities used to set coverage area were not realistic and is the crux of the problem people are having not being able to receive DTV programs. More realistic probabilities would have forced stations to use higher antenna or more powerful transmitter.
/tom
|
|
 knightmbEverybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN | said by tschmidt:said by RadioDoc:That they never fully funded the original number of coupons? I think there are three weaknesses in the transition program. 1) They funded 35 million coupons split between ones anyone can get and ones to qualify you had to state OTA was your only means of getting TV. I don't have a quarrel with size of the original Coupon Program. What should have happened is funding limit increased as soon as they found out more coupons then expected had been requested. When all is said an done it is likely no more then 35 million coupons will be redeemed. Lots of people who did not need them requested and got coupons. 2) The transition should not have originally been scheduled in winter. February is not a good time to be up on your roof in snow country. Having said that I was against changing the date to June 12 so close to the Feb 17th. 3) The Longley–Rice modeling probabilities used to set coverage area were not realistic and is the crux of the problem people are having not being able to receive DTV programs. More realistic probabilities would have forced stations to use higher antenna or more powerful transmitter. /tom I'm glad I'm not the only one that likes to look at the logical side of this instead of the "only (insert whoever you don't like) is too stupid to be ready to switch" excuse I often see. Granted, some people are lazy, there is no denying, but now that some of the stations have switched, the complaints are rolling in about the problems of not being able to receive anything when one could get many stations, even if a little snowy, before. I've seen it first hand, I'm lucky though that I live near a major city, so reception isn't really an issue, but a 15 minute drive down the road and reception is gone. DTV is NOT very friendly to anything other than "flat" terrain I'm discovering. There is no need for any "I told you so" either, because this hurts everyone. I'm glad that some areas get perfect reception and sadden that others didn't have a well planned out execution of the DTV plan. That probably explains why a lot of the major networks here are hanging on to Analog a little longer, guess they didn't want to be the guinea pigs for this one. 
--
Fight NebuAD and the like:
Click Here to pollute their data |
|
 BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | said by knightmb:said by tschmidt:said by RadioDoc:That they never fully funded the original number of coupons? I think there are three weaknesses in the transition program. 1) They funded 35 million coupons split between ones anyone can get and ones to qualify you had to state OTA was your only means of getting TV. I don't have a quarrel with size of the original Coupon Program. What should have happened is funding limit increased as soon as they found out more coupons then expected had been requested. When all is said an done it is likely no more then 35 million coupons will be redeemed. Lots of people who did not need them requested and got coupons. 2) The transition should not have originally been scheduled in winter. February is not a good time to be up on your roof in snow country. Having said that I was against changing the date to June 12 so close to the Feb 17th. 3) The Longley–Rice modeling probabilities used to set coverage area were not realistic and is the crux of the problem people are having not being able to receive DTV programs. More realistic probabilities would have forced stations to use higher antenna or more powerful transmitter. /tom I'm glad I'm not the only one that likes to look at the logical side of this instead of the "only (insert whoever you don't like) is too stupid to be ready to switch" excuse I often see. Granted, some people are lazy, there is no denying, but now that some of the stations have switched, the complaints are rolling in about the problems of not being able to receive anything when one could get many stations, even if a little snowy, before. I've seen it first hand, I'm lucky though that I live near a major city, so reception isn't really an issue, but a 15 minute drive down the road and reception is gone. DTV is NOT very friendly to anything other than "flat" terrain I'm discovering. There is no need for any "I told you so" either, because this hurts everyone. I'm glad that some areas get perfect reception and sadden that others didn't have a well planned out execution of the DTV plan. That probably explains why a lot of the major networks here are hanging on to Analog a little longer, guess they didn't want to be the guinea pigs for this one. The FCC is going to give stations permission to use more power if needed. First the whole transition has to get going and we need to see were we are at. |
|
 RARPSL
join:1999-12-08
Suffern, NY | reply to tschmidt
Even if they ramped up the Coupons or allowed them to be used after they expired, it would not have done any good since there are no more converters in existence. The makers stopped making them and removed them from the distribution pipeline. When the extension bill surfaced, the makers said that it would not be until late March or Early April before they would have any more available for sale. |
|
tschmidtPremium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
kudos:5 Reviews:
·Fairpoint Commun..
·Hollis Hosting
1 edit | said by RARPSL:The makers stopped making them and removed them from the distribution pipeline. Not sure about your locale but here in Southern NH there are pallets of converter boxes at BestBuy and Circuit City, even our local grocery store has them.
/tom |
|
| said by tschmidt:said by RARPSL:The makers stopped making them and removed them from the distribution pipeline. Not sure about your local but here in Southern NH there are pallets of converter boxes at BestBuy and Circuit City, even our local grocery store has them. /tom Same situation here. The three DMAs that I have visited in the very recent past/last few days have had the same types of pallets of converters in the BB stores. |
|
|
|
BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | reply to RARPSL
said by RARPSL:Even if they ramped up the Coupons or allowed them to be used after they expired, it would not have done any good since there are no more converters in existence. The makers stopped making them and removed them from the distribution pipeline. When the extension bill surfaced, the makers said that it would not be until late March or Early April before they would have any more available for sale. that's bullshit very wal-mart around me has DOZENS of them sitting on shelves. My local wal-mart has at least 50 on the shelves right now. Hell the whole county has maybe 6600 households. Adn I know that every week for the past year our local wal-mart has been getting a new shipment of 20 or more. So that's more than enough for everyone in my area that needs one. |
|
JPLPremium
join:2007-04-04
Downingtown, PA
kudos:1 | reply to RARPSL
said by RARPSL:Even if they ramped up the Coupons or allowed them to be used after they expired, it would not have done any good since there are no more converters in existence. The makers stopped making them and removed them from the distribution pipeline. When the extension bill surfaced, the makers said that it would not be until late March or Early April before they would have any more available for sale. No more converters? Where are you located? I can't walk into an electronics store, department store, heck even my local supermarkets and drugstores without tripping on these things. A local Rite Aid (pharmacy) must have had 2 - 3 dozen boxes sitting right by the checkout line. There may be some very localized shortages, but there are still plenty of boxes out there. |
|
| reply to tschmidt
said by tschmidt:said by RARPSL:The makers stopped making them and removed them from the distribution pipeline. Not sure about your locale but here in Southern NH there are pallets of converter boxes at BestBuy and Circuit City, even our local grocery store has them. /tom What you're seeing is what is left in the pipeline by distributors and retailers.
The actual manufacturing of boxes had halted in Asia in January because they had based their projections of supply needed on the original demand forecasts for 2/17.
Concern began to grow that demand rates were exceeding existing supply and especially concerning was what could happen if those who had been wait listed for coupons since December were suddenly issued them through additional funding.
Michael Petricone, Sr. VP, for the Consumer Electronics Association, brought forward the issue at the 2/5 hearings and stated, "there were between 3 million and 6 million boxes currently in the pipeline. Assuming the worst case, he said, of only 3 million boxes in inventory, if daily coupon redemptions continue at about 115,000 per day, "retailers would run out of boxes by the end of February."
"An unknown that makes any projections difficult is that, given the NTIA coupon wait list of 3.7 million requests, if NTIA were to suddenly issue all the coupons and 65% or so were redeemed, boxes would run out even earlier."
The manufactures have now restarted assembly based on new demand numbers, but the new boxes are not expected to be available until April.
Petricone was recommending to the FCC that they consider slowing the demand to accommodate this gap by extending the deadline and if re-funded, slowing the coupon distribution.
“CEA believes that the extension of the transition date to June 12 could reduce daily coupon redemption rates in the coming weeks" and CEA was also recommending (among other things), "Restricting the availability of vouchers to exclusively OTA households."
Presentation here:
»www.fcc.gov/realaudio/presentati···ment.pdf
My favorite quote was by FCC Commissioner Robert McDowell that the government had accommodated a possible shortfall in converters, saying that while there may not be an boxes on the shelves, that's OK, because there wasn't going to be enough coupons either. |
|
| Woops, Correction to above:
"My favorite quote was by FCC Commissioner Robert McDowell that the government had accommodated a possible shortfall in converters, saying that while there may not be enough boxes on the shelves, that's OK, because there wasn't going to be enough coupons either." |
|
| reply to knightmb
The whole "I can't get all the channels that I did before" is partially a chicken and egg situation.
"I can't get all of the channels I did before! Don't switch!"
"You won't know if you get all of the channels until you switch!"
So it's essentially a deadlock and no one will know for sure until everyone is on their final assignments.
And the only way to do that is to get on with the transition. |
|
tschmidtPremium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
kudos:5 Reviews:
·Fairpoint Commun..
·Hollis Hosting
| said by fifty nine:So it's essentially a deadlock and no one will know for sure until everyone is on their final assignments. And the only way to do that is to get on with the transition. Agree - Once everything simmers down after conversion stations will reevaluate coverage area and decide if it makes sense to make changes to equipment or install translators. Personally I hope they do because even with high quality outdoor antenna and preamp there are several DTV stations that are marginal for us. In fairness they were also stations that were snowy in analog.
By that time FCC will have real world experience with DTV interference problems. That will give them information they need to set maximum ERP transmit power levels.
/tom |
|
