| RE: Opera chief: Microsoft's IE 8 'undermines' web standards Opera is a whining loser. They want MS to hobble IE because it does a better job of supporting web sites coded with old code that doesn't meet standards. That is the complaint of a company that is rapidly falling behind in every area except some small mobile devices.
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Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO
1 edit | While I am no fan of Opera, I think they(Opera) make a lot of valid points that MS is using non standard means to hamper competition (again). The sooner MS follows the standards, the sooner all the web developers will follow them. |
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| It really is absurd to claim that its Microsoft's responsibility to force a 3rd party standard onto everyone. But in the end as long as the page has the standards doctype, they are by default rendering pages in standards mode. So opera really has no claim. Microsoft is doing exactly what they are crying for. |
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Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO
1 edit | If IE8 did not render the non standard code then all the web developers would bring their code into standard. Since IE8 still renders non standard code they are not doing what Opera (and many others) are asking for. If you had actually read the link you would see this.
It is not a 3rd party standard it is a WWW standard ("the standard"). |
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| said by Lazlow:If IE8 did not render the non standard code then all the web developers would bring their code into standard. Since IE8 still renders non standard code they are not doing what Opera (and many others) are asking for. And why should MS be forced to make web developers meet stds just to make Opera happy? IE8 will render standard compliant web pages correctly. But it also does more than that. It isn't Microsoft's job to be the internet stds cop.
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3 edits | reply to Lazlow
Re: RE: Opera chief: Microsoft's IE 8 'undermines' web standards said by Lazlow:If IE8 did not render the non standard code then all the web developers would bring their code into standard. Since IE8 still renders non standard code they are not doing what Opera (and many others) are asking for. If you had actually read the link you would see this. It is not a 3rd party standard it is a WWW standard ("the standard"). What a nice world you live in where everything is actively developed and all businesses have the money to fix something that isn't broke.
Business clients are most likely the number one reason for the compatibility mode. Businesses have internal web apps that are not actively developed. These apps have worked fine for years. There is no reason to waste money trying to make it ie8 compatible. Businesses just won't upgrade. If anyone chooses to stick with an older OS or IE7 for any reason, that slows the adoption of the standards supported in IE8.
Plus if Opera's browser works right now, it will still work after IE8 comes out so their argument makes no sense.
If you read the article, Opera must be claiming that as soon as IE8 comes out they are going to choose to make their Opera browser incompatible with all current webpages and wants Microsoft to force people into making their webpages work with the newer version of Opera.
Also once IE8 comes out there is still going to be one standard per browser. Developers will still test in all three and find differences.
Opera is making these idiotic claims because they don't have to answer for them. They just have to convince EU judges their warped reality is right so they can get judgments against Microsoft that will force Microsoft to ruin their own products. |
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Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO | Look, the standards (at least the parts I am talking about) have existed for a long time (definitely pre IE6). Opera did not just make up these standards, the governing body did. MS has just choose to ignore the standards. As far as slowing the adoption of the standards supported in IE8, they are the same standards that have existed all along. Think of this like roads. The way roads are built and marked follow a certain standard. Double yellow lines have one meaning, dashed yellow another. But for some reason MS decided that they will use purple lines to mean what the standard calls for to mean double yellow. |
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2 edits | Before you act like you made a valid point go find a version of Opera or any other browser that came out at the time of IE5 or IE6 that follows the standards. When you fail you will realize how pathetic Opera is acting.
Microsoft clearly is not ignoring anything if IE8 finally follows them. They will probably have the first mainstream browser release that follows the standards. |
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Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO | Pick one. Virtually every browser, other than IE, followed the standards. |
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| said by Lazlow:Pick one. Virtually every browser, other than IE, followed the standards. Well that settles it. You have never made a webpage before in your life, nor tested it in multiple browsers. That wrong statement you made is clearly the basis for all of your incorrectness. |
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Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO | Actually I do build web pages. IF you build them to the standard, they will display properly on almost all browsers. It is when you start doing or using non standard compliant tools that the issues pop up. |
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| said by Lazlow:they will display properly on almost all browsers. Yea, almost. It's that last 1% of things that don't work out that require most of the work to fix so it displays correctly in all browsers. I am not talking about catastrophic problems. Just small annoyances.
But that is more than enough to make everything you said invalid. |
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