Topic 'DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol' in forum 'World of Warcraft' - dslreports.com http://www.dslreports.com/forum/DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22182470 en Sat, 11 Feb 2012 12:00:02 EDT Sat, 11 Feb 2012 12:00:02 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22301355 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22301355 Mon, 27 Apr 2009 08:33:29 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22301055 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22301055 Mon, 27 Apr 2009 04:06:27 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22301053 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22301053 Mon, 27 Apr 2009 04:02:27 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22284701 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22284701 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 13:07:53 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22283507 said by Krisnatharok:

How much health you need is directly dependent on how good your healer is. For PUGing, 30k hp gives a nice buffer for a less than raid-level healer (you won't find too many willing to run with a non-guild tank). The less health you have, the less margin for error your healer has. Plain and simple.
And yet...someone with 30k health probably has no need of Heroics. Just saying. My tank is fully nax10 geared and has no upgrades from Heroics and is sitting at 28.5k hp. 29.5k if I put my HP gear on.
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Warrior definition of stealth: Kill anything that moves!
»wheresmedrink.wordpress.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22283507 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 09:13:41 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22277500 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22277500 Wed, 22 Apr 2009 08:50:43 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22275414 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22275414 Tue, 21 Apr 2009 21:11:00 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22275285 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22275285 Tue, 21 Apr 2009 20:49:30 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253968
It's a stronger enchant.

If you can't attain 540 without stoneskin, then you should use that.
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Warrior definition of stealth: Kill anything that moves!
»wheresmedrink.wordpress.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253968 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 15:28:25 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253760 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253760 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 14:50:57 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253658
Swordshattering gives 4% avoidance (4% Parry), which is not subject to diminishing returns.

Stoneskin gargoyle gives 3% avoidance (1% dodge, 1% miss, 1% parry), which is also not subject to diminishing returns, and it also gives you 2% stamina.

Swordshattering is better because it results in more avoidance, which is how DKs tank and it offers more threat through more Runic Strikes.

Stoneskin is the gearing enchant. Swordshattering is the geared enchant.
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Warrior definition of stealth: Kill anything that moves!
»wheresmedrink.wordpress.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253658 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 14:39:04 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253246 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253246 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 13:37:33 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253118
So if you are a fresh 80 and have 540 def and still have enchant/gems slots open I would suggest adding extra HP instead of more defense. As you start picking up raid gear personally I still prefer Stam, but many tanks will collect avoidence pieces for a second tanking set.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253118 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 13:18:46 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253101 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253101 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 13:16:05 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253038 said by awesome:

This is my goal at the moment. I have like 557 def or something like that, which is stupidly high...but I am still using the def enchant.

Once I hit 565 def I can drop that and put the swordshattering on there.
557 isn't "stupidly" high. People keep saying defense above 540 is worthless and that is FAR from the truth. Defense above 540 is still good. You still get added dodge and parry (and block if you use a shield) from defense. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22253038 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 13:07:17 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22252556 said by Krisnatharok:

Raikyon, my only suggestion is to maybe try and get enough Defense to make up for dropping Rune of the Stoneskin Gargoyle--you can get more avoidance with the swordshattering one.
This is my goal at the moment. I have like 557 def or something like that, which is stupidly high...but I am still using the def enchant.

Once I hit 565 def I can drop that and put the swordshattering on there.
--
Warrior definition of stealth: Kill anything that moves!
»wheresmedrink.wordpress.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22252556 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 11:55:10 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22252374 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22252374 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 11:26:12 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22252231 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22252231 Fri, 17 Apr 2009 11:03:58 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22202781 said by 43511267:

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lol @ goldseller.

And to Ghastlyone - enough with the whack ass advice.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22202781 Wed, 08 Apr 2009 06:20:40 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22201293 said by Reanimator:

One thing I see repeated is the term def capped. Defense is NOT capped at 540! 540 is the point where you can no longer be critted, but extra defense is not useless (like +hit is useless after hitting cap) Defense over 540 will give you + evasion stats. Granted as stated above pure dodge will give you more effective evasion than Def but being over 540 is not a bad thing.
Yesss... I was wondering wen someone would say that. It's a floor--a minimum. But because of diminishing returns (it IS affected by that, right?), it's better to start stacking dodge after that or stamina if your HP is too low for your/your healer's liking.

For instance, when my defense hit 570, I took off the SSG rune and added swordshattering. Sure I lost 25 defense (not rating, actual defense), but I gained 4% parry. Although the net gain isn't +4% (the def gave me avoidance too), some people would consider the 2% loss in stamina too expensive. But that can be fixed with one 41stam gem.

On another note Nick... DO NOT VENDOR ANY OF YOUR OLD TANKING GEAR. As you gain upgrades, you may drop down on a stat and need another piece of gear that has more of one stat to make up for that. Anything that is blue or better you should keep just in case you can't get something up to par when you snag an upgrade.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22201293 Tue, 07 Apr 2009 21:35:25 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22198141 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22198141 Tue, 07 Apr 2009 11:58:21 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22198059
I ran w/ the same shawman healer in all 3 and we had little to no trouble, the healer was new to 80 and geared about the same as me ( 13k mana before treeform )

got my rep revered with Wyvern and got both boots & chest, plus alot of tank gear in the H's

they brought my hp - 25k armr over 27k so now im g2g on any Heroic, but i still want the Titansteel Destroyer mentioned, would be icing on the cake

but with a good healer and smart dps 22k hp and 25k arm with def cap is enough to tank Heroic's as a DK

did H UK with shamy heals/hunter/2dk dps ( one blood/frost the other unholy/frost ) and me tanking as i was at begining of post and no wipes 8)

ty for the help everyone, gave me a clear picture of what i needed and thanks to the blizz gods i got most of it last night
Endbringer - Khadgar]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22198059 Tue, 07 Apr 2009 11:47:57 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22195691 said by Benty:

It is odd to me that you are overflowing in defense though, I had to really struggle to hit 540 and even had to use enchants to hit 535. I remember spaming trade chat trying to get a defense chest and sheild enchant so I could start heroics.
I actually hit 570 on defense BEFORE my sigil procc'd (+11 def), so I took off Rune of the Stoneskin Gargoyle and put on the swordshattering one (+4% parry). I'm now sitting at 539 def (550 with proc), which is still slightly high, but I just need to throw on a JC stam gem to make up for the 2% loss in stam. Overall I gained more avoidance.

Wyrmrest has a good chestpiece, Breastplate of the Solemn Council, that you only need revered to get. Titansteel Destroyer (2H mace) is going to last you a good long time into raids. It has the most strength of any end-game tanking weapon and all the others are PvP weps or raid drops.

As I've said before--it's easier to look at a tank and come up with a reason to blame him/her for a wipe ("not enough" [insert here]--stam, avoidance, whatever). But there are a lot of problems healers won't own up to. Either they spam heals and go OOM, they can't fight off a spell lock, or they try to keep a dps alive when the tank is already low. Get to know a couple good healers and put them on your friends list.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22195691 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 22:24:12 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22192013
Ton of stam and def. I really don't think there is a reason to start heroics before you have the WA chest and the two epics above. The chest is 3-4 lvl 80 runs if you did the quests in dragonblight and the epics can be had for as low as 600gold. Can also get the nubrahide(sp?) cloak for a ton of stam for around 400g. Do VoH for the pants, KT rep can get you a nice glove, not sure what the tanking DK 2 piece bonus is. I just know as warrior the hero gear gimped my defense at firt so I'd suggest badge neckalce, belt, glove, chest.

I'd always take extra stam instead of defense. Like I said before in 5mans there are certain trash packs that stun, this kills your avoidance and can result in your dieing fast if the healers aren't on the ball. When this happens it looks like your fault. The dryad/trent packs in nexus do this.

It is odd to me that you are overflowing in defense though, I had to really struggle to hit 540 and even had to use enchants to hit 535. I remember spaming trade chat trying to get a defense chest and sheild enchant so I could start heroics.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22192013 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 12:28:39 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191822
this is what i was looking for!!

i will start working on argent rep and my wyvern rep is almost at revered thank goodness, def even being over cap isnt bad imo cuz like someone said i can replace as a get gear fit my def needs as my gear improves, i felt like dodge/parry for us DK were good anyway so gemming and enchanting for only stam after def is capped to me didnt "feel right" but if i take one thing away atm than my def would drop below cap, so due to gear its either over or under cap, but im not really trying to overdue the cap

since post i did PUG tank H Occ & H old kindom with little problems so I feel i got a string of bad healers or something, to answer a few questions i was dieing first than the wipe, i now throw alot of DS to self heal now to help the healers out just in case

These type of forums are so helpful because even with elitejerks and stuff, DK's are still a new class and most go DPS so tanking idea's need to be talked about and discussed, ty again]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191822 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 11:58:53 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191597
I tanked Heroic HoL with less HP and quite a bit less avoidance than you and we did fine.

As for the parry/dodge debate...don't gem for either. Gem for stamina. If you need to use a non-blue gem, use stam/expertise for red or stam/def for yellow.
--
Warrior definition of stealth: Kill anything that moves!
»wheresmedrink.wordpress.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191597 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 11:21:25 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191238 said by Ghastlyone:

You kidding me. We're talking a 9.8 point difference between the 2 stats?? Is it really that serious? We're talking about tanking a fuckin' heroic for god's sake, not 25man Uldaur.
And just to clarify here, a 9.8 difference between stats is once again preferable to keeping stats "in line" for some nice aesthetic purpose when viewing a character sheet.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191238 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 10:19:06 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191219 said by Ghastlyone:

And by the way.....if Parry is so inferior? Why would a DK even spec the 5 points into that talent in the Blood tree then? Why would Blizz even put Parry rating on tanking gear right beside Dodge?
You're so confused. I'm the one saying they are the same, you're the one advising to gem parry over dodge to keep them "in line" for some fantasy reason.

It's all about the ratings per percentage point. 5 points in blood gives 5 PERCENT parry, not a rating.

Parry is fine when it appears on armor, but when it comes to gemming, why gem for parry when you get more avoidance from dodge?

Again I re-iterate. Don't gem for parry.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191219 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 10:17:15 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191164
1.25% pure avoidence from dodge.

Parry is not pure avoidence. More parry increases your threat by you getting parry haste, and accordingly increases the damage you take by giving the mobs more chances to parry you and get hasted. That is why parry is more expensive, because it increases your damage/threat. However, since threat hasn't been an issue, but survival always is, the value of Parry has decrease vs dodge.

In talent trees when 1 point buys 1% parry or dodge, effectively the Parry is being discounted by 25% from the cost of using gear to get the same amount, so it makes complete sense to grab the parry talents if you have the points.

A lot of things don't matter in the current content. Most decent tanks could gear for Mp5 and still be fine. "fine" is just a subjective term. If something is better why not take the better option? It is like a rogue going combat daggers, and saying they do fine. Yeah, they can kill stuff, if not they wouldn't have gotten to lvl 80. But the fact remains they could kill stuff better as another spec/weapon.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191164 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 10:05:55 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191110 said by WhakkaWhakka:

Its bad because the ratings are straight up worse. You get more avoidance from dodge than parry with the same numbers.

Dodge Rating: 39.3 rating grants 1% dodge

Parry Rating: 49.1 rating grants 1% parry

And the DK talent gives straight percent, not rating. As to why they put it on gear, it's all item budget.
You kidding me. We're talking a 9.8 point difference between the 2 stats?? Is it really that serious? We're talking about tanking a fuckin' heroic for god's sake, not 25man Uldaur.

If I gem for Parry and that makes me "terribad" then so be it...but imo, I can tank heroics and current 10/25 man content just fine.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191110 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 09:53:00 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191062
Dodge Rating: 39.3 rating grants 1% dodge

Parry Rating: 49.1 rating grants 1% parry

And the DK talent gives straight percent, not rating. As to why they put it on gear, it's all item budget.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191062 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 09:42:15 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191018 said by Sithra:

said by Ghastlyone:

Most DK's dodge is higher already, the reason for gemming parry is to bring your Parry rating in line with your dodge. From what I've heard, you want both to be close to each other. You don't want too much dodge and not enough parry.
What the hell? Why would parry need to be "in line" with dodge? The net result of a dodge or parry is identical.

Edit: Just to clarify, don't gem for parry, ignore terribad advice.

As elitistjerks would say: "You should never, ever gem for Parry it is strictly inferior"
Yes, because we all know....Elitist Jerks is the be all, end all of WoW knowledge. So please enlighten us all Sithra, why is Parry inferior?? It's ok take your time, we'll be waiting here for you to copy and paste something straight from your WoW knowledge database.

And by the way.....if Parry is so inferior? Why would a DK even spec the 5 points into that talent in the Blood tree then? Why would Blizz even put Parry rating on tanking gear right beside Dodge?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22191018 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 09:30:56 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22190950
How are your getting blamed? Is the group wiping? If so who is dieing first.

Gear and skill both matter. Gear minimums are based on what does "good" players need. If you or your healers aren't "good", you will need better gear as a buffer.

Most of the heroics out there can probably be tanked with less than 20k hp if the tank uses cooldowns and the groups use CC and dps isn't lacking. Much simpler to just have a 28k+ hp tank and grab everything and just AE it down though ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22190950 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 09:15:35 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22190387 said by Ghastlyone:

Most DK's dodge is higher already, the reason for gemming parry is to bring your Parry rating in line with your dodge. From what I've heard, you want both to be close to each other. You don't want too much dodge and not enough parry.
What the hell? Why would parry need to be "in line" with dodge? The net result of a dodge or parry is identical.

Edit: Just to clarify, don't gem for parry, ignore terribad advice.

As elitistjerks would say: "You should never, ever gem for Parry it is strictly inferior"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22190387 Mon, 06 Apr 2009 03:49:16 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22188976
Just remember that pre-3.1, you gain +10% parry when your blood runes are on cooldown (which is all the time), so regardless of how much Dodge you get, I don't think it will equal your buffed parry.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22188976 Sun, 05 Apr 2009 20:39:28 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22187602 said by WhakkaWhakka:

said by Ghastlyone:

Like others have said, your best bet is purchasing the Titan steel ring, neck piece, boots and Helm for the meta socket, until you get some 10/25man drops. And please don't gem all +stam. You should be gemming all either +defense/+parry or if your defense is good, gem all +parry/+stam.
Dont gem for parry, you get more avoidance point for point from dodge.
Most DK's dodge is higher already, the reason for gemming parry is to bring your Parry rating in line with your dodge. From what I've heard, you want both to be close to each other. You don't want too much dodge and not enough parry.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22187602 Sun, 05 Apr 2009 15:05:59 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22187547
»www.tankspot.com/forums/f97/4096···ist.html]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22187547 Sun, 05 Apr 2009 14:53:33 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22187420 said by Ghastlyone:

Like others have said, your best bet is purchasing the Titan steel ring, neck piece, boots and Helm for the meta socket, until you get some 10/25man drops. And please don't gem all +stam. You should be gemming all either +defense/+parry or if your defense is good, gem all +parry/+stam.
Dont gem for parry, you get more avoidance point for point from dodge.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22187420 Sun, 05 Apr 2009 14:21:19 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22187217 said by ErikVKing:

said by Ret Pally :

said by Margolis:

armory shows the stats you have when you log out, even with buffs.
This was changed recently. I believe it was with the WoTLK patch (could have been sooner but that was when I noticed). Armory does not show a dk in frost presence, a druid in bear or any buff at all. It shows your stats with your gear only. Gear enchants and gems are tallied but not buffs.
That was actually changed quite a while ago.

And to NICK: I didn't check your armory or anything of the sort, but I was tanking the "low-end" Heroics (VH, UK, etc.) with just the Tempered Saronite gear and was fine.

With 558 Def you need to itemize some and swap out gear that has +def for +stam/dodge/parry. I am *constantly* evaluating my tanking pieces and have about 10 slots of tanking gear on me in case I get an item with overall better stats (more dodge/AC/parry/TPS/etc.) and need to swap a piece back in that has more +def.

Right now I am 5 over the cap, but am leaving it as-is because it's barely over and I have nothing that swaps out to keep a decent set of stats.

As far as HPs go, I think you should be fine even at ~22k as a DK. From my experience, DK tanks don't need the same amount of HP that Warriors do with all of the extra mitigation you have.

Here is my Warrior: »www.wowarmory.com/character-shee···fG7d67CD

As you can see I *still* have some of the crafted pieces on (though they aren't Saronite anymore, upgraded to Titansteel). If you get a handful of the Titansteel pieces and the JC rings etc. as stated above, you will have those for quite some time.

GL to ya bud!

EDIT: Forgot to add something ... when you get a new piece, or even right now, make sure and think through what enchant and/or gem you use. Being so far over the cap, you might be able to use a stam/dodge/parry gem and a stam/stats enchant instead of going all out +def.

Also, I'm not sure how it works on DKs, but I know Warriors need a decent amount of +hit so as not to miss a Sunder etc. (yes, I'm way too low on that as-is) so that may be a stat to look into?.
Don't ever gem or look for +hit gear being a tank. That is an absolute garbage stat.

With DK's it's all about the mitigation. I've run with a DK tank that literally fully buffed had 21k health. But had a huge amount of Parry and Dodge, was spec'd right, and was over defense capped. We cleared the instances perfectly.

So when people say "OMG YOU DON'T HAVE 31K HEALTH!!" Tell them to shut the fuck up and drop them from the group.

Here's my DK in my tank gear..»www.wowarmory.com/character-shee···astlyone

I can tank pretty damn fuckin good, and I'm spec'd just right to where I can swicth gear on the fly and DPS like a mad man.

Spec'd in Blood, the single target threat cannot be matched. I've yet to have any class pull a mob from me. I was averaging 5k-7k TPS in Naxx the other day. I also like Blood for the Vampiric Blood talent. I can hit 43k health fully raid buffed.

Like others have said, your best bet is purchasing the Titan steel ring, neck piece, boots and Helm for the meta socket, until you get some 10/25man drops. And please don't gem all +stam. You should be gemming all either +defense/+parry or if your defense is good, gem all +parry/+stam.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22187217 Sun, 05 Apr 2009 13:37:43 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22186793 said by Ret Pally :

said by Margolis:

armory shows the stats you have when you log out, even with buffs.
This was changed recently. I believe it was with the WoTLK patch (could have been sooner but that was when I noticed). Armory does not show a dk in frost presence, a druid in bear or any buff at all. It shows your stats with your gear only. Gear enchants and gems are tallied but not buffs.
That was actually changed quite a while ago.

And to NICK: I didn't check your armory or anything of the sort, but I was tanking the "low-end" Heroics (VH, UK, etc.) with just the Tempered Saronite gear and was fine.

With 558 Def you need to itemize some and swap out gear that has +def for +stam/dodge/parry. I am *constantly* evaluating my tanking pieces and have about 10 slots of tanking gear on me in case I get an item with overall better stats (more dodge/AC/parry/TPS/etc.) and need to swap a piece back in that has more +def.

Right now I am 5 over the cap, but am leaving it as-is because it's barely over and I have nothing that swaps out to keep a decent set of stats.

As far as HPs go, I think you should be fine even at ~22k as a DK. From my experience, DK tanks don't need the same amount of HP that Warriors do with all of the extra mitigation you have.

Here is my Warrior: »www.wowarmory.com/character-shee···fG7d67CD

As you can see I *still* have some of the crafted pieces on (though they aren't Saronite anymore, upgraded to Titansteel). If you get a handful of the Titansteel pieces and the JC rings etc. as stated above, you will have those for quite some time.

GL to ya bud!

EDIT: Forgot to add something ... when you get a new piece, or even right now, make sure and think through what enchant and/or gem you use. Being so far over the cap, you might be able to use a stam/dodge/parry gem and a stam/stats enchant instead of going all out +def.

Also, I'm not sure how it works on DKs, but I know Warriors need a decent amount of +hit so as not to miss a Sunder etc. (yes, I'm way too low on that as-is) so that may be a stat to look into?.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22186793 Sun, 05 Apr 2009 11:34:09 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22186126 said by Margolis:

armory shows the stats you have when you log out, even with buffs. This was changed recently. I believe it was with the WoTLK patch (could have been sooner but that was when I noticed). Armory does not show a dk in frost presence, a druid in bear or any buff at all. It shows your stats with your gear only. Gear enchants and gems are tallied but not buffs. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22186126 Sun, 05 Apr 2009 05:28:35 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22183135
I think if you focus on getting the gear pieces that will last you a long time and then put really good enchants/gems in them, that will help you progress faster.

I'm not sure how you're doing financially but if you can afford it, I would say get the Tempered Titansteel helm and boots and get the good gems on them. That should boost your hp and defense/avoidance higher.

Also work on getting the Breastplate of the Solemn Council (wyrmrest rep reward) and Special Issue legplates (Argent Crusade rep reward) both which are pretty easily obtainable. Once you have these, you won't be looking back.

To the other poster, Nick is telling the truth about his stats. Armory doesn't show the correct presence/stat he is in. It's the same way with me. It shows I have approximately 24k hp but I'm actually at 27k when tanking. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22183135 Sat, 04 Apr 2009 13:49:16 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22183117
Simply cut and pasted from some pre-nax gearing website, here is the list of all the enchants you want and where to get them:

- Head enchant: "Arcanum of the Stalwart Protector" - Argent Crusade/Revered - 37stam/20 def rating
- Shoulder enchant: "Greater Inscription of the Pinnacle" - Sons of Hodirs/Exalted - 20dodge/15def rating
- Cloak enchant: "Enchant Cloak - Titanweave" - AH - 16 def rating
- Wrist enchant: "Enchant Bracer - Fortitude" - AH - 12stam
- Leg enchant: "Frosthide Leg Armor" - AH - 55stam/22agi
- Feet Enchant: "Greater Fortitude" - AH -22stam

As well as some crafted items to buy:
- JC: Titanium Earthguard Ring (+50str/+63stam/25def/34dodge, blue socket+4def)
- JC: Titanium Earthguard Chain Ring (+49str/+63stam/+34def, red socket+6stam)
- BS: Tempered Titansteel Treads (+45str/+120stam/+35def)

Your def is too good. I don't know if you gemmed for it or not, but drop some defense gems back to 535 and pick up some stamina or avoidance gems. Healers like a little bit of a buffer. JC +41stam gems are awesome for this, and they're prismatic. I'm not sure if your HP at 22.2k is in frost or not, but that's a little low for tanking heroics in my book.

You could even drop your defense back to 525 and pick up the Sigil in Dal that gives +11 def for 30 seconds when you use icy touch. Consider it a 100% proc.

Also... another thing to think about is dropping the Rune of the Stoneskin Gargoyle and getting the sword-shattering one. If you are over on defense you can eat the loss and gain more avoidance.

As far a tanking weapon... the best you can get is the Titansteel Destroyer without going into Naxx and hoping for a 0.8% droprate.

Ever since I dropped DPS to become a tank, I've found that as long as your tank has decent health, is uncrittable, and decent avoidance, the healer is most often at fault. You either have someone who doesn't understand their class (mb they leveled as an spriest the whole way and doesn't get healing) or just isn't geared. It's pretty easy to gauge whether a tank is ready for heroics or not. But it's harder to gauge healers, and since there are fewer of them, we tend to be more accepting of healers in substandard gear.

Anyways... look me up if you want more info... Krisnatharok on Grizzly Hills.

edit: typos
--
Violence has resolved more conflicts than anything else. The contrary opinion that violence doesn't solve anything is merely wishful thinking at its worst.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22183117 Sat, 04 Apr 2009 13:44:03 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22182639
You need more avoidance. work on gear that has def, dodge and parry. get rid of crap that has expertise or nature resist and replace with more avoidance. I don't have a dk tank, but without a shield and lots of armor, dk's need avoidance I would think, especially parry. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22182639 Sat, 04 Apr 2009 12:09:36 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22182539
please dont just tell me to gear up or i need more, im looking for what more i need, what should my dodge be at, what should my hp be at?

ty, i know i had alot in my post so maybe that part about the armory was over looked]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22182539 Sat, 04 Apr 2009 11:47:33 EDT Re: DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22182497 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22182497 Sat, 04 Apr 2009 11:37:33 EDT DK Tank stats needed for Heroic's plus Rant lol http://www.dslreports.com/forum/DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22182470
i've been playing for about 1.5 yrs, my main before I went DK was a DPS, i always used wowwiki.com & Thottbot.com to find my way thru the game to get what i need or answer my questions, didnt find this forum till a few months ago but i hated the wow forums due to to much crap, but i have read almost everything Archievious has posted about DK's ( sorry if i spelled that wrong man )

so heres the deal - my def is over the cap, it 558, my hp is 22.2k ( which i know it would be nice if more but thats what runing the Heroics are for, to gear up ) my armour is over 25k and my dodge is @ 19% and when my BB goes off my parry is 24%, sso according to wowwiki and elitejerk i have the stats to start doing Heroic's and even have the stats to start tanking Nax ( even thou i havnt even tried ), in looking up the drops of most dungeons i need to do Heroics for upgrades, there are some rep upgrades i could have but of course im working on that also and need to run the dungeon's to get there

so my question is, do i really have that bad of stats to where i cant tank a Heroic? and trust me its not my skill its my basic stats that are getting people to not inv me or leave when we have any kind of trouble, i dont have all the addon's i need to tell how dps is doing , how the healer is doing to try and place blame, im the kind of player that i think almost anything is possable if u work together, i feel that our server has had such a shortage of TANKS for so long that the groups are use to the tanking being "over geared" for the dungeon and not needing to work hard at all, plus the fact that DK's are new and most people who dont paly one dont understand them, i get crap all the time for not going tank instead of dps, and i have all the enchaments im going to get without some upgrade, not going to drop a mint at the AH on something that can be replaced in a week, but i do have good enchants

sorry for the rant but hopfully u can see my point of the post, are my stats really that bad? and if u armoury me for somereason after logging out my armory only showed 20k hp but its up to 22.2k

i just want to know if i have enough to start H or if im just getting in bad groups?

ty]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/DK-Tank-stats-needed-for-Heroics-plus-Rant-lol-22182470 Sat, 04 Apr 2009 11:30:17 EDT