battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000
| When you don't have to be responsible...
When you don't have to be responsible for the money you spend you can do things like this.
"Ban cities from pricing service below the cost of providing the service."
Oh you mean like run the network like a real business and not a government agency? If they would only apply this law to everything government does. |
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Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000
 ·VOIPo
 ·Cox HSI
| Oh, they mean like the predatory pricing Comcast was engaged in?
»Comcast Vs. Utopia
»'Discounted' Competition
...or Verizon who in competitive markets charges FAR less for 50Mb service than they do in other markets. |
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battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000 | If comcast runs out of money in their ventures they can go to someone who will willing give them money. If the City government runs out of money they go to the taxpayers who have to give the money if they are willing or not. |
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Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000 | No, Comcast being in an oligopoly simply raises their prices and they've been doing so at 3X the rate of inflation for more than a decade. |
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battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000 | As a consumer you can opt out of that rate increase by canceling your service. As a tax payer you can only move out of town. |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
 ·North State Commun..
| reply to battleop
said by battleop  :If comcast runs out of money in their ventures they can go to someone who will willing give them money. If the City government runs out of money they go to the taxpayers who have to give the money if they are willing or not. And the government NEVER gives free money to private business do they? Did you read the article? It mentions that in the past Embarq (the ILEC in the area) was given grants to build-out. Isn't that taxpayer money, only, it doesn't really benefit them as the return on that investment is piddly DSL.
You don't think government gives incentives, like tax breaks, right-of-way usage, and free land to local companies so they will come to their area? It's all taxpayer money, only in the case of the government, profits and golden parachutes aren't allowed so more of the money goes to benefit the citizens.
I'll take 100Mbps fiber for half the price any day. |
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battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000
| I don't care about AT&T and TWC, so don't think I am taking their side. It's the smaller providers who work their asses off, pay their city taxes both business and company build up their businesses only to get shit on by their city government. The smaller Wisp and ISP gets bent over and dry #$@#ed because of the ensuing price war between the city, the ILec, and CableCo.
Once the small providers are gone then you end up with things like Caps, by the byte billing and any other way the big guys get away with screwing your eyes out. |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| battleop , while in an idealistic world I would agree with you, the fact is if the smaller ISP doesn't have the gumption to work with city government then they deserve the same fate as the big boys who won't deploy.
I've worked with a lot of city governments, both small and mid-sized, and they LOVE for small business to get involved and take the initiative on things like this. So I don't for one second feel bad for the little guys. |
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Sammer
join:2005-12-22
Canonsburg, PA
| reply to battleop
said by battleop :Once the small providers are gone then you end up with things like Caps, by the byte billing and any other way the big guys get away with screwing your eyes out. Haven't you noticed that except in areas the big guys don't consider profitable enough the little guys are going away anyway. It's not like that many members of Congress or State Legislators expect AT&T & TWC to be responsible. |
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battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000 | You might try and argue that in the wISP forum. That's where a lot of the smaller guys pick up the slack and thrive. |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
| reply to battleop
said by battleop :"Ban cities from pricing service below the cost of providing the service." I'm all for a ban like this. Provided the local Cable companies and Telcos also have such a regulation that prohibits them from dumping their products below cost to put the public network under. Which is really the point of this ban: Force them to have a minimum price they can legally charge, then we'll lose money for a few years pricing under that price until it folds up and is sold off, then we'll go back to our gouging ways.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| The gov't can NOT tell a business how they set their prices unless its a Phone Company setting prices for dial-tone services. I'd like to see the Gov't go to TWC and Comcast and tell them they can't raise their prices anymore. How fast do you want your tax rate to go up? Someone will have to pay for the lawsuit that would bring on. And it would be you and everyone else paying taxes. Gov't lawyers don't come free. Why do you think the AG's office hasn't gone after AIG? Because it would cost too much to sue them. |
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Dolgan
Premium
join:2005-10-01
Sun Prairie, WI
·Verizon Online DSL
| quote:
The gov't can NOT tell a business how they set their prices unless its a Phone Company setting prices for dial-tone services. I'd like to see the Gov't go to TWC and Comcast and tell them they can't raise their prices anymore.
The Government can set prices if they decide to regulate Cable Cos like the Telcos. You are assuming that the Cable Cos would win a lawsuit against the FCC if they choose to regulate--if the cable co loses they could be on the hook for the Govt's legal cost. |
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hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| Cable has own several suites against the FCC. One is still pending in Court over the nice cap on customers. The Courts ruled once in favor of the cable industry they'll win again.
And Yes the cable industry would win. Cable is an Information Service. Telco's are not.  |
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Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000 | reply to battleop
Take it or leave it are not marketplace competitors, but rather the result of the lack of marketplace competitors. |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
| reply to hottboiinnc
But the Government can--- and does regulate industries based on a number of factors-- consumer protection being one (although rare these days.)
If they chose to do so, they could easily enact a law preventing Such and Such Cable Co from "dumping".
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | And such and such cable co would sue. Your bill goes up. Your taxes go up. A Win win for both the Gov't and the Cable company. What do you get? jack shit. |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
| Sue based on what? Government can govern. They could try and sue based on "we don't like this law" but that wouldn't be likely to be pass muster.
Basically, the point is, incumbent moves to block municipalities and towns etc from building their own networks are self-serving BS.
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"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| They sue to block this because the gov't has one task. To manage the city and public safety NOT get into the issue of business and compete.
The Gov't should stay out of the business world and worry how they're going to balance their budget for the year and how they're going to spend their stimulus money wisely. NOT irresponsibly. |
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