Topic 'Re: Just as I expected' in forum '' - dslreports.com http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286434 en Fri, 10 Feb 2012 18:07:50 EDT Fri, 10 Feb 2012 18:07:50 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303540
Dell's margins (about 5%) are public record and you aren't going to beat it.

So what you claim is if you spend tens of millions as a major distributor or OEM with vendors like Microsoft and Intel, you can beat Dell on their $350 machine. Brilliant logic. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303540 Mon, 27 Apr 2009 16:33:12 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303526
and if you don't think they're that cheap call dell up and ask them how much they pay for theirs and where they but them at. I'll tell you they don't pay over $50 for them. Also MSFT has their own reseller program you can join as well.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303526 Mon, 27 Apr 2009 16:29:46 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303519 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303519 Mon, 27 Apr 2009 16:27:47 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303509 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303509 Mon, 27 Apr 2009 16:25:55 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303356
Show me these resellers selling VHP SP1 OEM for $50 that you claim are so easily gotten.

The fact is that it can't be done or budget machine makers like Dell would be already doing it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303356 Mon, 27 Apr 2009 15:58:34 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303326
So you can't say the vast majority doesn't have access, its just they want the easy way out and then get suckered into Dell's over priced machines after the sales reps talk the customers into shit they don't need and lie to them.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22303326 Mon, 27 Apr 2009 15:54:25 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22296275
The VAST MAJORITY of people don't have access through a wholesaler, have a resale permit or otherwise get some backdoor deal on parts. The best the VAST MAJORITY of people can do is Newegg/ZZF/Fry's it or pick it off eBay. Just because you can swing some special deal doesn't mean everyone can. Mike and Steve aren't worried about losing your sale so enjoy your cookie and give your high horse a rest. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22296275 Sat, 25 Apr 2009 21:59:50 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22296136
OEM licenses are also only $50 with the company. Just because the retail prices are higher don't except EVERYONE pays that.

Plus who wants a paperweight from dell? when you get the POS you have to reformat it to take their shit off. Like their "remote desktop" client. Who wants to their OEM to have access anytime they want to their computer? I don't.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22296136 Sat, 25 Apr 2009 21:23:19 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22293621
The only benefit to BYO is you get to choose the exact parts you want in the form factor you want. Rarely if ever can you BYO cheaper than an OEM like Dell or HP can.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22293621 Sat, 25 Apr 2009 08:59:50 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22292519 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22292519 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 22:17:27 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22290880
I would agree with you if it were just 1 Dell that is thrown together like ass. But when you have a large percentage coming in (of various brands) with poor assembly quality, then later have hardware and/or software issues like dying power supplies you start to see a pattern. And for me it didn't matter how much I spent as I have the biggest problems with the most expensive machines. Meanwhile my army of G4 Mac Mini clients and eMac running OS X server run day and night without end, not a crash, not a kernel panic, nothin. They only reboot when an update comes down forcing a reboot or the power goes out. I'm sure there are people with Pee Cees with the same luck but I'm not one of 'em. My Dell servers, especially those running 2K3SBS require weekly restarts as they magically start refusing to authenticate clients and Dell support has no answers as to why.

Having a large number of Pee Cees and Macs and having to pay to support them I just see why some people would willingly pony up $1500 for a 24" iMac or MacBook or $2-$3K on a MacBook Pro or Mac Pro. I see them as a good buy even thought I might find a machine with the same processor cheaper elsewhere. To me there is much much more to a machine than what processor and graphics adapter are in it.

There are also a lot of people here that like tinkering with their machines or don't mind doing the necessary tweaks to get them running smoothly. I'm not one of those people any more. It was a great hobby in the early 80's into the 90's but now I just want a machine that I can take out of the box, install my software and have it just do it's job without endless hassle. I have more important things to do. I want to work WITH my machines, not work ON them.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22290880 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 16:03:21 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22290785 said by Bit:

I have one of Dell's brand new Studio XPS 1640's and the fit-finish is absolutely horrible, way worse than any unibody MacBook Pro and far worse than my Lenovo X200T. A dell is the basis for your dicontent?
Thats like buying a Yugo and say all cars are terrible!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22290785 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 15:45:42 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289937
As far as Studio XPS, they're certainly priced higher than the XPS-M machines they're replacing and they're Dell's latest DDR3 powered notebooks. What do you consider a "pure" XPS machine? The Studio XPS offers some of the fastest processors, graphics and RAM in their mobile line up. Only their foot thick M17xx offer remotely comparable performance (with SLI graphics) but they're hardly a real portable.

My impression is they added the Studio name as part of the aesthetic redesign (the leather, backlit keyboard, revised trackpad, etc). I think the XPS Ms are going away and Dell will be left with Inspiron, Studio and Studio XPS as their consumer notebook brands.

»www.dell.com/home/laptops#subcat···avla=&a=]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289937 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 13:02:46 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289914
And the pure XPS line is much better than the studio XPS line. Studio = budget.

And I agree with your last statement, these disagreements never go anywhere. I actually almost posted two links straight form the stock configuration comparing an XPS M1330 ($899) to the Macbook ($1299) just to illustrate that the only thing the Mac had better was a 9400M vs an 8600M, whereas the Dell had a faster processor, more RAM, and over twice the hard drive because I knew you're parrot out the "when you compare equal spec machines ..." but decided not to. :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289914 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 12:59:12 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289866
And I couldn't disagree more with Windows vs OS X. I use both daily, both in business and at home and aside from CAD and Games, Windows XP and Vista are horrible...slow in operation, horrible ergonomics and very long boot and shutdown times. And they are unstable even in factory condition. It's a horrible cliche' but for me, OS X has always just worked. Windows 7 is a huge improvement but I don't consider it surpassing Snow Leopard in usability or speed, not anywhere close.

Aside from my Mini 9, I don't buy "cheap" Pee Cees. My Lenovo tablet was nearly $3K, my Studio XPS 1640 nearly $2K and my servers $4K each and none are stellar.

These types of discussions usually go no where. Everyone has their preference. As I mentioned, I use both every day and IMO, Apple's products are simply superior in build quality and operation, their service top notch and thus usually worth the extra money. But what I find is when you compare LIKE products in terms of same hardware AND form factor AND software suite, the price isn't that much different. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289866 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 12:50:57 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289790 said by Bit:

Some would say you're paying for superior software, superior design and better/friendlier customer service. I have one of Dell's brand new Studio XPS 1640's and the fit-finish is absolutely horrible, way worse than any MacBook Pro and far worse than my Lenovo X200T. Of course is was about 2/3 the cost of the MacBook Pro so I expect it to be crappier. So sure, it has the same 2.8GHz C2D, DDR3 and Radeon graphics, but the similarities in build end there.
The studio line is cheap. The "presentation" of the Mac and the customer support (that I have experienced with my iPhone) is in fact top notch. However, you can purchase the same level of customer service if you so desire from Dell. And I urge you to take a look at the XPS line from Dell. The M1330 is an absolutely gorgeous piece of hardware, rivaling and surpassing anything I've seen in a 13" form factor from Apple.

I think what most Mac owners don't get is that as of Windows XP SP2 (minus Vista, but Win 7 is phenomenal), there is nothing compelling in OS X. Yes, I have a Mac Mini so I'm not speaking from ignorance. OS X was so much better than Windows when it came out, but it is stagnant. Windows quickly improved and closed the gap and unless Apple does something else ground breaking, OS X will start slowly losing market share again as has been evidenced by the decline in Macbook and desktop Mac sales, whereas others (HP and Dell) are accelerating. You'll always have a contingent of faithful buyers and you'll also have people who get so frustrated with Windows they shun it forever. But there are also people who use Linux on their desktop for God's sake ... that is a lesson in torture worthy of waterboarding.

Anyway, my point is, things have progressed to the point where a $500 Dell is just as capable as a $1299 Macbook. Sure the Mac may "look" prettier, but most people simply don't care. They want a functional device, not a fashion accessory and want to pay the least amount possible for it. Those who want to justify their purchase by clinging to old "PC's are cheap and unreliable" or believe the PC vs Mac commercials, well, people also believe the Mason's run the world. To each is own, but it's not exactly reality. :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289790 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 12:39:33 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289714 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289714 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 12:26:07 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289675 said by GilbertMark:

I don't want the typical PC, which is piece of junk that will require replacement in a year or two, if it doesn't break down on its own before then.

You get what you pay for. You want dirt cheap? Have fun with that "computer" of yours.
You do realize your Mac has the same components and is made by the same factory in China right? You're paying for a name and cheap to implement (but innovative) features like magnetic power connections or whatever they are.

Other than that, it has the same CPU, same RAM, same chipset, same hard drive, same video card ... everything.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289675 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 12:20:32 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289264 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289264 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 10:53:42 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289226 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289226 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 10:46:02 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289218
The only reason I got the Mini 9 is because of the ease of dumping Windows and installing OS X on it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22289218 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 10:44:37 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22288920
Apple's beautiful Macbook, Macbook Air and Macbook Pro, are form over function (with price a close 2nd). Premium. And higher than last models.

just don't spill a coffee or other liquid on them, k? ;)
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Weeeeeeee!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22288920 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 09:28:50 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22288698 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22288698 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 08:32:33 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22288690 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22288690 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 08:28:03 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22287989 said by GilbertMark:

I don't want the typical PC, which is piece of junk that will require replacement in a year or two, if it doesn't break down on its own before then.

You get what you pay for. You want dirt cheap? Have fun with that "computer" of yours.
I build my own state of the art systems for a fraction of what you pay for that Mac. Can you build your own Mac?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22287989 Fri, 24 Apr 2009 00:39:13 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22287621
You get what you pay for. You want dirt cheap? Have fun with that "computer" of yours.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22287621 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 22:54:10 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22287448 said by ThrowDemsOut:

said by Bit:

As does Apple's earnings which are amazingly up over last year.
Earnings are up, but Mac sales are down for the 1st time ever. Apple is soaring on iPhone sales right now, but if that slows down along with Mac sales they could be in trouble.
And the new shuffle design with the controls integrated into the headphones won't help those sell either. I need a new shuffle and I'm going to look somewhere else because I HAVE to use different headphones.

I'd love to have a Mac, but I can't justify $1299+ when I can get a Dell for $899 or $999 that is just as (if not more) capable.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22287448 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 22:19:09 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22287376 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22287376 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 22:08:49 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286673 said by ThrowDemsOut:

said by Bit:

As does Apple's earnings which are amazingly up over last year.
Earnings are up, but Mac sales are down for the 1st time ever. Apple is soaring on iPhone sales right now, but if that slows down along with Mac sales they could be in trouble.
Mac sales are down slightly, but their ASP is still high, that's why they'll weather this storm as well as (or better than) anyone else. And the iPhone is quite a versatile platform for those of us in the medical profession - the only reason I carry my old palm pilot around is for a single (yet important) program MData - but it appears an iPhone version is in the works so I may be putting the palm pilot up on eBay in the not too distant future and only carrying one PDA for everything from then on out.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286673 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 19:45:59 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286611 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286611 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 19:31:59 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286605 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286605 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 19:31:22 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286538
Cheapest Apple laptop is ~$1000.
Typical PC based laptop is $500-$750 range, with netbooks down as cheap as $300.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286538 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 19:18:44 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286512 said by Bit:

As does Apple's earnings which are amazingly up over last year.
Earnings are up, but Mac sales are down for the 1st time ever. Apple is soaring on iPhone sales right now, but if that slows down along with Mac sales they could be in trouble.
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My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286512 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 19:12:42 EDT Re: Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286443 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Just-as-I-expected-22286443 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 18:54:46 EDT Just as I expected http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Just-as-I-expected-22286434 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Just-as-I-expected-22286434 Thu, 23 Apr 2009 18:53:02 EDT