Moos
join:2008-12-11
Salt Lake City, UT
| reply to xcal78
Re: [ Classes] 3.1 mage specs and gear (PvE & PvP)
XCal, Have you been using FB for a bit now? Can you update us on how you like it VS arcane? I'm looking at making this switch as well but dont have the gear for the hit rating just yet. our guild is currently doing 10 man ulduar and not 25. Would FB be better over arcane for 10 man? Just hoping on an update and hear you opinion on it all. hows your DPS vs arcane? I'm just curious as to why everyone says FB is superiour to arcane in ulduar. |
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xcal78
join:2009-02-27
Waltham, MA
 ·RCN CABLE
| said by Moos  :XCal, Have you been using FB for a bit now? Can you update us on how you like it VS arcane? I'm looking at making this switch as well but dont have the gear for the hit rating just yet. our guild is currently doing 10 man ulduar and not 25. Would FB be better over arcane for 10 man? Just hoping on an update and hear you opinion on it all. hows your DPS vs arcane? I'm just curious as to why everyone says FB is superiour to arcane in ulduar. I just started using it a week ago half time. So far I've tried it in a few raids. I found FB/TTW to be less dps on EOE10 vs arcane for 2 straight weeks now. I think my 35% crits unbuffed isn't enough to proc pyro enough yet tho. It does take a bit of getting use to vs arcane. I'm having a delima on Imp. Scorch or Molten glyph also. Should I just stick to Molten and hope we have another mage or lock who does that or be safe and keep Imp. Scorch? I can't figure it out myself. I guess I could keep like 10 of each glyph on me and reglyph as needed but sheez. Anyone have any thoughts on this? |
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Al_Gore
join:2009-04-28 | Depends on who you raid with and if you're going to need the scorch or not. |
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Moos
join:2008-12-11
Salt Lake City, UT | reply to xcal78
I would say stick with Scorch until you are certain that another mage or a lock is going to be with you everytime. Scorch will improve the whole raids crit where molten armour will improve only yours. |
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xcal78
join:2009-02-27
Waltham, MA
·RCN CABLE
| said by Moos :I would say stick with Scorch until you are certain that another mage or a lock is going to be with you everytime. Scorch will improve the whole raids crit where molten armour will improve only yours. Yea but how much will starting with 5 vs 1 then adding 1 scorch every cycle matter is the question. Even with molten armor glyph you can use scorch the same it just takes 5 casts instead of 1. I think it's more of a 10man vs 25man issue for me. In 25mans we always have it covered but in 10mans it's often times missing. I guess I should glyph FB/TTW molten for 25mans and 10man will just suffer. Arcane gives no crit bonus to the raid so I think for the sake of testing apples to apples I need molten to compare dps correctly anyways. I'll re-glyph tonight and test it some more but I think my gear isn't good enough to surpass arcane yet. FB/TTW does really take an insain amount of gear to make it fly. |
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Moos
join:2008-12-11
Salt Lake City, UT
1 edit | Lol, Yeah I dont know what to tell ya. I tried out FFB awhile back witht he scorch thing but never really got that into it. My crit was too low for it to be any good at that time. Just Dual spec and go arcane for 10 mans and FB for 25's. Lol. I dunno. |
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xcal78
join:2009-02-27
Waltham, MA
·RCN CABLE
| reply to xcal78
Arcane is still doing more for me then FB/TTW. I guess FB/TTW is very very picky on your gear to max it out. I'm just going to keep using arcane and rolling on FB/TTW gear till I get BiS for almost everything to try it again. I'd be curious to look at some other people's FB/TTW specs for gear to see what they use to pull better dps with. |
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andy7117
join:2009-04-01
Newmarket, ON
| said by xcal78 :Arcane is still doing more for me then FB/TTW. I guess FB/TTW is very very picky on your gear to max it out. I'm just going to keep using arcane and rolling on FB/TTW gear till I get BiS for almost everything to try it again. I'd be curious to look at some other people's FB/TTW specs for gear to see what they use to pull better dps with. I've found its really just what your used to. FB/ttw can do more depending on your preference. I prefer arcane and I'm going to stick with it. |
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xcal78
join:2009-02-27
Waltham, MA | reply to xcal78
Does anyone have a Frost spec to share for PvP? |
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Moos
join:2008-12-11
Salt Lake City, UT | reply to xcal78
I'm at work so I cant link a picture but you can check my build out on the armory.
moostafari on bladefist. it's my dual spec talent. |
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Jason808
@army.mil | reply to xcal78
www.getbuffed.com is a good site that has a talent calculator. It's not blocked from my workplace network yet:/ *knocks on wood* |
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Shamartist
join:2009-05-01
Monterey, CA | reply to xcal78
i raid with FFB spec, so does the other 2 mages in my guild, i have the hit for FB/TTW i just dont like how it feels. feel free to check out my spec just Armory Wolftickets on Tichondrius |
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xcal78
join:2009-02-27
Waltham, MA
·RCN CABLE
| said by Shamartist :i raid with FFB spec, so does the other 2 mages in my guild, i have the hit for FB/TTW i just dont like how it feels. feel free to check out my spec just Armory Wolftickets on Tichondrius FFB and FB/TTW feel the exact same. The rotation is identical except one is FFB and one is FB. What exactly is different about the feel to you? Do you feel the extra hit requirement or is it the loss of Icy Veins you feel? |
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Shamartist
join:2009-05-01
Monterey, CA
| said by xcal78 :said by Shamartist :i raid with FFB spec, so does the other 2 mages in my guild, i have the hit for FB/TTW i just dont like how it feels. feel free to check out my spec just Armory Wolftickets on Tichondrius FFB and FB/TTW feel the exact same. The rotation is identical except one is FFB and one is FB. What exactly is different about the feel to you? Do you feel the extra hit requirement or is it the loss of Icy Veins you feel? mostly loss of ice veins, i like having that on demand burst |
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xcal78
join:2009-02-27
Waltham, MA
·RCN CABLE
1 edit | said by Shamartist :said by xcal78 :said by Shamartist :i raid with FFB spec, so does the other 2 mages in my guild, i have the hit for FB/TTW i just dont like how it feels. feel free to check out my spec just Armory Wolftickets on Tichondrius FFB and FB/TTW feel the exact same. The rotation is identical except one is FFB and one is FB. What exactly is different about the feel to you? Do you feel the extra hit requirement or is it the loss of Icy Veins you feel? mostly loss of ice veins, i like having that on demand burst Sounds like you should have the classic Arcane (Burst) spec + FB/TTW (Sustained) spec. Arcane dumps mana super fast which lends itself to IV better then FFB or FB/TTW. I personally love Arcane spec for insain bursting dps. Nothing touches an arcane mages burst dps as far as a mage goes. |
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xcal78
join:2009-02-27
Waltham, MA
·RCN CABLE
1 edit | reply to xcal78
FFB Spec |
You want to gear the same for FFB as fireball aside from less hit rating. Once your hit capped try to get like 400-500 haste then get as much SP and Crit as possible. FFB's real power is in Living Bomb and Pyro's so you want both of those to be going as much as possible. Pyro's are procs off crits so it's a very important stat to get high but you can't discount having a base amount of haste in addition to that. The faster you cast FFB the faster you can proc a Pyro. |
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xcal78
join:2009-02-27
Waltham, MA
·RCN CABLE
| reply to xcal78
Arcane Spec v.2 |
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Gudziel
join:2009-01-05
Pittsburgh, PA | What's the suggested base spell stats for FFB and Your arcane spec xcal78? |
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xcal78
join:2009-02-27
Waltham, MA
·RCN CABLE
1 edit | said by Gudziel :What's the suggested base spell stats for FFB and Your arcane spec xcal78? Arcane is pretty easy to do well with from 'just dinging 80' all the way to end game. I think I was doing like 2,500-2,800 dps in green/blue's when I hit 80 with arcane.
Here's some info from EJ on FFB:
"The Frostfire Bolt thread
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a thread dedicated towards frostfire bolt and frostfire bolt builds specifically. I know for now it looks more like its under construction (and it is), but the main goal for me to post this is to get the points of contention worked out. Also others might like to ask specific questions about the build at the same time, although I think most of it is rather intuitive.
Zaldinar's FFB thread
World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Everything you ever wanted to know about FFB.
World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Proven TheoryCrafting Stuff
World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Proven Beta Stuff
Some numbers
level difference hit cap % PVE hit cap % PVP hit rating PVE (lvl 80)
-4 0% 0% 0
-3 1% 1% 26.23199272
-2 2% 2% 52.46398544
-1 3% 3% 78.69597816
0 4% 4% 104.92797088
+1 5% 5% 131.1599636
+2 6% 6% 157.39195632
+3 (skull level boss) 17% 13% 445.94387624
+4 28% 20% 734.49579616
+5 39% 27% 1023.04771608
Rating Level 60 Level 70 Level 80
Spell Hit 8 12.61538506 26.23199272
Spell Critical Strike 14 22.07692337 45.90598679
Spell Haste 10 15.76923275 32.78998947
% Spell Hit Rating (lvl 80) Typical case draenai % Spell Hit with draenai
17% 445.94387624 hit cap 16% 419.71188352
14% 367.24789808 EP or (no EP + misery/improved faerie fire) 13% 341.01590536
11% 288.55191992 EP + misery/improved faerie fire 10% 262.3199272
8% 209.85594176 EP+AF (57/3/11) + misery/improved faerie fire 7% 183.62394904
1% 26.23199272
Spell Talents / metagem Crit multiplier (no T7) Crit multiplier (with 4pcT7) Note
arcane spell (no CSD) 150% 152.5%
arcane spell CSD 154.5% 157.225%
arcane spell spell power 175% 177.5%
arcane spell spell power + CSD 181.75% 184.475%
frost spell ice shards 200% 202.5%
frost spell ice shards + CSD 209% 211.725%
Fireball/Frostfire bolt ignite 210% 213.5%
Fireball/Frostfire bolt ignite + CSD 216.3% 220.115%
Fireball/Frostfire bolt ignite + burnout 245% 248.5%
Fireball/Frostfire bolt ignite + burnout + CSD 254.45% 258.265%
Frostfire bolt ignite + burnout + ice shards 315% 318.5%
Frostfire bolt ignite + burnout + ice shards + CSD 330.75% 334.565%
--
am (glyphed) spell power 187.5% 190%
am (glyphed) spell power + CSD 195.375% 198.1%
blizzard spell power + 2/3 ice shards 208% 210.5% 57/3/11
blizzard spell power + 2/3 ice shards + CSD 217.72% 220.445% 57/3/11
blizzard spell power + 3/3 ice shards 225% 227.5% 56/3/12
blizzard spell power + 3/3 ice shards + CSD 236.25% 238.975% 56/3/12
(crit multiplier formula listed in the formula section)
Specs - all 0/53/18 variants
Pure single-target dps build. 3/3 World in Flames. No blastwave/dragon's breath. This is generally the 'base' build used from which you make modifications from.
»talent.mmo-champion.com/?mage...···19000000
Typical modifications
1pt ice floes -> frostbite - Ice floes is fairly bad for the build anyway, so might as well max out frostbite for better farming. Keep in mind frostbite will not proc on blizzard without putting at least 1 pt in it.
1pt ice floes -> frostbite, 1pt world in flames -> imp. blizzard - More controlled blizzard dps. Keep in mind World in Flames affects blizzard dps.
1pt world in flames or 1pt frost channeling -> dragon's breath - Dragon's Breath
1pt ice floes -> frostbite, 1pt world in flames -> imp. blizzard, 3pt frost channeling -> shatter - Shatter/blizzard. This change alone isn't too awesome, however, if 2+ mages spec with 3/3 frostbite 1/3 blizzard the results can turn out excellent. Keep in mind you will do 10% more blizzard threat.
Other modifications
Some mages may prefer having fiery payback available at all times. I could see a good case being made for the matter.
Also I can understand mages cutting out Flame Throwing since FFB is unaffected by the talent. It does mean your scorch/living bomb/pyroblasts are limited by range though.
Playstyle
The damage is extremely streaky and bursty, mostly due to FFB crit multiplier and hot streak. This is also why Mirror Image is more interesting for that spec -- it allows you to work around streaky threat and 'normalize' it.
Generally speaking, the spec works with priorities. Here is what I use, as I point out in the points of contention, I am not 100% sure on them, although remain confident this is accurate.
Hot Streak pyroblast > Living Bomb > scorch refresh > ffb
However, this is only the main outline. Many improvements can be done. Amongst other things, Living Bomb explosion consumes a combustion charge, so you want to make sure to avoid it. You can always play around the timing of hot streak. There is no good reason to cast it right away. As such, if the hot streak mechanics allow you to safely cast living bomb / scorch -> hot streak, I would advocate it so as to avoid ignite munching. Of course, this assumes either living bomb or scorch was due for a refresh, otherwise I would just take the risk and hope ignite munching isn't too bad.
AOE
ranged aoe: living bomb > flame strike (full rank) > flame strike (rank 8) > blizzard
close aoe: living bomb > combustion/flamestrike/dragon's breath/blastwave > flamestrike > cone of cold > blizzard
AOE isn't a simple as it used to be. First, you can and probably will die from aggro pulls. Yes, even on blizzard. However, you can work around this by using mirror image to have 30s where you can't pull aggro.
The reason you want to do a full rank flamestrike followed by a lower-ranked flamestrike is because the ground dot will stack.
Threat management
Class Name Note
Mage Invisibility
Mage Mirror Image
Warrior Vigilance 31 prot
Warrior Intervene
Paladin Hand of Salvation
Priest Pain Suppression 41 disc
Hunter Misdirection
Mage - talent Arcane Subtlety
Mage - talent Burning Soul Does not stack with frost channeling
Mage - talent Frost Channeling Does not stack with burning soul
Generally you want to delay invisibility as much as possible, because the more you wait, the more effective it becomes.
Based on my personal experience, waiting for the boss to reach 70% hp before using invis will allow you to go all out for the remainder of the fight. Of course, this is only a rule of thumb and assumes that you produce more threat than your tank, and that you will catch up to him. You can play with the number a bit if you can afford to use invis at the end of the fight (ie: finish the fight with >130% threat). It has proven to work well, however, expanded math could give optimum values (if anyone is willing to do it).
Consumables
Flask Food Potion Gem
Best [Flask of the Frost Wyrm] [Fish Feast]/[Firecracker Salmon]/[Tender Shoveltusk Steak] [Potion of Speed] [Mana Sapphire]
Alternative [Great Feast]/[Smoked Salmon]/[Shoveltusk Steak] [Runic Mana Potion] [Flame Cap] (not recommended w/ 2pc t7)
Alternative- [Snapper Extreme]/[Worg Tartare] [Potion of Wild Magic]
Glyphs
0/53/18 18/53/0 57/3/11 51/20/0
[Glyph of Frostfire] [Glyph of Fireball] [Glyph of Arcane Blast] [Glyph of Arcane Blast]
[Glyph of Molten Armor] [Glyph of Molten Armor] [Glyph of Molten Armor] / [Glyph of Mage Armor] [Glyph of Molten Armor] / [Glyph of Mage Armor]
[Glyph of Improved Scorch] [Glyph of Improved Scorch] [Glyph of Arcane Missiles] [Glyph of Improved Scorch]
[Glyph of Blast Wave] [Glyph of Blast Wave]
Formulas
base formula for all mage spells (thx to Zaldinar for corrections)
avg_damage_per_cast_noncrit = (avg_cast_base_dmg + (spell_coefficient + empowered_fire + empowered_frostbolt + arcane_empowerment) * final_spell_dmg) * (firepower + ffb_glyph + spell_impact) * pwf * piercing_ice * coe * arcane_instability [* frostbolt_glyph] [* arcane_blast_buff] [* arcane_power] [* molten_fury] [* rune_of_razorice] [* ferocious_inspiration] [* tricks_of_the_trade]
spell_coefficient = (see table below for appropriate coefficients)
avg_damage_per_cast = avg_damage_per_cast_noncrit * (1 + final_crit% * (crit_multiplier - 1))
final_cast_time = talented_cast_time / (1 + total_haste_rating / haste_rating_per_percent / 100) / netherwind_presence [/ bloodlust or power_infusion or wrath_of_air] [/ retribution_aura] [/ icy veins] [/ berserking]
spell_dps = avg_damage_per_cast * chance_to_hit% / final_cast_time
ex: frostfire bolt -- molten fury + rune of razorice + berserking(20%) + bloodlust + icy veins + 4pct7 + CSD included, 2000 spelldmg, 55% crit, 500 haste rating
avg_damage_per_cast_noncrit = ( (722+838)/2 + (3/3.5 + 0.15) * 2000 spelldmg) * (1.1 + 0.02) * 1.03 * 1.06 * 1.13 [* 1.12] [* 1.05] = 4540.65
avg_damage_per_cast = 4540.65 * (1 + 0.55 * (3.34565 - 1)) = 10398.58
final_cast_time = 3 / (1 + 500/32.78998947/100) / 1.3 / 1.2 / 1.2 = 1.39
spell_dps = 10398.58 * 1 / 1.39 = 7480.99 dps
ex: arcane barrage(2.5/3.5 coef) -- ab_glyph(3%) + 3_stack_ab_buff + arcane power(20%) + torment the weak + berserking(20%) + bloodlust + icy veins + 4pct7 + CSD included, 2000 spelldmg, 55% crit, 500 haste rating
avg_damage_per_cast_noncrit = ( (936+1144)/2 + (2.5/3.5) * 2000 spelldmg) * (1.06) * 1.13 * 1.03 * 1.54 [* 1.2] = 5628.20
avg_damage_per_cast = 5628.20 * (1 + 0.55 * (1.84475 - 1)) = 8243.13
final_cast_time = 1.5 / (1 + 500/32.78998947/100) / 1.06 / 1.3 / 1.2 / 1.2 = 0.66
spell_dps = 8243.13 * 1 / 0.66 = 12489.59 dps (ignoring sub-GCD penalty)
notes/gotchas:
ffb glyph and spell impact are applied a very odd way, as shown in the formula above. Some frost calculations are not 100% known, given they give sometimes results outside of predicted values. As such, this should be only used to get a rough idea. Also, rune of razorice is known to be bugged and give 5% more damage, not 10% as shown in the tooltip. Also, a player can only benefit from one external (non-self-provided) haste% buff multiplier -- as such, bloodlust/powerinfusion/wrath of air will not stack together. Only the highest one of them should apply.
crit multiplier formula
crit_multiplier = (1 + ( ((1.5 [* CSD]) - 1) * (1 [+ ice_shards] [+ burnout] [+ spell_power] [+ 4pct7] [+ am_glyph]) )) [* ignite]
ex: frostfire bolt -- ignite + burnout + ice shards + CSD + 4pct7
crit_multiplier = (1 + ( ((1.5 * 1.03) - 1) * (1 + 1 + 0.5 + 0.05) )) * 1.4 = 334.565%
Base mana
Class Level 70 Level 80
Mage 2241 3268
Druid 2370 3496
Warlock 2871 3856
Priest 2620 3863
Paladin 2953 4394
Shaman 3457 4396
Hunter 3383 5046
Spell Coefficient Damage range Talents affecting the dot Mana cost % Mana cost (lvl 80) Notes
Frostfire Bolt 3.0/3.5 722-838 + 90/9s pwf, firepower, arcane instability, piercing ice 14% 457 1 tick / 3s
Living Bomb 0.80/12s + 0.40 1380/12s + 690 pwf (not firepower) 22% 718 1 tick / 3s
Pyroblast 1.15 + 0.20/12s 1210-1531 + 452/12s pwf, firepower, arcane instability 22% 718 1 tick / 3s
Scorch 1.5/3.5 382-451 8% 261
Fireball 3.5/3.5 898-1143 + 116/8s pwf, firepower, arcane instability 19% 620 1 tick / 2s
Fire Blast 1.5/3.5 925-1095 21% 686
Flamestrike 0.2427 + 0.1220 (per tick) 876-1071 + 780/8s pwf, firepower, arcane instability 30% 980 1 tick / 2s
Flamestrike (rank 8) 0.2427 + 0.1220 (per tick) 699-854 + 620/8s pwf, firepower, arcane instability 30% 980 1 tick / 2s
Blizzard 8.0/3.5/2 /8s 3408/8s 74% 2418 1 tick / s
Cone of Cold 1.5/3.5/2 709-776 29% 947
Dragon's Breath 1.5/3.5/2*0.90 1101-1279 31% 1013
Blast Wave 1.5/3.5/2*0.90 1047-1233 28% 915 / glyphed: 777
Arcane Explosion 1.5/3.5/2 538-582 22% 718
Frost Nova 1.5/3.5/2*0.90 368-419 8% 261
Frostbolt 3/3.5*0.95 803-866 13% 424
Ice Lance 1.5/3.5/3 223-258 7% 228
Arcane Blast 2.5/3.5 1185-1377 8% 261
Arcane Missiles 5/3.5 ~362 31% 1013
Arcane Barrage 2.5/3.5 936-1144 18% 588
Mirror Image - - 10% 326 30s
Mirror Image - frostbolt 0.10 163-169 * 150% crits, ~22-25 per cast - -
Mirror Image - fireblast 0.05 88-98 * 150% crits, ~10-14 per cast - -
Water Elemental - frostbolt 2.5/3.5*0.4 601-673 150% crits, sta/int = 0.3, 5% base crit 16% 522 45-60s
note: there is a discrepancy between the in-game-tooltip values and the ones reported by sites parsing the data files. The values above are taken from in-game-tooltips (except for arcane missiles).
* Based on a limited number of casts (~100 per).
base_mana_cost = rounddown( class_base_mana[player_level] * spell_mana_cost )
final_mana_cost = rounddown( base_mana_cost [* elemental_precision] [* arcane_focus] [* arcane_power] )
exception case: ab_mana_cost = rounddown( round(base_mana_cost [* arcane_focus] [* elemental_precision]) * (1 + ab_stacks * 2 [+ arcane_power] [+ 2pct5]) )
(Arcane_blast is different than the rest because the first part of the mana cost can be rounded up, whereas every other spell can only be rounded down. So even though it seems like the formulas are the same, they need to be treated separately.)
ex: arcane barrage -- 3/3 elemental precision + 3/3 arcane focus + arcane power(20%)
base_mana_cost = rounddown( 3268 * 0.18 ) = 588
final_mana_cost = rounddown( 588 * 0.97 * 0.97 * 1.2 ) = 663
ex: arcane blast (3 stacks already up) -- 3/3 arcane focus + 3/3 elemental precision + arcane power(20%) + 2pct5
base_mana_cost = rounddown( 3268 * 0.08 ) = 261
ab_mana_cost = rounddown( round(261 * 0.97 * 0.97) * (1 + 3 * 2 + 0.20 + 0.05) ) = 1783
Spell/buff Gain
classic buffs/debuffs--- ---
Ebon Plaguebringer/Curse of the Elements+Malediction/Earth and Moon 13% damage
Improved Scorch/Winter's Chill 10% crit
Wrath of Air Totem 5% haste
Retribution Aura+Swift Retribution 3% haste
Bloodlust 30% haste / 40s
Totem of Wrath/Demonic Pact/Flametongue Totem+Enhancing Totems/Improved Divine Spirit 280 dmg
Totem of Wrath/Master Poisoner/Heart of the Crusader 3% crit
Elemental Oath/Moonkin Form 5% crit
Misery/Improved Faerie Fire 3% hit
Ferocious Inspiration 3% dmg (proc)
Replenishment (Vampiric Touch/Judgements of the Wise/Hunting Party) 0.25% max mana/s
Blessing of Wisdom+Improved Blessing of Wisdom/Mana Spring Totem+Restorative Totems 109 mp5
Judgement of Wisdom 0.25% max mana/hit
Innervate
Mana Tide+Glyph of Mana Tide Totem 6-7% max mana/3s for 12s
gear / self buffs--- ---
[Glyph of Molten Armor] 2% crit
[Glyph of Frostfire] (2% damage + 2% crit) to ffb
[Glyph of Fireball] 5% fireball crit
[Glyph of Arcane Blast] +3% AB debuff damage
[Glyph of Arcane Missiles] +25% AM bonus crit damage
[Chaotic Skyflare Diamond] 3% bonus crit damage
Crit Strike Damage Percent 5% bonus crit damage (4pct7)
Improved Mana Gems 225 dmg / 15s (2pct7)
Molten Armor 3% crit
consumables--- ---
[Flask of the Frost Wyrm] 125 dmg
[Fish Feast]/[Firecracker Salmon]/[Tender Shoveltusk Steak] 46 dmg
[Potion of Wild Magic] 200dmg 200crit / 15s
[Potion of Speed] 500 haste / 15s
[Runic Mana Potion] 4200-4400 mana
[Mana Sapphire] 3330-3500 mana / 2min, 4662-4900 mana / 2min if 2pct7
[Flame Cap] 80 fire dmg / 1min (3min CD)
Evocation
more esoteric stuff--- ---
Berserking 10-30% haste
Power Infusion 20% haste / 15s, does not stacks with bloodlust/WOA/AP
Rune of Razorice 5% frost damage (tooltip is wrong)
Focus Magic 3% crit (from other mage)
Tricks of the Trade +15% damage / 6s
Improved Water Elemental 0.6% max mana/6s for 1min
[Kreeg's Stout Beatdown] +25spi -5int
[Midsummer Sausage] (fire festival) 23 dmg
[Fire-toasted Bun] (fire festival) 20 hit
[Burning Blossom]->Fire Festival Fury (fire festival) 3% crit
[Very Berry Cream] (valentine) 35 dmg
[Dark Desire] (valentine) 30 hit
[Sweet Surprise] (valentine) 30 haste
[Pyroblast Cinnamon Ball] (halloween) 6 dmg (stacks?)
[Chewy Fel Taffy] (halloween) 5 hit (stacks?)
[Soothing Spearmint Candy] (halloween) 11 dmg (stacks?)
[Mistletoe] (xmas) 20 spi
truly esoteric stuff--- ---
Basic Campfire 4 spirit
[Eye of the Night] 34 dmg to party members
[Braided Eternium Chain] 28 crit to party members
[Chain of the Twilight Owl] 45 crit to party members
Atiesh, Greatstaff of the Guardian (warlock) 33 crit to party members
Atiesh, Greatstaff of the Guardian (mage) 28 dmg to party members
Stats equivalence
Originally Posted by Muphrid
If you're just doing the equivalence for Frostfire Bolt (and not a typical mixed rotation of FFB with Pyroblast from Hot Streak procs and/or Living Bomb woven in), the calculations are extremely straightforward.
m is the average base damage (ex: frostfire bolt: (722+838)/2 = 780)
r is the spell power coefficient (see table above for spell coefficients)
d is your spell power.
b is the critical strike bonus. (see table above for crit multiplier)
c is your crit chance.
z is the bonus to your casting speed from gear-based haste.
h is your hit chance.
[slightly edited]
Interesting data points from spreadsheet
spell DPSC
scorch 3000
fireblast 4150
ffb 4500
living bomb 6650
hs pyro 8500
hs pyro + 4x dot 9500
aoe --- (all aoe numbers assume no coe and no scorch debuff)
frost nova 1050
flamestrike r8 (no dot) 1100
arcane explosion 1150
flamestrike (no dot) 1275
blizzard 1500
cone of cold 1625
flamestrike r8 (+4x dot) 1975
flamestrike (+4x dot) 2200
blastwave 2600
dragon's breath 2700
living bomb explosion 2750
living bomb 5650
note: the values come from the default values unless otherwise indicated. AOE section assumes no COE and no scorch debuff. The spreadsheet default values uses near-optimum 25-man gear numbers.
what does the above means ?
Well, a few things. First, your ffb dps alone is kind of low (4000). Living Bomb and Hot Streak really really do a lot more than ffb does. In other words, a large part of your dps is dependant upon casting those. This is what we've been saying for a long time, but hopefully the numbers will make people realize how important they are.
AOE numbers have some interesting points in them. Much to my surprise, although I suspected it a bit, the frostnova dps is almost on par with arcane explosion. Flamestrike dps with and without the dot is a world's difference. Almost double the damage in fact. Spamming flamestrike would normally yield at least 1 dot (and 2 if you alternate r9/r8), so the numbers would be higher than shown here, but not enough to overcome blizzard dps (well, it would do more dps than blizzard alternating r9/r8 flamestrike than casting blizzard), however, the small radius of flamestrike would make it somewhat a players call. It does make alternating flamestrike rank a decent alternative to blizzard, which I could see in a good number of cases being the better option.
Living bomb is the best AOE period. Even on collateral damage dps (I mean, targets exploding not originally targeted by living bomb).
In any case, this does makes a solid case about optimal aoe rotations.
More numbers
Level Crit / Int Int / 1% crit
70 0.0125 80
71 0.0116 86.2068944
72 0.0108 92.59259244
73 0.0101 99.00990313
74 0.0093 107.526879
75 0.0087 114.9425283
76 0.0081 123.4567927
77 0.0075 133.333327
78 0.007 142.857139
79 0.0065 153.8461534
80 0.006 166.6666709
crit_rate_from_int = 0.9075 + final_int / 166.6666709
note: 0.9075 applies only to lvl 80 ? currently unknown
Level 70 Level 80
BASE_REGEN 0.009327 0.005575
Level BASE_REGEN Level BASE_REGEN Level BASE_REGEN Level BASE_REGEN
1 0.034965001 21 0.019733001 41 0.013724 61 0.010701
2 0.034191001 22 0.019156 42 0.013522 62 0.010523
3 0.033465002 23 0.018819001 43 0.013363 63 0.010291
4 0.032527 24 0.018316999 44 0.013176 64 0.01012
5 0.031661 25 0.017936001 45 0.012996 65 0.009969
6 0.031076999 26 0.017577 46 0.012854 66 0.009808
7 0.030523 27 0.017201001 47 0.012687 67 0.009652
8 0.029995 28 0.016919 48 0.01254 68 0.009553
9 0.029307 29 0.016581999 49 0.012384 69 0.009446
10 0.028662 30 0.016233999 50 0.012233 70 0.009327
11 0.027585 31 0.015995 51 0.012114 71 0.008859
12 0.026215 32 0.015707999 52 0.011973 72 0.008415
13 0.025381001 33 0.015464 53 0.01186 73 0.007993
14 0.024301 34 0.015204 54 0.011715 74 0.007592
15 0.023345999 35 0.014957 55 0.011576 75 0.007211
16 0.022748999 36 0.014745 56 0.011473 76 0.006849
17 0.021958999 37 0.014496 57 0.011342 77 0.006506
18 0.021387 38 0.014302 58 0.011245 78 0.006179
19 0.020791 39 0.014095 59 0.011111 79 0.005869
20 0.020121001 40 0.013896 60 0.011 80 0.005575
ManaRegen(SPI, INT, LEVEL) = roundup( (0.001+SPI*BASE_REGEN[LEVEL]*(INT^0.5) *0.60 )*5 )
* applies only to 3.10
Professions / Racials
Profession Buff Non-profession buff Gain
Jewelcrafting 3x[Runed Dragon's Eye] 3x[Runed Scarlet Ruby] or (2x[Glowing Twilight Opal]+[Potent Monarch Topaz]) between [+39 dmg] and [+69 dmg, -8 crit, -24 sta]
Blacksmithing Socket Gloves+Socket Bracer +38 dmg
Enchanting 2xEnchant Ring - Greater Spellpower +38 dmg
Leatherworking Fur Lining - Spell Power Enchant Bracers - Superior Spellpower +37 dmg
Alchemy Mixology [Flask of the Frost Wyrm] +37 dmg
Inscription Master's Inscription of the Storm [Greater Inscription of the Storm ] +37 dmg
Engineering Hyperspeed Acceleration Enchant Gloves - Exceptional Spellpower 340 haste / 10s (1min CD), -28 dmg
Tailoring Lightweave Embroidery Enchant Cloak - Greater Speed
Skinning Master of Anatomy +32 crit
Mining Toughness +50 sta
Race Buff
Undead none
Troll Berserking + Beast Slaying (...)
Blood Elf Arcane Torrent
Human The Human Spirit
Gnome Expansive Mind
Draenai Heroic Presence "
I have FFB as my off-spec but honestly don't use it much. I'll 'guest' and I stress 'guest' since I never played with it until I had full epics. I'd try to get hit capped which is like 368 then try to get 1,800+ SP and 35% crits. Then I'd try to work in some haste to get 400-500 if you can while trying to increase your crit up a bit more to maybe 45% as well as up SP where possible to get 2,000+.
I will say there is a play style factor so some people just don't do well with arcane. I just can't seem to get FB or FFB to work better then arcane so I'd say my play style just doesn't work well for me to play FB or FFB. I'd say try both and see. If you can swing FFB then later you can switch to FB and be rocking the highest dps mage spec. If not arcane is a bit better then FFB but a bit worse then FB so you can't go wrong there. |
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Gudziel
join:2009-01-05
Pittsburgh, PA
| Thx for the reply. I already had a FFB spec from the source you provided (off of the wow forums). I just wasn't sure how far off the difference is between spell stats for arcane and ffb. I will try your arcane along with a dual spec for ffb. and try them both out to see. |
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