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 ·Optimum Online
 ·Verizon FiOS
| $300 activation? is that even legal? I've never in my life heard of a $300 installation/activation fee for broadband unless outside of an ordinarily SERVED market...
NOW Verizon doesn't have much to worry about if that's the way Cablevision wants to 1-up the competition. I seriously doubt that will hold.. BTW there is no INSTALLATION.. you bring your cablemodem into a cablevision office and swap it for a docsis 3 modem.. there is no need for a tech.. the existing install works just fine.
In conclusion, for existing customers it should cost absolutely $0 to get the new tier... anything else is price gouging profiteering. | |
|  Reviews:
·WOW Internet and..
| Re: $300 activation? is that even legal? here we go is it legal again. It's their network. they paid for it and only rent it to you. if you don't want to pay for the services and the fees they charge don't use them.
Also T1s are considered broadband as well and have install fees well above $1,000 in most markets in the country. | |
| | | | Re: $300 activation? is that even legal? said by hottboiinnc:here we go is it legal again. It's their network. they paid for it and only rent it to you. if you don't want to pay for the services and the fees they charge don't use them. Also T1s are considered broadband as well and have install fees well above $1,000 in most markets in the country. You cannot compare the two. A T1 requires a clean loop that has been tested and verified to meet certain SLA. 300$ to have someone upgrade your modem to D3 is a joke. | |
| | | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1 | Re: $300 activation? is that even legal? said by jmgeejr :
You cannot compare the two. A T1 requires a clean loop that has been tested and verified to meet certain SLA.
That test takes 5 minutes, if its not done completely by a switch from the CO and its done by hand, try a pair, if it fails, try another pair for 5 minutes, if you find no pairs, then time to delivery a couple $10Ks of construction charges to the customer. Thank for shopping with Ma Bell.
The pair delivering your T1 is in the same trunk line as the POTS line delivering phone service to granny. Nothing special about it except less insulation damage, and possibly being in a binder without other DSL or T1 lines. 99% of the time, its nothing more than any old POTS pair, otherwise you will get hit with $30K of construction charges for a fiber T3 emulating a T1. | |
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| | Of course it is legal. In the US you can charge what you want. Only someone who doesn't believe in or understand our economic system could ask such a question. And if the fee is too high - then just don't buy it. What is with all these people who thing they have some god given right to CHEAP everything and if they don't get it they want a law passed to take other people's rights away.
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| iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Comcast
| REALLY?!?
Do you know from experience that all that's needed is swapping out the cable modem?
101 Mbps is nearly the bandwidth of three channels on the node. 15 Mbps upstream is half the bandwidth of one upstream channel.
So there's PLENTY of work they have to do on the backend to offer a 101 Mbps connection over coax. Probably $300 worth or more. Dedicating three channels to one subscriber is no small feat. It costs money.
And yes it is legal. if it isn't some regulator needs to be shot. Grow up, people. If you don't have the money for the tier, I have three words for you: DON'T BUY IT.
Personally, I'll take FiOS for $100/month via DSLX and without a setup fee, with slightly better upstream (50/20 vs. 101/15).
WFor people who actually *need* 100 Mbps down, they'll be willing to pay the price. Seriously, satellite and wireless providers regularly charge $200-$400 for setup.
Am I missing anything? Nobody is being forced to pay for this service; there is comptition in the area (FiOS anyone?) and if you can't afford $300 for a setup fee to defray CV's costs then you obviously don't need the speed enough.
Sorry, I don't like whiners. | |
| |  QumahlinNever Enough TimePremium,MVM
join:2001-10-05
united state | Re: $300 activation? is that even legal? "Dedicating three channels to one subscriber is no small feat. It costs money."
You don't get three dedicated channels per subscriber...If you believe that is how DOCSIS 3.0 works then please re-read the specs. Yes three channels are bonded, but no they are not bonded to specific subscribers.
Also, the setup has already been done on their end. There is no additional setup that is costing them 300+ dollars.
It's to recoup costs and thats it.
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Forum Posts:7500 | |
| | | Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: $300 activation? is that even legal? said by Qumahlin:"Dedicating three channels to one subscriber is no small feat. It costs money." You don't get three dedicated channels per subscriber...If you believe that is how DOCSIS 3.0 works then please re-read the specs. Yes three channels are bonded, but no they are not bonded to specific subscribers. Also, the setup has already been done on their end. There is no additional setup that is costing them 300+ dollars. It's to recoup costs and thats it. I don't think it's about recouping deployment costs. Even when Verizon was hemorraging BILLIONS on their FTTP network... a INSTALL FEE was a NON-STARTER.. especially since they were only offering you a smidgeon better quality of service than a docsis 1.X speed of 15/2 (some would argue that a 101/15 is a smidgeon--that you'd notice anyway better than a 50/20 FIOS tier).. but last mile was not shared. Cablevision already has the (low price) NY Metro market locked down.. they don't seem to feel the need to use this ultra tier to effectively compete in the ultra spectrum. Even though much of the blame for lack of competition can be laid at the doorstop of the telcos from milking copper's DSL almost until their dying last breath.. the cable companies as of late are falling into the same complacency trap that forged telco style reforms in the first place.
You are right, a $99 tier and $300 and $34.95 are not $4 gasoline your about to pay for going to work.. you don't need it.. and it's not essential to one life. On the other hand, this is about common sense in pricing. No provider can expect to be able to get away with exorbinant up-front fees for an unproven product/service and I don't care if that comes from Verizon, Cablevision, or Obamavision. And don't kill the messenger.. we WILL see $4+ a gallon for gas this summer driving season & I don't care what the mass media keeps pulling over your eyes.. those bastard will do their worst again this year! | |
| | | | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Comcast
| Re: $300 activation? is that even legal? Apparently Cablevision has a different biz model than Verizon on this tier. Cablevision sees this as a premium, business-class product. Guess what? Biz-class products are MUCH more likely to be tied to setup fees. Just ask any NSP how much it costs to set up their business-class service (T1, Metro ethernet, etc.). If free, look at the price tag. Come back to me if you haven't died of sticker shock.
As far as analogizing gas to broadband goes, I'm a heavy internet user and don't need a 101/15 connection. I'd be perfectly content with 15/15 to tell you the truth, at least for 99.9% of what I do. Gas on the other hand is a necessity if I want to get from point A to point B around here. At college I can walk to the places I *need* to get to but not here. Broadband is NOT a necessity, a right or a federally regulated utility, so Cablevision can do what they please. They may get less cutomers due to the setup fee, but 101/15 internet costs them something, especially for relatively unscalable (vs. fiber) DOCSIS tech. They offer no-setup-fee Boost and 15/2 tiers; if you don't want to pay a setup fee they'll do that for you.
Sorry but I'm failing to see why this is such a big deal... | |
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| | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Comcast
| I know that the DOCSIS spec doesn't call for dedicated access to one subscriber, but that's not saying it can't be done. When you're talking abou 38 Mbps channels and 101 Mbps speeds, you can't get a lot of density there. The hardware costs money and thus...
What's the difference between recouping costs incurred and passing on installation costs, or what effectively are installation costs since there wouldn't be as much strain on the network without a 101/15 customer versus with it? | |
| | | | | There is setup .They have to run a new drop to the persons house for the docsis3 modem. that means paying the tech to set that up and the cable to do it. | |
| | | |  IgnitePremium,VIP
join:2004-03-18
UK | Re: $300 activation? is that even legal? said by majortom1029:There is setup .They have to run a new drop to the persons house for the docsis3 modem. that means paying the tech to set that up and the cable to do it. You know they're running a new drop? My DOCSIS 3 install here, using 4 channels of the more demanding EuroDOCSIS, works fine split from the video with nothing more than a 6dB attenuator on the modem. | |
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|  RARPSL
join:1999-12-08
Suffern, NY | said by iansltx:REALLY?!? Do you know from experience that all that's needed is swapping out the cable modem? That an pushing a settings file to the modem (the same as setting a modem for Standard or Boost). 101 Mbps is nearly the bandwidth of three channels on the node. 15 Mbps upstream is half the bandwidth of one upstream channel.
BTW: You need 4 (not 3) download channels to get 101 Mbs since all a channel will support is 32-33 Mbs and you need to have some buffer to support the rate speed (Boost is billed as 30 but is uncapped and can deliver when there is no congestion 32-33 Mbs). Thus if you bill as 101, you need to have more available to deliver it. There is also the claim that Ultra will be sharing the Boost 609Mhz channel as one of its Bonded Channels which will make it hard to deliver 101 (you need 3 Ultra-Only channels with the 609Mhz one added for load leveling). | |
| | | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Comcast
| Re: $300 activation? is that even legal? For the channel estimate I was being conservative. 38 * .85 (TCP overhead FTL) = 32.3, so you're right, four channels bonded are needed. That's four channels that are pretty much unavailable for other purposes, though some oversubscription could be done.
As far as the settings file is concerned, I'm interested in knowing personal experiences on the topic. If it's really just a settings change, people with a DOCSIS 3 cable modem would just have to cal, have their plan changed, reboot the modem and go, all in about 15 minutes. I'd bet that in fact the process is a bit more involved. Maybe it takes a day or three to get everything set. maybe a plant upgrade is required (or maybe not, who knows) to turn up the necessary bandwidth, since 101 Mbps requires an OC3 or better as the backhaul transport medium. Of course everything's probably wired with GigE or 10GE at this point, but someting to consider.
It'll be interesting to see when someone here actually does order 101Mbps, and what process they have to go through to get the upgraded service. | |
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