 batsona Maryland
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1 edit | reply to batsona Re: X10 Appliance Module: Window A/C???
I just read something about how sensitive the X10 modules are to noise on the AC line, and over/under-volt conditions. I have a huge post (although old) in the electronics forums that chronicals BGE trying to fix poor continuity on my neutral in my house.
When I switch on something with a high inrush current (attic fan), the leg with the fan drops its voltage to ~103VAC, and the other leg runs up to ~130VAC. With a condition like this, I don't think X10 is going to work very well.
EDIT: here's my post on my neutral problem: »Lights dim/brighten during inrush current... |
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 bkjohnson Premium join:2002-05-22 Birmingham, AL
| reply to i1me2ao When I Googled window AC remote T saw a 5000 BTU model with a remote for $120 at Walmart. I didn't read the particulars. It seems to have a timer function. Here's a link. »www.walmart.com/catalog/product.···10998012 There were lots of other links. |
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  i1me2ao Premium join:2001-03-03 TEXAS | reply to bkjohnson do they have a small 5000 btu a/c that can run from say 12 pm till 9 pm daily? |
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 bkjohnson Premium join:2002-05-22 Birmingham, AL | reply to batsona Any chance that you could replace the A/C with one that comes with a remote as part of the unit? Several companies seem to make them. |
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  i1me2ao Premium join:2001-03-03 TEXAS
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| reply to batsona dont loose sleep over it. they will fight just to fight. we just got back from mom and dads and they refuse to ride next to each other in van cause they had to sleep in same bed for three days. -- calling a illegal alien undocumented is like calling a drug dealer a undocumented pharmacist |
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  cowboyro
join:2000-10-11 Shelton, CT
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| reply to batsona said by batsona :When I was able to run the modules years ago when I had HomeSeer installed, I remember the Appliance Modules made a loud *bang* when the relay would close the switch inside, so I'd say it's a mechanical contactor in there... The 40W min load of this particular module is a good hint that it uses a solid state device. |
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 batsona Maryland
join:2004-04-17 Ellicott City, MD | reply to cowboyro When I was able to run the modules years ago when I had HomeSeer installed, I remember the Appliance Modules made a loud *bang* when the relay would close the switch inside, so I'd say it's a mechanical contactor in there... |
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 Waterbug
join:2008-03-30
| reply to Raphion Incandescent bulbs ??? Are they still legal ??? Aren't they a MAJOR contributor to Global Warming ? Every time someone turns on an incandescent bulb, it probably kills a Polar Bear.
Sorry, I just couldn't resist. Won't be able to get my tongue out of my cheek for a week.  |
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  royphil345 Premium join:2004-12-10 Lakewood, OH clubs:
1 edit | reply to DrD said by DrD :Uphill both ways, of course! ... and high as a kite!... lol |
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 bemis
join:2008-07-18 Stoneham, MA
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| reply to nunya said by nunya :You are correct, it's a non-issue. Unless we're talking about X10 modules!! :-D |
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  cowboyro
join:2000-10-11 Shelton, CT
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| reply to bemis said by bemis :I wish I had paid more attention in school... because what you said does not seem right. It does not take 12A to start a 100W light bulb..... does it? My living room has 5 100W bulbs on a single switch, so does that mean it draws 60A when I flip the switch to on? I suppose it might be believable if the current draw is nearly instantaneous and so it occurs so quickly that there is no time for the fuses/circuit breakers to blow or the wiring to heat up... Yes, the instant start current can be very high, but it's only for a fraction of a second. It could be up to ~17A/bulb (on the peak of the sine wave) if the resistance of the filament is 10ohm when cold. But it only lasts for a very, very short time. Even if it starts with the 17*5=85A, 8ms later it will be 0... Haven't you noticed that bulbs tend to burn when you switch them on? |
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  nunya SEE ROCK CITY 475 MILES Premium,MVM join:2000-12-23 O Fallon, MO clubs:
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| reply to batsona I suppose it might be believable if the current draw is nearly instantaneous and so it occurs so quickly that there is no time for the fuses/circuit breakers to blow or the wiring to heat up...
You are correct, it's a non-issue. -- Looks like Reverend Wright got his wish - God Damn America. |
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 bemis
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| reply to Raphion said by Raphion :I just checked the resistance of a 100 Watt incandescent bulb; it's 10 ohms, and 10 ohms at 120 volts is 120/10= 12 Amps! Surprising how much of a jolt those bulbs take to start up eh? It's an extremely short spike of current before the filament gets hot, but it still needs to be considered, especially with devices that use solid state electronic switches. I wish I had paid more attention in school... because what you said does not seem right.
It does not take 12A to start a 100W light bulb..... does it?
My living room has 5 100W bulbs on a single switch, so does that mean it draws 60A when I flip the switch to on?
I suppose it might be believable if the current draw is nearly instantaneous and so it occurs so quickly that there is no time for the fuses/circuit breakers to blow or the wiring to heat up... |
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  cowboyro
join:2000-10-11 Shelton, CT | reply to batsona The real stress will be starting the compressor, not running it. Honestly I don't see the control device (solid state relay, triac, thyristor) lasting too long - but you may as well be lucky. |
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 batsona Maryland
join:2004-04-17 Ellicott City, MD
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| reply to batsona UPDATE: I took the A/C unit (6000BTU Whirlpool unit from early '90s) and ran the compressor constantly for 45 min. I was pleased to see that the front of the Appliance Module got slightly warm, but then leveled off (didn't keep getting warmer and warmer..) I guess I can feel safe that the unit won't melt. |
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 Raphion
join:2000-10-14 Samsara
| reply to TheMG said by TheMG :said by nunya :Yeah, considering an incandescent load is purely resistive (for all intents and purposes). Actually, there might yet be some logic behind that spec. Incandescent bulbs have a very high inrush current when first turned on, which that X10 device may not be able to handle beyond 15A of inrush current. Something like that anyways. Bingo, incandescent bulbs have HUGE inrush current, because the resistance of the filament is proportional to it's temperature. So when it comes on, it's cold and low resistance, and draws a surge of current till it gets hot.
I just checked the resistance of a 100 Watt incandescent bulb; it's 10 ohms, and 10 ohms at 120 volts is 120/10= 12 Amps! Surprising how much of a jolt those bulbs take to start up eh? It's an extremely short spike of current before the filament gets hot, but it still needs to be considered, especially with devices that use solid state electronic switches. |
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 DrD
join:2008-03-03 Harrisonville, MO | reply to SparkChaser Uphill both ways, of course! |
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 batsona Maryland
join:2004-04-17 Ellicott City, MD
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| reply to SparkChaser Not to hijack my own thread, but my kids started to try to kill each other (9, 11) so we put them in seperte rooms. I'm an only child, and my mother is too -- I can't figure out why siblings fight.. Anyway.. I'll buy my $49 copy of ActiveHome with the Macros, and see if the Appliance module melts. The TStats in the A/C units routes the full current of the compressor thru it - I thought it might be a low voltage relay, then I could have controled it as a 24v relay, but no such luck. |
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  SparkChaser BURY BECK Premium join:2000-06-06 Downingtown, PA
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| reply to nunya said by nunya :A proper solution is to install a dedicated circuit for each window unit. For all the confabulation and speculation with X10 stuff, you could devote that time, energy, and funding to correcting the original problem. I was thinking the kids could bunk together and alternate rooms 
Did I tell ya, how we didn't have A/C and I walked 10 miles to school in the snow? -- "Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." - Aldous Huxley
"I'm tellin' you, man, every third blink is slower" - Fillmore
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  nunya SEE ROCK CITY 475 MILES Premium,MVM join:2000-12-23 O Fallon, MO clubs:
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| reply to batsona A proper solution is to install a dedicated circuit for each window unit. For all the confabulation and speculation with X10 stuff, you could devote that time, energy, and funding to correcting the original problem. -- Looks like Reverend Wright got his wish - God Damn America. |
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