Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. in VOIP Tech Chat http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r22418624 en Wed, 10 Feb 2010 11:32:19 EDT Wed, 10 Feb 2010 11:32:19 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22421617 ptrowski :
said by VOIPoTim See Profile :

said by ptrowski See Profile :

Your online support. According to them they checked with the "boss man" who said, using me as a specific case, that since my term ends in December 2009 after that I would go to the new itemized taxes.

He said it was a good question and they were going to get clarification.

Is there a way for me to get the transcript of the online chat session?
I know one of our guys checked with me, but I specifically told him that they'd be grandfathered in. No noe checked with me about a specific customer though. Maybe it was a different rep you talked to?

I'll look around for the chat and take care of it.
That would be a good thing to update on the posting in the forum also. The way it is written leaves alot to be interpreted either way.
--
"So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."

Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22421617 Thu, 21 May 2009 09:53:14 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418653 VOIPoTim :
said by ptrowski See Profile :

Your online support. According to them they checked with the "boss man" who said, using me as a specific case, that since my term ends in December 2009 after that I would go to the new itemized taxes.

He said it was a good question and they were going to get clarification.

Is there a way for me to get the transcript of the online chat session?
I know one of our guys checked with me, but I specifically told him that they'd be grandfathered in. No noe checked with me about a specific customer though. Maybe it was a different rep you talked to?

I'll look around for the chat and take care of it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418653 Wed, 20 May 2009 17:36:09 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418641 ptrowski :
said by VOIPoTim See Profile :

said by ptrowski See Profile :

said by slow mo See Profile :

The way I see it:

Current customers with $3 bundle won't see any change UNTIL they renew.
You are correct. According to support you are good until renewal time. After that itemized taxes and fees go into effect.
That is not correct actually, do you know who you talked to?

At this point, we have no plans to change pricing for existing customers at all.

If you order before we make this change, you're grandfathered in and would renew with the $3 flate rate fee.

Only customers ordering after is up will have to pay the itemized taxes (which they can view at the time of the order).
Your online support. According to them they checked with the "boss man" who said, using me as a specific case, that since my term ends in December 2009 after that I would go to the new itemized taxes.

He said it was a good question and they were going to get clarification.

Is there a way for me to get the transcript of the online chat session?
--
"So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."

Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418641 Wed, 20 May 2009 17:33:05 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418624 VOIPoTim :
said by ptrowski See Profile :

said by slow mo See Profile :

The way I see it:

Current customers with $3 bundle won't see any change UNTIL they renew.
You are correct. According to support you are good until renewal time. After that itemized taxes and fees go into effect.
That is not correct actually, do you know who you talked to so I can take care of that?

At this point, we have no plans to change pricing for existing customers at all and will honor existing pricing structures.

If you order before we make this change, you're grandfathered in and would renew with the $3 flate rate fee.

Only customers ordering after is up will have to pay the itemized taxes (which they can view at the time of the order).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418624 Wed, 20 May 2009 17:30:21 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418581 dcurrey :
said by ptrowski See Profile :

Shows $36 currently, I assume it goes into effect on June 1 due to the promo ending 5/31.
So basically this current promo is "Beat the Taxman". :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418581 Wed, 20 May 2009 17:22:23 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418544 ptrowski :
said by slow mo See Profile :

The way I see it:

Current customers with $3 bundle won't see any change UNTIL they renew.
You are correct. According to support you are good until renewal time. After that itemized taxes and fees go into effect.
--
"So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."

Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418544 Wed, 20 May 2009 17:15:28 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418050 ptrowski :
said by dcurrey See Profile :

At least it looks like you can check online right away what the taxes and fees are going to be. Beats the hell out of the other guys method.


Users will be able to check their service address prior to ordering for real-time figures.

Shows $36 currently, I assume it goes into effect on June 1 due to the promo ending 5/31.
--
"So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."

Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418050 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:51:53 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418018 slow mo : The way I see it:

Current customers with $3 bundle won't see any change UNTIL they renew.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418018 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:45:31 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418013 ptrowski :
said by bshelly See Profile :

I don't know. Tim's posting on the VOIPo forum said "All customers who currently have service or order service prior to this being fully implemented will be able to maintain the $3 flat rate “bundled” fee."

The key word is maintain. That, to me means as long as we remain customers, but I'm sure they could still change it after our first year is up.

EDIT: Brian in MD, you beat me to it :)
That's what I was thinking. Is it for the current term you have now, or for every renewal after that? It is a bit ambiguous.
--
"So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."

Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418013 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:44:59 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418012 dcurrey : At least it looks like you can check online right away what the taxes and fees are going to be. Beats the hell out of the other guys method.


Users will be able to check their service address prior to ordering for real-time figures.
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418012 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:44:57 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418000 bshelly : I don't know. Tim's posting on the VOIPo forum said "All customers who currently have service or order service prior to this being fully implemented will be able to maintain the $3 flat rate “bundled” fee."

The key word is maintain. That, to me means as long as we remain customers, but I'm sure they could still change it after our first year is up.

EDIT: Brian in MD, you beat me to it :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22418000 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:40:30 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417996 Brian in MD : From Tim's post:

Current Customers

We will honor our agreement with existing customers. All customers who currently have service or order service prior to this being fully implemented will be able to maintain the $3 flat rate “bundled” fee.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417996 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:39:38 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417890 ptrowski : Will this go into effect once we renew I assume? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417890 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:17:48 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417867 RockyBB :
said by josephf See Profile :

Cablevision serves some of the highest (telecom) taxed States in the nation.
then that would mean that if Cablevision started offering the same flat-rate priced service in a low tax state, then the customers of that new state would be paying too much for tax allocation, essentially subsidizing the customers of the high taxed state or enhancing CV profitability. This is why unbundling is most fair and equitable to all, though it is also frustrating to have to see it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417867 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:13:38 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417803 ptrowski : It was only a matter of time until this was going to happen. The $3 idea was good for launch, but that is it.

I think you will see it more and more in the VoIP world.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417803 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:03:33 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417789 josephf : Cablevision serves some of the highest (telecom) taxed States in the nation.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417789 Wed, 20 May 2009 15:00:49 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417395 usa2k : Perhaps a state by state flat rate?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417395 Wed, 20 May 2009 13:44:09 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417134 RockyBB :
said by josephf See Profile :

said by PX Eliezer See Profile :

said by josephf See Profile :

Cablevision's Optimum Voice charges a flat-rate with no add-on's for taxes, etc. If they can do it, anyone can.
They do, but their price is pretty high. I have one of their lines myself.
Point was that VoIP providers *can* give a flat-rate price, without any additional charges.
OOL is a bad example, as they have a very geographically limited operating area. VOIPo (and most others) are nationwide and have to deal with thousands of jurisdictions.

VOIPo today with a fixed blended $3 is a better example.

But here's the problem with that: with fixed pricing nationwide where vendor collects only what is necessary to pay all the taxes, someone living in a low tax area ends up subsidizing those living in high tax areas. If the NY taxes are $4, and the KY taxes are $2, and the blended rate is $3 ... then the KY people are paying too much, and the NY people aren't paying their fair share. You don't want others who don't know you to be paying your tax obligation, do you?

This also gives you some (minimal) control over your local taxes as you can elect officials that would rescind your telecom taxes.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417134 Wed, 20 May 2009 13:00:29 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417004 burris : I think Tim made his point when he said ....

"Some providers choose a very conservative approach and handle things just as if they were a traditional telco. Some choose to ignore this completely. Others take a more aggressive, yet compliant approach (which is what we’re doing). Essentially, we collect/remit only what we have to. Anything that’s still being challenged or things in states where it’s a gray area will generally not be collected. This is kind of the lesser of two evils. It leaves a small amount of liability since some of the “gray area” items could come up later, but it takes care of everything already in place."

Having come from the telco world, I personally know of some companies that shove most of the fees and taxes into their pockets. When/if they get caught, only then does it surface.
Some of them you may have heard of and others are small local outfits I know of.

From experience, the tax regs are so complex and because they overlap across all the states and municipalities, that even the tax people auditing this have no idea about how it works.


Some friends still in the CLEC arena have indicated just how they function with their taxes when they either do it themselves or even when they outsource to one of the companies that only handles the tax process..

They make it so complex, much like the Federal Tax Code, that no one really knows what to do.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22417004 Wed, 20 May 2009 12:39:07 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416469 PX Eliezer : Agreed. I share your wish that more did so.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416469 Wed, 20 May 2009 11:18:13 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416451 josephf :
said by PX Eliezer See Profile :

said by josephf See Profile :

Cablevision's Optimum Voice charges a flat-rate with no add-on's for taxes, etc. If they can do it, anyone can.
They do, but their price is pretty high. I have one of their lines myself.
Point was that VoIP providers *can* give a flat-rate price, without any additional charges.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416451 Wed, 20 May 2009 11:17:07 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416327 PX Eliezer :
said by josephf See Profile :

Cablevision's Optimum Voice charges a flat-rate with no add-on's for taxes, etc. If they can do it, anyone can.
They do, but their price is pretty high. I have one of their lines myself.

As has been said, have to look at the total cost, not the come-on price.

Car dealers are the worst. And while I have great sympathy for all the smaller car dealers that are now losing their franchises, and all their workers, the fact is that Detroit AND the dealers caused their own problems.

My last car buying experiences were bad enough that my wife and I both drive old cars (1992 and 1995) and will run them into the ground.

Anyway, people who buy Voip are smarter than the average bear, and smart enough to look at the TOTAL prices.

--------------------------------------

Jay Leno said---supposedly a true story---two teenagers left their bicycles at the entrance to a park because they saw a sign that said "No Peddlers" and thought that meant bicycles. The bikes were stolen. Leno said the teens deserved to get their bikes stolen for being so ignorant.

Smarter than the average bear.
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416327 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:57:42 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416154 josephf : Cablevision's Optimum Voice charges a flat-rate with no add-on's for taxes, etc. If they can do it, anyone can.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416154 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:24:41 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416141 dcurrey : Without the FTC or some other government agency forcing this it just won't happen.

Yes the advertised price should be what you pay. Doesn't matter if its voip (USF), buying a car (destination charge) or getting oil change (oil disposal fee.) But I don't see it happening anytime soon.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416141 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:20:11 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416127 josephf : The solution is to compare prices taking into account all "taxes", "fees" and "recovery" costs. And compare the total, whether a provider charges such junk charges or not.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416127 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:17:25 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416111 dcurrey : Others does not equal ALL.

Yes some still do it the old way for now. But we just lost another one that didn't itemize everything.

Yes they could just raise the so called recovery fee to say $6 to cover they expenses but then those that don't come close to the $6 in taxes/fee would raise hell. Up the base price everyone will raise hell and businesses fear revenue will be lost since company Z advertises lower base price. Its an old argument and it just goes round and round. I have given up on it, just no good solution.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416111 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:15:45 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416099 usa2k :
said by dcurrey See Profile :

Surprised nobody has mentioned this.
...
See. »forums.voipo.com/showthread.php?···ost12107
"Today, 04:11 AM"

It was a very new post. I did read it about an hour ago.
(When does Tim sleep!?!?)
--

Jim, VoIP since 12/2002, VOIPo 2/7/2007
FAH-Tool ... Whales ... USA2K site ... Artist-247]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416099 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:11:32 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416094 ropeguru : Well, that just did it for me. Was looking at moving over from CallCentric, but right now that would push my monthly more than one I am currently paying.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416094 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:10:51 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416077 PX Eliezer :
said by dcurrey See Profile :

It appears very soon Voipo will join the others....
Thanks for the info. :)

But not all the other companies have this.

CallCentric has no extra recurring fees or taxes except small 911 fee for US residents, and NY State sales tax for NY residents only.

Voip.MS has no extra fees or taxes.

Other examples as well.

So people should look at their options, and evaluate services, features, quality, and total costs.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416077 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:07:29 EDT Re: [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416064 josephf : Who says they "have to" do this? It is their choice to do so. Not every VoIP provider does it, or will do it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416064 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:05:26 EDT [VOIPo] To start itemizing taxes and fees. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416048 dcurrey : Surprised nobody has mentioned this. It appears very soon Voipo will join the others in itemizing taxes and fees. Current contracts will be honored and anyone managing to get in before they update the billing system only pays the $3 they have now. So if you want them get them NOW.

Its a shame voip businesses had to start doing this. The flat rate model plans are so much easier to follow and understand.

See. »forums.voipo.com/showthread.php?···ost12107]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22416048 Wed, 20 May 2009 10:01:03 EDT