baineschile
2600
Premium
join:2008-05-10
Sterling Heights, MI | Boo
Way to kill off the broadband economy Verizon. Though I dont have FiOS, VZW has made SEVERAL promises they failed to deliver on.
Maybe cable will finally be convinced to do more D3 upgrades, which should help out Cisco and Arris. |
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dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
 ·Covad Communications
| said by baineschile  :Way to kill off the broadband economy Verizon. Though I dont have FiOS, VZW has made SEVERAL promises they failed to deliver on. Maybe cable will finally be convinced to do more D3 upgrades, which should help out Cisco and Arris. The pace that Verizon was laying fiber was unsustainable for any for-profit company. I am surprised that their board of directors didn't reign in the spending long before now.
Comcast, on the other hand, has no excuse not to continue spending money for network buildouts. They should follow up their D3 rollouts by extending FTTP in highly profitable areas. If Comcast does this, the other cable carriers will follow and broadband expansion will continue. |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| said by dcdeadbeat :The pace that Verizon was laying fiber was unsustainable for any for-profit company. I am surprised that their board of directors didn't reign in the spending long before now. Really? Their CFO is quite happy with their earnings and growth and of all the telecom companies, Verizon's stock is sitting at the top of the heap. 20% higher or so actually.
»www.reuters.com/article/technolo···20090520 |
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TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
 ·Comcast
| reply to baineschile
said by baineschile :Way to kill off the broadband economy Verizon. Though I dont have FiOS, VZW has made SEVERAL promises they failed to deliver on. Maybe cable will finally be convinced to do more D3 upgrades, which should help out Cisco and Arris. MAybe you heard - the economy sucks and people are cutting back on services like phone and internet. That causes vendors to cut back on spending.
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| said by TKJunkMail :MAybe you heard - the economy sucks and people are cutting back on services like phone and internet. That causes vendors to cut back on spending. What I found interesting is that the Verizon CFO said that when the recession ends, he doesn't foresee a large uptick in consumer revenue, but rather business revenue. This leads me to believe that their consumer growth has been strong, despite the recession. (People fleeing cable for cheaper pricing and introductory offers perhaps?) |
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dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
·Covad Communications
| reply to Matt
I didn't say they were not making profit. There is making profit and there is making profit and keeping costs low.
Also Verizon's profits are being boosted by their shares of jointly owned Verizon Wireless. They also saw an increase in profits from their business division, Verizon Business (MCI).
What this means is that Verizon would do well to control its costs as it is losing significant amounts of residential landline customers and replacing them with (upfront expensive) FIOS and wireless customers. In the long run, this behavior is not sustainable for any company. No accountant in their right mind would agree that spending thousands to acquire each new customer is a good idea even if you can afford to do so.
Cable on the other hand can spend less to acquire new customers and use their profits in the future to build out a FTTP infrastructure. |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| said by dcdeadbeat :I didn't say they were not making profit. There is making profit and there is making profit and keeping costs low. Also Verizon's profits are being boosted by their shares of jointly owned Verizon Wireless. They also saw an increase in profits from their business division, Verizon Business (MCI). What this means is that Verizon would do well to control its costs as it is losing significant amounts of residential landline customers and replacing them with (upfront expensive) FIOS and wireless customers. In the long run, this behavior is not sustainable for any company. No accountant in their right mind would agree that spending thousands to acquire each new customer is a good idea even if you can afford to do so. Yes, but haven't the costs per customer decreased dramatically as they've rolled out FiOS? There is no reason to think that decrease in cost won't continue, so the high cost per customer won't continue indefinitely.
The goal of every business is to acquire new customers, even if you initially take a loss on that customer. You are banking on future revenues from that customer. |
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TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast
| reply to Matt
said by Matt :What I found interesting is that the Verizon CFO said that when the recession ends, he doesn't foresee a large uptick in consumer revenue, but rather business revenue. This leads me to believe that their consumer growth has been strong, despite the recession. (People fleeing cable for cheaper pricing and introductory offers perhaps?) I don't take away the same interpretation as you do. Consumer spending has been dropping over the last 18 months. Consumer spending is down and consumer savings is up. »www.bea.gov/newsreleases/nationa···ease.htm
Business expenditures are more logic based and depend on rising earnings and need to replace deteriorating equipment and dwindling inventories. So as the economy recovers, I agree that spending there would increase.
But consumer spending is much more emotional and I believe that even as the economy recovers, consumer spending will take a longer time to recover. And I believe that is the point being made.
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dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
·Covad Communications
2 edits | reply to Matt
said by Matt Yes, but haven't the costs per customer decreased dramatically as they've rolled out FiOS? There is no reason to think that decrease in cost won't continue, so the high cost per customer won't continue indefinitely.
The goal of every business is to acquire new customers, even if you initially take a loss on that customer. You are banking on future revenues from that customer.
No the goal of every company is to maximize ROI, not to acquire new customers. In other words, if it costs too much to acquire the nth customer, then the available resources should be redirected to a newer product while continuing to profit from the existing products.
Sprint is an example of this. They sold off their cell towers and lease them back access to them. Meanwhile they are directing profits from their Boost prepaid customers into new technologies like their Clear WiMax venture. The difference here is that Clear is a controlled rollout, unlike FIOS which spends lots of money to possibly acquire a new customer. |
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Michael C
@sbcglobal.net | reply to TKJunkMail
Maybe you HAVEN'T heard - consumer spending on broadband grew all last year and the first quarter of this year and shows no signs that it's going to stop growing. This is one area of the economy that ISN'T slowing down. |
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Big Pete 82
join:2009-01-30
Corona, CA | reply to dcdeadbeat
So basically you are trying to tell us that Sprint is a well run company and Verizon is a poorly run company? Their stock prices beg to differ... |
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dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
·Covad Communications
| said by Big Pete 82 :So basically you are trying to tell us that Sprint is a well run company and Verizon is a poorly run company? Their stock prices beg to differ... Actually Sprint is the dark horse that is making the comeback victory of a life-time. They made some seriously bad decisions in the past (most companies do at some point) and they can either fail or re-invent themselves. It is how you dealt with a crisis that is more important than the fact that you went through one.
Companies should not be judged entirely on their stock alone, especially technology companies that have the ability to re-invent themselves. Judge companies on their ability to survive long term. It is my assertion that you can do this by enhancing existing technology infrastructure until such time that the market allows you to explore new technology. |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| said by dcdeadbeat :Actually Sprint is the dark horse that is making the comeback victory of a life-time. I agree with this. I've had Sprint, Verizon and now AT&T and hands-down, in my area, Sprint was the best. They had the best call quality (Verizon was the worst), no dropped calls (AT&T drops them like hot potatoes), and a great 3G data network. |
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TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast
| said by Matt :said by dcdeadbeat :Actually Sprint is the dark horse that is making the comeback victory of a life-time. I agree with this. I've had Sprint, Verizon and now AT&T and hands-down, in my area, Sprint was the best. They had the best call quality (Verizon was the worst), no dropped calls (AT&T drops them like hot potatoes), and a great 3G data network. And if the Palm Pre is the hit some think it may be, it could give them the boost the iPhone gave to AT&T.
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| said by TKJunkMail :said by Matt :said by dcdeadbeat :Actually Sprint is the dark horse that is making the comeback victory of a life-time. I agree with this. I've had Sprint, Verizon and now AT&T and hands-down, in my area, Sprint was the best. They had the best call quality (Verizon was the worst), no dropped calls (AT&T drops them like hot potatoes), and a great 3G data network. And if the Palm Pre is the hit some think it may be, it could give them the boost the iPhone gave to AT&T. Absolutely. Although, it looks like Palm is already backing off on the announced feature set and saying those features will (may?) come later. For example, no video recording, no visual voicemail, no flash browser support, no application syncing with your desktop, and (understandably) a weak app store at initial launch. |
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patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| reply to dcdeadbeat
said by dcdeadbeat : The difference here is that Clear is a controlled rollout, unlike FIOS which spends lots of money to possibly acquire a new customer. A controlled rollout going nowhere. They haven't even upgraded their pre-wimax cities. |
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hescominsoon
join:2003-02-18
Brunswick, MD
·Comcast
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to TKJunkMail
said by TKJunkMail :said by Matt :said by dcdeadbeat :Actually Sprint is the dark horse that is making the comeback victory of a life-time. I agree with this. I've had Sprint, Verizon and now AT&T and hands-down, in my area, Sprint was the best. They had the best call quality (Verizon was the worst), no dropped calls (AT&T drops them like hot potatoes), and a great 3G data network. And if the Palm Pre is the hit some think it may be, it could give them the boost the iPhone gave to AT&T. unfortunately sprint's technical support are morons..their customer service even moreso. They are still bleeding customers due to these issues..also the pre has only a day or two before the new iphone launches...along with an acknowledged launch shortage. The ceo has slapped limits on data plans and is reworking their plans and costs to be more like vz and itt..this is not a reinvention..this is following hte crowd over the cliff.
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