Topic 'How can you patent something you did not invent???' in forum ''

Topic 'How can you patent something you did not invent???' in forum '' - dslreports.com http://www.dslreports.com/forum/How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591574 en Fri, 10 Feb 2012 01:36:42 EDT Fri, 10 Feb 2012 01:36:42 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22772760
____________
tadalafil]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22772760 Mon, 27 Jul 2009 13:26:42 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22771292 said by r81984:

Why wouldn't these companies just make their own DVRs?
Tivo sucks and likes to pretend they invented the DVR, but everyone knows they did not.

The Echo Star case was about this: "TiVo's patent for "Time Warp" software, which allows users to record one TV program while watching another." (this patent was from 2001, way after people have already been doing what the patent claims)
I do not see how you can patent such a broad thing like this when computer software and hardware has been doing this before Tivo was invented. Also, I am sure there are 1000 of ways to accomplish this task so if Tivo patented one why not just use one of the other 999 ways?

If this patent is continued to be viewed as valid then Tivo owns the rights to all DVRs, even the ones that existed before Tivo got their patent in 2001. It just does not make sense.
These days only clever people can survive in this world...

_____________
negative effects sildenafil]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22771292 Mon, 27 Jul 2009 08:00:12 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22604536 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22604536 Wed, 24 Jun 2009 17:30:36 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601894 said by curtis33:

said by KrK:

:/

Does any cable or DBS company currently provide DVRs without charging a monthly DVR fee?
Dish network, circa 1999ish-single tuner? "PVR" But after hardware cost, no monthly service fee.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601894 Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:53:06 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601885 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601885 Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:49:01 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601841 said by curtis33:

said by KrK:

basically the way it looks now, whether I choose DBS or Cable, I'm going to have be paying Tivo extra fees if I want DVR features. Whether directly to Tivo or via my provider's bills for their inbuilt payments to Tivo really matters not to me. :/

Does any cable or DBS company currently provide DVRs without charging a monthly DVR fee?
Now you are simply getting into the marketing semantics of the cable industry. There is no such thing as a free DVR, it's either incorporated into the overall price of the service, or broken out to give the appearance that the service is less expensive.

The cable conglomerates are fighting to maintain control of this revenue stream by creating ridiculous installation charges to set up a CableCard for a third party DVR or a TV that uses such a card. (Verizon charges $75 just to pair a CableCard!) They try to make it seem like they are doing the customer a favor by providing a $15-$20 box for each TV, yet they continually make it extremely difficult for Tivo or Moxi to offer similar services with regards to pay-per-view or on-demand features in an effort to keep customers tied to their own devices.

DVR's are money makers, and they keep the perceived cost of cable TV down, and nobody is giving these away for free outside of a promotional gimmick. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601841 Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:38:19 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601731 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601731 Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:12:54 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601663 said by KrK:

basically the way it looks now, whether I choose DBS or Cable, I'm going to have be paying Tivo extra fees if I want DVR features. Whether directly to Tivo or via my provider's bills for their inbuilt payments to Tivo really matters not to me. :/
Does any cable or DBS company currently provide DVRs without charging a monthly DVR fee?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22601663 Wed, 24 Jun 2009 08:59:47 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22600992
Don't get me wrong, I don't think Tivo sucks or anything like that, but I do dislike business models which consist of forcing other companies to pay or consumers to pay for services or fees they should be getting already included or available free.

One day I will build my own full on Media Center/DVR HD system and it will be a moot point, but basically the way it looks now, whether I choose DBS or Cable, I'm going to have be paying Tivo extra fees if I want DVR features. Whether directly to Tivo or via my provider's bills for their inbuilt payments to Tivo really matters not to me. :/
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22600992 Wed, 24 Jun 2009 01:37:28 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22598738 quote:

If ReplayTV had not been destroyed by the Hollywood copyright Facists then Tivo would never be in the position they are in now.

The ReplayTV patents are still there. They aren't even related to the TiVo patents. The USPTO is fully aware of both patents. Echostar was fully aware of both patents when they asked the patent office to do a reexamination and yet the patent office validated every single word of TiVo's patent.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22598738 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 17:30:41 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596478
Also, section b doesn't apply here. That's the on-sale bar exclusion.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596478 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:52:05 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596466 said by Goober:

LOL.

In 15 years the patent office has never called me a troll, but you are?

»www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/mp···_102.htm

35 USC 102(a) and 102(f) address your first set of comments regarding prior use and 102(g) addresses the last.

Read the statutes and learn something.
Thanks, now we can have a constructive discussion. The first part of your link supports what I was stating. If the technology was in widespread use, a patent can be denied.

35 U.S.C. 102 Conditions for patentability; novelty and loss of right to patent.

A person shall be entitled to a patent unless -

(a) the invention was known or used by others in this country, or patented or described in a printed publication in this or a foreign country, before the invention thereof by the applicant for patent, or

(b) the invention was patented or described in a printed publication in this or a foreign country or in public use or on sale in this country, more than one year prior to the date of the application for patent in the United States, or

So, as I stated, if the technology was in widespread use, a patent would most likely not be granted. However, in the case of TiVo, I believe their patent (as others have stated) is an improvement upon simple DVR features and is broad enough to cover pretty much any implementation of a record and watch system.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596466 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:50:46 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596426
In 15 years the patent office has never called me a troll, but you are?

»www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/mp···_102.htm

35 USC 102(a) and 102(f) address your first set of comments regarding prior use and 102(g) addresses the last regarding first to invent.

Read the statutes and learn something.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596426 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:45:32 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596373 said by Goober:

Your original statement(s) as it stands is misleading/incorrect.
You and I constantly have this problem. My statement is not misleading nor incorrect. Your interpretation of it is incorrect.

I can't possibly structure everything I post in such a way that it covers every possible interpretation that someone may read into it. So let's just agree to disagree and if you think my statement is misleading or incorrect, instead of simply stating that which doesn't help anyone understand why you feel it is incorrect or misleading, how about you provide clarification and or supporting material? Otherwise, it looks like you're just trolling.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596373 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:36:12 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596305 said by Matt:

said by Goober:

My point was that your comment implies that prior art has to be in widespread use to deny a patent. That's not true.

Also, the USA is a first to invent country, not a first to file. So, your follow up comment is inaccurate also.

My comment is true, but not an absolute. There are many reasons to deny a patent, but if DVR technology was as widespread and as common as the previous poster claimed, then the TiVO patent would have been denied.

And yes, I realize we are a first to invent country. But if no one else can prove prior work or bothers to even file, then the point is moot. In this case, obviously, no one did.
Your original statement(s) as it stands is misleading/incorrect.

I don't know enough about the Tivo situation and the dates to comment on that specifically. They very well may have gotten their patents because they were able to show inventor's notebooks with conception dates prior to other parties' claims or showings of prior use/art.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596305 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:26:25 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596268 said by Goober:

My point was that your comment implies that prior art has to be in widespread use to deny a patent. That's not true.

Also, the USA is a first to invent country, not a first to file. So, your follow up comment is inaccurate also.
My comment is true, but not an absolute. There are many reasons to deny a patent, but if DVR technology was as widespread and as common as the previous poster claimed, then the TiVO patent would have been denied.

And yes, I realize we are a first to invent country. But if no one else can prove prior work or bothers to even file, then the point is moot. In this case, obviously, no one did.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596268 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:20:42 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596248
ReplayTV and Tivo were developed side by side at the same time yet completely separate efforts. I personally feel that some of the patents Tivo now enjoys exclusive control of would have worked out differently if ReplayTV was around. For example if Tivo sued ReplayTV in much the same manner they did Dish they'd not have won IMHO.

Ah well, it's water under the bridge at this point. I just wish consumers had more choices for DVR's that DON'T require monthly fees. Other then a build-your-own, I don't think that's available atm.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596248 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:17:56 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596223 said by Matt:

said by Goober:

said by Matt:

Even if you had the capability to do this on a computer pre-1998, it wasn't widespread enough to deny the patent.

That's not how the patent system works.

Yes, it is. The first person to patent an idea is the one awarded the rights to it. However, if an idea is widespread or considered too common or already in widespread usage, you can't patent it. Unless of course you improve upon the common use that is.
My point was that your comment implies that prior art has to be in widespread use to deny a patent. That's not true.

Also, the USA is a first to invent country, not a first to file. So, your follow up comment is inaccurate also.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596223 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:12:14 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596207 said by Goober:

said by Matt:

Even if you had the capability to do this on a computer pre-1998, it wasn't widespread enough to deny the patent.

That's not how the patent system works.
Yes, it is. The first person to patent an idea is the one awarded the rights to it. However, if an idea is widespread or considered too common or already in widespread usage, you can't patent it. Unless of course you improve upon the common use that is.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596207 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:10:28 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596198 said by KrK:

said by curtis33:

TiVo's patent has been reexamined by the USPTO upon the request of Echostar and subsequently validated without a single word being changed. If their high priced lawyers couldn't uncover prior art I'm guessing the readers of this board haven't either.

If ReplayTV had not been destroyed by the Hollywood copyright Facists then Tivo would never be in the position they are in now.
Yeah, I miss ReplayTV. I still have a couple of their units with lifetime. I don't use them because they aren't HD. But, they had features that Tivo is only now starting to implement--years later.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596198 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:08:57 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596172 said by Matt:

Even if you had the capability to do this on a computer pre-1998, it wasn't widespread enough to deny the patent.
That's not how the patent system works.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22596172 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:04:56 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594736
If you're just saying it because capture cards were available with software to capture video from a source, then that's not the same thing in 1998 that TiVo and ReplayTV were doing. They had on screen guides and recorded TV shows.

PC's did not have this software capability at the time. Sure, you could capture video to them. But they weren't doing what you claim before TiVo patented it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594736 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 06:19:58 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22595010 --
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22595010 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 02:53:39 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22595007 said by KrK:

Ah, welcome back the Tivo fanboi. Sure they were. Now they'll just have to charge even more.
If you hadn't noticed, your cable company already has a deal with TiVo.

Either way, your feelings about the brokenness of the patent system do not in any way justify Dish choosing to ignore them.

I think it's broken, too, but so long as they exist in their current form, I expect all companies to play by the rules.
--
It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22595007 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 02:50:02 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22595004 said by wierdo:

Yes, the cable companies weren't already charging subscription fees and raising rates without this new excuse. :uhh:
Ah, welcome back the Tivo fanboi. Sure they were. Now they'll just have to charge even more.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22595004 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 02:47:44 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594999 said by curtis33:

TiVo's patent has been reexamined by the USPTO upon the request of Echostar and subsequently validated without a single word being changed. If their high priced lawyers couldn't uncover prior art I'm guessing the readers of this board haven't either. If ReplayTV had not been destroyed by the Hollywood copyright Facists then Tivo would never be in the position they are in now.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594999 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 02:45:57 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594998 said by KrK:

Of course the looser in this is the consumer; who will pay for all of it in subscription fees and increases in rates.
Yes, the cable companies weren't already charging subscription fees and raising rates without this new excuse. :uhh:
--
It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594998 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 02:45:25 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594993
TIVO got the patents, and beat Dish over the head with them. Now they will muscle into the Cable DVR market as well because the cable companies will have to allow it or forfeit their own DVR's.

Of course the looser in this is the consumer; who will pay for all of it in subscription fees and increases in rates.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594993 Tue, 23 Jun 2009 02:43:06 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594088 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594088 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 22:17:00 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594003 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22594003 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 21:55:07 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593665 said by r81984:

It does on my Media Center PC.
And someone is paying for the data itself and the cost of distributing it to you. That Microsoft or whoever hides that cost from you does not make it nonexistent, only hidden from view. I don't know what they charge for Media Center, so they could be building it into the price of the OS for all I know.

(Somehow I expect a TiVo HD+Lifetime would have been cheaper, anyhow)

Neyland, they offer the ability because people want to occasionally do so (and the folks who use it solely for trick play on sporting events want to view live), but the device is designed to primarily be used for watching time-shifted content.

There are a lot of things I disagree with TiVo on (no free space indicator, for one!), but they adamantly stick to their idea of how the device should be used and develop for that. Much like Apple in that respect, actually.

Edited to correct punctuation error

--
It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593665 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 20:55:50 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593362
I feel this is your opinion more so than anything else.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593362 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 19:47:28 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593146 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593146 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 19:01:44 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593142 said by r81984:

It is a DVR there is no reason for a subscription.
Tell that to TiVo, Replay, the cable companies, and the satellite companies. The guide data doesn't magically appear, you know.
--
It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593142 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 19:00:37 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593129 said by wierdo:

said by r81984:

Replay TVs version worked without a subscription fee meaning their technology was much better than Tivo's.

If by that you mean "ReplayTV cost a lot more up front because the cost of the subscription was built into the price of the box," you are correct.
It is a DVR there is no reason for a subscription.
--
For those of you playing a drinking game.... MY FRIENDS!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593129 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 18:57:46 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593120 said by r81984:

Replay TVs version worked without a subscription fee meaning their technology was much better than Tivo's.
If by that you mean "ReplayTV cost a lot more up front because the cost of the subscription was built into the price of the box," you are correct.

And if I might ask, what software were people using to record TV to their PC in 1998 that had trick play features? I first got a PCI TV tuner that had software to record in about 2000.

--
It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593120 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 18:55:51 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593102 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22593102 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 18:52:51 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592992 said by curtis33:

"You can have a DVR. Just not one that lets you record one show while watching another. In other words, you can single tuner your DVR action all you want. Just don't try to watch while recording."

Most DVRs can't display a direct picture. Everything you see comes off the hard drive. That's how you can pause and rewind the live picture. In other words, there is always recording going on even if you are just watching a "live" picture.
I'd be surprised if this were true. I've had a hard drive completely crash and I was still able to watch live TV until the DVR was replaced. There aren't really that many different types of DVR's out there, this was a Scientific Atlanta with Comcast.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592992 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 18:29:02 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592919 said by curtis33:

"this patent was from 2001, way after people have already been doing what the patent claims"

Lots of misinformation in this thread. The patent was filed in 1998.
Even if their patent was filed in 1998 people were still using computers as DVRs. Tivo did not invent anything.

Also replay TV had a DVR out before Tivo. Replay TVs version worked without a subscription fee meaning their technology was much better than Tivo's.
I do not see Tivo going after all DVRs they seem to be picking and choosing who they go after while ignoring the many many other DVRs out there that were created with no technology or knowledge stolen from Tivo. If Tivo can have a broad patent of technology not invented by them then why can't I just go and broadly patent whatever I want.

Hmmm.... A box that outputs calculations from inputs through a hand operated device. I'll be waiting for my royalties.
--
For those of you playing a drinking game.... MY FRIENDS!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592919 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 18:16:08 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592842 said by Uncle Paul:

I have a Tivo and really HATE not having the current tuned channel in a window while I look at settings, recorded content, etc.
Interestingly, I don't like DVRs that have the current channel in a window while I'm in the menu. More than once a TV show or movie has been spoiled for me by that.

If you don't ever watch Live TV, which is the use case TiVo is designed for, there is no good that can come of having that window.
--
It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592842 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 18:02:16 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592576
Most DVRs can't display a direct picture. Everything you see comes off the hard drive. That's how you can pause and rewind the live picture. In other words, there is always recording going on even if you are just watching a "live" picture.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592576 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 17:05:14 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592530
Lots of misinformation in this thread. The patent was filed in 1998. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592530 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:57:19 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592514
Lots of misinformation in this thread. TiVo filed the patent in 1998.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22592514 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:55:04 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591888
And the unit (Tivo HD) menu system is horrendously slow compared to the Dish interface or Comcast's.

Of course I'm sure someone probably holds the patent speedy interface or tuned picture in a window.

Next you'll hear, sir you owe us royalties for the 'Fold the toilet paper in squares before you wipe your butt' method of personal hygiene. We patented that back in 1820.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591888 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 15:09:54 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591664
Also, why is Tivo ignoring all the computer software that does dual tuners and everything a TIVO does + more. It seems like they are not really enforcing what they like to pretend they invented with a vague patent in 2001 (years after the technology was really invented).
--
For those of you playing a drinking game.... MY FRIENDS!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591664 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 14:33:02 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591640 said by r81984:

If this patent is continued to be viewed as valid then Tivo owns the rights to all DVRs, even the ones that existed before Tivo got their patent in 2001. It just does not make sense.It's been argued that Tivo's patent is an obvious extension of previous patents. The US Patent Office is currently investigating that:

»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···pute.php]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591640 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 14:29:26 EDT Re: How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591619 said by r81984:

Why wouldn't these companies just make their own DVRs?
Tivo sucks and likes to pretend they invented the DVR, but everyone knows they did not.

The Echo Star case was about this: "TiVo's patent for "Time Warp" software, which allows users to record one TV program while watching another." (this patent was from 2001, way after people have already been doing what the patent claims)
I do not see how you can patent such a broad thing like this when computer software and hardware has been doing this before Tivo was invented. Also, I am sure there are 1000 of ways to accomplish this task so if Tivo patented one why not just use one of the other 999 ways?

If this patent is continued to be viewed as valid then Tivo owns the rights to all DVRs, even the ones that existed before Tivo got their patent in 2001. It just does not make sense.
You can have a DVR. Just not one that lets you record one show while watching another. In other words, you can single tuner your DVR action all you want. Just don't try to watch while recording. :)

Many courts have upheld the patent. So just give in an buy a TIVO like everyone else. I did and now I am a very happy person.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591619 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 14:25:53 EDT How can you patent something you did not invent??? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591574 Tivo sucks and likes to pretend they invented the DVR, but everyone knows they did not.

The Echo Star case was about this: "TiVo's patent for "Time Warp" software, which allows users to record one TV program while watching another." (this patent was from 2001, way after people have already been doing what the patent claims)
I do not see how you can patent such a broad thing like this when computer software and hardware has been doing this before Tivo was invented. Also, I am sure there are 1000 of ways to accomplish this task so if Tivo patented one why not just use one of the other 999 ways?

If this patent is continued to be viewed as valid then Tivo owns the rights to all DVRs, even the ones that existed before Tivo got their patent in 2001. It just does not make sense.
--
For those of you playing a drinking game.... MY FRIENDS!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/How-can-you-patent-something-you-did-not-invent-22591574 Mon, 22 Jun 2009 14:16:28 EDT