Sly
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Johnson City, TN
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| reply to avd706
Re: 3 year old house will not stay cool
said by avd706  :said by Sly :Please do not do this. Spraying the condenser does work... but as the sprayed on water evaporates, it leaves behind calcium and mineral deposits on the coils. ... Repeat... do NOT simply spray water onto the condenser. And don't let rain get on it either!!!! As was already said, rainwater is much softer than most tap water. Also, with the cover on, most of the rain water does not get to the condenser anyway. But directly spraying it with a water hose can and will damage it. Misting is not a long term solution to increasing efficiency. It would be better to install a thermal barrier, install properly sized gable vents and a ridge vent to carry the heat out the top of the attic. Insulate the house well, especially the attic and keep curtains closed on sun facing windows.
If you want to mist your condenser... then go ahead. There have been many snake-oil ideas like this come along in the years and they all have one thing in common... People not wanting to take the time to do something right but instead wanting to take the short cut. 
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NOCMan
Verizon Fios User
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Flower Mound, TX
| reply to TooHotToday
Check your attic insulation.. if you're in a area that gets that warm you should have at least a foot of insulation in the attic.. Where I live it's suggested 18 inches.
Is the air leaving the registers cold?
While the unit is running the air coming out of the outside unit should be much hotter than the surrounding air as well.
If both of those are no, call a technician to look at it.
Check your filter as well.
You have a 3 ton unit which is about the right size for the square footage, assuming it's properly insulated it should have been fine.
I had this problem, 1900sqft and a 2.5 ton unit poor insulation. We fixed the insulation problem, replaced the 13 year old system with a 3.5 ton system and it was discovered that the return air was only sized for 2 tons, so they added more returns so the system was not starved for air.
Now I can get it to whatever temp I want.. 90 degree day, tech was out and set it to 65 to do the seasonal check, it was almost 65 when he was done.. had to open the door for a bit to get some warm air in 
Only way you're going to fix this is having professionals look into it.
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joetaxpayer
I'M Here Till Thursday
join:2001-09-07
Sudbury, MA
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| reply to haroldo
said by haroldo :Do you have an attic ventilator? Is it set properly or working? This is important. The attic will act as a greehouse, and your entire second floor is fighting it. When 100 outside go into the attic with a thermometer. I bet it's well over 110. You have 100 degree air you can use to cool that down, attic fan is cheap, and easy. Run it before sunrise as well, it will help keep the house cooler a few hours after sun up. The savings on the AC will pay to run the attic fan. |
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SmackWeasel
join:2008-01-02
| reply to rcabor
said by rcabor :said by SmackWeasel :You have to realize your 83 degree reading is the temperature at the thermostat location. That one area does not reflect the ambient temperature in the entire house. Why not try setting it at 70 or even 65? As stated earlier in the thread, setting it lower does nothing. When the unit is on its already working as hard as it can. Setting your oven to 400 when you want 350 doesnt make it heat faster either. But to help the OP, a portable or window unit might be worth the investment for those days the unit wont keep up. Not to quibble, but the OP stated; "I don't know if it would be better to set the system to a lower temp like 70 and then maybe it will get to 75?"
So I assumed they haven't yet set the thermostat lower than 75.
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Unimon
@l-3com.com
| reply to rcabor
said by rcabor :said by SmackWeasel :You have to realize your 83 degree reading is the temperature at the thermostat location. That one area does not reflect the ambient temperature in the entire house. Why not try setting it at 70 or even 65? As stated earlier in the thread, setting it lower does nothing. When the unit is on its already working as hard as it can. Setting your oven to 400 when you want 350 doesnt make it heat faster either. But to help the OP, a portable or window unit might be worth the investment for those days the unit wont keep up. Setting the thermostat lower can make a difference in a multistage system. Granted, this one probably is not.
Also, I think the OP was talking about letting the system get a "head start" from the night when cooling is easier. |
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aeblank
join:2004-09-07
Cadillac, MI
| reply to Sly
said by Sly :If you want to cool the condenser, then look for a unit called a desuperheater. This is a heat exchanger which hooks up to the condenser side and circulates cold water through it and then runs it to a water heater tank for pre-heat water. A desuperheater cools down the condenser which makes the heat pump run more efficiently and it uses that heat to heat your home's water... making your water heater more efficient as well. I run a boiler with a heat storage tank (insulated 1600 gallon tank) for my heating and domestic water. 1600 gallons is quite a few BTUs, and my goal, someday, would be to put in central air and instead of dumping the heat to the air, have it dump into my tank. It might well generate enough energy to satisfy my hot water needs. I could see having a loop that goes through my tank, then through the ground, then to the condenser. I get heat, the condenser sees 50 degree ground temperature.
Regardless, can you point me in the direction of a desuperheater for residential-type applications? I'm finding patent claims and industrial-type units. |
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avd706
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Premium
join:2003-02-06
Union, NJ
2 edits | reply to rcabor
said by rcabor :actually due to the nature of evaporation, rainwater is relativly soft compared to tap or well water. what does evaporation have to do with the mineral content of the water?
not all tap water is well water.
You should see the crap that is left on my car after a rain.
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SteveCon
IBEW 2222 Boston, MA
Premium
join:2004-09-02
Burlington, MA
 ·Verizon FIOS
1 edit | said by avd706 :said by rcabor :actually due to the nature of evaporation, rainwater is relativly soft compared to tap or well water. what does evaporation have to do with the mineral content of the water? Minerals are left on surfaces when water is evaporated - hence the term "mineral deposits". Minerals can not evaporate
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avd706
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Premium
join:2003-02-06
Union, NJ
1 edit | said by SteveCon :said by avd706 :said by rcabor :actually due to the nature of evaporation, rainwater is relativly soft compared to tap or well water. what does evaporation have to do with the mineral content of the water? Minerals are left on surfaces when water is evaporated - hence the term "mineral deposits". Minerals can not evaporate Exactly, so it is due to the nature of the mineral content of the waters source, nothing to do with the "nature of evaporation".
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IcePirate123
join:2003-01-12
Columbus, OH
| reply to TooHotToday
Ok, I will bite. There is a lot of snake oil / bad advice / incorrect information coming out in this thread already. To correct some of it..... You have a carrier 24aba series condenser. This is a 2 ton unit. It is undersized for 1800 square feet. The only way to tell if this is critical is to know what zone aka. state/city you live in. Also if the 1800 sq feet you are quoting includes non-serviced areas such as garages. So far you have been told to do everything from spray the exterior coil, told not to as this will harm your coil (how do you think we clean them when we service them), to digging around in your attic. Again. Call the warranty department on the house. Its 3 years old. They will contact the original installer and make him fix any problems. If you have the problem several times they will get a new contractor to service it and report to them what is going on. Without being at the house, aka, if you called me and asked what should you do when I am at work I would set up an appointment so I could come out and test the system and see what the problem was. You cant fix air conditioner cooling issues of this type over the internet. There are to many variables. |
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p0lyplanar
join:2006-04-11 | reply to TooHotToday
How about misting distilled water on the coils for short-term goals? |
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TooHotToday
@sbcglobal.net
| reply to IcePirate123
said by IcePirate123 :Ok, I will bite. There is a lot of snake oil / bad advice / incorrect information coming out in this thread already. To correct some of it..... You have a carrier 24aba series condenser. This is a 2 ton unit. It is undersized for 1800 square feet. The only way to tell if this is critical is to know what zone aka. state/city you live in. Also if the 1800 sq feet you are quoting includes non-serviced areas such as garages. So far you have been told to do everything from spray the exterior coil, told not to as this will harm your coil (how do you think we clean them when we service them), to digging around in your attic. Again. Call the warranty department on the house. Its 3 years old. They will contact the original installer and make him fix any problems. If you have the problem several times they will get a new contractor to service it and report to them what is going on. Without being at the house, aka, if you called me and asked what should you do when I am at work I would set up an appointment so I could come out and test the system and see what the problem was. You cant fix air conditioner cooling issues of this type over the internet. There are to many variables. Hello, & Thanks for the responce.
1st - I live in No. Cal. 2nd - The 1800 s/f is just the livable area that is being cooled, no garages or anything.
3rd - I am confused about the warranty advice. I do not pay for a warranty. Is that what you mean, or do you mean through the builder? I originally contacted the builder and they were the ones who told me to call the installer. They seem to not want to have anything to do with the house anymore (built as investors and then sold to us). Although, what I hear is that they are still responsible for the work on the house for (7 years?). Lastly, the original installer was not licenced to work on his own and did the job as a side job...so, the builder is the one ultimately responsible right?
Thanks again! |
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Dennis
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1 edit | Really you should just look into having a UV film or tinting put onto any windows/skylights to reduce the amount of heat that gets inside. Playing catch up will never work as well as you want it to.
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nokiatech
join:2000-10-18
Stuart, FL
·Comcast
| reply to TooHotToday
All of these ideas are certainly interesting but nobody has given OP a way to check the basic function of his system. If the air handler is accessible to you find yourself an indoor/outdoor thermometer with a probe. Put the "indoor" unit right in front of the air intake and put the outdoor probe on the cold air side of the evaporator coil. Obviously disconnect the power before you do this and take care to ensure the probe can't be sucked into the blower while running. With the system running you should see about a 20 degree drop in temperature between the two. If you have this drop then your unit is working properly and cooling as well as it ever will. If you don't then you need the unit serviced.
Next thing would be to check the air temp coming from your ducts. You should ideally only see a few degree difference between the cold evaporator air and the air exiting the ducts. If you only see a few degrees difference then your unit and associated ducting are probably both in good shape and your problem is the heat load of your home. If there is a large drop you either have a leaking duct in the attic or very poor insulation around them.
If you can't access the air handler then simply compare the intake air temperature with that coming out of your ducts. Anything better then about an 18 degree difference is probably pretty good. |
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djrobx
join:2000-05-31
Valencia, CA | reply to TooHotToday
If you like it cooler, setting it lower WILL help - but not today. It will help tomorrow, because it will kick in sooner and begin removing heat earlier in the day.
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LeeWL
join:2002-11-10
Morrisville, NC
·AT&T Southeast
| said by djrobx :If you like it cooler, setting it lower WILL help - but not today. It will help tomorrow, because it will kick in sooner and begin removing heat earlier in the day. If the system is not capable of cooling the house, it is not capable. Maybe starting to cool the house down really early gets cool air in there and keeps the hottest temperature inside down to 80 due to stored cool air, but it is still too small of a unit for a house that large.
to the OP, the reason the tech is saying to call teh builder is because they have sold you a house that was designed improperly. IMO, it is their responsibility to fix that.
I would also check with neighbors to see if they have similar issues and similar sized units. |
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Tyreman
join:2002-10-08
3 edits | reply to Sly
Whats the layout of the house back split, open concept 2 story etc?
high ceilings?
High heat gain area windows southern exposure no drapes, more sun on etc?
ductwork is good?
If its a 2 ton and it looks like the sticker nomenclature indicates that...sized okay?
also install a thermometer in the supply air duct above the coil and in the return if the temperature is between 15-20 degrees difference then thats not bad.
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Dennis
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1 edit | reply to nokiatech
said by nokiatech :All of these ideas are certainly interesting but nobody has given OP a way to check the basic function of his system. Assuming he's telling the truth and the pictures match....i don't think the system will be able beat 110 degree weather. Honestly at this point talking about warrenty is a waste of time in my opinion.
Then again the OP hasn't really come back with anything about skylights, window coverings, etc....
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nunya
SEE ROCK CITY 475 MILES
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O Fallon, MO
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1 edit | reply to TooHotToday
I am confused about the warranty advice. I do not pay for a warranty. Is that what you mean, or do you mean through the builder? I originally contacted the builder and they were the ones who told me to call the installer. They seem to not want to have anything to do with the house anymore (built as investors and then sold to us). Although, what I hear is that they are still responsible for the work on the house for (7 years?). Lastly, the original installer was not licenced to work on his own and did the job as a side job...so, the builder is the one ultimately responsible right?
Most A/C systems come with a 5 year warranty. Since your installer was not qualified to do the installation - it's a moot point. You're S.O.L.. No manufacturer in their right mind will honor that warranty.
So, here is the point. If you have a 3 year old system that's worked fine up until now, there's probably something wrong with your system that will require professional intervention. On an A/C, there isn't much the average DIY'er can do except routine maintenance (cleaning, filters, etc...). More advanced types might be able to change a contactor or fan if the system were not running (not your case).
Don't throw good money after bad with "snake oil" advice. Get it fixed right.
P.S., I'm not a professional A/C guy, but I think that is really a 3 ton unit. Someone said it is 2. You need to have your service company look into that while they are there.
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Lurch77
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| reply to avd706
said by avd706 :Exactly, so it is due to the nature of the mineral content of the waters source, nothing to do with the "nature of evaporation". You seem to know it pretty well. Tell you what, go run a sprinkler on your condensing unit for the rest of the summer, and maybe next summer too, and tell us how it works out. Unless you have soft water, set some money aside for a new condenser. Natural rain and domestic water are two different animals. And rain does not continuously coat the coil either.
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