organized crime
@cgocable.net
| reply to Questions
Re: [Internet] Yet another Bell Hell experience..
said by Questions :are these business practices legal? are there grounds for a Class Action Suit here? from the Wikipedia » en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraud"Fraud as a criminal act, generally In criminal law, fraud is the crime or offense of deliberately deceiving another in order to damage them – usually, to obtain property or services unjustly. [5] Fraud can be accomplished through the aid of forged objects. In the criminal law of common law jurisdictions it may be called "theft by deception," "larceny by trick," "larceny by fraud and deception," or something similar." Interesting questions.
You see if this were in the states there would be probable grounds for a RICO predicate. Many States Attorney's would jump on this like Elliot Spitzer (pre-bimbo).
Perhaps that is why this behaviour is relegated to Canada.
In accordance with the American legislation.
"RICO also permits a private individual harmed by the actions of such an enterprise to file a civil suit; if successful, the individual can collect triple damages".
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeer_···ions_Act
I have a mental image of someone on the court steps watching the Bell exec perp walk with tears of joy in his eyes.
It is $75.00 in Ontario to file a statement of claim. Claim the full amount you paid for Internets with a description of the inferior service
you received and let the JP decide what you get.
Bell probably won't file a defence as they can't recover their true expenses per the schedule of fees. If they defend schedule a trial for $100.00.
They would be foolish not to settle before and you get all your fees back. If they want a trial go for it.
It would cost them big and they can't recover the expenses beyond the fee schedule.
Who is the JP going to believe a Bell hack or a consumer. If you are lucky the JP is, or was a Bell victim, which is probable and then how will things go.
Here is the Small Claims forms on line.
»www.attorneygeneral.jus.gov.on.c···/guides/ |
|
marshals
join:2001-11-14
Windsor, ON
1 edit | I'm not wanting to take this to court. People are soo quick to do things like this. All I want is to get out of the contract and cancel my service without the termination fees at least for the internet part. If I can get out of the fees for both, then i'll be one ecstatic happy camper!  But at minimum, no fee for cancelling internet at least.. Hopefully.
Thank you for the suggestions of taking this to small claims but no thanks. Its funny though.. most of the people who say take this to small claims or have crud to say about Bell.. they seem to "hide" behind anonymous postings. :P got trouble.. file suit/goto court.. email KK@bell. "maybe" if this keeps up much longer.. yeah, but for now no.
EDIT: DKS, and others who have suggested to take it to the direct forums, why? I mean why not just settle it here. I "really" don't want to retread over what I've been trying to get done here when I don't think I'd have to. Bell employees read this forum just as much.. if something needs to be said that requires "personal info" then PMs would suffice. I guess. |
|
organized crime
@cgocable.net
| said by marshals  :I'm not wanting to take this to court. People are soo quick to do things like this. All I want is to get out of the contract and cancel my service without the termination fees at least for the internet part. If I can get out of the fees for both, then i'll be one ecstatic happy camper! But at minimum, no fee for cancelling internet at least.. Hopefully. Thank you for the suggestions of taking this to small claims but no thanks. Its funny though.. most of the people who say take this to small claims or have crud to say about Bell.. they seem to "hide" behind anonymous postings. :P got trouble.. file suit/goto court.. email KK@bell. "maybe" if this keeps up much longer.. yeah, but for now no. Going to court isn't for everyone. When dealing with some people and entities it is a necessity.
Can you think of a more obtuse corporation in Canada than Bell?
Many registered users post the same about Bell and more. Some in here have a history with Bell and remain anon.
Some are employees and some know the lengths Bell will go to stifle dissent. |
|
DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
clubs:
 ·Bell Sympatico
| reply to marshals
said by marshals :EDIT: DKS, and others who have suggested to take it to the direct forums, why? I mean why not just settle it here. I "really" don't want to retread over what I've been trying to get done here when I don't think I'd have to. Bell employees read this forum just as much.. if something needs to be said that requires "personal info" then PMs would suffice. I guess. Why? Because you may be required to provide confidential information about your account. I'm sure you would not want that made public.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care. |
|
marshals
join:2001-11-14
Windsor, ON | thats why I mentioned if that was needed a PM would do |
|
sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
H0H 0H0
 ·Rogers Hi-Speed
Host:
Rogers
Bell Canada
| One of the reasons for Bell direct forum is to be able to have a log of the problems resolved by the service to show management that it is a viable support tool to permit management to permit funding employees to actually DO it! So, it may not be a specific bene to you, but it is still good that it be used. |
|
mlerner
Premium
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON
·Rogers Hi-Speed
·TekSavvy Solutions..
·Bell Sympatico
| said by sbrook :One of the reasons for Bell direct forum is to be able to have a log of the problems resolved by the service to show management that it is a viable support tool to permit management to permit funding employees to actually DO it! So, it may not be a specific bene to you, but it is still good that it be used. sbrook, that would be nice but do you see any improvements at all? Nope. It still takes several calls to get anywhere and that's if you're lucky. The direct forum is just a scape goat to appear that Bell is actually resolving problems. |
|
dirtyjeffer
Lest We Forget
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
·Rogers Hi-Speed
| said by mlerner :The direct forum is just a scape goat to appear that Bell is actually resolving problems. bell doesn't give a shit...fortunately, a handful of their employees do.
--
Today's motto: Dearly beloved, We are gathered here today to bid farewell to personal responsibility and accountability. |
|
mlerner
Premium
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON
·Rogers Hi-Speed
·TekSavvy Solutions..
·Bell Sympatico
| said by dirtyjeffer :said by mlerner :The direct forum is just a scape goat to appear that Bell is actually resolving problems. bell doesn't give a shit...fortunately, a handful of their employees do. Which doesn't help the other thousands of customers who have no idea there is a direct forum. |
|
dissapbell
@bell.ca
| reply to dirtyjeffer
said by dirtyjeffer :said by mlerner :The direct forum is just a scape goat to appear that Bell is actually resolving problems. bell doesn't give a shit...fortunately, a handful of their employees do. I agree.
Bell_Dom disappeared and Bell_Sylvain appeared. NO answers to Bell_Dom in direct forum. |
|
dirtyjeffer
Lest We Forget
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
·Rogers Hi-Speed
| reply to mlerner
said by mlerner :Which doesn't help the other thousands of customers who have no idea there is a direct forum. which is why Bell has slid to the bottom of the pile over the last few years...when they stopped caring about their customers and their staff, both of them stopped caring about Bell...Bell thought they were saving money, all they have done is cost them Billions in revenues and are now the "last choice" for Canadians.
--
Today's motto: Dearly beloved, We are gathered here today to bid farewell to personal responsibility and accountability. |
|
GMAB
@bell.ca
| reply to Deadpool
Seriously?
said by Deadpool :I was referring specifically to the phone contract, not Internet. Edit: In regards to the Internet piece though, the only thing that could potentially go against you is the fact you waited an entire year before deciding the service wasn't satisfactory and cancel. Kind of a long time to give any company the benefit of the doubt, don't you think? ROFL. That comment is just dripping with irony. The way Bell responds to problems these days, a year may be just enough time to get a problem escalated from level 1 to level 2. Heck, I've been kept on hold with Bell tech support for up to 3 months at a stretch (they then hung up :^).
Moral of story, per Deadpool (a Bell manager): At the first sign of trouble with Bell, get out and run for the hills! Patience is a liability (not a virtue) and may be used against you at a later date.
Bring back the old Bell. It was a stand-up outfit that people respected. |
|
DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
clubs:
·Bell Sympatico
| reply to mlerner
Re: [Internet] Yet another Bell Hell experience..
said by mlerner :said by sbrook :One of the reasons for Bell direct forum is to be able to have a log of the problems resolved by the service to show management that it is a viable support tool to permit management to permit funding employees to actually DO it! So, it may not be a specific bene to you, but it is still good that it be used. sbrook, that would be nice but do you see any improvements at all? Nope. It still takes several calls to get anywhere and that's if you're lucky. The direct forum is just a scape goat to appear that Bell is actually resolving problems. I disagree. My own experience is a testimony to their effectiveness. After my false 911 problems last year, the local Bell technician would not certify the line beyond 3 meg. A note in the direct forum got me back to my full 5 meg profile in a few minutes.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care. |
|
Deadpool
Go Sens Go
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-29
Canada
·Bell Sympatico
| reply to dissapbell
Re: [Internet] Yet another Bell Hell experience..
said by dissapbell :said by dirtyjeffer :said by mlerner :The direct forum is just a scape goat to appear that Bell is actually resolving problems. bell doesn't give a shit...fortunately, a handful of their employees do. I agree. Bell_Dom disappeared and Bell_Sylvain appeared. NO answers to Bell_Dom in direct forum. Dom was a temp replacement while Sylvain was on vacation.
If Bell didn't give a shit, there would be no official presence on this site and no one would get help.
I'd say it's the opposite of "doesn't give a shit". 99% of the problems posted in the Direct Forum are not only fixed but done so quickly as well and that customer is happy - even the one's asking for help to cancel!
Unless you've actually used the service, don't knock it. It actually works very well.
The mantra to bash Bell for the sake of bashing Bell get's tiresome when it's not actually warranted.
And trust me, the bitching and unresolved issues would reach an all time high if we were to shut down the Direct Forum.
Agreed that a perfect world would see the same level and quality of support at all levels. The reality is that it's not but at least there are options. All we can do is work with what we have while we wait for something better.
--
Disclaimer: If I express an opinion, it is my own opinion, not that of Bell or its related companies. |
|
impalass1369
join:2007-09-11
Mercier, QC | I have no complaints about direct form. The techs and deapool do a very good job. Maybe bell will bring back coverage on the weekends. |
|
grayfox
join:2007-12-10
Whitby, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
·Bell Sympatico
1 edit | reply to marshals
Have to agree with deadpool on everything ive seen in this thread, Marshals if you sign a 2 year contact did you seriously expect to cancel it without paying?.
Also deadpool and the rest of the direct forum team do a really good job here, Deadpool himself has helped me solve many bell users as well as family members internet issues. |
|
Peter Principle
@cgocable.net
| reply to Deadpool
Re: Bell the last bastion of altruism in Canada
said by Deadpool :If Bell didn't give a shit, there would be no official presence on this site and no one would get help. I'd say it's the opposite of "doesn't give a shit". 99% of the problems posted in the Direct Forum are not only fixed but done so quickly as well and that customer is happy - even the one's asking for help to cancel! I'm sure there is a business case for this and it is cost justified and you know it.
Don't tell us Bell is being altruistic.
If some of this stuff wasn't swept under the rug it would come back to bite you in regulatory complaints, cancellations and lawsuits.
The mantra to bash Bell for the sake of bashing Bell get's tiresome when it's not actually warranted. When it's warranted is somewhat subjective.
The fact that it is warranted is absolutely, unequivocally irrefutable.
I'm sorry it's tiring but it comes with the territory when you work for a corporation like this.
And trust me, the bitching and unresolved issues would reach an all time high if we were to shut down the Direct Forum. See statement above.
I would be more than happy to start a direct forum to help people with the small claims court process in Ontario.
Agreed that a perfect world would see the same level and quality of support at all levels. The reality is that it's not but at least there are options. All we can do is work with what we have while we wait for something better.
That's a cop-out and you know it. Many other large corporations have realized this.
Don't you realize you are an enabler and Bell needs an intervention and don't tell us Cope is it. It starts at the board. |
|
sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
H0H 0H0
·Rogers Hi-Speed
Host:
Rogers
Bell Canada
| You do raise some good points there Peter Principle but at the same time, some, I think, go too far.
Sure there's a business case for the Direct forum. There's a business case to be made for anything that a company does, good and bad. Don't tell me that TSI provide good support for altruistic reasons either. They do it because it makes good business sense for them. So to throw up that as an argument doesn't really mean anything.
You assume that problems are simply swept under the rug with the direct forum. That's grossly unfair. After all, you could say the same thing about all the complaints that are made to 310surf or 310bell just because they're not all published and in the open for all to see.
Solving problems doesn't sweep them under the rug. The people who have problems resolved aren't being fed gag orders, or being forced to say good things only about the service they've had.
It certainly has become the MO to bash bell about everything imaginable and for lots of people to pile on with the same list of attacks every time someone posts a complaint. Sure a lot of the comments ARE valid, but the constant repetition isn't necessary. You get pissed off quick enough with Bell fanboi comments that come to defend Bell everytime they try. What's good for the goose is also good for the gander.
Comments directing people to small claims don't do many people much good because often the cost and inconvenience far outweighs the benefits they'd get. Far better to first use the tools available to them, but there's no need to keep piling on every time a new thread starts. |
|
dirtyjeffer
Lest We Forget
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
·Rogers Hi-Speed
| reply to Deadpool
Re: [Internet] Yet another Bell Hell experience..
said by Deadpool :Agreed that a perfect world would see the same level and quality of support at all levels. The reality is that it's not but at least there are options. All we can do is work with what we have while we wait for something better. there is no need for a "perfect world" example...there is no reason why Bell themselves can not offer the same level of service you yourself (and your colleagues here) offer to fix billing mistakes, credit accounts, correct profiles, etc...anything you can do, can be done by others in Bell...giving the majority of their customers the runaround, only for a select few to somehow find you in here out of desperation and at the last straw...it would take nothing to have the company provide the same level of service that YOU personally do...the truth is, they don't do that...they don't offer the same level of service you do...they don't provide staff with the same level of knowledge/expertise as you have...the reason??...they don't care...all they care about is adding new customers...they are so short sighted and ignorant, they don't realize they have pissed away so many customers over the last several years...most of the staff with good skills, experience, knowledge and years of service have been pushed out and/or packaged...they are dumping jobs here, and outsourcing to India...Bell started going downhill about 4 years ago.
out of curiosity, does Bell pay you to provide support here online, or do you simply do it out of the kindness of your heart, and because you care??
--
Today's motto: Dearly beloved, We are gathered here today to bid farewell to personal responsibility and accountability. |
|
