jabarnut
Light Years Away
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join:2005-01-22
Galaxy M31
1 edit | Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question Sorry, I did search this and found one very long thread from some time ago, but thought I'd start a new one instead of resurrecting that one.
Anyway, I'm wondering why there is a warning on some packages telling you to not install these in an enclosed fixture.
I have some high cathedral Ceiling Fans with an enclosed Globe light (the globe is maybe 6 to 8" in diameter), and it's a real PITA to change. (Have to get my tall step ladder in the house, and sway around on top of it while removing the globe and changing the bulb).
I'd love to put CFL's in them.
Is it because it's actually some sort of heat/fire hazard? (Or another reason?)
Or, is it just that they won't last as long?
If it's just because they won't last as long, it couldn't be any worse than the standard light bulbs I've been replacing all too often.
Thanks in advance for any info.
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nwrickert
sand groper
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join:2004-09-04
Geneva, IL
 ·AT&T U-Verse
 ·AT&T Midwest
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question Or, is it just that they won't last as long? I think that's it.
I have some enclosed lights that I put off using a CFL. But I eventually decided to give it a try. And they are working well, and I am not having to replace them as often.
I am still holding out on the recessed light over the kitchen sink. But perhaps I'll give that a try when the current incandescent bulb burns out.
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jadinolf
I love you Fred
Premium
join:2005-07-09
Ojai, CA | I have recessed fixtures in my hallway ceiling and some CFLs failed in the matter of a few weeks, Some have been in for years and have not failed.
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 | quatrix
Premium
join:2005-02-11
Davie, FL
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by TearAbite  :i tried putting CFLs in on our rear porchlight. It is enclosed AND upside down, and all CFLs i ever put in failed after a week or two - and they are only turned on for a minute or so per day (while we feed the dogs).. dont know if that's because it was enclosed or upside down.. or both. I just replaced the same kind a few days ago -- back yard, upside-down, and enclosed. It lasted about three years after about five hours a day. On the other hand, there's an enclosure in the front yard that's NOT upside-down, and that one kills CFLs about every six months. | |
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Bobcat
Premium
join:2001-02-04
Bedminster, NJ
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by TearAbite :FWIW we also put CLF's in the bathroom and are totally disappointed with the (lack of) brigtness & color. I have some Philips CFLs in my bathroom. They're 9W and are brighter than the 40W incandescents. The color is good. They're the 4" (I think) globe style. I got them at Walmart.
However, they take forever to warm up (I have to turn the light on at least 5 minutes before I go in the room) and one died very quickly. But they're the only globe type I've found that will fit in the fixture.
Read the reviews - »www.amazon.com/3-Pack-Vanity-Phi···0YUMHXY/
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the Grumble
Yep, I changed my name again -
join:2009-05-11 | CFL bulbs contain mercury if you put one where it can overheat easily and break and the mercury gas be trapped in the enclosure (read about mercury poisoning). | |
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| PrntRhd
join:2004-11-03
Fairfield, CA
 ·Comcast
·Comcast Formerly ..
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by the Grumble :CFL bulbs contain mercury if you put one where it can overheat easily and break and the mercury gas be trapped in the enclosure (read about mercury poisoning). I would think that trapping it would be beneficial. | |
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the Grumble
Yep, I changed my name again -
join:2009-05-11 | Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question You'll have to open the enclosure sooner or later. | |
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BonezX
Basement Dweller
Premium
join:2004-04-13
Canada | Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question by then the mercury would have cooled and settled to the bottom of the enclosure | |
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| | | | jay_rm
join:2002-04-12
Netville
 ·Fox Valley Internet
 ·ViaTalk
1 edit | Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by PrntRhd :said by the Grumble :You'll have to open the enclosure sooner or later. True, But the amount of mercury released by using CFL is lower than the amount released by burning fossil fuels like coal to produce the energy to light them. » www.energystar.gov/ia/partners/p···cury.pdf PROVE that running a multi-10's-of-megawatt plant for the milliseconds it takes to power a single CFL for it's lifetime generates MORE mercury then is enclosed in said CFL - I don't believe it.
Don't reference any government websites either - they're the ones mandating the use of CFL's...
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| | | | | PrntRhd
join:2004-11-03
Fairfield, CA
·Comcast
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| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question But the thread subject is not about mercury in CFLs, I was simply responding to Eregular's reply where he was dancing on the head of a pin. Not that there is anything wrong with that.
If you really do have independent evidence the government site is using falsified basis for their claims, you should post it, otherwise it is just opinion. | |
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| | | | | | jay_rm
join:2002-04-12
Netville
·Fox Valley Internet
·ViaTalk
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by PrntRhd :But the thread subject is not about mercury in CFLs, I was simply responding to Eregular's reply where he was dancing on the head of a pin. Not that there is anything wrong with that. If you really do have independent evidence the government site is using falsified basis for their claims, you should post it, otherwise it is just opinion. Translation - "My post is also opinion." Done.
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join:2008-11-18
| I have used CF bulbs since the early 80's in Europe with absolutely no problems whatsoever. they last longer they are far cheaper to run and they can be used in ANY fitting with enough clearance. If there is too much heat buildup inside a fitting then a normal incandescent bulb would produce the same, if not worse condition.
The mercury issue is not really an issue, all florescent bulbs contain a minute amount of mercury, no one has complained before about dangers. | |
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Tzale
Proud Libertarian Conservative
Premium
join:2004-01-06
Sweden
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| said by jay_rm :said by PrntRhd :said by the Grumble :You'll have to open the enclosure sooner or later. True, But the amount of mercury released by using CFL is lower than the amount released by burning fossil fuels like coal to produce the energy to light them. » www.energystar.gov/ia/partners/p···cury.pdf PROVE that running a multi-10's-of-megawatt plant for the milliseconds it takes to power a single CFL for it's lifetime generates MORE mercury then is enclosed in said CFL - I don't believe it. Don't reference any government websites either - they're the ones mandating the use of CFL's... Those "milliseconds" quickly add up when there are millions or billions of CFLs replacing incandescent bulbs around the world. To think otherwise is foolish! With your logic, we might as well make every 60 watt bulb a 100 watt bulb since the energy production at plant level is negligible for one bulb!
-Tzale
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BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
1 edit | said by the Grumble :CFL bulbs contain mercury if you put one where it can overheat easily and break and the mercury gas be trapped in the enclosure (read about mercury poisoning). considering CFL are MUCH cooler than regular bulbs I seriously doubt heat would be an issue if a 15W CFL is too hot for an enlcosure then a 60 W regular bulb certainly is. Mercury is so overblown. The CFLs out today have 1/500th the amount of mercury than the themometer your mom used to put in your mouth as a kid.
By the way they have CFL that are enclosed in a bulb to make it look like a regular bulb. So if overheating is an issue how coould they do that? | |
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DCIFRTHS
join:2000-02-18
Hartsdale, NY
2 edits | Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question Skip this post... | |
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DCIFRTHS
join:2000-02-18
Hartsdale, NY
| ... The CFLs out today have 1/500th the amount of mercury than the themometer your mom used to put in your mouth as a kid. ... When I was a kid, I broke at least two of those thermometers in the kitchen sink, just to play with the mercury (if it really was mercury). I'm 46, so were talking about 38 years ago. Thank God I'm still alive and I have no (obvious) defects from it! | |
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Tzale
Proud Libertarian Conservative
Premium
join:2004-01-06
Sweden
·Verizon FIOS
·Optimum Online
| said by BF69 :said by the Grumble :CFL bulbs contain mercury if you put one where it can overheat easily and break and the mercury gas be trapped in the enclosure (read about mercury poisoning). considering CFL are MUCH cooler than regular bulbs I seriously doubt heat would be an issue if a 15W CFL is too hot for an enlcosure then a 60 W regular bulb certainly is. Mercury is so overblown. The CFLs out today have 1/500th the amount of mercury than the themometer your mom used to put in your mouth as a kid. By the way they have CFL that are enclosed in a bulb to make it look like a regular bulb. So if overheating is an issue how coould they do that? Overheating is definitely an issue... But not with the gas in the CFL, rather the ballast (electronic) portion which resides outside the fake "bulb" covering.
-Tzale
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nukscull
@rr.com
| said by the Grumble :CFL bulbs contain mercury if you put one where it can overheat easily and break and the mercury gas be trapped in the enclosure (read about mercury poisoning). Yeah... they don't contain enough mercury to poison anyone immediately, unless you're breathing in every bulb that you break.
Eating tuna is going to poison you more than a lifetime of CFL's ever will. | |
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| | DannyZ
Gentoo Fanboy
Premium
join:2003-01-29
Erie, PA
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by nukscull :
Eating tuna is going to poison you more than a lifetime of CFL's ever will.
It works out to be if you eat 1.5 cans of tuna a week, you will absorb just as much mercury in a year as you do if you were to absorb _all_ the mercury in one CFL. It's an amount about the size of a period.
In other words, nothing to even think about, really.
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SparkChaser
BURY BECK
Premium
join:2000-06-06
Downingtown, PA | Since heat rises and it is enclosed, some ballast will overheat and fail. That's all there is to it. | |
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jabarnut
Light Years Away
Premium,MVM
join:2005-01-22
Galaxy M31
3 edits | Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by SparkChaser :Since heat rises and it is enclosed, some ballast will overheat and fail. That's all there is to it. I don't mind if it fails prematurely, but can it be a fire hazard?
If not, then I'm convinced (at least with my particular application), that it's worth a try.
In my Kitchen, I have a triple overhead light fixture with an open top,
I replaced the three bulbs with CFL's and it's incredible how much longer they've lasted. (They're still going).
By now, I would have replaced at least 6 or 7 incandescent bulbs.
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PrntRhd
join:2004-11-03
Fairfield, CA
·Comcast
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2 edits | I would look at halogen bulbs and a voltage reduction disc, good light quality and long life.
LED lighting will become a better option than CFLs but not enough have produced to get the price down yet.
I have had CFL tubes melt where they meet the ballast, yes that means they got very hot. | |
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| AricBrown
join:2002-12-11
Amarillo, TX
·Cox HSI
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by PrntRhd :I would look at halogen bulbs and a voltage reduction disc, good light quality and long life. LED lighting will become a better option than CFLs but not enough have produced to get the price down yet. I was at Sams Club and they had LED bulbs in a 2 pack for $15, Thats still a little pricey but its not ungodly expensive and at that price it will pay for its self by energy savings alone. Give it a few years and LEDs will be they way and CFLs will be on they way out. | |
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degauss1
join:2001-07-02
Hillsboro, OR | Halogen can do the job as well. Not as efficient as and LED but certainly will outlast by many yeas a standard light bulb. | |
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tmh
@verizon.net
| said by jabarnut :Anyway, I'm wondering why there is a warning on some packages telling you to not install these in an enclosed fixture. ... I'd love to put CFL's in them. Is it because it's actually some sort of heat/fire hazard? (Or another reason?) Or, is it just that they won't last as long? I think it's a heat issue. Having said that, I have a 60W CFL (about 13W real-life) installed upside down in a jam-jar type bulb enclosure lighting the deck. I have it under photocell control and it comes on for 6-10 hours every day. It's been close to a year and still running great, so it's pretty much a luck of the draw thing.
tmh | |
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Thane_Bitter
join:2005-01-20
London, ON
·Bell Sympatico
| You mention that these lights are in ceiling fans, because of the vibrations inherent in such a device there are specially designed incandescent "ceiling fan bulbs" that can better cope with the vibration.
I have had mixed results in using CFLs in an inverted position inside an enclosed fixture, some last, others wear out very quickly. Heat seems to shorten the lifespan of a CFL; then again some CFLs seem to have abnormally short life spans.
Just remember to properly dispose of any non-functional CFLs, people foolishly throw them out in the regular trash. It's a waste of resources (the Hg can be recycled), and an environmental hazard (heavy metal). Some stores even accept broken CFLs. | |
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the Grumble
Yep, I changed my name again -
join:2009-05-11 | I was just basically saying the Mercury may (is) one of the reasons for the warnings on some packages. | |
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BoulderHill1
join:2004-07-15
Montgomery, IL
·AT&T DSL Service
1 edit | I run a 60 room hotel for a living. I use CFL's everywhere in this building. Upside down, right side up, sideways, in enclosed fixtures, above the jacuzzi tup in a recessed fixture, inside the sauna, on ceiling fan fixtures, everywhere. Anywhere you can physically fit a CFL I have put one.
This amounts to several hundred CFL bulbs around the property. I can say with much experience that if you can fit a CFL in where an incadesent was then go for it with no worries.
I have been doing so for 5 years. In this time I recall only replacing one of these for premature failure. (It had only a days use and quit)
There are still a significant number of original bulbs still in use around the hotel from when we opened five years ago.
Actually the most often needed reason to replace a bulb at the hotel is because someone stole it out of the lamp!! | |
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jabarnut
Light Years Away
Premium,MVM
join:2005-01-22
Galaxy M31
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by BoulderHill1 :I run a 60 room hotel for a living. I use CFL's everywhere in this building. Upside down, right side up, sideways, in enclosed fixtures, above the jacuzzi tup in a recessed fixture, inside the sauna, on ceiling fan fixtures, everywhere. Anywhere you can physically fit a CFL I have put one. This amounts to several hundred CFL bulbs around the property. I can say with much experience that if you can fit a CFL in where an incadesent was then go for it with no worries. I have been doing so for 5 years. In this time I recall only replacing one of these for premature failure. (It had only a days use and quit) There are still a significant number of original bulbs still in use around the hotel from when we opened five years ago. Actually the most often needed reason to replace a bulb at the hotel is because someone stole it out of the lamp!! I really appreciate all of the replies folks....I think I'll go with this one. 
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| | PrntRhd
join:2004-11-03
Fairfield, CA | Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question good choice
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by nunya :As a professional, I feel the "cheapy" consumer grade CFL's that you buy at Lowe's, Home Depot, Wal-Mart, Etc... are all basically a crap shoot. Some last, some don't. I gave up on them a few years ago because of high failure rates. You either have to spring for the expensive ones or take your chances. IMPO, the OP should look into ordering some LED lamps for his particular situation. Now is the time. I haven't seen LED lamps anywhere at any price. only the flashlights
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| | DannyZ
Gentoo Fanboy
Premium
join:2003-01-29
Erie, PA
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question said by dvd536 :haven't seen LED lamps anywhere at any price. only the flashlights Walmart by me has all kinds of different LED bulbs for about $7 each. I'm gonna stick to CFLs until LEDs mature.
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nwrickert
sand groper
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join:2004-09-04
Geneva, IL
·AT&T U-Verse
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| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question Walmart by me has all kinds of different LED bulbs for about $7 each. I'm gonna stick to CFLs until LEDs mature the price of LEDs comes down.
Yes, I am waiting for the same reason.
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| | | | DannyZ
Gentoo Fanboy
Premium
join:2003-01-29
Erie, PA
| Re: Another CFL (compact fluorescent light) question No. I a waiting for them to mature. I have found LED bulbs unacceptable in terms of directionality and intensity. there are certain applications I would probably find satisfactory performance, but as a whole I find LEDs lacking.
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Dustyn
Premium
join:2003-02-26
Ontario, CAN | I've installed CFLs in enclosed fixtures years ago. They still work perfectly? I really don't see a problem? If there life is shortened a bit... it can't be any worse than using an incandescent. The CFL has still outlasted the incandescents. | |
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Bobcat
Premium
join:2001-02-04
Bedminster, NJ
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by jabarnut :If it's just because they won't last as long, it couldn't be any worse than the standard light bulbs Ha! I've had CFLs die in less than 100 hours.
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Bamafan2277
join:2008-09-20
Louisville, KY | You could also try LED bulbs in the fan. They will have a longer life than the CFL and will not have any Mercury in them. | |
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jabarnut
Light Years Away
Premium,MVM
join:2005-01-22
Galaxy M31
1 edit | Thanks for the replies since my last post folks.
Just thought I'd mention I already put CFL's in my ceiling fans.
We'll see how it goes. (I think it's going to go a lot better than the incandescents I've been replacing in the past).
If I don't have to carry that step ladder into the house, and teeter on the top of it as often, I'll be one happy camper.
Oh, and the "mercury issue" really doesn't bother me much, but hey, that's just me.
Feel free to continue with the debate, but it's a done deal for me.
I'll let you know if I have to carry the ladder in again tomorrow.
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