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l0thar
join:2005-12-29
Far Far Away
| Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? Telus wanted to buy BCE back when they put it up for sale; lost to the Teachers bid, which thankfully didn't close in the end (at an inflated share price, it would be a bad move for the pension plan).
So, I wouldn't be surprised if they tried again.  | |
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R0CKY
TSI Rocky
Premium,VIP
join:2005-05-19
Chatham, ON | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? Haven't read the article but Cope is ex-Telus I believe so it is entirely possible! | |
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| | nigrunze
join:2009-02-14
Cote Saint-Luc, QC
| Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? Great... so we're going to have to deal with fish, monkeys, and chameleons lying and telling us that their company is bettER.
And once Bellus comes around, the CRTC is probably still gonna brag about how competitive the Canadian cell market is. | |
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hmm no
@videotron.ca
| said by l0thar  :Telus wanted to buy BCE back when they put it up for sale; lost to the Teachers bid, which thankfully didn't close in the end (at an inflated share price, it would be a bad move for the pension plan). So, I wouldn't be surprised if they tried again. They didn't lose the bid.
Bell closed the accounting books on them and wouldn't let them review claims of how much Bell is actually worth.
Telus had to back out of a multi-billion dollar deal.
Would you bid on a company if they closed the books on you?
Then the teachers fund/KPMG determined Bell wasn't worth the money and didn't pass a solvency test.
So it's not a matter of them losing a bid, its a matter of Bell not allowing them the opportunity to review the figures Bell presented to everyone.
Big difference. | |
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PXA
Digital Ninja
Premium
join:2008-04-02
Nepean, ON | I can't possibly believe that the Competition Bureau would let this go through. Consolidation on this scale would eliminate far too much consumer choice in Canada, particularly in the cell phone space. | |
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| Davesnothere
join:2009-06-15 | Morphing Puns Bell + Telus = Bellus ~> Bullus ~> Bully-us ?
Hmmmm....  | |
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Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? Perhaps that's why Bell bought Virgin Mobile. Virgin has 300,000+ customers and the highest customer satisfaction among any cellphone company in Canada. | |
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| | Davesnothere
join:2009-06-15
1 edit | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? said by Guspaz :Perhaps that's why Bell bought Virgin Mobile. Virgin has 300,000+ customers and the highest customer satisfaction among any cellphone company in Canada. Which itself is odd, considering :
1) MY own nightmare, er, experience, with Virgin - Don't get me started....
2) Virgin was 50% Bell-owned from the start.
3) Virgin had attracted most of those customers from Bell, and Bell essentially just bought them back - now they'll all have to leave again ? - How Ironic !
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| | | ohmer
join:2003-08-06
Quebec, QC | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? yeah i left virgin mobile 1 week before bell's purshase  | |
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| | | | Davesnothere
join:2009-06-15
1 edit | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? said by ohmer :yeah i left virgin mobile 1 week before bell's purshase How did you know to do that ? | |
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tor
@yaknet.ca
| said by Guspaz :Perhaps that's why Bell bought Virgin Mobile. Virgin has 300,000+ customers and the highest customer satisfaction among any cellphone company in Canada. Not for long I bet. :P | |
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| | | cacruden
join:2008-03-18
Toronto, ON | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? Personally, I would not stop the merger - just put conditions on it that they have to spin the cell phone Virgin and Telus back off as a competitor  | |
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| | elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
join:2006-08-30
Toronto, ON
| They actually didn't "buy" Virgin Mobile, they just bought out the half they didn't own.
Virgin used Bell has their carrier anyways, so there really wasn't alot of difference. I suspect that we're either going to see the Solo brand disappear or the Virgin one. Either way they will be come the low cost BellER
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It's 106 miles to Chicago, we got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses. | |
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Kareeser
hm?
Premium
join:2006-07-18
Hamilton, ON | Wait a second... I thought Telus owned phone lines in Western Canada... whereas Bell owned all of the lines in the East.
Does that mean we'll have a POTS monopoly?
Good god... the horror. | |
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pnjunction
Teksavvy Premium
Premium
join:2008-01-24
Toronto, ON
1 edit | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? They already have monopolies...areas that have one don't have the other. Unless you're willing to move across the country for a different phone company there's no choice. | |
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Kareeser
hm?
Premium
join:2006-07-18
Hamilton, ON
 ·Bell Sympatico
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? said by pnjunction :They already have monopolies...areas that have one don't have the other. Unless you're willing to move across the country for a different phone company there's no choice. Obviously, but that's a duopoly. A monopoly is much worse. | |
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| | | jat
join:2008-04-28
Burlington, ON
| Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? said by Kareeser :said by pnjunction :They already have monopolies...areas that have one don't have the other. Unless you're willing to move across the country for a different phone company there's no choice. Obviously, but that's a duopoly. A monopoly is much worse. No, he's right. Telus has a monopoly out west, and Bell has a monopoly out east. That's not a duopoly. The only market where they compete in the same territory is mobile phone service. And even then, I think Telus owns most (all?) towers out west, and Bell most (all?) towers out east, and it's only through tower sharing agreements that they can offer service in each other's territory. If that's the case, then they're entirely dependent on each other to compete in their respective opponent's territory. That may not be a monopoly, but neither is it much of a duopoly. | |
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mlerner
Premium
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON | Makes sense, they've always had a bit of an alliance but would the CRTC approve it? If either one doesn't bribe them that is. | |
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An_Onymous
@teksavvy.com | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? BellTelus would only be giving CRTC one bribe instead of two. | |
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HeadSpinning
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON | Since Virgin wasn't an actuall cell phone carrier, I doubt the CRTC will have anything to say about it. They were simply a marketing brand, using Bell's network for the actual service. | |
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mlerner
Premium
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? I was talking about Bell and Telus.. | |
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freejazz_RdJ
join:2009-03-10
| This idea would never work. Neither company is likely interested in the deal for a multitude of reasons:
-Integrating two huge companies is extremely difficult. The synergies would take a long time to be realized.
-The regulatory scrutiny to simply get the deal approved would be massive, and would likely nix the deal or impose such harsh conditions as to make it very un-attractive to close the deal (more regulation).
Anyways, who would finance it? Would shareholders really be interested in Bellus? | |
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Big Dreamer
@teksavvy.com | i can't help but to wonder if Telus bought bell would they ditch their satanic boxes? I believe Telus doesn't throttle their customers or do they? | |
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MaynardKrebs
Premium
join:2009-06-17
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Sure, why not.
Condition 1 - CRTC and Competition Bureua enshrine net neutrality (application, protocol, content, provider) into law.
Condition 2 - All land line & data services are competitor neutral, ie. no throttle, speed parity, no nuisance charges, no DPI.
Condition 3 - All fiber facilities are offered to competitors on a non-discriminatory basis. Capacity to be added on a priority basis based on competitor requests ahead of Bellus regular build-out, ie. if Rocky needs more remote fibre DSLAM's or FTTH in Rosedale, they get put in before Bellus rolls out new capacity in an area Rocky doesn't need capacity in.
Condition 4 - One of their two wireless divisions is sold as a public offering or spun-off to existing shareholders, with an anti-takeover clause for 7 years, and individual or shareholders in-concert limited to a maximum of 4.9% of the outstanding shares. Debt assumed by the spun-off company to be in the same proportion as that retained by the combined Bellus. | |
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| freejazz_RdJ
join:2009-03-10
| Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? said by MaynardKrebs :Sure, why not. Condition 1 - CRTC and Competition Bureua enshrine net neutrality (application, protocol, content, provider) into law. Condition 2 - All land line & data services are competitor neutral, ie. no throttle, speed parity, no nuisance charges, no DPI. Condition 3 - All fiber facilities are offered to competitors on a non-discriminatory basis. Capacity to be added on a priority basis based on competitor requests ahead of Bellus regular build-out, ie. if Rocky needs more remote fibre DSLAM's or FTTH in Rosedale, they get put in before Bellus rolls out new capacity in an area Rocky doesn't need capacity in. Condition 4 - One of their two wireless divisions is sold as a public offering or spun-off to existing shareholders, with an anti-takeover clause for 7 years, and individual or shareholders in-concert limited to a maximum of 4.9% of the outstanding shares. Debt assumed by the spun-off company to be in the same proportion as that retained by the combined Bellus. The only reasonable condition among them is #4. 1-3 are all basically a surefire way to encourage those constrained to make no investments. Why invest a dime when competitors who bear none of the investment risk would get to dictate when, where and how you spend the money? Condition 3 is the most absurd of all. Condition 1 I could see being a pseudo-reasonable, but it would still lead to sucky internet if consumers aren't able to bear the cost of the any application at maximum speed function it would dictate.
At the end of the day, unless Canada decides industrial policy and a command and control regime is the way to go, private business will get to decide when and where they will spend their money. Canada likes social welfare, but it doesn't want a socialist economy. | |
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Big Dreamer
@teksavvy.com
| »www.thecanadianencyclopedia.com/···M0011790
Telus is owned by an american communications company.. So if Telus buys Bell things may get very interesting...
this link is also an interesting read, it has Telus and GTE corp saying, "we can take on anybody." so i'd believe they're trying to buy Bell as well.. could be a fun show... | |
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| freejazz_RdJ
join:2009-03-10
1 edit | Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? said by Big Dreamer :» www.thecanadianencyclopedia.com/···M0011790Telus is owned by an american communications company.. So if Telus buys Bell things may get very interesting... this link is also an interesting read, it has Telus and GTE corp saying, "we can take on anybody." so i'd believe they're trying to buy Bell as well.. could be a fun show... You're wrong. GTE, now Verizon, owns 0% of Telus today. At one point, SBC, now ATT, owned 20% of Bell Canada. They now own 0%.
BTW, your article is more than a decade old. | |
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jfmezei
Premium
join:2007-01-03
Beaconsfield, QC
·ELECTRONICBOX
| Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? GTE owned majority stake in BC Tel (which is interesting when you consider telecom ownership limits). In the 1980s, you could tell the difference between payphones in canada were almost all northern telecom/nortel, but in BC, they were .... yes, you guessed it, from GTE 
As I recall, Telus is really the alberta government (through AGT) buying BC Tel, so I would assume GTE's holding in the new combined Telus would have been very reduced.
Does anyone know if GTE sold all of its stake when Telus was formed, or did it retain some ownership for a few years before full divestiture ? | |
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| | | CR123
join:2006-11-04
Vancouver, BC
| Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? said by jfmezei :As I recall, Telus is really the alberta government (through AGT) buying BC Tel, so I would assume GTE's holding in the new combined Telus would have been very reduced. Does anyone know if GTE sold all of its stake when Telus was formed, or did it retain some ownership for a few years before full divestiture ? Close. AGT was privatized, became TELUS, and TELUS and BC Tel merged (a merger of equals, pretty much). GTE's holding in BC Tel was reduced gradually, and they effectively divested their stake in around 2003-4 I think?
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- The content of this post is my opinion, and does not reflect the opinions of my employer. - | |
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jfmezei
Premium
join:2007-01-03
Beaconsfield, QC
·ELECTRONICBOX
| People are forgetting that in the past, Telus was best buddies with Bell Canada.
Back in the goold old days, TCTS/Telecom Canada was a consortium of canadian telephone companies including BC Tel, AGT (both of which became Telus) and Bell Canada. They united in order to try to provide nationwide services which CNCP was able to provide under one account. They worked together to coordinate long distance system, provided nationwide services such as email (Envoy 100) and Telecom Canada branded services such as Datapac, Dararoute etc.
When mobile phones came out, the Telecom Canada group went for that proprietary CDMA technology and agreed to "free" cross roaming agreements in order to compete against Cantel (Rogers) which had a single nationwide network without roaming fees when you left your province.
Later on, competition between Telus and Bell started when Telus got the permission to buy Clearnet, and got spectrum in Ontario/Québec, and was forced to give Bell spectrum in BC/Alta. Telus bought some of the smaller telcos in ontario and quebec (notably Telebec) and started to compete for large contracts (it won a contract to supplie the governmnet of quebec with telecom services for instance).
The so called compeition between Telus and Bell is very recent. In fact, Telus itself is a young company compared to Bell. The merger of BC Tel and AGT wasn't easy for the staff, lots of layoffs etc.
Meanwhile, MTS (no, not "maladies transmises sexuellement !) bought the leftovers of CNCP Telecom (aka: Unitel aka AT&T Canada) and magically became an important nationwide player for commercial services.
Bell Canada bought Northwestel (Formerly a CN subsidiary), and I believe that CN Teleco which provided telephone services in Newfoundland is now under the Bell Aliant umbrella whih has all of atlantic canada.
During the Telecom Canada days, it was the good old days where Bell had enough profits so it could offer great service and never question or nickel-dime customers (except for the touch tone tax). | |
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| freejazz_RdJ
join:2009-03-10
| Re: Telus-Bell Merge Rumor - Say Whaaaaaaat!?!? JF provided a pretty good overview of the history of telecom since the 80's. Up until deregulation, the prices charges by telcos were set by guaranteed the return ("profit"). Once deregulation hit, this was no longer suitable.
Telus (and BCTel/ATG), Sasktel, MTS, the Atlantic providers and Bell were all Stentor alliance members. They were essentially a canada-wide alliance of telcos that shared common services beyond the boundaries of their serving areas. After Telus left the alliance due to Clearnet and wanting a piece of the nationwide enterprise market, MTS and Bell formed Bell West, which MTS had to leave when they got Allstream. As of that moment, MTS changed it's position on the issues from the incumbent side to the competitor side since they now derive more of their profits and growth from their Allstream division than their MTS ILEC division.
Regardless, the merger is a non starter since the resulting company would be subject to so much regulation, if it were allowed at all, that it wouldn't be worth it for shareholders. | |
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win win for us
@cgocable.net
| People you are getting worked up for nothing.
Its a win-win for us out east. Bell is in need of a lobotomy they are so bad. Can it be any worse?
So either some good comes from the Telus board and management or we can say to the people out west:
"Welcome to our world."
Freeze in the dark eh. FU | |
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Cloneman
join:2002-08-29
45436 | I'd be down for a Bell-Telus Merger just for anarchy purposes | |
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