Coarey
@rr.com
| separate ips
so i got a router that connects the internet and people in our house
the ips are like 192.168.1.1 - etc
but can i create like a second network with different IP addresses
like a couple of us would be on for example 10.10.1.1 , .2, .3 etc
so that the ones in the 192.168 cant access us easily?
or does windows/mac networking detect this other one as well? |
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bilbusb
join:2003-04-10
Tucker, GA
 ·Service Electric B..
| You want to use a completely diff subnet, but want to talk to the other subnet without a router? IP does not work that way.
if you want the 192.168.1.x network to talk to the 10.1.1.x network you need a router between.
If you want two completly diff networks sitting on the same switch (that dont comunicate) then thats fine. You wont have internet access on one of the networks though. Unless you have 2 internet connections / routers |
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JoelC707
join:2002-07-09
Tucson, AZ
clubs:
| reply to Coarey
It would really help if we knew what you wanted to do here. Did you just stumble upon this ability in your router and want to know how/if you can use it or do you actually have a need for two subnets? No, Windows, Mac, Linux, etc cannot normally talk to devices on a different subnet without being multi-homed (more than one IP address assigned which would defeat the purpose of running two subnets) or by having a router in between.
By adjusting the subnet mask you can control what segments of IP addressing your computer can see. On a 192.168.1.x network, the most common mask is 255.255.255.0, more commonly known as a "class c network". What the mask tells the network subsystem in your computer is that the first three octets are static for your subnet and the last octet represents other devices. In this case the last octet can be any digit between 1 and 254. 0 and 255 are reserved for network functions in this case.
You could use a subnet mask of 255.255.0.0 which is known as a "class b network". In this case the first two octets are static and the last two are dynamic and can be in the range is 0.1 to 255.254. In this case the last octet can be a 0 or 255 in all but two cases. 0.0 and 255.255 are reserved but 1.0 and 1.255 and so on are available for use.
I should also point out that for the 192.168.x.x subnet, a mask of 255.255.0.0 is the largest you can do. 192.167 and lower and 192.169 and higher are public IP's and could be assigned to anyone or anything on the internet. There are two other sets of ranges of private IP spaces though. 10.x.x.x is one of them and is what is capable of a "class a network with a mask of 255.0.0.0.
Where I'm going with this is to prove to you that short of the two options already mentioned, a PC cannot "see" a computer outside of it's subnet. Your PC could have an IP of 192.168.1.1 and a mask of 255.0.0.0 (yes it's possible but not recommended), and yet never see the 10.x.x.x network. Why? Because the only range that is local to it would be 192.0.0.0 to 192.255.255.255, 10.x.x.x doesn't fall in that range.
If you want to know more about subnetting, Google or this forum can provide you with plenty of info. You could possibly use a subnet mask of 0.0.0.0 which in theory would make every IP from 0.0.0.0 to 255.255.255.255 "local" to you but to be honest I'm not that well versed in subnetting and not sure if that would even work properly.
So what is it you want to do? Do you want to keep two sets of computers separate? If you do this will do it. As long as this is setup in the firewall/router, you shouldn't have any issues with either network accessing the Internet. The router in this case would have both IP addresses, in essence it would be multi-homed and local to both networks. Depending on the level of sophistication the router can achieve you could possibly allow controlled access between the two networks.
Even if the router can't do that, you could also do this with another router piggy backing the first. Simply plug the WAN port into one of the LAN ports on the first router. Assign the WAN port a static or dynamic IP that belongs in the first network (192.168.1.x). The LAN side of the second firewall will have the other network (10.10.1.x). The firewall on the second router will restrict access between the two networks while still allowing internet access. I should point out that with this particular setup you will be "Double natting" which can cause some things to not work properly. You could possibly solve that by using the software DMZ function of the first router and pointing everything not explicitly defined to the second router.
Anyway I could give you "what-if's" all night. Without knowing what you want to do no one can really help. |
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Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
| reply to Coarey
Another option is the zyxel NBG334W router. Besides the normal LAN which you would be on, there is a guest WIFI LAN (wifi only) intended for guests or for use with gaming devices (wifi). This second network has its own wifi settings including security and is dhcp serving and ONLY HAS access to the internet. Guest users cannot access the normal LAN.
This is also possbile on many of the linksys or other routers that can handle third party firmwares
--
Ain't nuthin but the blues! "Albert Collins".
Leave your troubles at the door! "Pepe Peregil" De Sevilla. Just Don't Wifi without WPA, "Yul Brenner"
LlamaWorks Equipment |
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Coarey
@rr.com
| reply to bilbusb
i got some of your answers, thank you,
JoelC707, not sure how i can restate the question differently:
i have 1 linksys wrt54g router, dhcp 192.168.1.X
if i speak the terms right: i would like the subnets not to talk to each other (at least so that normal users wont detect the other subnet computers easily - folder/printer shares to be specific)
both subnets need internet
so i understand i'd need either 3rd party firmware or another router. |
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janderso1
Jim
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-15
Saint Petersburg, FL
| My understanding is that the newer WRT54G routers don’t support third party firmware (but I haven’t checked on this for a while). A Zywall 2 plus will allow you to setup up the subnets and use firewall rules to control access between them in any way the you need/want.
--
Jim Anderson |
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JoelC707
join:2002-07-09
Tucson, AZ
clubs:
| reply to Coarey
That's actually all I needed to know, you actually want to do this and want them to be separate. If your existing router has the ability to program in a second IP address on the LAN side then this can be done with nothing added or changed. Your router would be multi-homed which basically means it has two IP address schemes. One set of computers could have 192.168.0.x/255.255.255.0 and the other set could have 192.168.1.x/255.255.255.0. Both will be completely separate though they can both see the router/internet and they can see computers within their own subnet.
I just wanted to clarify you actually wanted to do this and it wasn't just a feature you saw and were curious how to use or if you could use it. And even if that were the case, that's still fine, I'd just give you more "what-if" scenarios and help you understand them if need be. |
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