munky99999
Munky
join:2004-04-10
canada
clubs:
| reply to jfmezei
Re: CRTC Hearing - Day 6 - The Last Day
said by jfmezei  :Guys, Bell has 10 thousand lawyers who make sure that their advertising is (just barely) legal. They know exactly how far they can go with their misleading statements. Oh no doubt. I wasnt ever going to suggest bothering in attacking bell like this. I was just pointing out that those who are saying false advertising... the defenders for it are saying misleading.. but that's not a defence but rather admission.
Hell what does it even matter if it's shared or not? What does it really mean to the overall sync or anything?
Hell even the qualified argument isnt true because sometimes they will tap into your neighbour phone lines and such to see if there's a better sync. So there are shared lines going from the demarc to dslam.
It doesnt matter. We are talking about the final end experience here. Where bittorrent and other p2p applications and even some other applications get throttled; because of congestion; but they choose to do it even when there is no congestion. Which is a choice they made.
If congestion happens. Speeds slow down. This is going to happen. DPI can be put in place to speed up for example VOIP in relation to 911 calls. Even then... the overall thoroughput of voip on a network must be very very little; so prioritizing voip ought not have any real effect. But dropping down bittorrent to 30kb/s is absurd.
Soon as bell did that. They caused this storm. |
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munky99999
Munky
join:2004-04-10
canada
clubs:
| reply to jfmezei
said by jfmezei :As of today, my feeling is that the CRTC is now seeking suggestions on how to proceed on this. Find some way to let ISPs decide how to manage their traffic without allowing them to break the telecom act. No it's more like the CRTC is discovering that the issue is going to keep getting larger.
LOADS of people sent in letters and submissions. The crtc and bell were both surprised how many people... they also realize that it takes effort to make those submissions. I personally couldn't be bothered to do it.
Crtc came back on bell's side. We escalated it.
Now they have to go into the public, have public presentations and have to follow procedures. Etc etc.
Lets say they fall on Bell's side again. Guess what... we are going to say FFFFFFFFFFFFFF the crtc and start contacting the federal government. The liberal party has come out on the side of net neutrality. Green party I bet will be net neutral. Conservatives I bet might even go net neutral. NDP I suspect will go net neutral.
Guess what happens then. CRTC gets overridden... they lose all oversight... there will be an ban on technology which COULD be used to break net neutrality. Bell gets whooped. The overall effect will likely be worse in the longrun as DPI wont be there to be able to manage things that needs to be.
Anti-ddos? anti-ircbots? pro-voip?
These are all things DPI is good for.
It's the abuses the ISPs are doing that are the problem however. Limiting 30kb/s downloads; blocking all uploads; or blocking encrypted traffic. That needs to end and be quashed with heavy fines and possible criminal liability. |
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Davesnothere
join:2009-06-15
4 edits | reply to munky99999
said by munky99999 :DPI can be put in place to speed up for example VOIP in relation to 911 calls. Even then, the overall throughput of VOIP on a network must be very very little; so prioritizing VOIP ought not have any real effect. But dropping down bittorrent to 30kb/s is absurd. Soon as bell did that. They caused this storm. .
That about Nutshells it.
IMNSHO, Bell is abusing the available technology, and behaving like a Corporate Bully due to their position in the marketplace.
They are taking the chance that they can get away with it, and these hearings are just one way that some of us pray we can help make the sun reappear. |
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Davesnothere
join:2009-06-15
1 edit | reply to jfmezei
10,000 Lawyers
said by jfmezei :....Bell has 10 thousand lawyers who make sure that their advertising is (just barely) legal. They know exactly how far they can go with their misleading statements. .
AHHHHH !
NOW I get it !
Bell suffers from LAWYER CONGESTION !
But seriously, I commend you on your more measured (notice I didn't say Throttled  ) approach taken when you address bodies such as the CRTC.
Naturally, we all rant somewhat when we post here, but even with our strong feelings about Bell (or the Banks, or the Oil companies, etc....don't get me started), I agree that there is a proper way to say things when the listener has the power to help our collective cause.
And oh yes - I follow Politics too.
So tomorrow's presentation should prove to be very worthy of interest, and I hope that there IS a chance for Rocky and some of the earlier presenters to offer a rebuttal/followup, as I think Rocky was talking about doing on the 24th. - He certainly will have plenty of additional ideas and perspectives on which to draw from here. |
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chronoss2009
join:2008-09-23
 ·TekSavvy Solutions..
1 edit | reply to milnoc
Re: CRTC Hearing - Day 6 - The Last Day
You also have a newly forming pirate party dedicated to the issues of net neutrality , and copyright , TWO HUGE IT issues that will resonate with the younger under 40 crowd , if those politicians don't take heed they may see a further backlash and start seeing greens and PPoC people getting elected and really change things FOR the betterment |
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go chronoss
@cgocable.net
| said by chronoss2009 :You also have a newly forming pirate party dedicated to the issues of net neutrality , and copyright , TWO HUGE IT issues that will resonate with the younger under 40 crowd , if those politicians don't take heed they may see a further backlash and start seeing greens and PPoC people getting elected and really change things FOR the betterment chronoss for PM  |
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jfmezei
Premium
join:2007-01-03
Beaconsfield, QC
·ELECTRONICBOX
| reply to Davesnothere
Re: 10,000 Lawyers
>So tomorrow's presentation should prove to be very worthy of interest,
>and I hope that there IS a chance for Rocky and some of the earlier
>presenters to offer a rebuttal/followup, as I think Rocky was talking
>about doing on the 24th. - He certainly will have plenty of additional
>ideas and perspectives on which to draw from here.
I have no expectations for tomorrow. Bell will have a compelling presentation, so will Rogers. CRTC will have some pointed questions, and some questions that aren't too pointed.
I suspect that the CRTC will *try* to digest all of this, and perhaps consult with the government for guidance on the issue. Remember that Charlie Angus' proposed bill allows for DPI and thorttling, it is a net neutrality bill only by its cover not by its contents, and if the Liberals (a BCE subsidiary) introduce their own, it will lack even more bite than the NDPs. Reform only cares about saying YES to big business.
If you can read between the lines, I think that the CRTC has sent a fairly clear message of what it needs in the final round of submissions due at end of july. |
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N Terloper
@bell.ca
| reply to jfmezei
Re: CRTC Hearing - Day 6 - The Last Day
said by jfmezei :....Thus was one of my statements in my presentations, that ISPs should be forced to divulge the sustainable speeds they can support instead of , or along with the burstable "up to" speeds... I remember hearing you say that 'live' and responding with a 'fist-pump' and a big grin (I might have even shouted yes!). You got several of those gestures from me that day  Thanks for appearing on behalf of rational people everywhere. |
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N Terloper
@bell.ca | reply to jfmezei
Re: 10,000 Lawyers
I have to make myself a note to disable VLC's buslls**t filter plug-in or it's gonna be a lot of 'dead air'. |
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milnoc
join:2001-03-05
H3B | And I have to disable Windows Media Player's BS Generator otherwise the recordings will be three days long! |
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jfmezei
Premium
join:2007-01-03
Beaconsfield, QC | this is just a test from via train 31 , car 03 seat 9a
BTW, anyone know what the bitrate is for the live crtc hearings ? |
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DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
clubs:
·Bell Sympatico
| said by jfmezei :this is just a test from via train 31 , car 03 seat 9a BTW, anyone know what the bitrate is for the live crtc hearings ? I never found internet from VIA trains satisfactory. Too much signal dropping.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care. |
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nigrunze
join:2009-02-14
Cote Saint-Luc, QC
| said by DKS :I never found internet from VIA trains satisfactory. Too much signal dropping. JF repeatedly mentioned that last Tuesday on his way back from Gatineau. |
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jfmezei
Premium
join:2007-01-03
Beaconsfield, QC | Interesting that I get snappier response today (or just plain get a response) but am unable to upload an image. |
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mlerner
Premium
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON | reply to milnoc
Re: CRTC Hearing - Day 6 - The Last Day
Horrible idea putting satellite technology on a train, it can be worse than GPRS. |
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mlerner
Premium
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON
 ·Rogers Hi-Speed
·TekSavvy Solutions..
·Bell Sympatico
| reply to jfmezei
Re: 10,000 Lawyers
said by jfmezei :BTW, anyone know what the bitrate is for the live crtc hearings ? According to windows media player, the stream is 32 Kbps |
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jfmezei
Premium
join:2007-01-03
Beaconsfield, QC
·ELECTRONICBOX
| After a long stop just before Glen Robertsoon where I had time to re-imstall some software on myt mac, I tried something silly...
Yes folks, I can listen to the CRTC music on the train !!!!
I assume this is some UDP stream where I don't need to send acknowledgements.
Although it drops now and then for a second of two. it is actually working !
I woudl deduct that the downlink is failrly reliable, it is the uplink that would be unreliable.
Now, the big question is whether I can afford to thether this to my fido so I can listen to the start of the proceedings while on the bus between the via station and Hull. |
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mlerner
Premium
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON | I wouldn't try it if your data plan is under 1 GB. |
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DKS
Damn Kidney Stones
Premium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
clubs:
·Bell Sympatico
| reply to mlerner
Re: CRTC Hearing - Day 6 - The Last Day
said by mlerner :Horrible idea putting satellite technology on a train, it can be worse than GPRS. From VIA's web site:
quote:
Wi-Fi service on board our trains is temporarily affected by satellite service instability. Until service is fully restored, Wi-Fi access will be complimentary in all locations.
»www.viarail.ca/en/useful-info/on···nternet/
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care. |
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jfmezei
Premium
join:2007-01-03
Beaconsfield, QC
·ELECTRONICBOX
1 edit | reply to jfmezei
Re: 10,000 Lawyers
A veritable who's who of the 2008-19 pulic hearing:
Man, I can't cut/paste from my xterm. murphy's law.
Anyways, from the train:
ripnet.net (1 hop)
cgocable (1 hop)
globe internet (tata)
Bell
Train appears to be running late. New ETA is 08:55 . Looks like I may try to run my mac while in the bus, thethered to my fido. have to calculate how may kilobytes that will take
I have a 6megabyte plan.
32kbps = 400KB/s. With a 6 meg plan, that gives me 1500 seconds or 25 minutes.
And if there is compression (not a constant 32kbps flow) I could last a few monre minites before racking up a million dollar bill from Fido
at 3 cents per KB, it is 12 cents per second to listen to the hearing |
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