jumpingryan
join:2008-07-27
Frankford, ON
 ·TekSavvy Solutions..
| MLPP & home network questions
Good Day to all:
First I want to say, having been with Bell for years (Sympatico high speed regular and ultra packages, (both unlimited and 60 gig bandwidth packages), and Cogeco (16 MBPS package, 100 megs bandwidth), I want to say I am impressed with all that TekSavvy offers its customers. I am particularly happy with the unlimited packages. 
I will note, that when I was with Bell and Cogeco, I was living in Petawawa (bell), and Trenton (Bell and later Cogeco).
Although I am not a high bandwidth user by comparison to the other downloaders that are out there, I like the fact that I just don't have to worry about going over and either paying more, or having my service cut off (cogeco). In other words, reliability and price are the factors for me. My girlfriend also works on-line at times using a VPN connection, so reliability and speed is important to her as well.
I have currently moved to Frankford, Ontario, and Cogeco does not offer internet (cable only) to this area, and my only option is DSL. I have a TekSavvy phone service and DSL 5MBPS unlimited.
The problem is my current speed. Right now I get only 1.4 MBPS download and 400 MBPS upload on many speed tests over the past few months since I have moved to Frankford. I am currently on a 5 MBPS unlimited plan.
I realize that it is likely the speed I will get for this area until technology improves and lines are upgraded. I currently live in a new subdivision in a "farther out" area from the city, so it could happen sooner or later.....
Anyways, my question regards MLPP and how to set it up. My home network consists of:
Speed Touch ST516 V6 to a DLink DIR 655 to assorted switches throughout the house. I want to keep the DIR 655 in order to run a gigabit home network (a good to have for my Windows Home Server) and the wireless N (good to have for the Mac and other devices)
I would like to know if I can do the following:
1) Can I hook up the setup in the following manner:
Speed Touch to TOMATO flashed router (for MLPPP) to DIR 655 (for gigabit network and wireless N) to all my devices and switches.
Will I still keep my gigabit network and wireless N with this setup
2) Where would I enable the firewall on this setup, and where would I turn it off? I will note that the speed touch has a firewall, and I currently have it disabled there, and enabled at my DIR 655. I don't yet have a TOMATO flashed router installed.
3) Would MLPPP single DSL help out my speed for torrenting, VPN, and standard HTML downloads?
4) I am thinking on having a second DSL connection added, and doing the MLPPP with two DSL connections. Could I expect my speeds to double doing this?
Thanks in advance to any help you can provide.
Ryan |
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Martian3
join:2004-10-17
Lindsay, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| Right. In order:
1) That setup should be possible, but I'm not the expert on Tomato/MLPPP (I believe Guspaz is one of the devs, so perhaps he can give you the step-by-step). Basically what you're going to do is use the router to connect, and then forward that connection directly to your D-Link to bypass the Tomato router's NAT. It's important that you do that, because otherwise you'll be double-NATed which can cause some funky issues, especially with VPN's.
2) Your Speedtouch will be in bridge mode and the Tomato router will be tunneling the connection. Your D-Link will handle the firewall and routing, just like it is now.
3) Single link MLPPP won't change your speeds. What it will do is evade any throttling that Bell is applying to your connection, which is what causes problems with torrents and occasionally other encrypted traffic like VPN's. HTTP transfers should be unaffected, so there will be no change there.
4) Bonding two links will give you up to twice the speed, yes. In the case of two bonded links with MLPPP, you'll get twice the speed of the slower connection. Given that your profile is pretty low that could well be the limiting factor. I don't know what policy is on such things, but I'm not sure there'd even be a point in provisioning a second line if it's worse.
I'd give Teksavvy a call if I were you and see if anything can be done to improve that sync. If you're happy with it I guess it's okay, but at the same time you're paying for 5 Mbps and might as well get the best possible speed out of it. |
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Gokuu
join:2001-08-27
| reply to jumpingryan
Ryan
ST516 -> Tomato -> Dlink 655 -> devices (wired and wireless)
The tomato router will be the router for your home network. One cable from Tomato (LAN switch) to the Dlink (LAN switch on the router). Setup Tomato router for DHCP. Turn off DHCP on the 655 and make sure it has an IP and network parameters (static) that's the same as Tomato
Basically you're not using the 655 as a router...just using it as a switch and AP. There will only be one cable from Tomato to the 655, and the remaining network devices plug into the 655 gigE switch or wireless N.
Good luck. |
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jumpingryan
join:2008-07-27
Frankford, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| reply to Martian3
Screen shot of DMT |
After speaking with their support, I went to the demarkation box outside my panel, opened it up, and disconnected my home phone line wiring, and did a test from there, hooking up my DSL modem to it.
When I opened a box inside the demarkation there to hook-up, my home wiring was automatically disconnected, and I was hooking up my modem straight to the source with no interference from my home wiring.
I ran the speed test, and still got 1.45 or so MBPS download and arround 0.41 MBPS upload, with a ping of 30 MS.
The tech support did some checks, and told me about a program called DMT where I could do my own tests. Here is a screen snap shot of it.
While I don't understand all of it (yet!), an RCO of 27 % is low, and an RCO of 83 % is high. Apparently they need to be checked out.
As well, the Teksavvy tech support told me a cool way to find the distance from the CO. Just take both my attenuation's and add them, and divide by 18. My attenuation was 51 DL and 31.5 UL. Basically my distance is 4.58 KM.
The limit is apparently 6 KM or so from what I remember.
They are sending a work order to bell to check out the lines, and apparently I should be able to get a 4 MBPS setup if all goes well from the Bell side of things.... although since I am with them for for nothing, I expect them to drag their feet on it.
That doesn't mean I won't go with MLPPP dual DSL sometime soon, but good advice on sorting out this connection first, before I move on to the next. MLPPP will likely be next though!
Thanks to all for your replies!
Ryan |
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DJ R
Premium
join:2005-06-12
Brossard, QC | reply to jumpingryan
no the limit is 4.5
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PixiWork |
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Martian3
join:2004-10-17
Lindsay, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| reply to jumpingryan
Actually, there's no fixed limit -- if you can get sync, you can get sync. Typically the outer range is around 4-5 km, but it varies quite a bit depending on the quality of the line. It's not a case of 4.5km=good, 4.6km=no go.
Your attenuation is high, which indicates that you are on quite a long loop; on the other hand, you've got a great SNR and should be able to get a much better sync rate than you have currently. I'm not sure I'd trust the RCO in this case (RCO, for clarity, is an estimate of your max sync based on your line quality), but certainly you should be able to do better than 1728.
Keep us posted on how it goes. |
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bioflare
join:2007-11-18 | reply to jumpingryan
I have been doing okay for about a year now and they say the line distance is around 5.3 km. Its not 5meg profile but I was quoted 3 Meg when i first started, which was decent for that distance. |
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jumpingryan
join:2008-07-27
Frankford, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| reply to jumpingryan
So as an update.... Bell just finished working on my line after TekSavvy sent in a work order!
I did a few speed tests, and got 1.46 MBPS and 0.31 MBPS upload with a ping of 68 MS!
That is actually worse for the ping and UL!
What a pain.
Here is a screen shot of my DMT run as well.... after doing a complete re-set of my DSL modem (powered down, and powered back on after 2 minutes).
I am pretty pissed at this now, and pissed at Bell!
Apparently Bell got me on 1.7 MBPS, but I really don't see any improvement on this scale as compared to the other one!
I am still thinking of going dual DSL MLPPP, just to at least get a decent connection, or somewhat double it. At least until Bell upgrades or gets forced to sell off it's last mile connections.
Any thoughts or suggestions on this? Can anyone tell me if I should make another call to TekSavvy to get this checked out again?
Thanks again to all who provided advice!
Ryan |
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nigrunze
join:2009-02-14
Cote Saint-Luc, QC
| They downgraded your stats from fastpath to interleave, as well as lower your upstream from "544 kbit/s" (There is no 544 profile. They previously had the upstream set to either 640 or 800 which was too high for your modem to sync at with your line stats.) to 384kbit/s.
You should get TekSavvy to send out another ticket. Your upstream should be able to handle 512. For your downstream, I'd have to take a guess at 3mbit, maybe even 4. |
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jumpingryan
join:2008-07-27
Frankford, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| Thanks Nigrunze,
I just got off the phone with the Teksavvy dudes, and they are sending out another ticket.
I read him out your reply, and tech support said he agreed with your 100%!
Hopefully I can get that 3 or 4 meg connection..... from there, I will decide if I am gonna try my luck with dual DSL with MLPPP!
If getting a second connection to mirror this one is this much ass pain, I just might stick with one good one. I don't know if I want to try my luck! LOL
Thanks again,
Ryan |
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nigrunze
join:2009-02-14
Cote Saint-Luc, QC
| said by jumpingryan  :Thanks Nigrunze No problem.
said by jumpingryan :Hopefully I can get that 3 or 4 meg connection..... from there, I will decide if I am gonna try my luck with dual DSL with MLPPP! If you want to be (almost) guaranteed the higher speeds, then you might want to keep the modem directly connected to the demarc. Of course, this means that you can't use your phone for a bit.
What are your stats like from where you'd normally have the modem hooked up? |
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An_Onymous
@teksavvy.com
| reply to nigrunze
I wouldn't call going interleave a down grade depending on what you are doing with your connections. It actually let you gain ~2 dB in SNR artifically via forward error correction in exchange for extra 40-50ms latency. You shouldn't have problems getting 3-4Mbps.
Mine upstream is also at 31.5dB, but right now I am at 736kbps during summers (and 800 during winters).
Your profile looks a bit weird as there is a big gap between your up and your downstream. See if cleaning up the wiring and check your phone filter would help. |
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grayfox
join:2007-12-10
Whitby, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
·Bell Sympatico
1 edit | reply to jumpingryan
Somethings killing your upload.
Also the RCO on the downstream indicates your line should handle at least 5megs (it says 6.4 down).
Something is killing the lower frequency's used by the upload, If you can findwhat is you can get your sync raised.
If you have an alarm system that is on the same line this will cause it.
edit: Nevermind you tested at the demarc, your good. But Theres osmething on bells end hurting your upload speeds. |
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jumpingryan
join:2008-07-27
Frankford, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| reply to nigrunze
I actually tried hooking it up to the demarc, and I got the exact same results on DMT, with the house wiring disconnected on the first test. I also hooked up to another room in the house for another test, and it worked the same.
I have no reason to think it is my house wiring after doing the comparison.
My house is well wired internally, as it was just built less than a year ago (I live in Frankford, Ontario), and the phone lines are wired with CAT 5E.
Ryan |
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jumpingryan
join:2008-07-27
Frankford, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
1 edit | reply to An_Onymous
Hmmmmm
Could this be caused by a bad DSL filter? 
Never really thought about changing those arround......
I got a couple of spares, might be worth a try. I really only cordless phones here (we work on cordless sets at 6.0 DECT) with one base station...... time to check some things out!
Thanks for the tip!
Update: Just tried that, and no luck....  Hopefully Bell can have another look at this line, and get me somewhere! Watching youtube video can be painful on this connection!
Ryan |
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jumpingryan
join:2008-07-27
Frankford, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
1 edit |  reply to jumpingryan
Well, Teksavvy rocks!
Those guys just gave me a call, and I ran a speed test here...... got 4.31 MBPS Download and 0.37 MBPS Upload.
Video runs great, and everything seems to be awesome so far! Now to get MLPPP setup to really get rocking! LOL I will probally wait a month or so and decide if I want to try dual DSL MLPPP. I have MLPPP now with a static IP, but I don't yet have the router to set up Tomato.
I am posting a DMT screen shot on here too.... I guess Bell can rise to the occasion if Teksavvy does enough kicking and prodding to get Bell to do their jobs. For the technically inclined, the before, middle of the process, and final DMT screen shots really tell a tale of Bell screwing me around.
I had been on this slow service for more than 5 months.
Thanks again to all on the forum for your help and technical advice.
As well, thanks goes to the tech support at Teksavvy for their call backs, friendly customer service, and technical support that actually knows the technical side of things!
Ryan |
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