dave
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| reply to poacher 1rtd
Re: UK Government Petition: No Swine Vaccine
That article was written by one Jane Bürgermeister. She seems like a sensible well-balanced person to me.
said by other paranoid website :
Jane Bürgermeister contends offshore banksters [sic] have cooked up an engineered flu virus in order to realize their eugenics plan for mass extermination.
Bürgermeister says the core group sets its strategic goals in secret using the Trilateral Commission and Bilderberg meetings. “It can be identified as the ‘Illuminati,’ a mafia-like group with family dynasties at its center.” It is the “world’s first truly global crime syndicate” based in “off shore banking centers” and employs international organizations such as the UN and WHO.
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Jtmo
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join:2001-05-20
Novato, CA
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| reply to Dude111
See, we wear tin foil hats no matter where we live.
Vaccines may be strongly pushed, but no one is forced to accept them.
Yes, there is some risk in Flu vaccines and many of us will not take them.
I am allergic to Penicillin, and many people get sick from those allergies, 400 die each year in the USA.
So, should we ban it, no.
Same with measles shots, and all the other nasty diseases that used to be common. There are risks, but they are outweighed by the common good of millions of people NOT getting sick.
Pertussis
Polio-the Crippling disease of yesteryear, now making a comeback thanks to tin foil hats
Mumps-nothing like swollen testicles. Please do not get this one, we need to clean the gene pool.
Hep A and B-6000 die each year in the USA, millions infected.
Tetanus shots- Three of 10 who get this from a cut Die.
And many, many more. |
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Dude111
An Awesome Dude
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USA
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| reply to Dude111
Swine Flu Trial Results.......SCARY!!!
»content.nejm.org/cgi/content/ful···a0907413
Make sure to click the PDF link and print out a copy for yourself!!
These results are not surprising!! |
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dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio | Indeed, looks like a promising initial test of an H1N1 vaccine. |
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Dude111
An Awesome Dude
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1 edit | reply to Dude111
Re: UK Government Petition: No Swine Vaccine
Well these 3 quotes are a bit scarisome!
"Data regarding unsolicited adverse events are being collected but are unavailable for this preliminary report".
"The full safety profile of H1N1 vaccine has not yet been elucidated. Population-based postlicensure surveillance will be required for all H1N1 vaccines, especially to assess rare outcomes, such as the Guillain–Barré syndrome".
"Finally, estimates of the true effect of the vaccine when used in mass immunization programs will come from vaccine-effectiveness studies". |
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wonko3fc
Verbum sat sapienti
join:2001-06-02
UK
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| reply to Dude111
Well, I'll be honest, I've barely looked at this thread but from the scant few entries I have read, it looks fascinating. 
I've learnt recently, that I am top of the list to receive the vaccine, after the HCP's have had theirs (or not). 
Will I have it? 'Course I blooming will - no intention of dropping dead because of a blooming German pig.  |
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dave
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1 edit | reply to Dude111
They don't scare me.
1) Note that all the adverse events were mild/moderate. They include the usual sort of "my arm is a bit sore" complaints. The researchers asked about certain specific reactions that they considered possible. In addition, people will will report other things (that may or may not have anything to do with the vaccine). Those are the 'unsolicited adverse events'. We already know that there were no serious adverse reactions, and the tabulation of the unsolicited ones is all that remains to do.
2) Of course not; they'd be fools to think that a 100-person trial establishes safety beyond a shadow of a doubt. Does that mean the 100-person trial should not be done? No. And obviously they mention Guilllain-Barre, since that's on everyone's mind - it needs to be watched for even if it is not expected to happen with this vaccine.
3) Again, you have misunderstood the study. This study merely measured the immunogenic reaction to the vaccine. That's a good indicator of effectiveness, but the true measure of effectivenesss is "not getting the virus afterwards". That can only be done statistically, since it'd be immoral to give people the vaccine and then deliberatly expose them to the virus. |
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Dude111
An Awesome Dude
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1 edit | reply to Dude111
This is how stupid they think we are Dave!!
Read the LAST PARAGRAPH of this article
»www.theage.com.au/national/vacci···w56.html
Then go to slide #66 of this.......
»www.public.health.wa.gov.au/cpro···nvax.pdf
HOW CAN THEY BLATENTLY LIE TO THE PUBLIC!!!!!!?????
I swear to god things are going to get extremly bad if more and more dont wake up and take a stand!!!! |
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dave
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join:2000-05-04
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| Just like conspiracy nuts everywhere, you construe a difference of opinion as a deliberate attempt to lie to you. If you can find someone who claims X, and then someone else who claims not-X, you will assert that one of them is part of some huge plot to fool the public.
Here are several things for you to consider:
0. No large organization speaks with a single voice.
1. Linkage is a statistical phenomenon, not a yes/no issue.
2. Beware post hoc, ergo propter hoc arguments.
3. Even if (for arguments' sake) the 1976 US swine flu vaccine was the cause of G-B syndrome, this is not a comment on all vaccines.
4. It is prudent to tell all professionals at the point of vaccine delivery to 'watch out for G-B syndrome' even if you believe there is no linkage.
But that's probably too sober an analysis for you. |
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Dude111
An Awesome Dude
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| reply to Dude111
Ineffectiveness and Dangers of Flu Shots
This is a great article:-
»www.opednews.com/articles/Ineffe···937.html
Doctors: FluMist Vaccine Could Spread H1N1 Virus
»www.prisonplanet.com/doctors-con···rus.html
quote:
With 60 per cent of the U.S. population at risk, is swine flu nasal spray a pandemic waiting to happen?
Doctors and hospitals are expressing concern that the FluMist vaccine could endanger people because it contains live H1N1 virus, unlike the injectable shot that contains antibodies. With no less than 60 per cent of the U.S. population immunodeficient in one way or another, could FluMist be a pandemic waiting to happen? [more]
I was concerned about these stupid mist things last week in this manner (As well as others are also) |
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dave
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join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
1 edit | I'm through trying to knock sense into your anti-scientific head. You might, however, look up the phrase "not even wrong".
One question though, why are you spewing Alex Jones's paranoid junk in the UK Forum, of all places? |
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Dude111
An Awesome Dude
Premium
join:2003-08-04
USA | reply to Dude111
Re: UK Government Petition: No Swine Vaccine
Why are you dead set against even considering anything other than MAINSTREAM info?? |
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dave
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| I'm not. But when considering the message, I also consider the messenger. You can figure out all you need to know about Jonesey's web site by the presence of crap like this:
quote:
CANCER CONSPIRACY? Are "they" suppressing the cure? Will YOU be the next victim? Learn the Secret Truth! - READ FULL STORY.
How does this differ from the crap 'news'papers they peddle at supermarket checkouts, exactly?
Also, I can recognize selective quoting when I see it. Here, let me quote from one of Jone's sources (emphasis mine).
quote:
But several metro area hospitals said they won’t be taking the FluMist because they don’t want to endanger patients.
When asked if that meant that FluMist was dangerous, Lois VanFleet, infection prevention specialist at Exempla Good Samaritan Medical Center in Lafayette said, "No, it's a very safe vaccine in healthy people."
But tin-foil boy only pays attention to the "hospitals won't be taking..." part of the article.
Also, it says this on Jone's web site:
quote:
According to studies, “the odds of transmitting the virus after receiving the nasal spray are about 2.5 percent,” with children the most susceptible.
Unfortunately, the link is now dead. But if you followed the link, it went on to say that those to whom the virus was transmitted did NOT develop an infection: exposure to virus != get infected by virus. (They probably gave numbers but I don't recall them).
Apropos the inhaler - yeah, it's not appropriate for people with depressed immune systems. But it says that on the packaging. Is it therefore appropriate to use in hospitals? I don't know, but I'm willing to let trained hospital staff figure that out, rather than relying on a deluded paranoid with a web site.
I recommend adding the following web site to your daily reading list; then you'll perhaps learn how to interpret what you read.
»www.badscience.net/ |
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Pjr
join:2005-12-11
UK | dave, I want to say that I really admire you patience.
Ah man. |
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jvmorris
I Am The Man Who Was Not There.
Premium,MVM
join:2001-04-03
Reston, VA
2 edits | You have to understand that dave (not being in Ohio, of course) still suffers from the delusion that rational discourse is possible.
Now, if he were in Ohio, . . . .
--
Regards,
Joseph V. Morris |
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Pjr
join:2005-12-11
UK | And there was I thinking he knew everything... |
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Dude111
An Awesome Dude
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2 edits | reply to dave
quote:
CANCER CONSPIRACY? Are "they" suppressing the cure?
Many think they are Dave!!
If a cure was found,it would mean they couldnt get rich anymore selling supposed things to make it better! (I myself dont doubt they may be blocking the cure) |
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dave
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| D'oh, you're right. Because of course no-one actually in possession of a cure for cancer would be able to sell a cure for cancer. It would be worthless in the marketplace. No-one's interested in a cure for cancer. No-one would pay for that sort of thing.
Instead, it's much more sensible to keep it a secret and hope no-one else discovers it. |
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jvmorris
I Am The Man Who Was Not There.
Premium,MVM
join:2001-04-03
Reston, VA | Sort of like "The Man in the White Suit"?
--
Regards,
Joseph V. Morris |
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dave
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join:2000-05-04
not in ohio | I'm not sure whose side you're taking with that comment - but good reference! (You've really 'gone native' once you start dropping references to Ealing comedies). |
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