Qwest → frequent disconnects

I have been struggling with frequent disconnects since switching to a new DSL account. Nothing physical changed, only my PPP username and password. I have contacted QWest several times without any success yet.

It happens as little as twice a week, and as often as four times a day, but generally about once per day. The disconnection lasts only a minute or so, and everything recovers automatically.

I have verified my PPP username and password with QWest several times. Each time they assure me it's correct.

I have the ActionTec M1000 DSL router. Yes, I know it sucks, but it's what I have. I have tried putting it into a transparent bridge with a Tomato based router, but I still get the disconnects regardless. When I used Tomato I received "LCP appears to be disconnected (pending: 5)." I am trying to find additional debug information from Tomato to see if that helps. Even if I could get a L2TP error code that would help a lot.

This morning I experienced another disconnect and I immediately checked the M1000 to see what it was doing. I noticed my CRC, FEC had no errors, no authorization errors, but the session time reset. I called QWest Tech Support and they registered no disconnection or authentication errors. What is interesting is they indicated I have been connected non stop for 252 days, but this DSL account is not even one month old yet.

Does anyone have any ideas how to debug this regular disconnection issue? QWest Tech Support doesn't appear to have the devices available each time I call them.

Scott

For additional information...

Here are my current stats from my M1000 WAN Status page:

WAN Status
Connection Status

Qwest Broadband: CONNECTED

Internet Service Provider (ISP) : CONNECTED
PPP Status
Status: Connected
User Name: xxx@qwest.net
LCP State: up
IPCP State: up
Authentication Failures: 0
Session Time: 1hr 15min 34sec
Packets Sent: 110556
Packets Received: 114353

Broadband Status
VPI: 0
VCI: 32
DSL Mode Setting: MMODE
DSL Negotiated Mode: G.DMT
Connection Status: Showtime
Speed (down/up): 7168 / 896 Kbps
Number of Retrains: 1
Number of Retrains Elapsed Time: 33 Hours 41 Mins 19 Secs
ATM QoS class: UBR
Near End CRC Errors (I/F) : 0/0
Far End CRC Errors (I/F) : 0/0
Near End CRC(Within last 30 mins)(I/F) : 0/0
Far End CRC(Within last 30 mins)(I/F) : 0/0
Near End RS FEC (I/F) : 0/0
Far End RS FEC (I/F) : 0/0
Near End FEC(Within last 30 mins)(I/F) : 0/0
Far End FEC(Within last 30 mins)(I/F) : 0/0
Discarded Packets(Within last 30 mins): 0
SNR Margin (Downstream/Upstream): 22/14
Attenuation (Downstream/Upstream): 6/8

I logged into the M1000 shell and pulled this from the log file:

(GMT-07:00)03:11:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: read conflict_time 86400
(GMT-07:00)03:11:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: read lease_file /var/tmp/landhcps0.leases
(GMT-07:00)03:11:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: local IP address xx.xxx.xxx.xxx
(GMT-07:00)03:11:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: remote IP address 67.42.184.210
(GMT-07:00)03:11:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: primary DNS address 205.171.3.25
(GMT-07:00)03:11:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: secondary DNS address 205.171.2.25
(GMT-07:00)03:11:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 logic: cmd1=/usr/bin/wrapntp clock.isc.org ntp0.nl.net ntp.actiontec.com time-nw.nist.gov pool.ntp.org &
(GMT-07:00)03:11:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 syslog: config.name_server[0]=205.171.3.25
(GMT-07:00)03:11:27 Sat Jul 25 2009 logic: got wan ip launch stunnel
(GMT-07:00)03:11:27 Sat Jul 25 2009 logic: launch stunnel 1, 0
(GMT-07:00)03:14:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: No response to 4 echo-requests
(GMT-07:00)03:14:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Serial link appears to be disconnected.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: MRU: 1500
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Connection terminated.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Connect time 3.1 minutes.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Sent 39226 bytes, received 27639 bytes.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Doing disconnect
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Exit.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: Plugin pppoe loaded.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: PPPoE Plugin Initialized
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: Plugin pppoe called.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: pppd 2.4.1 started by admin, uid 0
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: setting line discipline hook
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: Sending PADI
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: HOST_UNIQ successful match
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: HOST_UNIQ successful match
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: Got connection: 1846
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: Saved Session ID: 0
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: Connecting PPPoE socket: 00:1e:4a:75:29:48 1846 br0 0x1000d538
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: Using interface ppp0
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: Connect: ppp0 -> br0
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: MRU: 1500
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 syslog: DNS request timeout, server: 205.171.3.25.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read start 192.168.1.2
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read end 192.168.1.254
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read interface br0
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read opt router 192.168.1.1
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read opt domain domain.actdsltmp
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read opt dns 192.168.1.1 205.171.3.25
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read opt subnet 255.255.255.0
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read opt lease 86400
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read conflict_time 86400
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: read lease_file /var/tmp/landhcps0.leases
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: local IP address xx.xxx.xxx.xxx
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: remote IP address 67.42.184.210
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: primary DNS address 205.171.3.25
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: secondary DNS address 205.171.2.25
(GMT-07:00)03:14:36 Sat Jul 25 2009 syslog: config.name_server[0]=205.171.3.25
(GMT-07:00)03:14:38 Sat Jul 25 2009 logic: cmd1=/usr/bin/wrapntp clock.isc.org ntp0.nl.net ntp.actiontec.com time-nw.nist.gov pool.ntp.org &
(GMT-07:00)03:14:41 Sat Jul 25 2009 logic: got wan ip launch stunnel
(GMT-07:00)03:14:41 Sat Jul 25 2009 logic: launch stunnel 1, 0

(GMT-07:00)03:14:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: No response to 4 echo-requests
(GMT-07:00)03:14:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Serial link appears to be disconnected.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:24 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: MRU: 1500
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Connection terminated.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Connect time 3.1 minutes.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Sent 39226 bytes, received 27639 bytes.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Doing disconnect
(GMT-07:00)03:14:30 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12009]: Exit.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: Plugin pppoe loaded.
(GMT-07:00)03:14:34 Sat Jul 25 2009 pppd[12403]: PPPoE Plugin Initialized

It looks like the your modem sent out some keep alives, got no response, so it initiated a new PPP session. There is nothing to indicate you recieved a termination packet from the ISP. This suggests that something other than PPP terminated the PPP session, since the purpose of PPP is to create, manage and tear down sessions. Usually some layer 1 event happens, so the LCP disappears and the PPP is unable to terminate gracefully. That is the purpose of the keep alives. Same thing with the tomato: "LCP appears to be disconnected": it sent out some packets and got no response from the ISP, so as far as it knows, layer 2 is gone.

I dont think you can assume that no equipment changed. Did they tell you you are on the same pair/same port, and just the ISP account was rebuilt? I would find out exactly what changed, so you can eventually work thru and swap out the changed parts (and by parts I mean physical and account configurations)

I know nothing physically changed from the demarcation point to anywhere within my home. I only have one pair on a Cat5 connected to Line 1 in the demarc so pairs could not have changed.

They could have changed something else within the telco but every call I have made indicated only my PPP credentials changed to the new account.

I understand what you are saying about the keep alive, but why would it not respond to a keep alive? I had run in the same physical configuration for a year non stop without an IP change or disconnection. Starting the day I switched to the new DSL account I started getting these disconnects. I can't imagine responding to a keep alive would be specific to an account, could it?

Since posting this I had another disconnection. I plan to call QWest tech support again and see if I can get someone other than Tier 1.

Scott

The ISP might not respond to the keep alive because it never gets the keep alive

I've read other posts on non qwest forums where the modem remains trained (bridge mode) but the users router keeps creating new PPP sessions..... turns out it was the modem causing the problem, their was no data thruput.

So since your modem is the same, perhaps the port you are training to is different now, and for some reason you remain synched up, but their is no data thru put, your keep alives die at the dslam.

The way I understand it, if the ISP was terminating the PPP session for anyreason, it would send a terminating packet, so its hard to see this as a PPP issue, and easy to see this "a layer underneath PPP prevented the PPP communication" issue.

Nevertheless, if they are certain that the only thing that changed was the ISP account, then they need to tear that down and build another one (and make sure your old account isnt still in their system) . I would ask them nicely,,,, "how do you know the port is the same"

What do you mean by port?

The modem at the dslam that syncs with your modem

I will ask about that. I'm typically pretty knowledgable on networking stuff, but how DSL works isn't something I know much about yet. Thanks for helping!

I'll post back when I get more details from QWest tomorrow.

Scott

QWest tech support ran a bunch of tests today that spanned nearly an hour. They couldn't find anything wrong so they are sending me a new DSL router. I doubt that's the problem but it isn't a bad thing to try either so I'll give it a go. I will post back the results once I have the new DSL router in place.

Cheers,
Scott

Hey Scott, this is Brian with Qwest. I ran across your posts here, and I'm sorry that you've had so much trouble with your DSL being intermittent, but I am glad to hear that we're sending you a new modem. Hopefully this will fix this issue.

However, if it doesn't, and you need more help, send me an e-mail to TalkToUs@Qwest.com. I will do more to help resolve this for you, if the new modem doesn't work.

Thanks Scott,

B
Consumer Affairs Manager
Qwest Communications
www.socialmedia.qwest.com

Thanks Brian!

I'll be sure to contact you regardless. If it works I'll let you know it solved the problem, and if it doesn't I'll contact you to see if there is another solution to this.

I'll also post back to the forum as well.

Scott

This is crazy. Since the test I have been running non stop without a disconnect. Is it possible the test somehow flushed the settings for my account on the DSLAM?

I have the new DSL router from QWest but I'm going to let this run for a while longer to see if it continues uninterrupted.

Scott

If they spent an hour they probably rebooted the modem on their end

I just hit one week of continuous uptime with my Tomato router handling the PPP. Sweet. This problem is solved!

It turns out the problem is not solved. I don't know what happened but after a full 10 days of up time I'm back to the same problem again. I swear someone at the local QWest office is dinking around with things and doesn't understand the side affects. It appears the cycle is now around 72 hours per disconnect. Since it was always happening in mid day during primary work hours when we need our connection to not disconnect the most (our work applications crash when this happens) I did a manual disconnect in the middle of the night. Now three days later it disconnected in the middle of the night. If I can continually persuade the DSL disconnect to happen in the middle of the night I'll write a little script on my router to drop the connection at 3am every night and I'll be happy enough.

However, QWest really needs to figure this out. I have seen this posted on several forums. I had contacted Brian but he hasn't responded.

I doubt anyone can help other than someone that at QWest. I have confirmed repeatedly this is a problem within QWest and not my environment at home.

I'm updating this post since this morning to clear up some bad typos and language mistakes. Since then my DSL has dropped 4 more times in a short burst a couple of hours ago. I will try QWest once more, and if it doesn't work out I am dropping them because it is always happening during working hours and it is killing our work applications. If we cannot work, it's worth paying the $10/mo more for Cable if Cable is reliable.

Scott

Scott:
Same here. Went for about 6 days without a disconnect and have now been getting disconnects for the last 2 evenings. These disconnect problems are documented all over the Internet and Qwest forums! Keep up the good work and post all over the place to get some attention!

We should get together to see if it is happening at the same times for all of us. I wonder if it's regional, per DSLAM, per CO, per account?

Where have you seen the most chatting about this issue so I can head over there to compare notes?

Cheers,
Scott

Hey Scott, this is Brian with Qwest again. Dang, I'm sorry this issue is still ongoing for you. Can I help with anything? I have several DSL tech support specialists that are great with assisting our customer's with complex issues. Just let me know. E-mail at TalkToUs@Qwest.com if I can help.

Thanks Scott,

B
Consumer Affairs Manager
Qwest Communications
www.socialmedia.qwest.com

I am so glad i found others like me with this same issue. And i mean the exact same issue you described it perfectly Scott. I have tried so many things, i have even had the DSL tech come out and re patch me into a different port on the switch and have the account re trained with no luck. The best i can get is after they flush my account it seemed to work for almost a week and then the issue started over again. I Have tired it all ways with 2 different modems the 701G and the M1000 both stand alone and both transparently bridged with two both DD-WRT and Tomato. Have you guys been heard of anything else , currently i am tired of calling the tech support and am seriously considering Comcast or even Whispertel. Dial up is almost better than the constant disconnects i have been receiving. - Casey

Yesterday I worked with the technician Brian at QWest suggested. The tech's name is Doug and he's part of the escalation team. Doug did some tests and checked things out. He read this thread to get up to speed. He said he'd need to work with tier 3 to figure this one out because everything looked right, but he seemed to have some theories to chase down.

This may be unrelated but I had another QWest oddity yesterday. I just learned that I have two DSL accounts with QWest. Long story why I'm just finding out about it now so I won't go into that. I will take care of that on Monday to shut down the second account. The reason I mention this is that I am using my second account (the one I shouldn't have) for my PPPoE. I wonder if this could be related? Could the port on the DSLAM be specific to the account? If so, that could be the problem. I will be calling QWest Monday morning to shut down the second account and to get the PPPoE credentials for the account I should be using.

I will be sure to continue posting updates to this thread until I get this resolved. I know there are others out there having the same issue and I want to ensure there is a good write up to be found.

Scott

I'm just going to suggest that you double check phones for filters. Only because I had this problem with someone stealthily connecting a fax machine without filters without my knowing speeds still worked fine but when we would get a phone call we would get a disconnect. I'm on an m1000 also.

Scott, thanks for keeping us updated until they fix your connection so maybe we can get the same resolution. Just as a side note to your oddity i have had an old qwest account that was canceled before is singed up at my current address so hopefully there is not a problem with having two accounts in there system. Just thought it would be odd that we both had that happen to us. But i am going to keep posting on the qwest Twitter account until someone responds to me and addresses this problem for everyone involved. - Casey

Qwest Twitter = TalkToQwest

QWest has run several line tests and every time they are superb. I have zero CRC and any other type of error on the line. The logs point to an LCP problem, not a physical frame or error problem. Most importantly, I have disconnected every line in the demarc and ran a single Cat5 straight from the demarc to the DSL modem and nothing else is on it. I do not subscribe to QWest telephone service so there's no need to bother with the phone wires inside the home. I did this explicitly to maximize my line quality and to remove all doubt what is wrong in this situation.

I appreciate the suggestion, but I am 100% certain this is a problem outside of my home.

Cheers,
Scott

kcimpulse, I see that you are in Denver. I wonder if this could be a regional problem? According to Doug the QWest escalation tech Brian suggested, he'll be working with tier 3 today and running a bunch of other tests. I'll ask him if multiple accounts has potential to cause this. If the DSLAM or CO is configured for the account, it is possible since I am using the PPPoE credentials for an account I'm not supposed to be using, but is currently active. I don't really know how DSL technology works in the backend, so I could be misspeaking.

Scott

Scott, Hopefully you can get though and finally get a Tier 3 that is willing to help. I just hate how it works after they clear some settings but in a few days or hours it seems to start to disconnect again and again. Since i have been using tomato and i have been dissecting the logs i am getting LCP errors too. So hopefully they can figure out what is up with the DSLAM. And thanks again for keeping us all informed of the progress. Hopefully after they figure yours out i should be able to call and say excatly what i need done. And if you dont mind sharing what tier 3 person you are talking to that would be awsome if i can grab their number after you are done with them.

Thanks for this thread. I have been dealing with the same symptoms since the initial installation (at 20mbps) using the M1000 in late April. As often as a few times per day, but usually more like every day or two, the connection drops. It can always be restored by resetting or power cycling the modem. This must have been my tenth call to Qwest, this evening.

They have rolled trucks a couple of times. The first time, they confirmed that their readings were just the same with the modem outside the house as in, went over to the DSLAM, and then came back to tell me to be patient, as they were doing work over there that would take a couple of days. That work didn't seem to solve anything, which led to a second visit, but on that second trip they never got to my house. They had some sort of major screwup (their description) at the DSLAM during my appointment that had coincidentally killed most connections in my neighborhood, and when I called to find out where they were, they connected me by cell with a tech at the DSLAM who declared victory as soon as I had a working connection again.

None of that did anything for my connection stability problem. In July, they sent a replacement M1000, but if anything that one seems worse (when it drops, it usually needs to be power-cycled to get it back online). I put the old one back and called them again. They said they'd send another replacement.

I called tonight (a week later) to find out where the replacement was, and got some very strange advice. I am told that I must inquire via about the absent modem with their business office during the day. The supervisor I spoke with says the delay may be because they are sending me a Motorola 3347. According to that supervisor, this is the only modem they support that can handle 20mbps.

The best trained rate I've seen on the M1000 is a little under 19mbps down. It had degraded to about 14mbps this evening, until (at the Qwest supervisors' request) I power cycled it and it came back up to over 18. I have never tested at more than 16mbps down and 600kbps up, but until tonight, I've been consistently told this is normal. I'm past caring about the speed, but will certainly share any other information I get about the disconnects.

Exactly! They run some tests which seems to flush some settings. Things are great for a while, and then blamo, it's back to disconnecting regularly.

I have been working with Brian's escalation team which is tier 2. They quickly determined they needed to work with tier 3. Both have agreed that the problem is not physical. A tech came out today. I was at work but my wife was home. She didn't know where the modem was but pointed the tech to my network rack. She said he was a bit amazed by the sophistication of a home user. Anyway... he did a line test and confirmed everything is fine on the line.

The Tier 2 tech (Doug is his name) turned off a few things hoping they might help, even though they aren't related. He turned off interleaving which really helped my latency (went from 48ms to 9ms on speedtest.net) and turned off some sort of DNS update feature. Doug said my line stats are good enough that I don't need interleaving. So on the plus side, my ping times rock!

I had another disconnect at 10:45pm MDT last night. Still the same thing. I sent Doug another email hoping to come up with more ideas to try.

I'm going to put my ActionTec M1000 back into play as my router and pull Tomato out. That way I can say truly to QWest, "This is entirely your problem". I have even considered building a little weather proof box with power out by the demarc so I could put the M1000 out there to prove that nothing of mine is related to the issue. I think Doug believes me on this, but it is still crossing my mind to remove all doubt. The tech that came to the door suggested our computers.

I don't have anything new to report other than I am very actively engaging on this and I promise I'll provide even the slightest detail to update you with. It appears this thread is being found by others with the same problem. I'm glad for that because I searched high and low and couldn't find a thing.

Cheers,
Scott

dwinut,

How frequent are your disconnects? Mine are once a day to a couple of times a week. Every once in a while, it rapidly disconnects/reconnects several times but still is up and running automatically within a minute or so. The outtage is never very long, but is frustrating when using work applications from home that do not deal so well with the disconnection. Some take nearly 20 minutes until they are restarted and back up and running again.

Scott

Scott,
Good to see that they are trying to activly work on the issue. I two have gone to pure DSL Modem and not PPOE with my router to see if it fixes the problem but it still hasent. At its worst 2 weeks ago i had the modem up for 3 days straight with minimal usage and it was cutting out every 30 mins or so. But is seems with high usage it sometimes gets down to every 15 mins and usally reconnects within 30 seconds but the hickups in downloads or video streaming are almost unbearable. Currenly it will work fine for a few hour but it seems at peak time 5 - 1 pm or so it will drop like every 15 mins or so. So i think i might be on a overloaded DSLAM. Also i am only on the 7 MB but they are upgrading the area to the 15 and 20 MB speeds soon. Its funny that it looks like we are in the same boat when dealing with their support analists because they have noted on my file that i used to do home installs for GeekSquad and that i am CCNA Certified so they dont bother asking me if i have any other phones or DSl Filter issues when i call the first thing i saw is please read my previous tickets. Quick question for you though is the interleaving and DNS update features where did he turn those off? Maybe i will have to go though the settings. Also i have been dreading to bring this up but are you an avid P2P downloaded? Im just worried that i might be flooding the system with to many requests and packets that might be causing the issue for my self. But this is why i use DSL instead of cable because of the none Caps and the steady constant upload and download. Just thought i would though that out there.

I do not do any P2P of any kind at all. I avoid that stuff. Too much chance for legal problems. Plus, if I actually care I'll buy it, but after the big RIAA uprising against Napster, I just stopped carrying about all types of media. So to answer your question, "no" I don't really use my connection for anything heavy duty at all.

I have what they call a home run. I don't need DSL filters because I made sure it's only my DSL modem, and the demarcation point. Nothing else is involved and all other wires have been disconnected in the demarc.

I just had another disconnect a couple of minutes ago. I wasn't doing anything on the computer (crying baby to deal with this afternoon). My disconnects are not related to usage at all. Many times they happen in the middle of the night when we're sleeping. If they always did I wouldn't care.

I haven't received any response from Doug. I wonder if I flooded him with too much, or if it's time to throw in the towel on a single user?

I haven't switched to the M1000 handling the PPPoE yet (e.g. crying baby) but I hope to this evening. I have in the past when I first started digging into this problem. It didn't change anything but at least I can say without a doubt that the problem isn't on my end. So that's why I'm going to switch back to that configuration.

Scott

Almost all my downloads from P2P is using it for opensource programs and over the air tv shows which are fair use, but i do it because its faster that a DVR for tv shows. Yea and i dont have a Home Run Install But i might as well but since im in a condo its a bit harder. But they know it isnt anything inside my house either because 2 weeks ago when the Tech was out he couldn't get it to work with his DSL modem at the switch at the street. I did just hopefully call my ace in the deck to hopefully get us a Tier 3 Person to look into this issue for us. Since i work for Corp Best Buy / Geek Squad i deal with Qwest Reps that work out of the Denver Offices. So she is going to figure out who can contact me tomorrow. And if i get any response i will forward them onto you. Good Luck with the Crying Baby... - Casey