Many AT&T Employees Working Without Contracts > Is It Really That Bad?

reply to Homer J

Re: Is It Really That Bad?

So only union workers are allowed enough time to get their job done properly. I find that difficult to believe.
Allowing someone the time to do their job properly is just good business sense. If the job is done right the first time, it does not need to be done again. That is not a solely union idea.
So you were there when the foreman told them to do the job in a set amount of time, which was unreasoable, or is that what the union told you to think.
Quality work is qua
lity work whether the worker is union or non-union. A union worker doing a job does not guarantee the job will be done with any better quality than a non-union countrpart.
Using non-union people to do work does not mean you have to accept substandard work. If a contractor is providing substandard work, they will not survive long in business.
I have trade experience and have relatives who are retired and current union memebers. They tell many stories of lazy workers who are protected by the union. They often had to clean up their mess or had to work harder to make up for the other workers laziness. The lazy workers had no reason to do better as the union protected them. They were paid the same money for inferior work because the union said that was the way it should be. In the union mind people should all be paid the same for the same job, no matter how well or poorly they perform the job.

While I'm sure *your relatives* are a reasonably large and randomized sampling of their industries at large, I do believe you should reassess your initial conclusions.

Lazy people exist everywhere. Union or non-union. The point bogey is trying to make is that non-union workers have extra pressure to do a certain amount of work in a certain amount of time. As long as they can do a barely good enough job to avoid customer complaints they will complete the work as quickly and as substandardly as possible *to keep their job*.

reply to bogey780
In my experience in the Carpenters union, I was paid to do a job. the contractor paid my union wages and benefits. If I didn't do the job in the time the foreman figured it should be done I would get a pink slip on Friday with a "we don't need you anymore" end of discussion. I happened to be very good and worked journeyman level jobs as a 2nd year apprentice with a Journeyman to mentor me. By my third year I had a first year apprentice as my helper and we teamed up and made LOTS of money for the Contractor who didn't have to pay journeyman wages. Back then one would take pride in their work. Sadly there is little or no union carpentry being done in my area and the housing shows it! Wood butchering is what its called and I'm sure the same thing goes for Union telecom employees, There those who have pride and are really good and there are lazy shiftless bums who rely on unions to protect their sorry ass from being fired for incompetent work. There are also great non-union telecom workers. Being union is no guarantee of pride and responsibility for ones work work nor is it a indicator of quality. The bigger issue is the idea that life owes you a living and you should have everything you want and not have to work for it and two, the companies have no respect for those they employ and they are treated as throw away commodities!

Carpenters' unions are a different story than many.
--
Ali Fazel
i2Telecom Representative

reply to sonicmerlin
I agree lazy people exist in union and non-union jobs. Non-union people are likely to be fired for being lazy though and not be paid as much as someone who is productive and hard working. A lazy person in a union is going to be protected by that union and paid the same as someone who works much harder and deserves to be paid better.
It seems what you are telling me is that union guys are allowed to do as much or as little work as they see fit. No matter how much work they could have done. Non-union guys are just going to do a barely passable job.
That's generalizing and certainly not true. It's just union propoganda. Non-union guy are just as capable of doing a job properly as a union guy. It's all individual and being union or non-union has no bearing.