| Not Totally Not totally their own network. They still depend on ATT's copper and depend on ATT leaving it in place. They'll be SOL if ATT ever went to full Fiber. |
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 davoice
join:2000-08-12
Saxapahaw, NC
 ·Comporium
| said by hottboiinnc:They'll be SOL if ATT ever went to full Fiber. ROFLOL. Yeah. Just like fat cat politicians and lobbyists will be SOL if we ever get transparency and accountability in our government. Like that will ever happen. |
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Reviews:
 ·WOW Internet and..
| ATT already has several cities that are already FTTH. It killed the Indie ISPs and all the CLECs in those areas. You can't offer DSL over Fiber it just doesn't work. ATT will kill them just watch and see. And after all ADSL2 limits their customer base by NOT being allowed access to the RTs.
Snoic will die and that will be the end. Instead of relying on DSL they should be building out in the form of Wireless and Fiber. Maybe servicing MDUs |
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patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1 | reply to davoice
said by davoice:said by hottboiinnc:They'll be SOL if ATT ever went to full Fiber. ROFLOL. Yeah. Just like fat cat politicians and lobbyists will be SOL if we ever get transparency and accountability in our government. Like that will ever happen. ATT can't collect USF subsidizes on Fiber, only on Copper. |
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iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 | reply to hottboiinnc
Where, en masse, has AT&T rolled out FTTH to the exclusion of copper? U-Verse doesn't count because in most of those areas you can still get copper-to-the-CO DSL. |
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 DaneJasperSonic.NetPremium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:7 | reply to hottboiinnc
said by hottboiinnc:Not totally their own network. They still depend on ATT's copper and depend on ATT leaving it in place. They'll be SOL if ATT ever went to full Fiber. We do not anticipate issues with availability of copper in the near future.
That said, clearly this (ADSL2+ over copper) is not the end-game.
The primary issue is that we have limited reach. Currently we are limiting availability at 11,100ft from COs, and this is just nowhere near complete coverage.
Also, there are inherent limits in copper. I'm sure we will continue to see some incremental gains using things like dynamic spectrum management for noise compensation, but DSL over copper doesn't hold a candle to what can be done with fiber.
That said, as a next step, in the areas where the product reaches, it's exciting stuff. We are serving many people today with 18Mbps/1Mbps services who's only other options are six to twelve megabits from other carriers. In a couple weeks we'll be boosting that to 30/2, then 30/4 in a month or two.
We also have reasonably priced static IP services and are happy to see customers hosting servers, and we've got no bandwidth caps.
All in all, it's a nice product set.
But yes, long term we've got to continue to deliver more, and we are working in that direction.
-Dane |
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| reply to iansltx
U-Verse is also FTTH. Monroe County Michigan was one of the FIRST cities that SBC under Ed was FULLY Rebuilt to FTTH. several other cities were done as well in WI and MI. |
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| reply to patcat88
they don't have to worry about that when they charge $9+ for CID and $8+ on Call Waiting. |
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 KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to hottboiinnc
The thing is, if given enough time to build a good foundation, Sonic.net won't NEED AT&T's copper. They'll be able to build out their own RT's and directly connect to customer's homes.
Problem is, they will have to grow to a certain point before such actions start making economic sense.
The more customers they can get off AT&T's equipment and onto their own network, the more profitable it is... but they need a solid enough base to support the initial infrastructure cost outlays.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1 | reply to hottboiinnc
said by hottboiinnc:they don't have to worry about that when they charge $9+ for CID and $8+ on Call Waiting. Its still money. There is no limits to making the dividend. |
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 caesarv
join:1999-08-02
Santa Rosa, CA
 ·AT&T U-Verse
·SONIC.NET
| reply to DaneJasper
Okay, you convinced me. I signed up for the 12/1Mb plan today since it is only $6 more than I am currently paying for 6Mb. You indicate that you may be boosting 18/1 to 30/2 or 30/4. Will the lower tier products also see a boost?
I really only need 1 static IP, but you only offer 8. Any ideas on what I can do with those remaining ones? And does anyone need an old Alcatel 1000...I see they are going for 99cents on eBay!
I am hoping you offer voice in the very near future, I really want to lose my existing ATT connection. |
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oxwich
join:2009-06-30
Santa Rosa, CA | If you need voice you can go with Vonage. I have Sonic Fusion and Vonage works fine with it. It's $24.99 for unlimited local and long distance. I use it for unlimited calls to Europe. You can also get voicemails sent as an email. Way better and cheaper than
At&T. |
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Reviews:
·WOW Internet and..
| reply to KrK
WHY USE COPPER? That's the question. Who in their right mind wants to still use copper telephone lines in 4years? The speed will still be what it is today. There is no changing that speed. Sonic is making a nice bed with copper and they'll feel that when it comes time. Instead of deploying something scalable like Wireless they decided to sink money in a hole that will never be anything but that.
Look at VZ, they realized what a blackhole copper is, ATT is starting to. But yet you have Indie ISPs that are FREE to build out here and just NOW are starting BUT STILL relaying on on the copper phone system.
Also Sonic recently bought a Wireless ISP, they have their website being redirected to Sonic.net but YET have to offer the service on their main site. Talk about a waste, yet they keep promoting their DSL services.  |
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DaneJasperSonic.NetPremium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:7 | reply to caesarv
said by caesarv:Okay, you convinced me. I signed up for the 12/1Mb plan today since it is only $6 more than I am currently paying for 6Mb. You indicate that you may be boosting 18/1 to 30/2 or 30/4. Will the lower tier products also see a boost? I really only need 1 static IP, but you only offer 8. Any ideas on what I can do with those remaining ones? And does anyone need an old Alcatel 1000...I see they are going for 99cents on eBay! I am hoping you offer voice in the very near future, I really want to lose my existing ATT connection. Thanks for joining up, hope you enjoy the service!
We will be offering POTS voice delivered on the Fusion dedicated pair in the future.
-Dane |
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DaneJasperSonic.NetPremium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:7 | reply to hottboiinnc
said by hottboiinnc:WHY USE COPPER? That's the question. Who in their right mind wants to still use copper telephone lines in 4years? The speed will still be what it is today. There is no changing that speed. Sonic is making a nice bed with copper and they'll feel that when it comes time. Instead of deploying something scalable like Wireless they decided to sink money in a hole that will never be anything but that. ...(trimmed) Also Sonic recently bought a Wireless ISP, they have their website being redirected to Sonic.net but YET have to offer the service on their main site. Talk about a waste, yet they keep promoting their DSL services. Delivery over copper in the last mile makes sense for us today because the copper is there, and there is new technology that allows us to drive it faster (ADSL2+, Annex M, and pair bonding.) Obviously this isn't the end-game, and I do believe it's inevitable that everyone will be served with fiber in the long run.
As for wireless, it doesn't have the speed to compete. Where we can deliver 30Mbps on copper, and 100+ on fiber, wireless point to multi-point is generally limited to around 5-10Mbps per customer. Also, it's a shared network, so there is a lot of congestion potential as adoption grows.
As for our West Sonoma County "PogoWave" wireless network and product, we haven't added links to our website because we're still working on some important changes to the product itself for speed and reliability, plus integrating signup processes and staff training. I do anticipate that this product will continue to serve rural West county residents with quality broadband in the 3Mbps and below speed range.
Due to the speed limitations in wireless, I'd always expect to see DSL and other directly connected products promoted where they are available. Along the same lines, note that terrestrial wireless (PogoWave, etc) will be preferred over our satellite broadband product due to speed, reliability and cost. All the products have a niche where they are best used.
-Dane |
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| So you claim DSL isn't shared as well?
But like i said before, you'll be screwed if ATT decides to pull that copper out. Your "new" DSL will be SOL along with your company....
DSL= death of all ISPs investing money in it STILL. |
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