[iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones in All Things Macintosh http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r22999133 en Wed, 10 Feb 2010 01:12:33 EDT Wed, 10 Feb 2010 01:12:33 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23096345 bbarrera :
said by bbarrera See Profile :

If end-user device lock-down matters, then why aren't you running Blackberry Enterprise Server, or creating a white-list of approved mobiles for use with Exchange 2007 SP1?
Or using RSA SecurID to stop Sprint Mobile Email and other OWA based workarounds to side-stepping the server security policy for mobile clients.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23096345 Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:12:08 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23093449 bbarrera : By the way, in my spare time I assist supporting an Exchange 2007 Server with 150 users. The biggest offenders of 'can't honor Exchange device encryption' policy are:
- owners of WinMo 5.x and 6.0 phones
- owners of Sprint phones, using Sprint's Mobile Email Services that grabs email from Outlook Web Access and forwards to the phone

The 2nd case exemplifies how opening up Outlook Web Access to Internet username/password login (w/o 2 factor auth) immediately allows a software app (like Sprint mobile email services) to talk directly with OWA, and broker email on behalf of a mobile phone, completely bypassing Exchange server mobile policies. To cut off those users, you'll need something like RSA SecureID to stop users hell-bent on sidestepping security policies.

iPhone users are the least of my worries, at least we've got a chance of remote wiping their devices.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23093449 Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:57:58 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23093402 bbarrera : While I understand your disappointment this is a problem that Microsoft created, to maintain backwards compatibility with Windows Mobile 5 and 6.0 devices (many of which can't be upgraded). When SP1 was rolled out I read Microsoft's release notes about the new ActiveSync policies, repeated here:
quote:
Exchange 2007 SP1 introduces new Exchange ActiveSync policy settings. The policy settings introduced in Exchange 2007 Service Pack 1 require Windows Mobile 6.1, or a later version, or other compatible mobile phone operating systems. Windows Mobile 6.0 and earlier versions only support the Exchange ActiveSync policy settings available in the original release (RTM) version of Exchange 2007. For more information about the additional Exchange ActiveSync policy settings, see New Client Access Features in Exchange 2007 SP1.


OK, its very clear that Microsoft allowed the servers to define a policy and for the mobiles to ignore it. Now go search the Exchange 2007 documentation and attempt to find as clear a statement as in the release notes for SP1. Good luck, what you'll find are high-level statements that sound like the device must obey the server policy. Does that mean that Microsoft lied about Exchange ActiveSync policies being mandatory?

Security is a complex process, and Exchange compatibility is a complex topic even in an all Microsoft world. There are still a lot of Exchange 2003 servers in the world, where enforcing device encryption is not possible. There are still millions of Windows Mobile 5.x and 6.0 mobile devices, where enforcing device encryption is not possible. And Exchange 2007 SP1 was in beta when Windows Mobile 6.0 was released, why didn't Microsoft ensure that WM 6.0 would be compatible with server security features they intended to rollout in 6 months?

Microsoft designed their server to allow syncing with older Windows Mobile devices. If you are so passionate about iPhone, how come you aren't ranting about the security hole perpetuated by Microsoft for backwards compatibility with older Windows Mobile devices?

By the way, at this time the new Palm Pre doesn't support device encryption policy setting on Exchange 2007 SP1:
»kb.palm.com/wps/portal/kb/na/pre···_en.html

If end-user device lock-down matters, then why aren't you running Blackberry Enterprise Server, or creating a white-list of approved mobiles for use with Exchange 2007 SP1?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23093402 Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:35:35 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23092074 anon : Do you work for a bank?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23092074 Sun, 27 Sep 2009 19:22:08 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23070861 anon : @philr5150

Thanks for the intellectual discussion and understanding at least some of my points. It's been a frustrating last couple of weeks.

Regards.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23070861 Wed, 23 Sep 2009 16:06:36 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23070853 anon : This will hopefully be my last post regarding this issue.

Again, I never expected the device to work under all circumstances from now and until the end of time. I understand that updates happen (both by Apple and other vendors like Microsoft) that may disable functionality for some and enhance it for others. I am also not saying that enforcing the additional layer of hardware security is a bad thing. Apple did not release a bug in 3.1 by plugging the security hole with hardware encryption, they fixed one. The only problem is that it wasn't a bug. A bug is unintentional. This was clearly a deliberate move. In addition, to this date they are still not informing potential 3G customers of the issue up front. Having verbage in the 3GS manual or expecting people to know about a press release burried somewhere on the Internet which acknowledges the issue does not help inform 3G customers of any shortcomings. The only people who really know about the issue are a few tech support people at Apple, Gizmodo, enGadget and the rest of us who got screwed. Not even the people at the Apple or AT&T stores are aware of it so they can't warn customers. I mean how long would it take to update their website to alert users who purchase an iPhone 3G and opt for the MS Exchange service that the 3G doesn't support hardware encryption???

I just got an email from Apple yesterday informing me about the 3.1 iPhone OS update and that if I haven't downloaded it yet, I should. How ironic is that? Guess what was noticably absent from the marketing email? If you said "any warning about blocking MS Exchange for iPhone 3G" then you guessed correctly! If Apple isn't trying to hide anything then why is there no mention of this in the email? Not even in the fine print!

Lastly, your comment about Apple never stating that the 3G would work on MS Exchange indefinitely is also missing the point. I am not saying that they ever claimed this. What I am saying is that it was not legitimately compatible with MS Exchange from day one but they deceived the public into thinking it was. There is a very, very big difference between Microsoft making an update to MS Exchange that breaks the iPhone ActiveSync support after the release of the iPhone 3G and Apple ignoring a security requirement from the get-go when they knew full well that the server required it. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23070853 Wed, 23 Sep 2009 16:06:29 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23057459 philr5150 : I think Godlikesme point is that Apple knew they were going to break that functionality for 3G but they let people buy it anyway for that purpose. He's saying - in his opinion - that constitutes fraud.

I always like to play Devil's Advocate, so I can see his point, but as I mentioned in my 2nd post you can't expect software/hardware to behave the same way forever when updates are being applied. All I can think of is really for Godlikesme to find someway of rolling back the update to a previous, working version. I'm sure on some iPhone modding sites there will be a tutorial on how to do it.

Also as I mentioned earlier, Apple never stated that the 3G would work indefinitely on Exchange... but the assumption is that it would... but you know what happens when you assume. C'est la vie. I can sympathise to a point, but dude, tell your boss to get you a 3GS :-)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23057459 Mon, 21 Sep 2009 09:51:43 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23047045 bbarrera : I totally disagree with you, and here is a quote from the Apple's "iPhone in Enterprise" PDF made available July 2008:
quote:
Exchange ActiveSync security policies
• Remote wipe
• Enforce password on device
• Minimum password length
• Require alphanumeric password
• Require complex password
• Inactivity time in minutes

There is no fraud, and Apple was upfront about the enterprise capabilities in the documentation made available to enterprises.

That information is in the 2-page iPhone_MS_Exchange.pdf and longer iPhone_Enterprise.pdf, and both were made available around the time iPhone 2.0 firmware launch (when Exchange compatibility was introduced). Go bark up Microsoft's tree over their weak protocol for policy enforcement on mobiles.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23047045 Fri, 18 Sep 2009 17:52:36 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23046599 anon : philr5150,

I agree with mostly everything you've written in your last post. I realize that I am living in a dream world by thinking I can beat Apple in court. Life is not a Disney movie.

I also realize that there are many other options for phones and I HATE AT&T as a provider -they are absolutely attrocious. In the end I may very well end up getting another phone but that wouldn't make what Apple did right.

I emphasize this specific issue over any other shortcoming on the iPhone to date because it was done deliberately to deceive consumers and arguing that no one forced me to update the iPhone OS software is like telling you not to update Windows or your antivirus definitions. When people buy hardware or software these days they expect that at some point in the product's lifetime at least one or more software updates will need to be applied. Granted there are always disclaimers about the risks involved and how the company assumes no reliability etc. but this case is different. In this case Apple falsified functionality when the 3G was initially released knowing it would ultimately deploy updated software that would effectively render the MS Exchange functionality useless when using the iPhone 3G in a secure corporate environment. For over a year (i.e. June 2008 through September of 2009) Apple continued to sell the 3G without providing any information to existing or potential customers that this was an issue. In my mind this constitutes fraud.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23046599 Fri, 18 Sep 2009 16:43:40 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23046485 anon : Agreed. My gripe is that I (along with anyone else who was also lied to by Apple) should be compensated fairly. I called them serveral times with my issue. I said I would even accept a refurbished iPhone 3GS since it wasn't like I hadn't benefitted from the use of my current iPhone 3G for the last 10 months. I tried to be as accomodating as possible -especially since I was the one that was "misled".

I put it to them very simply. I said that if they would have been forthcoming from the get-go and not "spoofed" the whole MS Exchange hardware encryption support I would have immediately known that the phone would not meet my needs with respect to the corporate email functionality and I would have promptly returned it within my 14 day window. I could have then opted for another phone or stuck with my existing one until a newer version of the iPhone launched that did support my needs. This was a chance for Apple to set things right with me. I didn't immediately jump up and yell lawsuit. I only started pursuing the idea after I exhausted ever other attempt at resolving the dispute.

You know how the entire ATM banking system has an agreed upon set of "guidelines" which all participating banks must adhere to (i.e. Plus, Star, Most etc.) and failing to adhere to those guidelines would result in the cards issued by those banks being refused access to the ATM network?

If Apple ran a bank you could probably expect something like this to happen...

Most people using an ATM card are under the impression that as long as no one knows their 4-digit pin their money is safe. Not with the "Apple Computer iDebitCard". With this wonderful piece of plastic the whole 4-digit pin is bogus and in reality if someone got a hold of your card they could have entered in any 4-digit combination and cleaned out your account.

Now in the case of a bank it didn't cost me anything to open up the account and I might have even received a free gift or $50. In addition there is no penalty for me closing the account. In the case of the iPhone however it cost me $300. Are you starting to catch my drift here?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23046485 Fri, 18 Sep 2009 16:42:54 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23045111 philr5150 : I'm an email admin and have been for 12 years. I've worked in just about every sector imaginable. Right now I'm in Pharmaceuticals. I totally understand corporate environments, both in the US and UK (I'm English and now living in the US).

My whole issue with you is the fact you think you can sue.

Let me ask, and answer some questions...
(First, I totally understand your point about SP1 Nov 07 and Apple, June 08 and their claim about something). But let me ask this...
When you bought it, did it work as advertised? "Yes"
Did anyone FORCE you to upgrade? "No"
Do/Did Apple claim it will forever work? "No"

On that basis, a lawsuit will fail dismally and Apple will laugh hard and long at you. I can be pretty certain that their lawyers get paid more than the one you hired.

I understand you're upset that something that worked now doesn't. But Apple NOT telling you that something MAY NOT work in the future is just bad communication, not a lie and not false selling.

As for turning off encryption, yes I understand for some people that's not an option, nor is forwarding email. I realise that. But you have never addressed the point many people, and myself, raised... why not just ditch it and get a Blackberry? Or a Nokia? Or a Palm? Do you continue to use the iPhone for other things? Does everything else work?

I have to ask this also - if you SO badly need work email on a handheld device, why doesn't your employer supply you with a device that will work? I'd never use my own device for work email, just out of principle. If I need to check work email outside of the office, I'll use an internet cafe and VPN. I'd suggest you ask your boss about the company providing you with something compatible. Hell, they may even get you a 3GS if you ask nice.

I know you feel slighted by Apple's behaviour and it's understandable to a point, but not so far as you genuinely thinking you can sue. That's just ridiculous, and you're letting your anger overshadow your better judgement. I'm sure in the back of your mind you can't seriously think you'll get anything from Apple.

Oh BTW - I personally HATE FaceBook and Twitter etc so please don't assume I'm a spotty teenager and mix me up with other spotty teenagers. I've got almost 20 years in the tech industry. I'm no PFY or a noob.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23045111 Fri, 18 Sep 2009 12:05:21 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23044259 ptrowski : godlikesme, if that is the case then your option would be to upgrade to the 3GS or another handset.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23044259 Fri, 18 Sep 2009 09:41:55 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23044172 anon : With all do respect, I can tell by your post that you don't exactly know what it's like to work in a real corporate environment. I work for a goverment contractor. Our clients include agencies like the FBI, DHS, DOJ etc. All of our email communication must be secure. My team all has security clearance and I would get fired and possibly sent to prison if I forwarded my work email to a gmail account. Not everyone lives in a world of "Facebook and Twitter". Some of us do important things that really matter.

Another thing, and for the last freaking time...

IT IS NOT ACCEPTABLE TO EXPECT COMPANIES TO TURN OFF ENCRYPTION!!!

Having my company relax their security settings is not an option and shouldn't have to be! Why is that so difficult for you to understand? Apple marketed a product as being compatible with MS Exchange "touting" their ability to run with the likes of RIM in the corporate market and it looks like they were a bit too early coming out of the gate. They need to own up to it just like Microsoft did with all of the failed Xbox 360 red-ring-of-death issues.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23044172 Fri, 18 Sep 2009 09:36:12 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23042423 Daemon : Well, for one, apps and app data would also have to be encrypted. Companies could create custom apps using proprietary information in the interface, and many already existing apps just act as containers for data (see Air Sharing, e.g.).

Photos also need to be encrypted, or at least have the option to do so. Lots of health patient data can be stored in visual form.
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23042423 Thu, 17 Sep 2009 21:28:18 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23042218 rradina :
said by Matt See Profile :

... This is not HTTPS encryption which is relatively minuscule...
Why isn't it like HTTPS encryption? How much encryption is bloody needed? And why does EVERYTHING on the flash have to be encrypted? To comply with the ActiveSync policy, what more than the e-mail, contacts and attachments would be encrypted? How hard can it be to retrieve 20 e-mail messages, encrypt them and store them on the flash? The titles and contacts could be cached in memory and kept unencrypted for fast searching. When a message is opened, it's decrypted. Attachments might be a bit more challenging but the only thing I see is a bit slower experience and the potential for some significant battery drain. Who bloody cares about the battery? I'd rather experience a bit of a slow down and not lose my e-mail capabilities.

I just don't buy into why this isn't technically feasible. The only thing that would make it a non-starter is if ActiveSync encryption requires 1024-bit encryption or something else that would take a thousand years to crack. I've read 128-bit SSL would take 10 years to crack using a brute force method. If true, unless you work for the CIA, 128-bit SSL should be sufficient to keep corporate e-mail safe for the next several years until the current iPhone models outlive their useful life. And if SSL is part of Safari on the iPhone, it seems completely PLAUSIBLE that pre-3GS iPhones could encrypt and decrypt the e-mail and contact store without major performance or battery-life issues.

This smells fishy to me.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23042218 Thu, 17 Sep 2009 20:54:05 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23040506 philr5150 : @godslikeme...

Dude. I've been reading your posts across various forums. I can somewhat understand your frustration about being led to believe the phone did something it apparently doesn't do, but seriously...

A lawsuit? ARE YOU KIDDING???

Tell your Exchange Admin to turn off the policy setting to require encryption. Job done.

Or, sell your phone on Craigslist and buy a Blackberry. Job done. That's cheaper than a lawsuit.

You think Apple will give you money because you can't get your email?

How about having your work mail forwarded to Gmail and access it there?

You have got no grounds for a lawsuit, it's frivolous at best. So what, you can't get your work email on your phone. Too bad. If your company switch to Lotus Notes, or Sendmail, or move to some other system, will you blame Apple then too?

You can't get your own way, so you sue. It's (re)actions like this that give America the "ambulance chaser" and "screw everyone for cash" labels the rest of the world think about you/us. Sorry to say it, but it's true. Just accept the fact that your toy has been taken away and now you need to decide whether to deal with it, or just get a new toy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23040506 Thu, 17 Sep 2009 16:07:01 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23039316 Matt : Good luck with your lawsuit.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23039316 Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:46:43 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23039238 anon : Here is the link to the original Exchange Server 2007 SP1 download page.

»www.microsoft.com/downloads/deta···ylang=en]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23039238 Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:45:14 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23039225 anon : Just thought you guys might be interested in knowning that MS Exchange Server 2007 SP1 was not released in May 2008 but in November 2007 which was a full 8 months prior to the release of the original iPhone 3G. That gave Apple MORE than enough time to test compatibility with MS Exchange 2007 SP1. This is TOTALLY Apple's fault and I have already contacted an attorney to start preliminary discussions about a possible class action lawsuit. If anyone else is interested in filing please let me know and I will start a listserv.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23039225 Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:44:38 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23035124 Matt :
said by ChiefTom :

Matt,

Thanks forthe referance links.

In the first referance in the middle of the page is the following

Require Device Encryption
This setting specifies whether device encryption is required. If set to $true, the device must be able to support and implement encryption to synchronize with the server.

This means to me that unless the device has can support encryption, it can not synchronize.

It has been this way since mid 2008.

If Encryption was required, why was the device able to sync when this policy say no.
Because the iPhone's version of Activesync had no idea about that requirement. The requirement wasn't introduced until Exchange 2007 SP1, so the iPhone (or any other device) would have to run a version of Activesync updated or released after the release of SP1 to honor it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23035124 Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:53:32 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23034925 Gmud : As a user, not an admin, is there an easy way I can check whether or not my Exchange server requires encryption before I choose to upgrade to 3.1? Of course this won't help me if there is a policy change in the future...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23034925 Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:11:17 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23034711 bbarrera :
said by ChiefTom :

This means to me that unless the device has can support encryption, it can not synchronize.
It doesn't matter what it means to you, it matters how Microsoft designed the Exchange ActiveSync protocol. One of the protocol's weak links is that mobile devices can ignore policies set on the server, full stop.

That means older Windows Mobile devices may connect to Exchange 2007 SP1 servers and ignore the policy settings.
»technet.microsoft.com/en-us/libr···129.aspx

It means Nokia, Palm, Apple and anyone else that has licensed Exchange ActiveSync can pick and choose which policies are enforced on the device. It means that if you want to limit access and control the security policies, the Exchange ActiveSync protocol will force you down another path to gain control over the mobile device.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23034711 Wed, 16 Sep 2009 16:36:05 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23034235 anon : Matt,

Thanks forthe referance links.

In the first referance in the middle of the page is the following

Require Device Encryption
This setting specifies whether device encryption is required. If set to $true, the device must be able to support and implement encryption to synchronize with the server.

This means to me that unless the device has can support encryption, it can not synchronize.

It has been this way since mid 2008.

If Encryption was required, why was the device able to sync when this policy say no.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23034235 Wed, 16 Sep 2009 15:58:50 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23034017 wingrider01 :
said by bbarrera See Profile :

Yeah I got a good chuckle from that comment too, if there is one thing Microsoft does well its Exchange.

I'm curious about your Outlook Web Access comment, do you allow any device to connect to OWA? If so how do you reconcile the 'no encryption no support' comment (which I could parse one of two ways)?
RSA key required for logon to complete]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23034017 Wed, 16 Sep 2009 14:45:47 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23031832 Matt : Chief, I don't think you understand how Activesync policies work. The policy is sent to the device, but it's completely up to the device whether to honor and apply those settings or not. If anything is communicated back, it's simply that the policy was received successfully. The iPhone hasn't been "lying" to the Exchange server in any way, which is why people are in an uproar.

»technet.microsoft.com/en-us/libr···84.aspx#
»msexchangeteam.com/archive/2007/···551.aspx

Note the requirement that for all those policies to be applied, the device must support Activesync 12.1. If the device doesn't support a 12.1 requirement that it doesn't know about (as is the case with the iPhone) it continues to function but it just ignores that policy setting. My guess is that Windows Mobile 5 devices also continue to function normally yet don't support encryption or any of the new Activesync 12.1 policies either.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23031832 Wed, 16 Sep 2009 09:44:34 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23029864 anon :
said by Matt See ProfileNo, it wasn't reporting anything to the Exchange server. It simply ignored the policy setting sent to it by Exchange.[/bquote :

That is not what was happening but, even if it was, that makes it ok????

The Data Owner says don't connect unless you have Hardware encryption and Apple ignored the data owners requirement.

That is still a LawSuit.

Hea, how about you send me your credit card number... Its ok, I promise to encrypt it so no one can get it if my computer is stolen.

The data exchange between the Exchange Server and the iPhone went like this...

iPhone: I have a user that wants to log in.
Exchange says: Do you have hardware encryption?
iPhone says: Yes (I really don't but I am say yes anyway)
Exchange says: ok, give me the user's credentials...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23029864 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 21:43:19 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23028304 Matt :
said by ChiefTom :

said by Matt See Profile :

Exchange 2007 SP1 was released in May of 2008, you bought your iPhone 3G in November of 2008. It is not Apple's fault you didn't research this issue before buying one.
What you seem to be failing to realize here is that prior to the 3.1 patch your iPhone was reporting to Exchange that id had Hardware Encryption when it did not. In other words, it was lying! It was tricking Exchange so it would allow data the data owner had decided needed to be encrypted at rest to be downloaded and stored without hardware encryption.

That my friend IS cause for a Lawsuit.
No, it wasn't reporting anything to the Exchange server. It simply ignored the policy setting sent to it by Exchange.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23028304 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 16:50:44 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23028293 avd706 :
said by ChiefTom :

said by Matt See Profile :

Exchange 2007 SP1 was released in May of 2008, you bought your iPhone 3G in November of 2008. It is not Apple's fault you didn't research this issue before buying one.
What you seem to be failing to realize here is that prior to the 3.1 patch your iPhone was reporting to Exchange that id had Hardware Encryption when it did not. In other words, it was lying! It was tricking Exchange so it would allow data the data owner had decided needed to be encrypted at rest to be downloaded and stored without hardware encryption.

That my friend IS cause for a Lawsuit.
How you figure?
--
standard disclaimers apply.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23028293 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 16:49:16 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23028218 anon :
said by Matt See Profile :

Exchange 2007 SP1 was released in May of 2008, you bought your iPhone 3G in November of 2008. It is not Apple's fault you didn't research this issue before buying one.
What you seem to be failing to realize here is that prior to the 3.1 patch your iPhone was reporting to Exchange that id had Hardware Encryption when it did not. In other words, it was lying! It was tricking Exchange so it would allow data the data owner had decided needed to be encrypted at rest to be downloaded and stored without hardware encryption.

That my friend IS cause for a Lawsuit.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23028218 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 16:46:50 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23027223 avd706 : I'm almost sure that my winmobile device is getting corporate emails through some sort of parsing of OWA.
--
standard disclaimers apply.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23027223 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 13:43:18 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026659 bbarrera :
said by wingrider01 See Profile :

said by itguy05 See Profile :

quote:
Shouldn't the server know its on an encrypted connection?


Yes but you are talking about crappy MS software (Exchange) here and like with all things Microsoft, it's neither reliable nor stable.
/rofl so speaks one that has not used Exchange 2007 in a large environment
Yeah I got a good chuckle from that comment too, if there is one thing Microsoft does well its Exchange.

I'm curious about your Outlook Web Access comment, do you allow any device to connect to OWA? If so how do you reconcile the 'no encryption no support' comment (which I could parse one of two ways)?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026659 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 11:59:46 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026373 Matt :
said by rradina See Profile :

Does anyone know why you have to have a "hardware encryption chip" to encrypt e-mail on the iPhone? I understand that asking the general purpose CPU to perform this task may cost battery life and performance but isn't it possible to offer this to pre 3GS users and still adhere to the Exchange policy?

The iPhone supports HTTPS which is at least 128-bit encryption. Are there requirements from Exchange that specify it has to be something only a hardware encryption chip can perform?

This seems senseless on Apples part for not being able to perform software encryption of the e-mail. Perhaps I'm just twisting in the wind because I don't understand the complexities but it just seems like the hardware chip would enable the 3GS to perform faster and use less battery life when working with encrypted e-mail. Great -- that's part of the allure of a 3GS, it's faster. This doesn't mean pre 3GS users have to get locked out of Exchange. Surely some form of minimal and efficient software encryption can be performed on pre-3G phones that adequately protects corporate e-mail.
This is encryption of all the data on the internal flash, which would require it to be encrypted and decrypted on the fly, for every single read/write. This is not HTTPS encryption which is relatively minuscule. That is likely too taxing for the hardware in the pre-3GS models as just running the OS software, they pause and stutter.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026373 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:59:35 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026302 wingrider01 :
said by itguy05 See Profile :

quote:
Shouldn't the server know its on an encrypted connection?


Yes but you are talking about crappy MS software (Exchange) here and like with all things Microsoft, it's neither reliable nor stable.
/rofl so speaks one that has not used Exchange 2007 in a large environment]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026302 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:45:25 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026286 wingrider01 :
said by Daemon See Profile :

said by Youngjm See Profile :

Some industries such as Health Care require mobile devices to be encrypted. This just fixes that setting so that admins be assured of compliance with outside agencies.

IMHO.
I work at a health care research institution. Even though none of our lab members ever handle patient data, we still have to be trained and aware of HIPAA rules, and ensure that HIPAA-protected data does not end up on our machines, because we are not following the more strict set of protection standards.

It's been several days since we last heard from our exchange server administrators. I suspect they are weighing HIPAA against the complaints of a thousand or more faculty and students grousing they no longer have exchange connections. (They haven't disabled the required encryption policy yet)
SysAdmin at a CRO - easy response here for us, no encryption, no support. That is IF we allowed personally owned items to connect

Add to the fact that we do not permit ANY personally owned equipment, be it cell phones, laptops, personal computers access to the network outside of Outlook Web Access.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026286 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:42:38 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026264 rradina : Does anyone know why you have to have a "hardware encryption chip" to encrypt e-mail on the iPhone? I understand that asking the general purpose CPU to perform this task may cost battery life and performance but isn't it possible to offer this to pre 3GS users and still adhere to the Exchange policy?

The iPhone supports HTTPS which is at least 128-bit encryption. Are there requirements from Exchange that specify it has to be something only a hardware encryption chip can perform?

This seems senseless on Apples part for not being able to perform software encryption of the e-mail. Perhaps I'm just twisting in the wind because I don't understand the complexities but it just seems like the hardware chip would enable the 3GS to perform faster and use less battery life when working with encrypted e-mail. Great -- that's part of the allure of a 3GS, it's faster. This doesn't mean pre 3GS users have to get locked out of Exchange. Surely some form of minimal and efficient software encryption can be performed on pre-3G phones that adequately protects corporate e-mail.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23026264 Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:37:42 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23013704 MadDog3057 :
said by ssj4android See Profile :

Just curious, what about iPods? Do the new 32 and 64 GB support encryption while the rest don't?
And I do think it's stupid Apple isn't even giving people the option of using software encryption.
According to the deployment guide from Apple:

The Exchange policy to require device encryption (RequireDeviceEncryption) is supported on iPhone 3GS, and on iPod touch (Fall 2009 models with 32 GB or more). iPhone, iPhone 3G, and other iPod touch models do not support device encryption and will not connect to an Exchange Server that requires it.
--
"The only thing that’s worse than being blind is having sight but no vision."

"Nothing is impossible, you just don't have the technology or the knowledge to do it"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23013704 Sat, 12 Sep 2009 17:44:27 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23013117 ssj4android : Just curious, what about iPods? Do the new 32 and 64 GB support encryption while the rest don't?
And I do think it's stupid Apple isn't even giving people the option of using software encryption.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23013117 Sat, 12 Sep 2009 15:07:53 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23011355 Homunculus : They need to make a commercial about this with the "I'm a Mac" guy.
--
Islam is a hate crime: »www.thememriblog.org]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23011355 Sat, 12 Sep 2009 01:35:25 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23010737 smunro622 : after reading all the posts, both parties are to blame. Apple knew of this in exchange 07 when they BOUGHT MS TECHNOLOGY. Apple did not come up with this and MS did not tell them. Apple wanting to be a enterprise phone bought the licensing from microsoft after hearing customer complaints about this. THis goes back so saying 10.6 mail clients works with exchange it does on 07 and newer, so i move more of the blame to apple. This goes back to the first day someone asked about iphones it is not a enterprise phone/pda. This is why we stick with RIM. As other have pointed out apple has had some false pretenses on there devices. This will go on for weeks and weeks on how to fix it and who is to blame. The point being personal phones do not belong in a corp setting. If your company supplies them this is a different story, they will have to give up security or buy new phones most likely.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23010737 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 22:16:32 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23010569 itguy05 :
quote:
Shouldn't the server know its on an encrypted connection?


Yes but you are talking about crappy MS software (Exchange) here and like with all things Microsoft, it's neither reliable nor stable.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23010569 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 21:39:45 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23008944 Daemon :
said by avd706 See Profile :

The same guy in charge of MMS was in charge of encryption? Why cant the unit encrypt a folder or two with software?
The thinking is that the decryption routines are CPU intensive and would thus demolish what little battery life the phone has. The 3GS has a built in decryption chip.
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23008944 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 16:10:04 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23008052 avd706 :
said by Daemon See Profile :

said by avd706 See Profile :

Shouldn't the server know its on an encrypted connection?
Yes, but the feature we are talking about is not the connection between the server and the device when downloading emails (SSL), it's encrypting the data on the device after it's downloaded. It's so that in case the device is lost or stolen, someone can't remove the data storage chips/drive in the device and download all of the information on it, bypassing the password. If it's encrypted, they'll need the password or the data will just look like a garbled mess.

It's like encrypting your home directory on a mac.
The same guy in charge of MMS was in charge of encryption? Why cant the unit encrypt a folder or two with software?
--
standard disclaimers apply.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23008052 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 13:34:04 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007902 Daemon :
said by Youngjm See Profile :

Some industries such as Health Care require mobile devices to be encrypted. This just fixes that setting so that admins be assured of compliance with outside agencies.

IMHO.
I work at a health care research institution. Even though none of our lab members ever handle patient data, we still have to be trained and aware of HIPAA rules, and ensure that HIPAA-protected data does not end up on our machines, because we are not following the more strict set of protection standards.

It's been several days since we last heard from our exchange server administrators. I suspect they are weighing HIPAA against the complaints of a thousand or more faculty and students grousing they no longer have exchange connections. (They haven't disabled the required encryption policy yet)
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007902 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 13:10:57 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007883 Youngjm : Some industries such as Health Care require mobile devices to be encrypted. This just fixes that setting so that admins be assured of compliance with outside agencies.

IMHO.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007883 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 13:08:14 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007817 Daemon :
said by avd706 See Profile :

Shouldn't the server know its on an encrypted connection?
Yes, but the feature we are talking about is not the connection between the server and the device when downloading emails (SSL), it's encrypting the data on the device after it's downloaded. It's so that in case the device is lost or stolen, someone can't remove the data storage chips/drive in the device and download all of the information on it, bypassing the password. If it's encrypted, they'll need the password or the data will just look like a garbled mess.

It's like encrypting your home directory on a mac.
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007817 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 12:58:22 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007784 avd706 :
said by Daemon See Profile :

said by avd706 See Profile :

Shouldn't this be enforced on the server end and not the client end anyway? This is just poor design by Microsoft.
Aside from Microsoft issuing signed certificates to handset makers to include on ActiveSync devices, how would Microsoft enforce it on the server side? Devices could just claim to be encrypted. I suppose since ActiveSync already requires licensing, having a Microsoft-maintained 'whitelist' wouldn't cause too much grousing, but MS already takes a lot of flak for not being interoperable.
Shouldn't the server know its on an encrypted connection?
--
standard disclaimers apply.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007784 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 12:53:08 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007746 Daemon :
said by avd706 See Profile :

Shouldn't this be enforced on the server end and not the client end anyway? This is just poor design by Microsoft.
Aside from Microsoft issuing signed certificates to handset makers to include on ActiveSync devices, how would Microsoft enforce it on the server side? Devices could just claim to be encrypted. I suppose since ActiveSync already requires licensing, having a Microsoft-maintained 'whitelist' wouldn't cause too much grousing, but MS already takes a lot of flak for not being interoperable.
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007746 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 12:44:24 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007708 avd706 :
said by Daemon See Profile :

said by PhoenixDown See Profile :

However... if the IT group did allow it, and I saw the iphone supported exchange syncing (I'm sure I saw it for the 3G, not 100% about the original) -- I would've bought the phone on that assumption and been REALLY pissed if that functionality was taken away in an update like this.
Functionality wasn't taken away per se. Microsoft added a feature to the Exchange 2007 system. Apple then started supporting that feature, which is to prevent connections when the Exchange server forces encryption.

The 3G has NEVER supported encryption. Nothing was taken away.

It's a hell of a lot worse for Apple to just let 3Gs connect to the server anyway. Having a bunch of non-encrypted devices connected to an exchange server that is supposedly requiring encryption is a nightmare for IT managers and companies that have sensitive data in emails.
Shouldn't this be enforced on the server end and not the client end anyway? This is just poor design by Microsoft.
--
standard disclaimers apply.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007708 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 12:38:05 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007437 Daemon :
said by PhoenixDown See Profile :

However... if the IT group did allow it, and I saw the iphone supported exchange syncing (I'm sure I saw it for the 3G, not 100% about the original) -- I would've bought the phone on that assumption and been REALLY pissed if that functionality was taken away in an update like this.
Functionality wasn't taken away per se. Microsoft added a feature to the Exchange 2007 system. Apple then started supporting that feature, which is to prevent connections when the Exchange server forces encryption.

The 3G has NEVER supported encryption. Nothing was taken away.

It's a hell of a lot worse for Apple to just let 3Gs connect to the server anyway. Having a bunch of non-encrypted devices connected to an exchange server that is supposedly requiring encryption is a nightmare for IT managers and companies that have sensitive data in emails.
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007437 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 11:45:52 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007431 Matt :
said by PhoenixDown See Profile :

However... if the IT group did allow it, and I saw the iphone supported exchange syncing (I'm sure I saw it for the 3G, not 100% about the original) -- I would've bought the phone on that assumption and been REALLY pissed if that functionality was taken away in an update like this.
I would agree, but nothing was taken away per se, it simply never supported encryption. The 3.1 software now honors the Exchange Server Activesync setting that forces device encryption and since the pre-3GS models don't, it won't connect.

It still syncs with Exchange, just not if you disallow non-encrypted devices. I'm sure there are tons of Windows Mobile phones that don't support encryption either.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007431 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 11:44:38 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007352 PhoenixDown : When I was originally deciding between the original iphone and a blackberry -- one of the things I specifically looked into was whether or not I could use the device to view my email account at work.

It turns out that my companies IT group wont allow non-corporate owned phones to sync with the network so it didn't matter what device I bought anyway.

However... if the IT group did allow it, and I saw the iphone supported exchange syncing (I'm sure I saw it for the 3G, not 100% about the original) -- I would've bought the phone on that assumption and been REALLY pissed if that functionality was taken away in an update like this.

So I can get where some of the users are coming from. I guess one could say that the user should've checked into the encryption thing before buying but honestly, I would never have thought to even look for it. Nor would I have if I saw the sticker "syncs with exchange".
--
~ Insert a Funny Sig Here ~]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23007352 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 11:32:56 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23006529 dda :
said by godlikesme :

Asking the IT department of a major corporation or government agency to relax it's security settings for individual users would be like forcing TV stations to continue broadcasting in analog. (emphasis mine)
Since when is "asking" like "forcing"?

Apple says it works. It does work. It might not work the way an anonymous poster on DSLReports wants it to work but that's hardly the same as "not working."]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23006529 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 09:19:02 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23006339 avd706 :
said by bbarrera See Profile :

[
Secondly the Enterprise Deployment Guide provides a list of Exchange ActiveSync policies that are enforced on the device. Again, if EAS policy enforcement was vital then someone reviewed the document and quickly determined if the subset supported by Apple was sufficient. I see no 'crime' when Apple's enterprise deployment guide makes it clear what policy are enforced on the handset.
Explain this to me... isn't this what changed in the firmware update?

Anyway, how had is it to do soft encryption with these phones?
--
standard disclaimers apply.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23006339 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 08:32:26 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003828 bbarrera :
said by godlikesme :

I am not sure if you all read my first few posts but in case you didn't let me give you the gist of my argument.

I have no problem with the whole hardware encryption thing. Personally I think it should be a requirement for all corporations and government agencies. The beef I have with Apple is that they knowingly manufactured, marketed and sold a product that they knew was missing a vital feature
We can stop right there. Anyone that considers something as vital takes steps to test and validate, or rely on third parties to do the same. This is not just my opinion but one you'll read about in the enterprise magazines/ezines. These same magazines have done reviews of the iPhone and invariably the breadth of enterprise manageability is listed as a negative when compared to RIM and Blackberry.

Secondly the Enterprise Deployment Guide provides a list of Exchange ActiveSync policies that are enforced on the device. Again, if EAS policy enforcement was vital then someone reviewed the document and quickly determined if the subset supported by Apple was sufficient. I see no 'crime' when Apple's enterprise deployment guide makes it clear what policy are enforced on the handset.

Software has bugs, software is incomplete, and software is ever changing. If something is vital then best practices mandate that software updates on both the server and device side are tested for compatibility and assurance that critical requirements are still met. This is known by anyone that has vital or mission critical requirements. If it isn't known, then you've got the wrong people in charge and you pay the consequences.

You can't have it both ways, in this imperfect world you either take responsibility for guaranteeing compliance to vital/critical requirements or you pay someone else to do it. RIM has made a big business out of meeting the needs of enterprises, and Apple has never positioned the iPhone as

This whole issue is much ado about nothing. Sure there are some large companies that demand lock-down across laptops and mobiles however those same companies will not allow you to use your own laptop or cellphone.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003828 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 18:11:52 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003611 anon : From what I've read encryption could be done in software but it's a heavy CPU load and the impact on already marginal battery life would be unacceptable.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003611 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 17:59:20 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003658 Matt :
said by NOVA_Guy See Profile :

OK, so there is a difference there. Thanks for clearing that up.

Is there some way that encryption/decryption for this purpose can be done by software, or is it a hardware-only option? If hardware-only, then it's pretty hard to fault Apple. If not, then it still seems like a problem that Apple has the responsibility to fix.
That is a questions that I've been wondering about also.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003658 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 17:44:15 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003590 NOVA_Guy : OK, so there is a difference there. Thanks for clearing that up.

Is there some way that encryption/decryption for this purpose can be done by software, or is it a hardware-only option? If hardware-only, then it's pretty hard to fault Apple. If not, then it still seems like a problem that Apple has the responsibility to fix.
--
Obama lies. His public option forces people into paying more for less coverage, and provides government paid abortion and euthanization while denying treatment and coverage to many others. Read the fine print, it's worse than an cell phone contract.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003590 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 17:31:50 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003296 Daemon : We hit the front page of mac rumors. Well, not us specifically, but this issue:

»www.macrumors.com/2009/09/10/iph···devices/
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23003296 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 16:33:33 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002951 anon : I am pretty certain any versions prior to Exchange Server 2007 SP1 are OK. A buddy of mine at work has a 3G and just happens to have his email account stored on a server running MS Exchange 2007 without SP1 and he can get email just fine.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002951 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 15:41:51 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002937 anon : I am not sure if you all read my first few posts but in case you didn't let me give you the gist of my argument.

I have no problem with the whole hardware encryption thing. Personally I think it should be a requirement for all corporations and government agencies. The beef I have with Apple is that they knowingly manufactured, marketed and sold a product that they knew was missing a vital feature and deliberately ignored the MS Exchange server settings to enforce hardware encryption. The issue is not with the lack of hardware encryption support but with Apple's decision to mask the omission until yesterday morning. I am not even arguing whether or not it was documented. There's no doubt in my mind that it was documented. The crime lies in Apple's decision to let the user think that everything was working as it should. The proper thing to do (as I mentioned previously) would have been to prevent users from accessing MS Exchange email that required hardware encryption from the get-go. This obviously would have caused many corporate and government customers to think twice before purchasing iPhones so Apple decided to "ignore" the server policy instead.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002937 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 15:40:24 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002921 ddesautels : I am using Exchange 2003, do I need to check something before I upgrade? If so, where?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002921 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 15:32:20 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002853 anon : As an Exchange admin, with lots of iPhone users, I was concerned that we would have this issue. It turns out that these encryption settings are _not_ the default on Exchange 2007 SP1, just an optional feature, so our iPhone 3G users have had no difficulties. I hate to say it... but the real problem is not Apple or Microsoft, but your Exchange Adminstrator.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002853 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 15:22:45 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002819 Matt : I agree it was irresponsible of Apple to ignore the setting until now and as I stated earlier, I was under the assumption it WAS honoring the setting. However, I didn't seek a definitive answer when I bought my iPhone, so I hold myself, not Apple, responsible.

Could Apple have been clearer that it didn't support encryption? Absolutely. Do I fault them or think in the grand scheme of things they are ultimately responsible for it? I don't. The information was out there, I just chose not to look for it, so shame on me.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002819 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 15:15:17 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002383 anon : I have no control over my Exchange server. I work for a company with like 30,000 employees.

Let's go with the argument that I didn't do my research. However, enforcing hardware encryption was the approach Apple should have taken all along. It would have removed any doubt as to whether or not a customer's MS Exchange servers required it. I would have tried to access my email and received the message I am getting now and known right there and then that the device was not compatible. That would have given me a fair chance to decide whether or not I still wanted to make the purchase. That would have been the right thing to do. Could my IT department have done more research? Perhaps. Could Apple have been more transparent regarding the lack of hardware encryption and it's long-term ramifications? Definitely.

Just to be clear, I could live with a 3.1.2 update that didn't require hardware encryption.

By the way, it's nice to be able to have an intelligent discussion with people and have different opinions without getting flamed like I often see people react on other message boards.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002383 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 15:10:25 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002603 anon : I have all those settings configured. I know all about how the push stuff works. Trust me I have researched this subject to death. What I have noticed is that Apple has been incorporating fixes to address this issue in recent releases but hasn't come full circle. When the iPhone 2.2 OS was all the rage the only time you were notified about new messages with the red new message indicator was when they were in your inbox. In addition, no new messages in any of the subfolders were retrieved unless you navigated into each subfolder and clicked refresh. In the next OS release you were no longer required to navigate to each subfolder to refresh their contents. In the release that followed that the phone would vibrate when new messages in both the inbox and/or subfolders came through.

To date however, the only time you actually see any form of "visual" indicator on the mail application icon is when new messages are in the inbox -not subfolders. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002603 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 15:02:13 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002689 Matt : The 3GS has a hardware encryption chip, pre-3GS phones do not.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002689 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:54:55 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002688 bbarrera : This is not about encryption between the Exchange server and the mobile.

This is about encrypting the cached emails stored on your phone. The same emails that are not encrypted when cached in your web browser when using Outlook Web Access. The same emails that are most likely NOT encrypted when cached in Outlook.

So any company that takes the mobile device encryption without enforcing the same for laptops running Outlook or webmail is fooling itself, and likely doesn't understand the policy impact of accepting Microsoft's default settings.

Not all mobile devices, phones or laptops, are configured to encrypt the email stored (cached) locally on the device. And not all mobile devices (Windows Mobile included) are capable of encrypting locally stored emails.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002688 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:54:44 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002649 NOVA_Guy : I don't understand how this isn't a bug, if it works fine on the 3GS and fails elsewhere.

Or does this signal that Apple is only interesting in providing crippleware to non 3GS phones? I guess sales of the 3GS didn't go as well as expected for them then, so they have to try to force communities of users to upgrade, whether or not the users feel that it's necessary or even a good deal. :uhh: :uhh: :uhh:
--
Obama lies. His public option forces people into paying more for less coverage, and provides government paid abortion and euthanization while denying treatment and coverage to many others. Read the fine print, it's worse than an cell phone contract.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002649 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:48:43 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002508 anon :
said by godlikesme :

Again, I think the absence of new email notifications for messages in subfolders is a much, much, much bigger issue than anything people are complaining about right now. As much as I want Flash, I can "somewhat" understand the issues that might be causing the delay but with the whole subfolder thing there's just no excuse.
Wrong. You CAN be notified when mail is pushed to a subfolder on the iPhone. To enable this:

tap Settings > Mail, Contacts, Calendars > Fetch New Data > Advanced > [select the account that is Push enabled]

In that window you should see an option to select the folders to push new email to, the default is for the Inbox ONLY.

"Matt" said something about blaming the IT guys for not knowing that pre-3Gs the iPhone didn't support Exchange encryption, fine. But why didn't Apple make it known or mention this themselves beforehand? As an "IT guy" I'm forced to deal with a fleet of 3G users in the field that can't access their e-mail in real time because that's the phone the CEO demanded despite my assertion that it's not the best choice.

Business as usual for Apple just may cost me my job.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002508 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:22:39 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002254 anon : All good points Matt. But I can't believe all the people out there who are screaming bloody murder about something like MMS which the lack thereof does not exactly qualify as "missing a critical component" nor does it stop anything from working. It is such an over-hyped feature in the first place!!! Again, I think the absence of new email notifications for messages in subfolders is a much, much, much bigger issue than anything people are complaining about right now. As much as I want Flash, I can "somewhat" understand the issues that might be causing the delay but with the whole subfolder thing there's just no excuse.

I don't want to get too off topic and I do see your point about putting some of the onus on my IT department but don't you think that it's just a tad bit misleading for Apple to announce to the world that the iPhone supports MS Exchange and for a 14 months there are no major hiccups until all of a sudden they push an update that actually enforces hardware encryption without even so much as a warning? If the iPhone is capable of preventing me from accessing my corporate email now because my device doesn't support hardware encryption couldn't a similar test have been performed prior to applying the update in order to warn me in advance?

Getting back to the whole "blame the IT department" I still feel that the information regarding hardware encryption should have been much, much, much more prominent -I'm talking "cigarette label prominent". If this was something that Apple knew they would ultimately have to succumb to then they should have kept customers informed at the time of purchase. There was no reason for anyone to expect that one day their email would work and the next day it wouldn't. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002254 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:50:58 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002203 Matt : Exchange 2007 SP1 was released in May of 2008, you bought your iPhone 3G in November of 2008. It is not Apple's fault you didn't research this issue before buying one. You can disable forced encryption and your phone will work fine, so this is a non-issue. I know for Windows Mobile phones, you can still enable encryption on the device itself. It's likely you could even create two different Activesync Policies on your Exchange Server, one specifically for your iPhone devices that doesn't force encryption and another for other mobile devices that does force it.

I'd like to see Apple release 3.1.1 that reverted to ignoring the setting, but that is the most I would expect to see them offer.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002203 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:33:15 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002193 ptrowski :
said by godlikesme :

Maybe I am over-reacting a bit. It's barely been 24 hours since the update was released and I should at least give Apple a chance to respond to the issue.

If a reasonable solution can be implemented then great. I would be totally amicable to some form of settlement that would either allow me to get out of my contract without penalty or upgrade to a 3GS for free or at a reduced price. I am a reasonable person. I have been using my current iPhone for almost 10 months and it wouldn't be fair for me to demand a "free iPhone 3GS". Perhaps Apple could have some sort of "Exchange for Exchange (i.e. MS Exchange)" program.
Give it some time. But I would expect that your forms of settlement would come around once hell freezes over.
--
"So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."

Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002193 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:31:40 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002093 anon : Maybe I am over-reacting a bit. It's barely been 24 hours since the update was released and I should at least give Apple a chance to respond to the issue.

If a reasonable solution can be implemented then great. I would be totally amicable to some form of settlement that would either allow me to get out of my contract without penalty or upgrade to a 3GS for free or at a reduced price. I am a reasonable person. I have been using my current iPhone for almost 10 months and it wouldn't be fair for me to demand a "free iPhone 3GS". Perhaps Apple could have some sort of "Exchange for Exchange (i.e. MS Exchange)" program.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002093 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:23:32 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002122 ptrowski : Great post, Matt. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002122 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:21:22 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002062 Matt :
said by godlikesme :

I purchased the 3G back in December of 2008 only because I was told it supported MS Exchange. There was no literature about it not having hardware encryption that if implemented by my IT department would not allow me to access corporate email.
I know this may sound Troll'ish, so I apologize, but just because your IT Department can't use Google doesn't mean you can start a class action lawsuit. A simple Google search shows that the iPhone 3G doesn't support data encryption with Exchange: »www.google.com/#hl=en&source=hp&···7f87ed47

The iPhone supports Exchange just fine, what it doesn't support is a single feature added in SP1 as Daemon See Profile noted. No one is forcing Exchange-based organizations to use pre-3GS iPhones. You can't sue or start a class-action lawsuit because you didn't perform due diligence before deploying iPhones in your organization.

What you can do is fire the member of your IT staff who didn't perform the necessary research, or lied and said the device supported encryption when in fact it never has, if encryption is that important to you.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23002062 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:11:44 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001764 anon : True, but for starters people have already started filing lawsuits against AT&T for the whole MMS thing and as for whether or not I'm justified in suing a company for not documenting or supporting a feature is not my argument. All of the things you mentioned can be supported with software updates. My argument is that Apple sold me a product that will never support hardware encryption just like it will never have a digital compass. The only difference is that I knew the 3G didn't have a digital compass and that it's absence won't prevent me from using Google Maps after future updates are applied. Although after this experience I'm not so sure. ;)

Apple stated that the iPhone 3G supports MS Exchange. It may do a poor job of doing it and there may be many features that it does not currently implement but none of them actually prevent me from accessing my corporate email. This 3.1.1 update completely screws iPhone 3G owners. Period. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001764 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 12:20:22 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001738 darcilicious :
said by godlikesme :

You are entitled to your opinion but I feel pretty cheated.
And that's all it takes to win file a class action suit. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001738 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 12:15:14 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001692 anon : With all due respect, why not?

If an official workaround cannot be provided that meets the security standards of all IT departments then how are iPhone 3G owners going to access MS Exchange email?

I am not saying that Apple's decision to enforce the encryption policy is wrong. On the contrary, it's a very positive step in the right direction and will only increase the iPhone's prominence in the corporate world for both current and potential customers.

The issue I have with Apple was their approach.

The whole transition to digital TV provides the perfect example. People really had no excuse for not knowing about it and if they went out and purchased a TV set without a digital tuner it was their own damn fault. If however, consumers would have been misled or if the government never told anyone that analog TV would be turned off and continued to let consumers blindly purchase soon-to-be obsolete televisions, that would be flat out wrong.

At least with digital TV if the consumer was totally out of touch with society or in a coma for the last few years they could always purchase a converter box or get cable if they had to.

But with the iPhone 3G -no such luck. Asking the IT department of a major corporation or government agency to relax it's security settings for individual users would be like forcing TV stations to continue broadcasting in analog.

You are entitled to your opinion but I feel pretty cheated.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001692 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 12:07:35 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001636 Daemon :
said by godlikesme :

Not to jump the gun here or anything but I think this may be grounds for a class-action lawsuit for 3G owners. [snip] There was no literature about it not having hardware encryption that if implemented by my IT department would not allow me to access corporate email. [snip] Either way, this is bad news for all the 3G corporate users out there and something must be done. Anyone for starting a petition?
Sorry, but not documenting that a feature is absent is not grounds for a class action lawsuit. The iPhone also didn't support MMS for a long time, still requires multiple inboxes instead of a unified inbox, is not linux compatible, etc etc. Should we start several class action lawsuits?
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001636 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 11:56:02 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001485 ptrowski : Hardly a class-action lawsuit case here.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001485 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 11:30:09 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001444 anon : Not to jump the gun here or anything but I think this may be grounds for a class-action lawsuit for 3G owners. I purchased the 3G back in December of 2008 only because I was told it supported MS Exchange. There was no literature about it not having hardware encryption that if implemented by my IT department would not allow me to access corporate email. Had I known that I would never have purchased the iPhone -or I at least would have waited until a newer model that did support hardware encrption was released. For apple to just have the iPhone 3G ignore the policy and make users think everything was fine is wrong. In hindsight it appears as if they released a half-baked product that barely met the minimum requirements to support MS Exchange in order to get it into corporate customers hands and turn up the heat on RIM before it was too late. In the last year Apple probably started getting called out on the issue of hardware encryption which was a huge (but understated) feature of the 3GS. My guess is that they probably didn't want to make a big fuss about the importance of hardware encryption at the 3GS launch because it would have prompted 3G owners to question what their fate would be once the policy was enforced. Apple on their end didn't want to spoil the launch party with angry 3G customers so they decided to wait on actually updating the software on the iPhone OS until sometime later when more people would start using the 3GS.

Either way, this is bad news for all the 3G corporate users out there and something must be done. Anyone for starting a petition?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23001444 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 11:24:43 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999835 Thinkdiff : Thanks for the tip. I just checked our Exchange server and Encryption was already disabled, so it looks like I won't be getting a bunch of calls tomorrow afterall.
--
University of Southern California - Class of 2010. Fight On!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999835 Thu, 10 Sep 2009 01:01:28 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999547 Matt :
said by Daemon See Profile :

said by Matt See Profile :

That setting is the default in Exchange 2007.
Previous versions of Microsoft would have thought 'requiring X when not all devices in Y may support X would break stuff, so we'll disable it by default for maximum compatibility'. New Microsoft says 'leaving X as an option by default may cause many people to never enable it, leaving things less secure, so we'll turn it on by default'.

My perspective is the new M.O. is a good thing-- make people acutely aware that allowing compatibility may cause security holes.
I agree. Also, as far as I know, there are only two mobile devices that support Activesync anyway, Windows Mobile and the iPhone, so it's completely possible Apple and Microsoft didn't communicate on this one. I still wouldn't be surprised to see a 3.1.1 that reverts to ignoring that setting on pre-3GS models.

It would certainly make me happier. :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999547 Wed, 09 Sep 2009 23:27:37 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999533 Daemon :
said by Matt See Profile :

That setting is the default in Exchange 2007.
Previous versions of Microsoft would have thought 'requiring X when not all devices in Y may support X would break stuff, so we'll disable it by default for maximum compatibility'. New Microsoft says 'leaving X off by default may cause many people to never enable it, leaving things less secure, so we'll turn it on by default'.

My perspective is the new M.O. is a good thing-- make people acutely aware that allowing compatibility may cause security holes.
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999533 Wed, 09 Sep 2009 23:25:22 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999497 Matt :
said by Daemon See Profile :

said by Matt See Profile :

Hrm, luckily I'm the Exchange 2007 Admin and I do believe there is a policy setting for encryption on mobile devices. I always assumed that my iPhone honored that setting ... I'm going to investigate now.
See my edit above, which was a simulpost with yours.
Yep, I just turned it off and now I can connect.

For any Exchange 2007 Admins, you need to go into your Organization Configuration - Client Access, right click the policy you have configured for your Exchange Activesync Mailbox Policies, and disable Require encryption on the device.

I'm not that concerned about it, because remote wipe is still supported, but I can see how there will be an outcry about it, especially since there was no advance warning that anything previous to the 3GS would suddenly fail. That setting is the default in Exchange 2007.

Activesync Policies
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999497 Wed, 09 Sep 2009 23:19:41 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999469 Daemon :
said by Matt See Profile :

Hrm, luckily I'm the Exchange 2007 Admin and I do believe there is a policy setting for encryption on mobile devices. I always assumed that my iPhone honored that setting ... I'm going to investigate now.
See my edit above, which was a simulpost with yours.
--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999469 Wed, 09 Sep 2009 23:14:50 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999464 Matt : Hrm, luckily I'm the Exchange 2007 Admin and I do believe there is a policy setting for encryption on mobile devices. I always assumed that my iPhone honored that setting ... I'm going to investigate now.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999464 Wed, 09 Sep 2009 23:13:57 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999447 Daemon : Happens at my work too. I suspect it's an exchange server setting requiring encryption on the device, which works fine for blackberries and iPhone 3GS's, which support it.

In iPhone 3.0 and earlier, iPhones simply ignored the policy setting, but now the 3GS supports it, it's a subtle move telling enterprises that if they want encryption, upgrade to 3GS.

I'm not sure if Exchange even has a 'use encryption if you have it, otherwise don't' setting. It might be 'don't care at all' versus 'have to have it'. My work is not going to be happy if they have to relax the encryption requirement on all mobile devices.

The apple discussion thread is hilarious. It's a combination of 'me too', 'help', and 'delete the account and re-add' posts. Nothing constructive.

edit: »technet.microsoft.com/en-us/libr···484.aspx

I'm almost sure I'm right now. There are both 'enable device encryption' and 'require device encryption' boxes. All my server admin has to do is keep the former and disable the latter and things should work again.

This is NOT a bug on Apple's part. Administrators that really want to FORCE encryption probably do not want old iphones connecting. The old behavior, of simply ignoring the policy, was a bug. From a bit of basic googling, it seems the new setting was added in 2007 SP1, so it seems like 3.1 just updates to a new revision of active sync. So maybe it was not technically a bug when 3.0 came out, but it would be now.

--
-Ryan
sig for sale! Only one previous owner, lovingly cared for]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999447 Wed, 09 Sep 2009 23:10:58 EDT Re: [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999166 ArchAngel21x : Thanks for the heads up. I will wait on the update. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999166 Wed, 09 Sep 2009 22:20:48 EDT [iPhone] 3.1 breaks Exchange Sync for pre-3GS phones http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999133 Matt : I upgraded to 3.1 and now I receive the message you see in the screenshot. Apparently I'm not the only one: »discussions.apple.com/thread.jsp···10166076

Nice
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999133 Wed, 09 Sep 2009 22:12:57 EDT