Rogers → [Extreme Plus] Issues hosting on Xbox Live

I have Rogers extreme plus service and usually get around 15mbs down and 956kbs up. This should be plenty of upload to host COD4 games on Xbox live but I've been having issues where everyone else in the room experiences terrible lag and some people trying to join cannot get fully in. At the same time, everyone will have full green bars...

I've recently switched to the new modem, the SMC D3GN, and I hoped it would fix the problem. It didn't. The xbox is hardwired to the modem. I have this problem whether or not the main computer is also connected to the modem. Rogers has come out and rerun the line from the pole to the house and rerun the line in the house to the modem. This happens on two different xboxes. It never happened on these same xboxes with my old service provider, comcast.

Neither Rogers nor Xbox live customer support can help with this issue. Xbox live is not a supported application according to Rogers and Rogers cannot tell me if they do something to slow my upload speeds if I host a game. My NAT is open. I have placed the Xbox in a DMZ. Nothing seems to help.

This is very frustrating and I'm not sure where to go from here. I play mainly Call of Duty 4 which picks a host based on connection speeds. I often get chosen and once the game starts, half the people leave and I have to end the game and go to the lobby where everybody accuses me of having a lag switch.

Does anybody know of any issues Rogers has that would cause this? Is there anything I should be doing differently on my end? (I haven't forwarded ports as I think having the xbox in the dmz and having an open NAT should negate the need for this). Is there another service provider I should be looking at? If I can't get this fixed, I think my only option is to downgrade my service so I don't get chosen to host anymore.

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

What modem did you have before SMC D3GN? Was it by SMC too?

Since it is a known fact that Rogers throttles upstream by dropping random packets - their routers probably see numerous connections to your modem and think you are doing p2p and drop packets. Other guys have to re-transmit, which takes time and slows everything down to a crawl.
This is the reality of Canadian internet, they all throttle, they all have pathetic bandwidth caps - nothing new.
If I were you, I would drop down to Extreme, or even Express. There is no point of having anything higher than that - waste of money.

I play COD4 on XBL quite a bit, and haven't had any problems.

are you running anything else on a PC while playing? I noticed if I'm running torrents at the same time my connection goes a bit crazy.

I will say it's definitely on your end, or a problem with the node being congested and packets being dropped. I host GoW a fair amount on Rogers Extreme in downtown Toronto, and there's only problems if one of my roommates is running torrents unchecked, or the node is dying and all of the internet is really slow.

Also... I didn't know Rogers served Jacksonville, FL.

You are not the only one experiencing this problem. I have it too with COD4, CODWAW, and MW2. I found someone else posting the problem here and replied to it this morning.
I have Rogers Internet & I am using their EXTREME package. All my ping stats and speed stats are EXCELLENT.

»www.avforums.com/forums/ ··· 10860627

Is that 15mb/956kb your burst speed or is it sustained?

Just thought id add in that i too have this same issue, that if i host a game everyone just drops.

To all that are having this issue:

CALL ROGERS AND GET TECH SUPPORT

They will try and pass the buck off by saying the following:
This is an xbox live issue
Your modem stats are find and their is no packet loss

Keep to your guns and explain that you are not complaining about your download or upload speeds.
Tell them that this is not an issue revolving around xbox live, but rather an issue with them blocking or screening or traffic shaping anonymous requests coming into your router.

Keep at it, it is not going to take just one phone call. The more people that complain and waste their time with this issue (and it is their issue) the more likelyhood that they are going to address the problem.

Call now.

Listen, if you are really wanting to work on this problem I would suggest we pool our combined resources (those who are on Rogers here in Canada) and make a combined effort to get rogers to resolve or at least admin there is an issue here. This would involve getting activision, xbox live, and rogers involved at the same time such that we can work on the problem together.

My email address is iamcnd@gmail.com

Contact me if you are interested in joining up to sort this problem out. I am over 30 f-n years old and I love this game. I am almost ashamed to admit it. LOL.

Anyways... If you do wish to contact me, please put in the subject the following line:

"ROGERS XBOX LIVE CALL OF DUTY"

Once I get your email I will keep you posted on the events to come.

Thanks all.

I wonder if this issue is area specific. I have not encountered this problem on my previous extreme service and and now the Docsis 3 Extreme Plus.

I've been playing Modern Warefare 2 and COD 4 without issues. Both with a wireless connection and wired.

Strange.

im in ottawa, somebody else is confirmed toronto...
others have said they have changed cable modems and still have this problem...

tubesurfer... are you having this issue currently?

No issues at the moment. Another thing i should point out is i rarely have throttling issues with BT. However i almost never use BT just newsgroups.

I have always had a very stable solid connection. I'm located in Whitby Ontario.

We all have stable solid connections, Fast as lightning, no packet loss, 2-3ms of jitter (variance between ping responses). The problem only exhibits itself when we are hosting a game.

You may be having this issue, but you just don't know it. When people are host, most of the time they have no idea they are. I always no whether I am the host or not because I check each game.

When the match starts, press select first thing, you have to pick a class then press select, when you do that you will see if you are the host, if you have 4 green bars, and everyone else doesn't, then you're the host.

Usually if you are host it will show that you have 4 green bars, and everyone else has 1 red dot.

Also, if you weren't quick enough to do that, press select during the game and see if your green bars drop to 3 bars. If you have three bars then you can't be host.

That is exactly right hawkeye. I check as soon as I get into a game and if I see myself as host, I now immediately just end the game as it's not even worth trying to see if I can host anymore. I'm in the center of Toronto (yonge and eg) with excellent speeds, pings and packet loss and never have any issues until it makes me host (which happens all the time b/c xbox thinks I have a great connection). I've spent many hours on the phone with Rogers and they are no help at all. I will probably end up decreasing my speeds because of this so I don't have to worry as much about hosting.

Mapleleafguy - I wish I knew enough about this to monitor my connection and somehow prove Rogers is doing this. Right now they just tell me they aren't aware of anything of the sort and that Rogers doesn't do this one of thing. I can't call them out because I have no proof. It would be awesome if we could get actvision involved. Maybe let activision prove Rogers is doing this and then recommend all COD players switch to a different ISP. I bet that would get Rogers' attention.

Hawkeye, thanks for posting that. That is exactly what I do to determine if I am the host.

I have current open cases with Activision, XBOX Live, and Rogers.
I am getting a couple of emails from people that I am going to pool together for more proof that the common denominator here is Rogers.

Unfortuanatly there is not much one can do to monitor their connection while using the xbox console. You can't open up any software on an xbox to run any tests like you could on a PC.

The xbox is a very closed down system... you can't even ping it from your home network (unless you are running the test your xbox live connection).

All I can say is this.... it works for millions of people. It doesnt seem to work for Rogers people. My XBOX connects to the live system with no issues.

My internet connection is rock solid.

Activision knows that their system works for millions of people. If enough Rogers people call to complain about this then they will also start to see a correlation. More advice... contact Activision, and contact xbox live and complain about this problem. If you havent already contacted Rogers do so immediately. PLay dumb, and be calm. Explain the problem.

Anyways, ill keep you all posted on my progress with the above three organisations.

Regards,
Paul.

Sounds like it might be best that people send there complaints about this issue here.

The Office of the President
Rogers Cablesystems - Rogers Yahoo! HiSpeed Internet
855 York Mills Rd
Don Mills, Ontario
M3B 1Z1

Dear Paul,

Thank you for your email.

Allow us to apologize for your recent experience in this matter.

Since you are hosting the game form your connection (not form a
dedicated server host) this is a peer to peer connection. To ensure a
consistently high level of service for all Rogers customers, it is
necessary to put limits on the amount of network bandwidth available for
certain types of applications. This process is called traffic regulation
(rate-limiting, traffic shaping, throttling).

To ensure that a relatively small number of connections do not slow
service for everyone, Rogers limits the space available for P2P uploads.
This ensures all customers have an equal connection. For example if you
host the game, and 10 people connect to it, your upload limit will be
devided so it can be shared equally with the 10 people that are
connected to you. The more connections made the slower the connection
will be.

Rogers does not block any type of Internet traffic or application. Nor
do we monitor the content of customer communications or activities on
the Internet. Our traffic regulation is based on the type of
application, not the way it is used.

If you find the answer unsatisfactory, we suggest you to contact our
technical support line at 1-888-ROGERS1 and request to speak to Tier 2
support in order to correspond to your questions and concerns.

Regards,
Mieszko J.
Rogers Hi-Speed Internet
Electronic Support Group

I'd be sending a letter to the crtc about this ITMP.It is not acceptable to be blocking any games wether you host or not.

Wow. That sounds like they are admitting this. I would send that email to all the gaming mags as evidence that Roger's cable internet is not compatible with xbox live. If the media start spreading that Rogers doesn't work with xbox live, I bet people will start leaving and Rogers will change their policy.

at least it means we aren't crazy and they really are doing this. makes my $100 a month charge for extreme plus rather useless.

What magazines might be interested in this story?
How would you respond to this email I received from Rogers?

Have you tried DMZ'ing / port forwarding the needed ports for XBL? The SMC D3GN does not, by default, port forward for xbox live compatible systems like most other wireless routers. The ports are 53, 80, 88, and 3074. You'll need a static IP address if you're going to be port forwarding as well.

I imagine any magazine devoted to gaming would be interested. IGN, OXM, Cnet, boing boing, slash dot, etc. I'd notify Infinity Ward, Activision, Microsoft, 402 and Major Nelson. Rogers has basically admitted that they don't let their customers host xbox live games. This would by default make their service incompatible with Xbox live as the service relies on P2P gaming. You could also notify Bell or some competitor of Rogers to let them know they could capture some substantial market share by advertising that Rogers hampers their customers' internet connections to make gimp xbox live gaming.

yes. i have put the xbox in a DMZ, forwarded ports, etc. The NAT is open. I've spent hours on the phone with Rogers tech support as well as the modem manufacturer's tech support (who incidentally were vastly more helpful and knowledgeable than Rogers were). I know how to forward ports, set up a static IP and move the xbox to a DMZ. This is the only thing Rogers tech support was able to offer on the phone as well. At least it sounds like mapleleafguy has actually had someone admit to what they are doing.

»forums.xbox.com/30172460 ··· 30172460

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I posted this on one of the xbox forums and avsforum as well.

Dear Rogers Tech. I certainly don't want this to come across like I am flaming you, but have your read this thread? Or did you just jump in with your usual off the cuff Rogers answers?

This thread discusses the problems that ROGERS subscibers are dealing with when they are hosting cames on XBOX live. We have all tried connecting our xbox directly to the cable modem, and some of us have gone as far as to change the cable modem. We all have opened up the necessary ports, and/or enabled uPNP on the routers.

If you look at one of my most recent replies, after a week long back and forth with Rogers email support I finally have them admitting that they are port shaping the xbox live port (and every other port under the sun that has multiply anonymous connections coming into our cable modems).

This is a real problem, and not one that can be solved with open ports on Routers. Rogers is taking away from my internet and gaming experience. I pay for my Extreme connection. I also pay for some 95 GB of traffic. Some are paying more. If I am paying for these services and I am allotted "x" amount of bandwidth, and "y" amount of data transfer I should not be interfered with when I am playing call of duty online. I am furious with this and it is simply NOT fair.

This is an over abuse of power. This is something I am not going to let go, and I am going to make waves whereever I can if I cannot get Rogers to kindly stop this practice when I am gaming. I am NOT running any P2P software. I am just playing a online game. This is discusting policy (policing) and NOBODY should stand for it.

If I get nowhere I am going to try and get a telephone conversation with Activisoin, and XBOX live. They need to be aware of this and stop advertising that ROGERS is a compatible ISP with their service and games. It is simply not the truth. I am also going to contact the media, and other regulatory bodies to see if they have any weight in this matter.

I am not going to let this go.

Does anyone know what the URL is to Rogers "Terms and Agreement" page (or whatever it is called)?

I hope those who are equally annonyed as I am and not simply watching me do all the fighting. Other need to get involved and make waves. I will support you in any way I can.

Paul.

I sent a message to Major Nelson after I posted the issue on xbox live forums.

Thanks for everything you are doing mapleleafguy.

How did you contact him? Was it a generic way? Twitter?
Just curious because I am looking for concrete ways of contacting these types of people/organisations.

Thanks LJ3.

In regards to the tech (Mieszko J.) response over at Rogers, does everyone agree this is a p2p setup?

I certainly disagree. Before you comment, please review what a p2p network looks like over at wikipedia. The URL is here: »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pe ··· -to-peer

If anything it is a hybrid of the two, but predominantly a server based service model. The only commonality of the p2p setup is that it has no central infrastructure that the user of xbox live has.

I look forward to your input.

Thank you.

Paul.