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OHdeer
Anon
2009-Sep-30 5:34 pm
Norton's response to MSE |
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CudniLa Merma - Vigilado MVM join:2003-12-20 Someshire |
Cudni
MVM
2009-Sep-30 6:54 pm
damage limitation by Norton from what is another good free AV solution.
Cudni |
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SirSteve Premium Member join:2003-11-28 Woodbury, CT 1 edit
1 recommendation |
to OHdeer
A little off-topic but NAV 2009/2010 is a great product...and this is coming from a long-time ESET NOD32 user. |
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almex Premium Member join:2001-09-18 Chandler, AZ
2 recommendations |
to OHdeer
Found this in the Slashdot comments. Thought it was very appropriate. |
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to OHdeer
Should of seen Norton's short video on youtube where they basically said free AV's were worthless. It was posted on Tom's Hardware news but in no time the vid was pulled from youtube. |
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SirSteve Premium Member join:2003-11-28 Woodbury, CT 1 edit |
to almex
A quad-core system with NAV 2003 on it...yeah right.
A PhotoShop if there ever was one. |
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DownTheShorePray for Ukraine Premium Member join:2003-12-02 Beautiful NJ |
It shows their age - lol. |
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Woody79_00I run Linux am I still a PC? Premium Member join:2004-07-08 united state |
to OHdeer
ouch indeed
what a disingenious argument on their part.... |
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VikingBobGo Jets Go! Premium Member join:2004-06-05 MB Canada |
to OHdeer
There's another opinion out there, from the Internet Storm Center - see » isc.sans.org/diary.html? ··· yid=7204Microsoft Security Essentials (MSE) hit the streets today (Thanks Kia for the heads up). So I thought we'd have a quick look at it and let you know how it goes.
MSE replaces the Onecare offering and the free Defender installation standard on Vista installations. It will provide you with malware detection and removal ONLY. So do not rely on this as your one stop shop for security. It does not have the features and functionality that many of the AV vendors provide in their products. Think of this as the AV as it used to be in 2000 or so.
There is no central management and updates are taken from windows update services (from the looks of it not from WSUS).
The install is straight forward. After downloading it (approx. 8MB), run the installer and follow the yellow brick road. It does a genuine product check and after installation it will go and update itself. I had troubles getting it to update when behind a proxy server, but I suspect that was a local issue. Going direct it updates and applies the latest signatures. Reportedly there will be 3 updates per day on average.
Detect rates seem to be quite good. It seems to have found most of the things on a test malware drive. I have to check more closely if it missed things and if so why.
There are plenty of people who don't want to pay for AV, we all have one or more in the family. This will plug that gap, assuming the Windows version being used is legit. |
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said by VikingBob:assuming the Windows version being used is legit. This is going to be a pivotal issue for MSE adoption, I think. The other free alternatives don't care whether you pass WGA. |
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Mele20 Premium Member join:2001-06-05 Hilo, HI 1 edit |
to VikingBob
said by VikingBob:There's another opinion out there, from the Internet Storm Center - see » isc.sans.org/diary.html? ··· yid=7204It will provide you with malware detection and removal ONLY. So do not rely on this as your one stop shop for security. It does not have the features and functionality that many of the AV vendors provide in their products. Think of this as the AV as it used to be in 2000 or so.
Really? That is just what I want. I don't want a gunked up AV. I remove as much gunk as I can and disable the rest. How refreshing to have an AV with no gunk! Of course, the WGA crap will stop me from using it but otherwise it sounds fantastic! As for that Symantec review, that is just Symantec getting back at Microsoft for all the grief caused them with Vista ...same grief caused many applications including ProcessGuard and I took Symantec's side on that mess back when it was happening and was rooting for them to be big enough to stop Microsoft but no one can successfully take on Microsoft (except the EU...certainly not our pussycat gov). |
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almex Premium Member join:2001-09-18 Chandler, AZ |
almex
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 1:18 am
I'd like to know what "features and functionality" MSE is missing that doesn't make it a one stop shop? In my experience, most AV scanners do not detect malware, which is why I would pair Avast up with MBAM. Granted, I have not had MSE for very long, but I am trusting Microsoft on this one. Only time will tell.
Also, I don't understand what the big fuss over WGA is about. I've always used a legitimate copy of Windows, and I've never been burned by WGA. I highly doubt the vast majority of those against WGA have been burned, as well. To each their own, I suppose. |
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MarkAWBarry White Premium Member join:2001-08-27 Canada
1 recommendation |
MarkAW
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 1:43 am
said by almex:Also, I don't understand what the big fuss over WGA is about. I've always used a legitimate copy of Windows, and I've never been burned by WGA. I highly doubt the vast majority of those against WGA have been burned, as well. To each their own, I suppose. Most on BBR are using a legitimate copy of Windows and haven't been burnt by WGA, that's not the point it's the constant nagging by MS with WGA if one needs to install something from MS. If the OS has already passed WGA why do we always have to jump through the MS hoop when we all have already passed activation when we first installed the OS onto our PC. |
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to OHdeer
Norton? lol. |
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almex Premium Member join:2001-09-18 Chandler, AZ |
to MarkAW
said by MarkAW:Most on BBR are using a legitimate copy of Windows and haven't been burnt by WGA, that's not the point it's the constant nagging by MS with WGA if one needs to install something from MS. If the OS has already passed WGA why do we always have to jump through the MS hoop when we all have already passed activation when we first installed the OS onto our PC. What constant nagging? What hoops are we jumping through? As for the MSE installer, it was one very simple and quick screen. Maybe I'll never understand. |
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Mele20 Premium Member join:2001-06-05 Hilo, HI
2 recommendations |
Mele20
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 4:08 am
If you don't understand "show your papers, NOW asshole" then no you won't ever get it. Microsoft doesn't use those words nor is the unspoken threat if one does not comply a terribly frightening one. However, both bullies and those seriously intent on destroying our freedom and liberty use these same tactics. It is just a matter of degree between the two. If I paid for Windows and it passed activation there should be no need to accuse me anytime I want to download most anything from Microsoft (other than security patches) of being a software thief. I should not need to prove AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN that I legally own my copy of Windows.
That is tantamount to Microsoft saying to me "We do not believe you. Yes, we know your copy of Windows passed activation but we are almost positive that since then you have decided to get rid of it and instead install a pirated copy of Windows. Prove to us again and again and again WHENEVER THE WHIM HITS US that you have not decided to become a thief since the last time we didn't believe you and forced you to yet again PROVE YOUR INNOCENCE."
Not only is it bullying from a convicted monopolist but it turns a basic principle of our Constitution on its ear. We are not innocent until proven guilty in Microsoft's eyes. We are guilty until we prove our innocence over and over and over every time Microsoft snaps its fingers. Once is not enough for Microsoft and being a monopolistic bully they badger us to repeatedly prove our innocence. |
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GKI Premium Member join:2007-07-19 Tacoma, WA |
GKI
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 4:51 am
Methinks the WGA test is so quick, as mentioned earlier, that it isn't a case of "Prove it" as much as 'we'll check'. They're just being upfront as they are with their other free software. |
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Mele20 Premium Member join:2001-06-05 Hilo, HI |
Mele20
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 6:15 am
Since when did the amount of time involved in a "papers" check determine it legitimacy?
The check is done because Microsoft believes you are a THIEF and requires you to prove over and over that you are not a thief.
What does being "upfront" have to do with accusing someone of being a thief? I purchased a copy of XP Pro. It passed validation. Now Microsoft tells me they think I am a thief and require me to show that I am not a thief. If they were being "upfront", before I ever bought XP Microsoft would have told me in writing that I would be required to repeatedly prove to them that I have not changed my mind after purchasing XP Pro and thrown it away and gone and pirated a copy that I am now using. Then I could have decided right then that I wanted nothing to do with a company that intended to treat me in a such a shabby manner.
I can't understand why you don't mind that Microsoft is repeatedly accusing you of theft. As for the check being quick, it is anything but! You have to allow Microsoft to download software to your computer and that takes time. Then they run the software to check. Then you want the garbage off your computer. You find that Microsoft will not allow you to remove it. That is extremely offensive that if I were to allow Microsoft to install the crap that I could not later remove it. How can that not offend you? I got WGA hidden in IE7 beta and I couldn't decline it because it was cleverly and nastily installed in the MIDDLE of the IE7 installation. I couldn't back out at that point. I was one of the first to install the beta so it was not common knowledge then that Microsoft was doing this. Had I waited a while to install the beta, I would have known and would have not installed it. Microsoft was able to pull a fast, nasty one on me only because I was eager to try IE7. I haven't been eager since to try anything from Microsoft. I was so angry that I was tricked like that and could not remove WGA that I did my first and only search for a crack to kill it and that I did so it's installed but DEAD and I lost most of the respect I used to have for Microsoft.
This is just in regard to WGA. WGAN I hate with a bitter passion and surely you at least hate it! |
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CJ30 join:2000-07-18 USA
1 recommendation |
CJ30
Member
2009-Oct-1 6:29 am
Mele20 , I bet you just hate the hell out of DUI checkpoints. Even though they advertise in the media as to when and where they are going to be before hand. They are pulling you over under the assumption that you are intoxicated until they prove you aren't. Those bastards. How dare they keep my children and me from getting run over or hit by some asshole that has been out drinking all night. Damn them...Damn them to hell and back. I have come to the conclusion, my own of course, that this whole argument about WGA is nothing but a bunch of bullshit. Most bitch about it just to hear themselves bitch. They, MS, are just protecting their investment. No different then the alarm system in my house. I have a code to disable it and if you come in my house, you better know that code. |
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owlyn MVM join:2004-06-05 Newtown, PA
1 recommendation |
to Mele20
Mele,
Do you have some other way for MS to protect its investment against pirates that is better than WGA? |
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to Mele20
said by Mele20:If you don't understand "show your papers, NOW asshole" then no you won't ever get it. Microsoft doesn't use those words nor is the unspoken threat if one does not comply a terribly frightening one. However, both bullies and those seriously intent on destroying our freedom and liberty use these same tactics....Not only is it bullying from a convicted monopolist but it turns a basic principle of our Constitution on its ear. While I agree with you in principle, don't you think you are taking it a bit far? M$ cannot infringe on the constitution because, well, they aren't the government and Steve Ballmer is not the president (though he might act as if he is). And instead of complaining about Windows, why don't you use one of the alternatives -- some of which are free in cost and with no EULA's? People who b*tch about M$ yet continue to use their products will get no sympathy from me when there are better OS's that can be had for free. |
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GKI Premium Member join:2007-07-19 Tacoma, WA |
GKI to Mele20
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 7:09 am
to Mele20
Methinks you are very excitedly paranoid. I don't hate WGA, I just put up with it since unscrupulous people make a corporation act this way. By the way, WGAN is a radio station. |
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Mele20 Premium Member join:2001-06-05 Hilo, HI |
Mele20
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 8:00 am
said by GKI:By the way, WGAN is a radio station. Without a smilie I am not sure what you mean by that. Surely, you are joking. You must know about WGANotification. I guess Ford automobiles have never been stolen since Ford doesn't feel compelled to insult its buyers in this manner. In fact, I can't think of a SINGLE OTHER BUSINESS besides Microsoft that has chosen to insult its buyers in this manner. But then Microsoft is a convicted monoplist and Ford isn't. That is the root of all the problems with Microsoft and the reason I continue to use Windows also. The problems could have been solved if we didn't have wimps in the court system, Congress and the White House that allowed Microsoft off the hook. At least Europe stands up to the bully. |
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GKI Premium Member join:2007-07-19 Tacoma, WA |
GKI
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 8:11 am
I'm not the best with all the acronyms, I googled that one. Otherwise, you contradict yourself by saying that "Microsoft is the monopolist" yet you don't use another OS. |
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cork1958Cork Premium Member join:2000-02-26 |
to OHdeer
"In the same test, Norton Antivirus 2010 received AV-Comparatives highest award, Advanced+. Yeah, right! |
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1 edit
1 recommendation |
to Mele20
I guess Mele also doesn't' t buy liquor or cigarettes. Always have to show ID in the stores, even if I have been going to the same store for years now. Guess they think that I got younger since the last time I was in the store and am no longer of age to buy it.
/sarcasm off
Nobody steals directly from Ford. Ford already has their money. |
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CJ30 join:2000-07-18 USA
2 recommendations |
to Mele20
Piss poor analogy. Ford insults me by making me use the correct key EVERY DAMN TIME I START MY CAR!!!!!!! What's up with that??? They don't trust that I am the owner??? Bastards!!! |
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to Mele20
Microsoft, as a private citizen (corporate citizen at any rate) can pretty much do want it desires to protect it's interest in non-pirated software. Any other private citizen can decide not to participate and refuse to do business with Microsoft. As a person who has taught constitutional law for many years, I constantly tell people that the Constitution protects people from government, not people. Believe me, this is not an apology for Microsoft but a recognition that Microsoft is exercising its rights to do business as a private, non-governmental entity. Simple as that. |
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Mele20 Premium Member join:2001-06-05 Hilo, HI |
Mele20
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 10:21 am
MICROSOFT IS A CONVICTED MONOPOLIST. It shouldn't have ANY RIGHTS as a private business. It should have been torn apart forcibly by the court but Microsoft, like any convicted monopolist has scads of money and was able to BUY OFF the court (and our federal goverment in general including Congress and the White House). And you argue a company like that has any rights as a NORMAL business? BAH!
This is becoming a despiciable country to live in. It is not the great nation I grew up in and I guess I will die seeing it die because things are fast coming to a head in this nation and I don't believe the majority olf people of this nation give a shit about freedom or privacy or anything that truly matters.
As for those asking for the umpteenth time why people continue using Windows unders such circumstances are you all blind idiots? It should be obvious why we do that: MICROSOFT IS A CONVICTED MONOPLY. THAT IS WHY. If that still is a mystery then I suggest you read Wikipedia on monopolies. |
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OB1 Premium Member join:2006-07-17 italy |
OB1 to OHdeer
Premium Member
2009-Oct-1 10:34 am
to OHdeer
Puah ! Norton = Symantec have a look at the symantec "performance" here » unixwiz.net/paychoice/then pick your AV |
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