Verizon Continues Layoffs > Hmmm

reply to Z80

Re: Hmmm

reply to Z80

Length of time at a particular employer is not synonymous with "experience, knowledge and training".

What if the new hire just came from a competitor and has 20 years of experience but only 8 months at Verizon or in the IBEW? "G'bye guy, you don't have seniority. It doesn't matter how good you actually are."

We also know there is a difference between 10 years experience and 10 years of 1 year experience. So no, I don't see seniority as justification for anything. Length of time is irrelevant. Job performance whether from years of experience from that employer, from another previous employer or simple natural bust ass talent is.

reply to KrK
My swipe is at any company, union, management, anyone who would pick seniority as a criterion for who gets the axe.

IF, and I mean IF a company decided they must cut payroll, whether the anti-capitalists see it as justified or not, it should be those worst performers who get the axe. It shouldn't be "last hired first fired". I think that is fundamentally unfair, nearly as unfair as a company laying off people just to maximize profit for the quarter to the long term detriment of the company.

We can "yeah but Verizon suits..." all day long. This seniority is my pet peeve and the only issue I'm harping about. Not the value of the union, or whether or not the workers are overpaid or underpaid or anything else. As far as the union goes I believe the IBEW is absolutely necessary otherwise the corporate machine would simply roll over them and turn them all into Wal*Mart drones. But that doesn't excuse the things that the union or company does that I disagree with like using seniority to determine who goes or standing in the way of higher worker productivity. I feel bad that anyone gets laid off but I feel worse that perhaps someone who was recently hired, finally got a job and busted ass got dumped so that potentially a long time lazy sh!thead could keep his job.

If you want to hear a union related rant from me it would be about hypocrites like Limbaugh. While fathead rags on unions for negotiating contracts for their membership, fathead has an agent maximizing his salary and benefits to the point he can buy jets and potentially a football team. The day he negotiates his own wages he can criticize others for having representation. Pill headed hypocrite. /rant off

reply to Z80
Unions DO NOT make the decision to lay-off. The company or corporation makes THAT decision. The company/corporation is the one who decides the lay-off criteria. Unions have virtually no power when it comes to lay-offs. However, they can try and make it financially debilitating so the company/corporation changes it's mind. Also, they can oversee the lay-off to make sure they company or corporation adheres to their criteria fairly.

That is simply not true. The unions absolutely have say in who gets laid off, particularly when it comes to seniority.

reply to Z80
well if you want to be a boss go ahead & bust your butt & see if it works for you.your plan would have some poor 50 year old man who has 30 years in the company be fired because his knees are shot from hooking poles for 20 years.sounds fair doesn't it.we have always helped out the senior employes.I did & I felt no anger toward them.they were smart-knew their job & had some great stories.I backed them .you however seem very selfish that you do not have my back.how many strikes did you go thru so todays workers would have what they have? how many picket lines have you been on? many people paid their dues for you.your attitude reeks of "poor me"-I pray we have some real men in our ranks otherwise you & I are doomed.