Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs in Rogers

Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs in Rogers http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r23203944 en Wed, 10 Feb 2010 02:43:42 EDT Wed, 10 Feb 2010 02:43:42 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23235099 Stewy :

said by Croaker

:

Nothing much has changed save that now network management and UBB must be made visible to the customer. That's a good thing.

As if Rogers or Bell will fully disclose with transparency their traffic/network management. Even IF the CRTC mandates it.

As with everything in our society, telcos depend heavily on "manufactured" scarcity. Always remember that they are selling you the very solutions to the problems they create. In other words if you're having problems with your voip and you get a home phone add in your mailbox, it's not by chance.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23235099 Sat, 24 Oct 2009 12:50:11 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23234897 Croaker :

said by Stewy

:

unfortunately it has nothing to do with the cost of the service. It has to do with the maximum customer tolerance limits from the return on investment in order to appease the shareholders.

I don't even know what this quote is supposed to mean... I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer though so be patient with me.

Nothing much has changed save that now network management and UBB must be made visible to the customer. That's a good thing.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23234897 Sat, 24 Oct 2009 11:41:38 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23234742 Stewy :

said by Croaker

:

I don't have a problem with the consumer being aware of the cost for service.

unfortunately it has nothing to do with the cost of the service. It has to do with the maximum customer tolerance limits from the return on investment in order to appease the shareholders.

It's been proven time and again that the cost of internet delivery keeps going down as technology keeps improving.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23234742 Sat, 24 Oct 2009 10:53:48 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23233485 Croaker : You may wish to to peruse »The TV Tax thing....]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23233485 Fri, 23 Oct 2009 23:36:55 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23233239 Xstar_Lumini : Has anyone heard the hypocritical Rogers radio ads lately? They are telling people to vote against the "TV tax" which in reality is a fee demanded from Rogers by CTV and independent stations for transmitting their signal without giving them a royalty.

Rogers goes on to tell in the radio ads that CTV and other independent TV stations pay $800 million to U.S. television shows and how does that help out the canadian production companies, it's funny to see Rogers whining in radio stations about sneaky & blood-sucking corporations, so why doesn't Rogers make a radio ad about the system access fee tax it charges people when the government has clearly stated that it should not be charged anymore?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23233239 Fri, 23 Oct 2009 22:31:55 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23223704 Croaker : This topic is drifting more towards a Canadian Broadband issue but I don't have a problem with the consumer being aware of the cost for service.

The more transparency the better. Perhaps it's lead to a change in regulatory policy, or not.

It's all good.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23223704 Thu, 22 Oct 2009 10:15:51 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23223494 Stewy :

said by Stewy

:

The CRTC just opened a whole new can of worms with this, basically what Rogers and Bell will end up doing is forcing you to buy a Fee or "insurance" to cover Internet Traffic Management to the tune of about $6.95/month even if you use 1% of your allocated bandwidth and no matter what plan you have. Actually the amount can and will be anything they want and of course they will force this fee unto their wholesalers and all with the blessings of the CRTC.

OMG I'm replying to my own quote. :uhh:

I was thinking about this at around 5am and there's now no limit. What if they get into PBB or Protocol Based Billing and International Internet Peering Fees for if you want to goto websites in other continents.

IIPF $2.95 for Europe
IIPF $3.95 for Asia
IIPF $5.95 for Middle East

$3.95 if you want to use HTPPS or $7.95 if you want to use NNTP, and so on for SMTP, VPN and others.

All under the guise of the Traffic Management and Bandwidth boogieman. CRTC what have you done.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23223494 Thu, 22 Oct 2009 09:45:59 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23220276 Stewy :

said by sbrook

said by blueeyesm

:

Installed and paid for by taxpayers money.

Myth ... the only place tax money has come into play is rural and northern services.

I would tend to agree, tax money is such a dirty term.

It's was more of a system of ah... guaranteed commissions and funded by ah... direct and indirect subsidies.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23220276 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:20:58 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23220269 sbrook : We have some competition in Internet access, but the problem is that we have no competition in the part where the speed of our connection is largely determined. The last mile.

The incumbents have control over the last mile because it is the most costly part to provide and they had an existing network ... wire for phones, cable for TV. Adding the technology to double them up to add internet is not as costly as wiring some alternative feed for internet. Wireless really is not an option as has been shown.

The only companies currently to have the funds to build out a faster last mile service are the incumbents. Why? Because they have infrastructure and rights of way already in place! The cost of some new company to do this is ludicrous.

The result is that there will NEVER be more companies in the market at a last mile level. And our governments, either liberal or conservative are sufficiently capitalistic to not force the incumbents to hand off the entire last mile services to some 3rd party let alone, acquire them by nationalization.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23220269 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:20:00 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23220190 sbrook :

said by blueeyesm

:

Installed and paid for by taxpayers money.

Myth ... the only place tax money has come into play is rural and northern services.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23220190 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:08:33 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219943 Stewy :

said by Croaker

:

Yes but, at least it's transparent meaning the consumer must be told exactly how and when.

The CRTC just opened a whole new can of worms with this, basically what Rogers and Bell will end up doing is forcing you to buy a Fee or "insurance" to cover Internet Traffic Management to the tune of about $6.95/month even if you use 1% of your allocated bandwidth and no matter what plan you have. Actually the amount can and will be anything they want and of course they will force this fee unto their wholesalers and all with the blessings of the CRTC.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219943 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 16:29:05 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219663 blueeyesm :

said by Croaker

:

It's their network. Now as long as they treat their retail service in a similar manner it's ok. It's was more than what we had before.

Installed and paid for by taxpayers money.

Did you ever read your bills? They have always stated when they were making changes to your service 30-60 days before. The CRTC just told them to do what they have been doing.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219663 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 15:42:43 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219617 Croaker : It's their network. Now as long as they treat their retail service in a similar manner it's ok. It's was more than what we had before.

Petition the CRTC for effective Open Access regulations if you're not happy.

I know I will be.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219617 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 15:34:42 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219558 blueeyesm :

said by Croaker

:

Yes but, at least it's transparent meaning the consumer must be told exactly how and when.

So, you are ok that Rogers/Bell now have carte Blanche, can decrease the over-all quality of your service while increasing rates 60 days from now, insert new fees and do as they wish, just so long you are told?

I'm sure as hell not!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219558 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 15:24:57 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219409 Croaker : Yes but, at least it's transparent meaning the consumer must be told exactly how and when.

This can be used to distinguish service offerings from competitors. It's better than what we had. Also, VOIP can not be degraded ever and certainly not in order to favor there own offering.

It's not much but it's a start...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219409 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 14:59:12 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219234 Stewy :

said by sbrook

:

but there's nothing in the ruling today that will actually get them off their collective duffs to do anything.

I'm afraid that it's much worst that you think.

Basically what the CRTC is saying that Rogers can do "Economic Internet traffic management" Not only can overages go through the roof but with the blessing of their CRTC friends Rogers if it wants to are now also able to implement Time Based Billing during peak time all under the guise of *cough*traffic managment*cough*.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23219234 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 14:30:57 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23218922 Stewy :

said by Hello_123 :

there is no incentive (as of yet) for ISP's to offer anything faster or cheaper...

Your right in saying that regulations and laws are different, the very laws you referring to are the ones who have given the Telco's such as Rogers a monopoly on the system.

There's no incentive because there's no competition, why would rogers focus on innovation for faster and cheaper when you can milk this overprice and under performing cash cow for years to come.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23218922 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 13:45:38 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23218687 sbrook : Sure you can ... just don't offer TV! You can definitely offer internet ... and with nobody's permission!

But why do you think that Sweden or France or any other country is any different? They all have last mile controlled by somebody. The issue is building out your own last mile.

This isn't about competition. This is about the incumbents milking dry the services they currently provide. The incentive to improve SHOULD be to satisfy the customers' needs and desires. But for our conservative community, the incentive is only barely there.

With the latest round in the UBB / Throttling scandal out of the CRTC, our government through one of its agencies (the CRTC) is continuing to allow this status quo with only a mild rebuke to say that they expect increased spending on infrastructure, but there's nothing in the ruling today that will actually get them off their collective duffs to do anything.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23218687 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 13:17:21 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23218220 anon : I was referring to competition laws and policies, not technology limitations. I can't for example start a cable company inside's Roger's footprint and start offering 100 Mbps service tomorrow... Roger's own the access network, and unless regulatation changes, they will always have this last mile, thus stiffling competition and new entrants. I suppose I can start building my own fiber.. but that would be crazy expensive. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23218220 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 12:32:12 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23218078 sbrook : That's exactly why you CAN compare them!

There's nothing to prevent Canada from delivering 50Mbps service to homes for the amount that we currently get 10Mbps service.

Regulation doesn't stop it. The CRTC doesn't say "You cannot deliver 50Mbps service." Nor does Industry Canada.

There is nothing technologically speaking that prevents Canada from delivering significantly faster speeds on Cable and DSL (Well ... DSL would require more remote slams ... but the technology exists ... it's just the will to install it) Cable's already delivering.

The infrastructure is nearly there. While Bell may be bleating that they don't have the bandwidth so they have to go to UBB, there was no clear evidence of the congestion that they're claiming. And at a high level the cost of stringing another fibre and lighting it isn't THAT high compared, for example, with stringing FTTH. What's missing really is the will to take the step. The confidence to invest the dollars. So, in the meantime they'll milk the existing cow dry but instead of plowing the profits they make doing it back into the infrastructure, they're giving it away to shareholders and to the execs.

France is astonishingly similar to Canada ... I was surprised trekking across the country a couple times in the last few years. Not been to Sweden, but it has climate that is not so dissimilar.

There are two things that make Canada different. The first is the lack of desire by Industry Canada to kick the providers in the teeth and say "We've given you encouragement, now get on with it", and the conservative nature of the investment industry to trust that they'll make the money ... they want guarantees so they're looking for high profit on revenue numbers. Rogers got into trouble when @home went away because they had to go into the ISP business and went to find investment monies to extend the business. Investors saw low returns for the revenue and decided to Junk Rogers credit score.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23218078 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:46:44 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23217738 anon :

said by Xstar_Lumini

:

Ummm what's YOUR point? We are simply telling you that internet speeds are faster and cheaper in other countries and you come up with the silly answer of "different country, different laws, what's your point?".

How does your german autobaun comparison come to play anyways? I can drive at 280 km/h on the 400 north too, who told you I can't? But I can't get 100 mb/s internet speeds here in Canada even if I wanted to, that's my point.

MY point (to make it very clear), is that you can't compare the ISP market from different countries.. it's simply not a fair comparison. Regulations and laws are different, economics of scales are different, technologies are different... and as mentioned previously Canada is a closed market due to government policies and laws. Thus, there is no incentive (as of yet) for ISP's to offer anything faster or cheaper...

This whole thread can be applied to Wireless as well... if you start looking at what we pay for cell phones and rate plans, it's the same observation... extremely cheap in other countries compared to North America.

Btw, you CAN get 100 Mbps here, get a business line from an ISP provider that offers it..Yeah, it's extremely expensive and stupid... but so is driving 280 km/h on the 400.

The autobahn comparison is simple, you can legally drive 280 km/h there, but not here, why? Because of government laws, and to an lesser extent, the road infrastructure cannot support cars driving at that speeds. This is the same reason why our broadband speeds are behind other countries.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23217738 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:31:01 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23217121 JAC70 :

said by Xstar_Lumini

:

I can drive at 280 km/h on the 400 north too, who told you I can't?

Sure, but your overage fee will be $10,000.;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23217121 Wed, 21 Oct 2009 09:16:19 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23215727 Xstar_Lumini :

said by Hello_123 :

said by Stewy

said by Hello_123 :

So we are getting there, but slowly.

So... What's your point?? I can try 280 km/h on the Autobaun in Germany. Diffferent country, different laws, and more importantly, different markets.

Ummm what's YOUR point? We are simply telling you that internet speeds are faster and cheaper in other countries and you come up with the silly answer of "different country, different laws, what's your point?".

How does your german autobaun comparison come to play anyways? I can drive at 280 km/h on the 400 north too, who told you I can't? But I can't get 100 mb/s internet speeds here in Canada even if I wanted to, that's my point.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23215727 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 22:37:52 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23214086 Stewy :

said by Hello_123 :

So... What's your point??

no point, just showing how pathetic our world class internet is. While others are moving ahead by leaps and bounds we are shackled and are competing with a third world internet.

:huh:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23214086 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 17:04:15 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213928 Croaker : I agree.

When I use the term open, I mean one where the gatekeeper (phone/cable/fiber) cannot erect barriers to entry. A mythical effective open access regime. Enough countries have chosen variations thereof to allows us to borrow from the best. That's one advantage of lagging so far back...

You only need one player to provide the infrastructure. What we need are many service providers on top of this infrastructure. Without choices, there are no natural competitive forces driving speeds up, prices down or rewarding innovation/efficiency.

It's always been about the services and not the number of pipes connecting a home! In the real world, we all share the same road leading to the shopping mall. We don't all buy from the same vendor in that mall...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213928 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 16:33:21 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213722 sbrook : I think you need to go to some of these countries with higher performance and see how much control government has over industry. You would be surprised.

If we had a totally open marketplace in Canada, there would be 2 players in any market area ... cable and telco. They would not provide TPIA in any form.

How much interference is government allowed to provide effective open access? People say we have too much control as it is and yet the majors keep attempting to whip minor players.

Canada will never have effective competition as long as the two major players own so much of the networks from last mile to Internet gateway.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213722 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 15:57:44 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213441 Croaker :

said by sbrook

:

The flip side ... why should Sweden and a host of other countries have faster for similar cost internet than us?

Bud, you know the answer to that already. It's called an open marketplace where regulation is limited to providing effective open access.

New entrants with, or without, innovative service offerings are allowed access to the market. The industry is not allowed to live in a bubble...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213441 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 15:03:05 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213325 sbrook : The flip side ... why should Sweden and a host of other countries have faster for similar cost internet than us?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213325 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 14:39:11 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213266 Croaker :

said by sbrook

:

Why should we have slower ISP connectivity ?

Because there's no need to provide it. It's not like there's a competitor waiting on the sidelines... The marketplace is completely insulated from reality. As long as the industry operates in a regulatory bubble - make do with your horse and buggy!

What are you, some kind of a commie? ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23213266 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 14:27:59 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23212953 sbrook : Yup, we can't drive anything over the pedestrian 100km/hr here ... so? Does that mean our car makers are only selling cars that can do 100 km/hr? Nope, we can buy cars that do those blistering speeds here providing they meet our pollution and safety standards.

Why should we have slower ISP connectivity ? A computer connecting to the net is a computer connecting to the net. Swedish users like more than just Abba and information in Swedish so they wanted and got faster speeds. Looks like the same stuff we want.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23212953 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 13:39:41 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23212669 anon :

said by Stewy

said by Hello_123 :

So we are getting there, but slowly.

So... What's your point?? I can try 280 km/h on the Autobaun in Germany. Diffferent country, different laws, and more importantly, different markets.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23212669 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 13:32:40 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23212327 Stewy :

said by Hello_123 :

So we are getting there, but slowly.

I had a chat with someone from Sweden yesterday, they received an email from their ISP saying that they are removing the outdated 50Mbps link they have and replacing it with a 100Mbps link before the end of the month for the same price, no throttling, no caps, no wallet access fee.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23212327 Tue, 20 Oct 2009 11:59:19 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23210148 ModdTaco : This is alot like McDonalds. I some countries the McD's is a very very fancy place with real food like you would find in a restaurant. The reason is because they wont buy what we get at our fast food places. The reason the dont do that here is because we pay for it. We put up with it all. Same thing for DSL and Cable. We pay for it so there is no incentive from the companies to offer better speeds or unthrottled connection. Of course by law they can do whatever we want because our market is un-regulated.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23210148 Mon, 19 Oct 2009 22:51:27 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23210055 Xstar_Lumini : Okay I take back all my comments about planning to change from Rogers to satellite internet, I acquired a flyer from them at their authorized dealer and look at their top-end plan:

Our Fastest Plan
"Pro Plus"
$79.99/mo
1600 Kbps download (1.6 mb/s)
250 Kbps Upload (0.2 mb/s) :uhh:

Alright....... so it's back to the drawing board.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23210055 Mon, 19 Oct 2009 22:27:03 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23207688 mlerner :

said by sbrook

:

Moreover, I'm sure Bell on seeing how few people want their FTTH (due to cost) will go bleating to the CRTC saying "See, we told you it wasn't really wanted".

If they wanted to prove that no one wants FTTH, they went to some considerable expense. Aliant has a good chunk of cash but they still need a good return.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23207688 Mon, 19 Oct 2009 14:53:34 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23207324 anon : I'd love to see a breakdown of speed by isp in canada.

I may not have the fastest in the world, but I average well above 5 megs/sec.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23207324 Mon, 19 Oct 2009 14:24:51 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23206328 sbrook :

said by Hello_123 :

They've JUST launched DOCSIS 3.0 @ 50/Mbps and Bell JUST launched FTTH @ ~20 Mbps

So we are getting there, but slowly.

Given the very poor takeup of these higher speed tiers due to the exhorbitant prices, slowly is going to be an understatement. Were it not for the fact that DOCSIS 3 is going to actually save on performance upgrading for a little while, I'm sure our cable operators wouldn't go with these higher speed tiers.

Moreover, I'm sure Bell on seeing how few people want their FTTH (due to cost) will go bleating to the CRTC saying "See, we told you it wasn't really wanted".]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23206328 Mon, 19 Oct 2009 10:38:38 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23206260 anon :

said by Xstar_Lumini

said by Bytebender

said by Croaker

:

Their job is to maximize revenue. The fact they can do this in a marketplace protected by the regulator from competition and innovation is hardly their fault.

Instead, blame the CRTC and the federal cabinet for allow it.

Not their fault? Who's cash do you think persuaded those regulators to do this to us?

Here in my highrise building (17 floors) it was in the tenants' contract that satellite dishes were not allowed in the property. I later discovered that the landlord got kickbacks from Rogers for this and tenants were at the mercy of Roger's exorbitant & usurious cable TV fees. I was ready to challange this transgression and placed a satellite out of my balcony. As expected a letter was sent to me that I was "breaching the contract". I replied to them that I would take this matter to court and that I had the right to select my provider which was satellite TV. They then warned me that I would get evicted because the satellite dish was drilled on the building's wall (they did not challenged my freedom to choose my TV provider). I simply took off the dish from their wall and set it up on a table, not physically touching their building and sent them a photo. That was that, I was never again warned, that was 7 years ago now my building is full of satellite dishes everywhere.

It is disgusting that a corporation can bribe landlords to infringe on our basic freedoms and our government stands-by and allows it.

PS: It works both ways... There are some buildings were only Bell or Telus is the main provider, this isn't a Rogers specific issue. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23206260 Mon, 19 Oct 2009 10:33:09 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23206307 anon :

said by Xstar_Lumini

said by Manesh

:

we are also the LEAST densely populated country...

That's bull, Moldova is not more densely populated than the GTA, why can't we beat them?

Again the study is a reflection of the whole County... GTA != Canada.

It is already well known that North America (I notice you didn't show USA, but it's also not in your top 15) is slower in deploying faster networks.

They've JUST launched DOCSIS 3.0 @ 50/Mbps and Bell JUST launched FTTH @ ~20 Mbps

So we are getting there, but slowly.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23206307 Mon, 19 Oct 2009 10:32:55 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23205335 Xstar_Lumini :

said by Bytebender

said by Croaker

Not their fault? Who's cash do you think persuaded those regulators to do this to us?

said by Croaker

Not their fault? Who's cash do you think persuaded those regulators to do this to us?
--
reboot, reset, reconfigure, then recycle.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23205162 Mon, 19 Oct 2009 00:07:22 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23205121 Xstar_Lumini :

said by Manesh

:

we are also the LEAST densely populated country...

That's bull, Moldova is not more densely populated than the GTA, why can't we beat them? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23205121 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 23:49:06 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23205053 Croaker :

said by Xstar_Lumini

:

Wait a minute, but aren't we using satellite transmissions when we surf websites in Europe and Asia? How is this any different from me receiving broadband internet by a via-dish ISP? I don't get any latency or slowness surfing the BBC website in the UK for example.

I don't know bud. I was only trying to determine who was offering 100Mbps connectivity over satellite. You saw the flyer, not me.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23205053 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 23:24:13 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23205047 Croaker :

said by Manesh

:

we are also the LEAST densely populated country...

If only if it was that simple. Even our urban areas which are denser to others on that list are much better served. Most have effective open access rules which is a better explanation for the ranking...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23205047 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 23:22:01 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204952 Manesh : we are also the LEAST densely populated country...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204952 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 22:58:08 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204829 sbrook : Nope ... haven't used satellite for transatlatic/transpacific comms in a long time.

Transatlantic/transpacific has gone back to cables ... now fibre cables.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204829 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 22:27:56 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204818 Xstar_Lumini : Wait a minute, but aren't we using satellite transmissions when we surf websites in Europe and Asia? How is this any different from me receiving broadband internet by a via-dish ISP? I don't get any latency or slowness surfing the BBC website in the UK for example.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204818 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 22:25:14 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204357 sbrook : This sounds more like a UHF link using a dish reflector (that makes it *look* like satellite) on the aerial. Latency is the killer on any wireless solution.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204357 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 20:41:24 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204271 Croaker :

said by Xstar_Lumini

:

[...] saw a flyer of a high-speed broadband provider that gives you speeds higher than Rogers via satellite dish, [...]

That doesn't even make sense. Think it through, how many transponders would be needed for 100Mbps? Two or three at least (45Mbps/transponder). How many do you think are on Nimiq 5 to use as an example. I think it's 32 in all but I could be wrong. Anyhow, the whole bird would be dedicated to servicing 10-20 customers. It's no longer broadcast and must be point to point. Does that sound like a viable business proposition to you? Plus, we're talking down link. What would you do for upstream? Also, what you you do for latency? 500ms may be fast but it won't satisfy most gamers.

Anyhow, I'm looking forward to being corrected.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204271 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 20:23:01 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204116 Xstar_Lumini :

said by Hello_123 :

And to the OP, what's there to explain? Canada ISP's is a closed market... duh.

and what exactly did I tried to prove except for that? :uhh:

P.S. I was at a flea market at the 400/Allistown, saw a flyer of a high-speed broadband provider that gives you speeds higher than Rogers via satellite dish, I wonder if the CRTC can defeat this one as *successfully* (not!) it beat DISH and DirectTV from reaching tens of thousands of homes in Toronto :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204116 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 19:45:19 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204113 Croaker :

said by Hello_123 :

And to the OP, what's there to explain? Canada ISP's is a closed market... duh.

+1.

Their job is to maximize revenue. The fact they can do this in a marketplace protected by the regulator from competition and innovation is hardly their fault.

Instead, blame the CRTC and the federal cabinet for allow it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204113 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 19:44:11 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204005 anon : The title of this thread should be changed, the study is related to all of Canadian ISP's, not specifically to Rogers.

And to the OP, what's there to explain? Canada ISP's is a closed market... duh. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204005 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 19:25:22 EDT Re: Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204003 Robrr : You mean ISP's in Canada in general.

This really isn't a Rogers specific topic but the facts are already well knows.

Rogers and Shaw to some extent have helped Canada catch back up in the speed race but it will cost you dearly]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23204003 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 19:20:36 EDT Rogers Gets Pathetically Creamed By Other World ISPs http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23203944 Xstar_Lumini : It's funny that we in Ontario would think to ourselves we might be among the fastest world's ISP's but boy are we in for a distasteful surprise, nations such as Moldova and the Alan Islands cream Rogers broadband extreme both in download speeds and upload speeds up to a whopping 5 times faster, for example the Alan Islands have an average upload speed of 5.33 Mb/s, Lithuania has an average upload speed of almost 9 mb/s, while Korea's download speeds average 21.79 mb/s while paying only about $22 CAD a month.

Any Rogers apologists want to explain this one away?

Top Countries by Download Speed

1. 21.79 Mb/s Korea, Republic of
2. 16.05 Mb/s Japan
3. 14.90 Mb/s Aland Islands
4. 13.47 Mb/s Lithuania
5. 13.41 Mb/s Latvia
6. 13.28 Mb/s Sweden
7. 12.91 Mb/s Romania
8. 12.38 Mb/s Netherlands
9. 12.06 Mb/s Bulgaria
10. 10.05 Mb/s Moldova, Republic of
11. 9.53 Mb/s Hong Kong
12. 8.98 Mb/s Slovakia
13. 8.93 Mb/s Andorra
14. 8.66 Mb/s Portugal

36. 5.74 Mb/s Canada ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23203944 Sun, 18 Oct 2009 19:06:43 EDT