Topic 'Bay Bridge cable .....' in forum 'Northern California' - dslreports.com

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Wed, 11 Nov 2009 03:35:01 EDT

Wily_One posted :

said by Jtmo:

200 foot nose dive over the rail, poor driver.

No kidding.

A blurb in the newspaper said he "died instantly". Upon impact on the ground it was instant, but I think there would be a terrifying few seconds leading up to that as he fell.

And now I see that the driver's family wants to sue Caltrans. Natch.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 10 Nov 2009 20:47:46 EDT

Defcon888 posted : Caltrans should post these signs throughout the entire east span!

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 10 Nov 2009 12:52:19 EDT

GemSnake posted : I think the problem is people do not expect for the speed limit to fall by 10mph in the middle of the bridge. Don't be surprised if they lower it to 40 for the entire bridge.
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 10 Nov 2009 12:33:20 EDT

sashwa posted : I haven't been on the bridge since the new curve was added.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 10 Nov 2009 12:31:17 EDT

Boricua65 posted :

said by sashwa:

Thanks. How terrible. There has sure has been a string of bad luck on the Bay Bridge lately. :(

Actually, I think they fracked up on that curve, besides too many (add expletive here) driving too fast. I was on the bridge for the NACA's Save Your Home Event saw what the hubub is all about. If people didn't drive soo fast this wouldn't be happening. BTW, crossing that section made me nervous (and usually I'm not) because of (insert expletive here).
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 10 Nov 2009 10:38:01 EDT

sashwa posted : Thanks. How terrible. There has sure has been a string of bad luck on the Bay Bridge lately. :(

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 10 Nov 2009 10:32:33 EDT

PrntRhd posted :

said by sashwa:

What did I miss? I've been on the East Coast since last week vacationing.

3AM Monday a WB big rig loaded with Asian pears went off the upper deck S-curve and landed 200 feet down on YBI. The driver had been going 50 MPH when entering the curve section and CHP says the load shifted. Driver and the truck totally destroyed.
Nothing damaged on the bridge but it will cause CalTrans to redo signage and paint the sides with reflective paint.

Previous Monday at 9 AM they reopened the bridge, the repair on the eyebar has been installed in reverse and the tension rods now are aligned down the cracked bar itself and are wrapped to prevent movement.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 10 Nov 2009 07:10:54 EDT

sashwa posted : What did I miss? I've been on the East Coast since last week vacationing.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 10 Nov 2009 00:43:28 EDT

PrntRhd posted :

said by Defcon888:

said by GemSnake:

Well, it's not cable per se, but the s-curve has claimed it's first fatality.

It's seems that all these "high-profile" crashes have taken place on the upper deck. Why is it? It curves the same way for people on the lower deck as well.

I think it is because the "openness" of the upper deck allows people to drive faster, while the "enclosed" lower deck may cause people to drive a bit slower (more carefully).

Personally, I find the downhill approach eastbound to be more scary than the uphill westbound approach toward the tunnel.

Driving too fast on a curve with a tall big rig is what caused this.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 10 Nov 2009 00:22:40 EDT

Jtmo posted : 200 foot nose dive over the rail, poor driver.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Mon, 09 Nov 2009 16:45:24 EDT

Gbcue posted :

I've driven it in both directions and it's just an ordinary curve to me.

For somebody who almost never drives on the Bay Bridge, it wasn't unexpected at all.

It must be weird for those who drive it every day?
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Mon, 09 Nov 2009 13:54:00 EDT

Defcon888 posted :

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Mon, 09 Nov 2009 13:22:42 EDT

GemSnake posted : Well, it's not cable per se, but the s-curve has claimed it's first fatality.

It's seems that all these "high-profile" crashes have taken place on the upper deck. Why is it? It curves the same way for people on the lower deck as well.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Thu, 05 Nov 2009 20:51:59 EDT

B52GUNR posted :

said by wilbilt:

said by B52GUNR:

But I'm sure it's only temporary, like all the other toll hikes are.

Like that sales tax hike to "rebuild the Bay Area" after the 1989 quake?

I notice that one is still with us 20 years later.

Exactly. Once they get their grubby paws on that money, good luck getting it back.
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Wed, 04 Nov 2009 22:09:03 EDT

wilbilt posted :

said by B52GUNR:

But I'm sure it's only temporary, like all the other toll hikes are.

Like that sales tax hike to "rebuild the Bay Area" after the 1989 quake?

I notice that one is still with us 20 years later.
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Wed, 04 Nov 2009 16:55:19 EDT

B52GUNR posted : But I'm sure it's only temporary, like all the other toll hikes are.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:03:47 EDT

Boricua65 posted : It never ceases to amaze me during a crappy economy everybody and their mama wants to raise prices :uhh:.
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 03 Nov 2009 23:20:12 EDT

PrntRhd posted : Bay Area Toll Authority is proposing the increase to $5. They have to hold public hearings, then vote Jan 27,2010. Increases would take effect July 1, 2010.

The public hearings:
TOMORROW November 4 at 1:30 pm at the MetroCenter 101 Eighth Street, Oakland
Nov 17 at 6:30 pm at SanMateo City Hall, 120 W 20th St, San Mateo
Dec 3 at 6:30 pm at Concord Senior Center, 2727 Parkside Circle, Concord

They want to raise an additional $750 million to make the Antioch and Dumbarton Bridges safer during earthquakes. They also say fewer people are paying tolls over the last 5 years and have rising municipal bond debt to to market changes and claim rising operating expenses.

They want to enact "congestion pricing" up to $6 on certain bridges, and possibly charge $3 for car pools instead of free trips, requiring transponders in the carpool lanes..

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Tue, 03 Nov 2009 11:54:37 EDT

Boricua65 posted :

said by PrntRhd:

And they just voted for another dollar added to the toll, this is not even humorous.

Wha, what? When did this increase happen?

and

When will this increase start?
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Mon, 02 Nov 2009 23:36:34 EDT

PrntRhd posted : I was on the bridge at 09:03 AM this morning, I heard it might open, headed to Emeryville and sneaked over in line on W Grand.
They are now admitting to looking at alternatives to fix the problem should this fix come apart again.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Mon, 02 Nov 2009 12:58:46 EDT

bobrk posted :

said by shinjuru:

Crazy. I wonder what the effects on the entire bay area, in terms of financial costs, is going to be.

Would have been worse if it fell down!
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Mon, 02 Nov 2009 11:59:58 EDT

sashwa posted : And it's finally open in both directions. They are escorting cars across as I type.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Mon, 02 Nov 2009 11:27:07 EDT

sashwa posted : »www.ktvu.com/index.html

»www.ktvu.com/news/21444672/detail.html

Bay Bridge should be re-opened between 8:45 and 9:00 am this morning.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Mon, 02 Nov 2009 01:30:02 EDT

PrntRhd posted : So much for visiting a Brisbane problem account on time tomorrow AM. I will have to go via Golden Gate Bridge. I expect the trip will be 2.5 hours or more.
This type of problem with the repair is what I was noting when this first occurred, they may find the repair is not going to work and would have to have an eyebar fabricated. And they just voted for another dollar added to the toll, this is not even humorous.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Sun, 01 Nov 2009 23:54:41 EDT

shinjuru posted : Crazy. I wonder what the effects on the entire bay area, in terms of financial costs, is going to be.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Sun, 01 Nov 2009 21:49:23 EDT

sashwa posted : Bridge will not be open for the morning comute. They said it failed a test on the evening news. :huh:

»cbs5.com/local/bay.bridge.closur···519.html

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Sat, 31 Oct 2009 14:41:20 EDT

GemSnake posted : Caltrans gets a point for being honest.

There is no good answer to when the Bay Bridge will reopen - Caltrans simply does not know for sure.

This morning, officials reiterated that there is a good chance that Monday morning commuters will have to struggle yet again with packed BART trains and sluggish traffic due to the days-long closure of the Bay Bridge.

»www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c···VXYORsPY
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Fri, 30 Oct 2009 18:09:59 EDT

PrntRhd posted : More funny stuff.

"we knew there were issues with the rods moving when we did the weekly inspections-except for one weekend that we didn't, and we were already designing enhancements when it broke."

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Fri, 30 Oct 2009 17:49:53 EDT

Gbcue posted : »blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/200···il_w.php

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Fri, 30 Oct 2009 17:47:01 EDT

PrntRhd posted : And now they say it will be closed all weekend with a goal of opening Monday.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:41:19 EDT

PrntRhd posted : Possibly, they still have not tensioned the rods and have not had the promised third party inspection.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:33:08 EDT

sashwa posted : You think the bridge will be open for the Monday commute?

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:31:47 EDT

PrntRhd posted : And they still are not done with the installation, CalTrans says they have to align the rods and other parts better.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Fri, 30 Oct 2009 03:08:26 EDT

PrntRhd posted : They say the original eyebar crack did not get worse after the patch failure, and that is some good news.

The latest update is that they plan to have the tension rods and modifications installed and testing done tonight.
They are installing strain gauges on the rods this time to see what is going on with the loads on the rods.
They are using rounded nuts on the rods to keep the rods centered in the plates vs the flat ones used on the failed installation.
They are asking commuters to plan on the bridge being closed but may open it in the morning if the patch tests ok and if third party inspectors and engineers give their approval.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Thu, 29 Oct 2009 18:23:03 EDT

bobrk posted :

said by Gbcue:

said by PrntRhd:

CalTrans spokesman says the cables are actually tensioning rods that took the load off the cracked section of eyebar and they claim "vibration" from the wind caused one of the 4 rods to fail and took out the other two parts connected to it. Their fix is to replace all 4 rods and tie the parts so they won't fall if they break.

See "Caltrans Won't Talk Reopening" link from Sashwa's first link.

The vibration can cause the cable to resonate.

Fatigue is probably a bigger problem.
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bobrk

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Thu, 29 Oct 2009 17:48:33 EDT

Gbcue posted :

The vibration can cause the cable to resonate.
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Thu, 29 Oct 2009 17:31:30 EDT

GemSnake posted : I got dizzy watching that video... :(

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Thu, 29 Oct 2009 17:28:02 EDT

bobrk posted : Yep, I'm a mechanical engineer...

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Thu, 29 Oct 2009 17:20:50 EDT

PrntRhd posted :

said by bobrk:

You say "vibration from the wind" like it's nothing.

I am not trying to be cruel to engineers. Nature is cruel to engineers who underestimate or ignore natural forces.

Side to side movement of a beam or an entire bridge span is also a very low frequency "vibration". Like this famous example:

»www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mclp9QmCGs

Bridges do move with traffic loads, thermal cycles, wind loading etc, and structural engineers must engineer their designs to accommodate those forces, otherwise the structures will fail.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Thu, 29 Oct 2009 13:19:24 EDT

dose posted : I feel bad for my girlfriend who has to commute to work. She spent about 4 hours in the car yesterday :(

»511.org/baybridge/default.asp
Looks like it will be closed at least all day today as well.

I thought I left all my commuting woes back home in Boston with the Big Dig!
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Thu, 29 Oct 2009 13:11:32 EDT

bobrk posted : You say "vibration from the wind" like it's nothing.
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bobrk

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Thu, 29 Oct 2009 03:33:32 EDT

PrntRhd posted : CalTrans spokesman says the cables are actually tensioning rods that took the load off the cracked section of eyebar and they claim "vibration" from the wind caused one of the 4 rods to fail and took out the other two parts connected to it. Their fix is to replace all 4 rods and tie the parts so they won't fall if they break.

See "Caltrans Won't Talk Reopening" link from Sashwa's first link.

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Wed, 28 Oct 2009 18:48:47 EDT

sapo posted : Hopefully not public
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Wed, 28 Oct 2009 17:56:19 EDT

Boricua65 posted :

said by PrntRhd:

No, time to get the span replaced. 20 years after Loma Prieta and still not fixed...

The two Browns held up the Bay Bridge replacement along with some others that had to stick their nose in it, or else the bridge would've been done by now :uhh:.
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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Wed, 28 Oct 2009 14:52:18 EDT

GemSnake posted : That's one memorable vacations...

»www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local-be···ml?tsp=1

Evelyn Mau and her husband got a rough start to their Bay Area vacation. The couple, who had just flown in from Canada, had no idea what hit their rental car as they drove over the Bay Bridge during Tuesday's commute.

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Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Wed, 28 Oct 2009 12:00:10 EDT

PrntRhd posted : No, time to get the span replaced. 20 years after Loma Prieta and still not fixed.

"Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, a civil engineering professor at the University of California, Berkeley who has spent 20 years studying the Bay Bridge, called the initial crack a "warning sign" of potentially bigger safety issues with the bridge.

"The repair they were doing was really a Band-Aid," said Astaneh-Asl, who criticized Caltrans at the time for rushing to reopen the bridge. "The Band-Aid broke, in essence."

Astaneh-Asl said the failure of the repair job demonstrates the need for a longer-term solution. The span's age and design make it susceptible to collapse, especially if commercial tractor-trailers are allowed to continue using it, he said.

"I think Caltrans is putting public relations ahead of public safety," he said."

I was in South San Francisco in 1989 during the quake and we were fed a lot of information by CalTrans public relations after the Cypress Freeway collapse and during the initial SF I-280 repair:

"Double deck freeways are perfectly safe designs"
"The western approaches to the Bay Bridge held up perfectly in the quake, they are safe"
"No need to remove the Embarcadero freeway, it can be retrofitted"
After the 1989 deck collapse:
"The repair we did on the Bay Bridge is safe, motorists will not even know where the problem occurred"

Re: Bay Bridge cable .....

Wed, 28 Oct 2009 10:18:40 EDT

Gbcue posted :

said by PrntRhd:

Wikipedia is already running updated information on the problem in the history of the bridge:
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Franci···y_Bridge
"Engineers have known the cantilever section would likely fail in a major quake for at least 30 years"
An anonymous quote but it is true.

Time for infinite $ for civil engineering.
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