 IPPlanManHoly Cable Modem Batman
join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1 | And the cap prevents what again? Gosh... it's almost November now....
I still don't understand why a cap is necessary if there is a congestion management system in place to prevent "real time" congestion from occurring and affecting users.
And for that matter, how can a few users, supposedly an almost insignificant amount, affect the "experience" for the rest of the subscriber base?
This 250 GB cap, which hasn't changed in a year now, reeks of Comcast's fear of video competition from Hulu, Netflix Streaming, iTunes/Apple TV, and Vudu....
Don't want us cutting the cord to your premium channels/on demand, do ya Comcast?
Not fooling me....
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"We're going to start at one end of (Fallujah), and we're not going to stop until we get to the other. If there's anybody left when that happens, we're going to turn around and we're going to go back and finish it."
Lt. Col. Pete Newell: 1st Inf. US Army |
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 espaethDigital PlumberPremium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2
 ·Clear Wireless
| said by IPPlanMan:I still don't understand why a cap is necessary if there is a congestion management system in place to prevent "real time" congestion from occurring and affecting users. Congestion management systems can only be effective if they are forced to take action by exception, not as a rule.
That's sort of like saying: I have overdraft protection, so I don't understand why I need a budget. |
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IPPlanManHoly Cable Modem Batman
join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1
2 edits | Is that really the case? I'm not sure I agree with that at all.
...and how long does Comcast plan on sitting at 250GB? It's been a year already you know...
...and let's assume that you're right for a second... and if you are, then how will Comcast ever get its system to support a cap higher than 250GB?
It's clear that Docsis 3.0 isn't changing a damn thing. 50/10 and still a 250GB cap... Why not do 100/20 while they're at it?
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"We're going to start at one end of (Fallujah), and we're not going to stop until we get to the other. If there's anybody left when that happens, we're going to turn around and we're going to go back and finish it."
Lt. Col. Pete Newell: 1st Inf. US Army |
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espaethDigital PlumberPremium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
| said by IPPlanMan:...and how long does Comcast plan on sitting at 250GB? It's been a year already you know... Considering the average broadband connection utilization is far below that, the pressure to boost the cap isn't quite as dire as you suggest.
»Cisco: Average Connection Consumes 11.4 GB Per Month
said by IPPlanMan:and let's assume that you're right for a second... and if you are, then how will Comcast ever get its system to support a cap higher than 250GB? Continual upgrades. Reducing the number of modems per downstream channel, further rollouts of DOCSIS 3 CMTS upgrades and user modem upgrades. The capacity of the system can always be augmented for additional cost.
Yes, the cap hasn't increased, but neither has your monthly HSI bill. |
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IPPlanManHoly Cable Modem Batman
join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1
1 edit | said by espaeth:Yes, the cap hasn't increased, but neither has your monthly HSI bill. Hasn't increased? Really?
»Comcast Raises Cable Modem Rental Fee
Additionally, that average amount was called into serious question for a number of reasons in that thread.
Lastly, your argument doesn't hold true because the business tiers provide perhaps 10 times the usage (or more) for around 20-40 dollars more or so per month than the residential tier, with all of the extra goodies included. (Microsoft Email, Web Page, Business level support)
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"We're going to start at one end of (Fallujah), and we're not going to stop until we get to the other. If there's anybody left when that happens, we're going to turn around and we're going to go back and finish it."
Lt. Col. Pete Newell: 1st Inf. US Army |
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espaethDigital PlumberPremium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
| That's not an increase in broadband pricing. Many people, especially members of this forum, own their modem so this change in fees won't affect them.
said by IPPlanMan:Additionally, that average amount was called into serious question for a number of reasons in that thread. People on this forum question the ISPs because it comes from biased sources, then they question the independent sources by challenging the methodology. There are sites like »www.dtc.umn.edu/mints/home.php that have a plethora of different statistics that fall into line with the Cisco 11GB average finding. The point is, even if the Cisco numbers are only accurate +/- 100%, the monthly average is still a full order of magnitude less than the 250GB cap.
said by IPPlanMan:Lastly, your argument doesn't hold true because the business tiers provide perhaps 10 times the usage (or more) for around 20-40 dollars more or so per month than the residential tier, with all of the extra goodies included. (Microsoft Email, Web Page, Business level support) The Exchange accounts and web page infrastructure is dirt cheap to offer and support. As for the bandwidth, you don't get 10x the amount. In most markets, even with a business account, you're not going to be able to pull down 2.5TB and avoid getting a call from Comcast looking to move you to a non-DOCSIS product.
The overwhelming majority of business accounts use far less than 250GB. |
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IPPlanManHoly Cable Modem Batman
join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1 | It absolutely is an increase in broadband pricing... How can you say otherwise? I'm not only talking about members of this forum. The sheeple that rent a modem are paying more too.
You are also disregarding what I said about real-world use. A few streamed HD movies from Netflix/Apple TV/Vudu, and one day HD from Hulu, puts you over that alleged "average" without accounting for any other usage whatsoever.
Dirt cheap to support Exchange and a Web page? Ok, I'll take that as a given. So what about the remainder of the 20-40 dollar difference (probably 15-35 dollars at this point).... That covers the extra bandwidth available over 250GB.... If you're not convinced it's 10x, then let's make it 5x.
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"We're going to start at one end of (Fallujah), and we're not going to stop until we get to the other. If there's anybody left when that happens, we're going to turn around and we're going to go back and finish it."
Lt. Col. Pete Newell: 1st Inf. US Army |
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espaethDigital PlumberPremium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
| said by IPPlanMan:It absolutely is an increase in broadband pricing... How can you say otherwise? Because it's not. Say I buy a car at a dealership and they raise the cost of oil changes, that doesn't mean my cost of ownership goes up. I have other options to avoid the fee, it's not part of cost of the car. The specific line item for HSI service has not increased; the modem rental is an optional part of the service.
said by IPPlanMan:You are also disregarding what I said about real-world use. A few streamed HD movies from Netflix/Apple TV/Vudu, and one day HD from Hulu, puts you over that alleged "average" without accounting for any other usage whatsoever. Sure, streaming a ton of HD content will put you over the average -- but again, actual statistics show a different picture of real world usage than your conjecture.
There are approximately 228 million Internet subscribers in the US, of which approximately 70 million are broadband subscribers. (source: »www.internetworldstats.com/am/us.htm )
According an October 2009 report, 168 million unique viewers watched online videos of some kind. Hulu averages 38.7 million unique viewers a month viewing an average of 15.1 videos. So about 17% of all US Internet subscribers are hitting up Hulu and watching an average of 15.1 videos. So that's like 30 hours of video, right? Not according to the statistics...
•The average Hulu viewer watched 15.1 videos, totaling 1 hour and 32 minutes of videos per viewer.
•The duration of the average online video was 3.8 minutes.
Source: »www.comscore.com/Press_Events/Pr···ewership
said by IPPlanMan:So what about the remainder of the 20-40 dollar difference (probably 15-35 dollars at this point).... That covers the extra bandwidth available over 250GB.... If you're not convinced it's 10x, then let's make it 5x. Again, you're assuming that every business account uses more than 250GB, which the vast majority do not. Have you priced car insurance recently? The premium on a policy for $300k isn't double that of the premium for a $150k max coverage policy. The higher pricing for business connectivity is based around expected higher usage in relation to the average residential connection, not higher usage in relation to users who run to the edge of the cap. |
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IPPlanManHoly Cable Modem Batman
join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1
2 edits | We'll have to agree to disagree on that. The sheeple pay it even if you don't. If they don't consider buying a modem an option, then the higher rental fee is absolutely a service cost increase.
What are the figures for NetFlix, Vudu, and iTunes/Apple TV? Hulu is just starting to offer HD. Netflix HD (720P) , Vudu HD (1080P no less !), and iTunes/Apple TV HD (720P) currently exist. You don't need a ton of streaming either. Just a couple of those movies and you'll be well above that so-called "average", forgetting other usage.
Expected higher usage for business? How many times higher? I don't think using a car insurance analogy is a good one.
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"We're going to start at one end of (Fallujah), and we're not going to stop until we get to the other. If there's anybody left when that happens, we're going to turn around and we're going to go back and finish it."
Lt. Col. Pete Newell: 1st Inf. US Army |
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IPPlanManHoly Cable Modem Batman
join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1 | reply to espaeth
said by espaeth:In most markets, even with a business account, you're not going to be able to pull down 2.5TB and avoid getting a call from Comcast looking to move you to a non-DOCSIS product. The overwhelming majority of business accounts use far less than 250GB. »Re: When do I get the call or will I?
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"We're going to start at one end of (Fallujah), and we're not going to stop until we get to the other. If there's anybody left when that happens, we're going to turn around and we're going to go back and finish it."
Lt. Col. Pete Newell: 1st Inf. US Army |
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espaethDigital PlumberPremium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
| What's your point? That's a guy who claims to have downloaded 3.5TB and upgraded to Business HSI because he thinks it will avoid him getting "the call" --- not that he was a business user and hit 3.5TB.
Again, these are extreme cases -- they have absolutely nothing to do with average use.
The average user doesn't stream Netflix, doesn't have a Vudu box, or doesn't have Apple TV. Only about half of broadband subscribers ever use the free Hulu video offering, and of that group the average person doesn't watch more than about 90 minutes of video.
If you are arguing the cap can be exceeded through media streaming, I won't disagree. My point is that multi-hour media streaming isn't common -- and the numbers show that. |
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IPPlanManHoly Cable Modem Batman
join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1 | My point is that new technology and services develop to market to people who don't do "average". |
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espaethDigital PlumberPremium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
| Broadband access is a product that caters to the masses, it is a series of compromises to meet the feature requirements and price of the intended market.
It's not designed to be everything to everyone, it's designed to be adequate for as many people as possible. |
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IPPlanManHoly Cable Modem Batman
join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1 | Really... You could say that about any product.
The point here is not to "maintain the status quo" either....
You can say "intended market"... Having caps is one way to shape the market and control it so it's yours. |
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