Jtmo
Premium
join:2001-05-20
Novato, CA
 ·Comcast
| reply to silentlooker
Re: Looking for security alarm advice
No
NO fire, but a head leaks/breaks, the smoke detectors will sit there happily watching your house flood at 8GPM.
Yep, known folks it happened to, really fun to come back from dinner and water is coming out of every door.
»yobotsnewhouse.files.wordpress.c···2008.jpg
But, even the best sometimes have issues
»www.blogbat.us/problems2.jpg
»www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvUvG1umqLg
And the one I love, yes it is real.
»www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhdzjNg0···=related |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01 | The way my current system is designed, if sprinkler goes off, smoke detector goes off. It do not makes a difference if it's a leak or sprinklers actually went off. |
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robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
| reply to cabot
said by cabot  :IMHO, for a DIY'r the GE 3 (now simon) is the easiest to install. I have been considering installing a SimonXT in my mom's home. I like the internet monitoring capabilities available with it.
»www.safemart.com/Wireless-Home-S···ONXT.htm
There is even a monitoring app for the iPhone!
»reviews.cnet.com/8301-19512_7-10···233.html |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01
| Looking at that, i can't tell if it's fully wireless or if it's hybrid system. |
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robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX | Differences? |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01
| said by robbin :Differences? Hybrid is combination of wired and wireless. A hybrid system is combination of wired/wirelsss. A lot of hybrid system require that you to have keypad, siresn etc wired. All wireless, let you have everything wireless and no wiring with exception of power to the cotrol panel is required. |
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robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
| reply to silentlooker
If you want an outdoor siren I think it has to be hard wired, otherwise everything is wireless. Here is a link to all of the accessories for the XT
»www.safemart.com/Wireless-Home-S···essories |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01
| Unfortunately that site is pretty limited in the information that it gives. An outside siren can be wireless if your system supports it in terms of "connection". You can just wire it for the power only. |
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robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
| I only posted the link to that site as they have good prices on the system and their monitoring also seems to be good. If you have the ability to install and program a system such as this or any other I would sincerely hope that you have the knowledge necessary to research the info needed (hint -- I would download an installation manual if I were considering the installation of a particular system)!  |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01
| Way ahead of you, already have the installation manual downloaded   but thanks for suggestion. Also thanks for the link, always appreciate an extra place to check the prices |
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dgilbert
Good Bye My Friend
Premium,MVM
join:2002-06-15
none
clubs:
| reply to silentlooker
if you wire a siren for power only, you may as well wire it to the panel. keep in mind that going all wireless will require a LOT of batteries be replaced at one time in several years. some will require replacement sooner if the window/door is opened more often, same with a wireless motion it will require fairly frequent battery changes.
you want a hybrid system and hardwire motions/smokes/entry door/keypad/siren. this way if some jack ass cuts power to your home(this is getting to be SOP here) the alarm battery will still power everything. and that dinky little 4aH battery in teh kit earlier won't do it long.
--
Lack of Preparation on YOUR Part does NOT Constitute an Emergency on Mine! |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01
| The control panel will be on second floor hidden. I don't want to run a wires all over the house to hard wire it. Control panel does come with own siren which i will disable as to hide it. Also backup battery will be connected to the control panel as well as back up gsm. So if they cut cable line in my case alarm can still communicate with alarm center.
Regarding battery replacement, they last good 4-5 years. Yes I might have a big battery bill ever 4-5 years but i am okay with that. |
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dgilbert
Good Bye My Friend
Premium,MVM
join:2002-06-15
none
clubs:
| the siren is comes with is an INDOOR siren, designed to be loud in a house, but not very noticeable outside at all. but it is cheaper to buy the DSC as a kit and then add the other devices than it is to buy teh panel/box/keypad/battery seperate.
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Lack of Preparation on YOUR Part does NOT Constitute an Emergency on Mine! |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01
| said by dgilbert :the siren is comes with is an INDOOR siren, designed to be loud in a house, but not very noticeable outside at all. but it is cheaper to buy the DSC as a kit and then add the other devices than it is to buy teh panel/box/keypad/battery seperate. I am still doing research on the cost and what will cost cheaper/more expensive. I know i can buy wireless door contacts from ebay for $25 instead of 29-31 i seen on other security websites. So still need to do more research to see if buying separately or combo is cheaper. |
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jinjimbob
Troy Mcclure
join:2001-11-13
1 edit | reply to silentlooker
For the battery you select; read the alarm panel manual, it will specify the max sized battery that can be used, this is limited by the charging circuit.
Most standard metal enclosure alarm systems allow you to connect two batteries.
Do not get the all in one units, they can be ripped off the wall, i.e: quicker than keying in the code.
Select a hardwired unit, and then add wireless. Such as one of these DSC (actually owned by Tyco, which owns ADT).
»www.homesecuritystore.com/c-72-h···&mfrid=6
These wireless modules are very small and have fast response times to the panel. »www.homesecuritystore.com/p-431-···sor.aspx , smallest I have seen. I use these.
These will fit in your door frame. »www.homesecuritystore.com/p-429-···act.aspx
When people are saying don't use ADT/Brinks/etc... all these companies are franchise owners for the most part. They all use different hardware, depending on what the local franchise chooses. You can download the DSC manuals, as with other hardware brands. Once you have set it all up, you can use these people, »alarmrelay.com/
For a good company to buy everything from, see here.
»www.homesecuritystore.com/
They will also help you if you call them. |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01
| Jin thank you for reply, i am kind of confused. The alarm panel that i chose will be directly hard wire to the power. All the sensors will be wireless, including keypad. If you set off the alarm and destroy keypads, it will be to late as the alarm already been tripped. So I am confused on what you mean it can easily be ripped off the wall and how that will destroy the system? |
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joako
Premium
join:2000-09-07
/dev/null
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| said by silentlooker :Jin thank you for reply, i am kind of confused. The alarm panel that i chose will be directly hard wire to the power. All the sensors will be wireless, including keypad. If you set off the alarm and destroy keypads, it will be to late as the alarm already been tripped. So I am confused on what you mean it can easily be ripped off the wall and how that will destroy the system? There are two types of systems:
1) Keypad is just a keypad, control panel is in a box somewhere (e.g. closet) Look at the DSC kits as an example. If someone rips off the keypad worst case nothing happens best case it trips the tamper alarm.
2) Keyapd contains the control panel. Someone can rip this out and that is it, your alarm is disabled.
Alarms have an entry delay. Meaning if you enter through the correct door the alarm will not immediately go off (obviously) it will give you 30-45 seconds (average) to disarm the system.
If someone were to remove the alarm control panel during the entry delay your alarm system was just made worthless. An integrated unit is that much easier to quickly rip out.
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PRescott7-2097 |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01
| Thanks for that explanation. The system that i am going to use has own control panel and keypad is just keypad. If they don't enter the code in the permitted time it will go off regardless if they destroy the keypad or not. They will actually have to find the control panel and destroy it otherwise system will going off. |
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Splitpair
Premium
join:2000-07-29
Cow Towne
 ·T-Mobile US
| reply to silentlooker
I can make the following recommendations for what they are worth.
If you can run wiring, do so as much as possible and use wireless as a fallback.
Do use fully supervised wireless, hard wiring being a closed circuit will be supervised.
You can tie in your existing interlinked smokes using a listed relay made for the application, find the manufacturer of the smokes and check their web site or post the model here and someone will be able to help you out. Do note fire alarm circuits are open circuit therefore you must place the end of line resistor (EOL) at the relay for wiring supervision.
And speaking of EOL’s when hard wiring any circuit the EOL needs to be at the far end of the wiring or it will fail to provide short circuit supervision.
ADEMCO/Honeywell Vista is good equipment robust and very configurable. Note if you up-grade the standby battery to a 7 amp hour you may need to also upgrade the plug-in transformer to a 40 VA if it is not one already.
Also, do not cut corners on the battery, one of the best is made by Enersys under the Genesis brand, they cost a few bucks more than most but hold up very well.
Having worked in the industry for many years I have learned the name DSC is an acronym for Dog “poop” Controls, be forewarned.
If you do the install, any reputable alarm company can do the monitoring, do note most control panels Vista DSC etc are downloadable and most monitoring companies require they do the downloading to ensure the panel is programmed properly, however most alarm panels can be central station ID (CSID) locked out which prevents you or anyone else other than the CS from making any changes to the programming, do be sure to have in writing from your alarm monitoring company that they will not lockout your panel.
If you use a Vista insist the monitoring CS utilize Contact ID signaling as it is the most reliable and fastest dial-up reporting method of CS signaling. If the CS claims they cannot do CID find a real CS.
If at all possible place at least one preferably more than one inside sirens in areas away from the control panel, this serves two purposes, the sound will alert you when the fire alarm activates allowing a quick evacuation of the premises and will provide a level of confusion to anyone who may break into the home. Do not under any circumstances have the inside siren near the control panel as that only guides someone who whishes to disable the panel of it’s location, and do provide each siren with a fuse within the panel so in the case someone pulls the siren down and shorts the wiring they pop the fuse and do not shut down or damage the panel.
Also consider as an internal trap installing recessed contacts on selected room or closet doors, that way should someone make it past your perimeter protection they will fall into the trap of a closed door which must be opened to see what is on the other side.
Do locate the control panel in a well hidden location hopefully behind a locked door as once someone gets to the panel it’s game over unless you have supervised long range wireless monitoring.
Any other questions just ask.
Wayne
--
If you cannot fix it with a buttset and some beanies you're not a technician. |
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silentlooker
join:2009-11-01
| Thank you very much for that detailed post. I will make sure that battery i get is 7 amp hour even if it's means upgrading to transformer to a 40 va. I do plan on turning off control panel internal siren as to keep its location hidden. Interesting point about "trap" door, will have to think about that.
I do have an outside house fire alarm that is tied directly to the fire sprinklers/smoke detector. |
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