Topic 'Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input...' in forum 'Canadian Broadband'

Topic 'Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input...' in forum 'Canadian Broadband' - dslreports.com http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23296649 en Wed, 08 Feb 2012 17:44:09 EDT Wed, 08 Feb 2012 17:44:09 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23305626 said by sbrook:

Wouldn't that have been Jim Prentice/Tony Clement ... I think Bernier predates this.
It started with Bernier. "Hands off approach" and all the BS we heard from Prentice was a regurgitation of Bernier.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23305626 Sat, 07 Nov 2009 11:52:27 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23305052 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23305052 Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:11:13 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23304902
Yeah, it would be nice to get to the documents that show "analysis" and debate. But we could start by demanding that the CRTC explain its decisions.

Re: Po0licy directive. The policy directive dates back from when Bernier was in charge.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23304902 Sat, 07 Nov 2009 00:08:27 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23304894 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23304894 Sat, 07 Nov 2009 00:06:00 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23304855
Thank you for your

21(1)(c)

thanks
d
------

Anyways, I suggest you appeal the information that was redacted. State that the public's interest and benefit, in knowing the full and honest opinion the CRTC has of public input outweighs the potential costs/harm.
6600+ comments, on a CRTC issue of all things, where even the CRTC themselves are surprised of the comment-load, should be enough ammunition to start things off.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23304855 Fri, 06 Nov 2009 23:55:51 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23303491
They found a way to twist this so that Bell wins. The R&V request was specific to GAS. CRTC wasn't about to give GAS "thorttle free" service while Sympatico was throttled.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23303491 Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:41:47 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23303453 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23303453 Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:34:23 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23303154 said by sbrook:

There's a summary at the top (P1) yes, but notice it's the cons, no pros ... probably also redacted.
No, it wasn't redacted. All redactions were accompanied by a reference to the section of the law under which they were entitled to make the redaction. There are no such notations on that page.

I've gone through hundreds of the public comments, and I can say that the summary is fairly representative of the comments submitted. Only the cons are shown, because there simply weren't any pros.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23303154 Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:26:42 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23302042
I've seen tons of documents released under FoI requests in several countries and altogether too many were simply the salutation and complimentary closing or page numbers. Totally inadequate.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23302042 Fri, 06 Nov 2009 13:06:59 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23299900
What he got was the extend of discussions within the CRTC about the public submissions.

My guess is that the people processing the request forgot to look at the powerpoint presentations made by analysts to the commissioners to find the page where the public comments might have been mentioned.

But the specificity of his request did result in the small amount of documents being copied to him.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23299900 Fri, 06 Nov 2009 01:17:01 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23298425 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23298425 Thu, 05 Nov 2009 19:29:55 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23298136
While individual comments wouldn't have been presented to the commissioners, the comments, as a whole, would have been discussed.

Also, what was included in your "result" were the presentations made to the commissioners. Thos would have yielded more information on how the analysts take all the submissions and pass it through their "reader's digest" machine to make simple powerpoint presentations to commissioners. This is where you see what arguments were and weren't considered.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23298136 Thu, 05 Nov 2009 18:24:43 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23297895 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23297895 Thu, 05 Nov 2009 17:27:28 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23297567 said by jfmezei:

Is the pdf you posted *ALL* of what they sent you ?
This PDF is the entirety of everything the CRTC sent me, with the exception of the 1-page cover letter, which I did not include for privacy reasons. There was nothing of significance in the cover letter.

It did seem a little short on substance to me. What I can surmise from this response is that there was no significant analysis or consideration of anything submitted by the public. That's a little hard to prove, however, given that everything of any substance whatsoever was redacted.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23297567 Thu, 05 Nov 2009 16:20:10 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23297513
What I had done my request for the throttling decision 2008-108, I had asked for communications/presentations between analysts and the commissioners. What I got were a couple of PDFs which the analysts used when making the summary to the commissioners. It showed which points they discussed and which ones they ignored. And there were a couple of goodies, such as proof the commissioners knew that Comcast was discriminatory.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23297513 Thu, 05 Nov 2009 16:10:40 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23297228 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23297228 Thu, 05 Nov 2009 15:26:04 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23296848
What is there is an unbiased summing up of the 6000+ complaints they received on the first page, and indications in the rest of the documents that the volume of feedback surprised them.

Here's a transcript of the first page:

said by CRTC :

RELEASE PACKAGE (Guspaz: handwritten note)

P - Podiiic (Guspaz: Handwritten, illegible)
- olt rbf slci (Guspaz: Handwritten, illegible)

DONE - A, B, C, .... V, X, Y, Z

Against
- Not form letters; many are short; most are considered; some include links to articles websites;
- Very strong concern that Bell and cableco are effectively a duopoloy; bell is using market power to squeeze independent ISPs and with the negative effect it will have on the amount of retail IS choice available to consumers
- Bell would be effectively dictating independent rates and marketing; limiting consumer choice
- Numerous former Bell customers dissatisfied with Bell service
- IS market is dominated by telco and cableco
- concern re Canada slipping position internationally regarding internet development; internet in Japan, Australia (a few in particular), Europe, US referred to
- concern re price increases

- UBB will affect all indep ISPs because no advantage in using indep ISP

!

000001

I believe that should be accurate, most of the errors in it are in the original document.

Note: That gap in the bullet list is there in the original, it was likely either censored or a typo.

Note: The handwritten stuff might be "Produce at something"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23296848 Thu, 05 Nov 2009 14:16:29 EDT Re: Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23296738 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23296738 Thu, 05 Nov 2009 13:53:11 EDT Here's how seriously the CRTC takes public input... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23296649
The text of my request, as quoted in their cover letter, was as follows:

Memos, reports, emails and other documents pertaining to comments from the public submitted online referencing file # 8740-B54-200904971 (TN242), particularly in relation to their use or utility when formulating decision for Telecom Order CRTC 2009-484, including summaries, directives and opinions.

Attached is their response.

DOC_20091105···2634.pdf
CRTC 2009-484 - ATIP

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Heres-how-seriously-the-CRTC-takes-public-input-23296649 Thu, 05 Nov 2009 13:36:58 EDT