 hobgoblinSortof AgoblinPremium
join:2001-11-25
Orchard Park, NY
kudos:4 | reply to Rob
Re: No excuse.. said by Rob:There's simply no excuse why every home in the U.S. cannot subscribe to DSL. If they have access to a phone line, they should have access to DSL. The same goes with cable TV. There's just no valid excuse. This is why I don't support giving any funding to Comcast, AT&T, Verizon or any of the big companies to expand their network. IMO, they haven't made the effort, and therefore don't deserve any help. So are you saying that a public company (lets say Comcast) has to run cable to every home in their footprint no matter how rural it is? This may mean that they may never get a return on their investement?
ROI is a very valid excuse for a company whose sole purpose is to make money. Telco's and Cable companies are not charities.
Hob
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"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson
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| I think everybody agrees on this. The question now is how to subsidize these deployments. |
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iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 Reviews:
 ·Comcast
| Don't subsidize them. Make any telco who doesn't serve 100% of their customers out of a certain CO give the CO over to a cooperative. Or at least hand over control of the affected lines to the cooperative. Also make the ILEC give the cooperative reasonable pricing on bandwidth ($500 for a 10 Mbit connection, $1000 for a 30 Mbit connection).
Co-ops allow for cost-based pricing, so if it's more expensive to deploy DSL to an area they can pass the costs on without anyone complaining. $70 3M DSL IMHO is better than no DSL, or $70 1.5M satellite. |
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Host:
Road Runner
PC gaming GAMES
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1 edit | Don't subsidize them. Make any telco who doesn't serve 100% of their customers out of a certain CO give the CO over to a cooperative. Or at least hand over control of the affected lines to the cooperative. Also make the ILEC give the cooperative reasonable pricing on bandwidth ($500 for a 10 Mbit connection, $1000 for a 30 Mbit connection). That works too.  My point being the argument isn't over whether companies have the right to make an investment return, it's about where to go from here.
The problem I think you'd find with your model is that these carriers often want their cake and eat it too. They want to be able to selectively not service a market, but they want the possibility left completely open should they sometime decide to (look at municipal broadband bans). Also, what happens should the Co-Op fail? Does the government step in to subsidize? |
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And when the co-op "fails" who is going to pick it up? The gov't? |
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 RobIn Deo speramus, God Bless the USAPremium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
kudos:2 | reply to hobgoblin
said by hobgoblin:said by Rob:There's simply no excuse why every home in the U.S. cannot subscribe to DSL. If they have access to a phone line, they should have access to DSL. The same goes with cable TV. There's just no valid excuse. This is why I don't support giving any funding to Comcast, AT&T, Verizon or any of the big companies to expand their network. IMO, they haven't made the effort, and therefore don't deserve any help. So are you saying that a public company (lets say Comcast) has to run cable to every home in their footprint no matter how rural it is? This may mean that they may never get a return on their investement? ROI is a very valid excuse for a company whose sole purpose is to make money. Telco's and Cable companies are not charities. Hob I understand they aren't charities, but if they want to have franchise agreements that gives them sole control as the provider in that market, then yes, they need to run cable to every home in their footprint.
Just look at how far BellSouth went when Lafayette wanted to run their own fiber network.
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iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 | reply to Karl Bode
Give me an example of when a cooperative has failed. By definition it's a very hard thing to do. There has to be no demand for services rendered in order for that to happen. |
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Airwolf7Premium
join:2004-12-12
Franklin, KY
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Comcast
 ·AT&T Southeast
| reply to Karl Bode
said by Karl Bode:I think everybody agrees on this. The question now is how to subsidize these deployments. The $98,000,000,000 that was wasted in fiscal year 2009 would be one Hell of a start!
We could start a ten year plan today using money that would otherwise be wasted. I bet that $1,000,000,000,000 would buy some real nice Internet service.
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More than $98 billion in improper gov't payments »news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091118/ap_···nt_waste
"WASHINGTON – More than $98 billion in taxpayer dollars spent by government agencies was wasted, much of it on questionable claims for tax credits and Medicare benefits, representing an increase of $26 billion from the previous year." |
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Host:
Road Runner
PC gaming GAMES
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| reply to iansltx
Not saying it's going to. I like the Co-Op model. I've been watching my Uncle negotiate through one in Virginia with great interest. But what happens if it does? Assuming it becomes the defacto model for all coverage gaps, isn't the possibility viable? Don't get me wrong, I like the idea. |
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| reply to hobgoblin
Umm, actually, YES, Comcast has to run cable to EVERY HOME in their footprint, at least in the states that haven't been bought by the telco's. Part of the agreement to let comcrap (and telcos) to use the poles (owned by electric company), is that the LOCAL BOARD forces them to provide telephone and cable to anyplace that has electricity. At least that's the way it is where I live. And guess what, the LOCAL board is a GOOD thing. Every home has electricity, telephone and cable BECAUSE it's a MONOPOLY. Guess what, telcos and cables do not have a right to RIP OFF PEOPLE simply BECAUSE they are a monopoly, in fact, their profits should be LIMITED because they are a monopoly,
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The happiest countries are the most secular. The struggle AGAINST corporations is the struggle FOR humanity! |
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Road Runner
PC gaming GAMES
PC gaming Tech
| reply to Airwolf7
Shhhh! In order to have a conversation with people in the industry, you have to pretend their employers haven't gotten billions in unaccountable tax breaks and subsidies over countless generations to provide service only partially delivered and at exorbitant prices.
What, are you new at this? |
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 DaveDudeNo Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey
kudos:1
 ·Vonage
·ViaTalk
| reply to Karl Bode
said by Karl Bode:I think everybody agrees on this. The question now is how to subsidize these deployments. After the bailouts, and Obamas spending spree, there isnt any room for subsidities. Broadband will become more of a luxury in the years to come. |
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| This country is so rich, it's mistakes wind up feeding the poor. Have some optimism, regardless of partisan dysfunction.  |
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That may be true in your area, but in mine, the CATV company only has to place cable down a road that has a minimum of 20 subscribers per mile. |
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 FBGuyyippee ki yayPremium
join:2005-03-19
·Comcast
 ·T-Mobile US
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| reply to Karl Bode
said by Karl Bode:This country is so rich, it's mistakes wind up feeding the poor. Have some optimism, regardless of partisan dysfunction. yea people tend to forget that the US is god awful rich compared to the rest of the world. but then again, americans like to think of themselves an awful lot anyways.
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sbcglobal.net speedtest result 11/11/09 - 5256kbps |
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DaveDudeNo Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Vonage
·ViaTalk
| said by FBGuy:said by Karl Bode:This country is so rich, it's mistakes wind up feeding the poor. Have some optimism, regardless of partisan dysfunction. yea people tend to forget that the US is god awful rich compared to the rest of the world. but then again, americans like to think of themselves an awful lot anyways. I think you need to visit the UAE, and some other countries around the world. The USA isnt the richest in the world.
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FBGuyyippee ki yayPremium
join:2005-03-19 Reviews:
·Comcast
·T-Mobile US
·AT&T U-Verse
1 edit | said by DaveDude:said by FBGuy:said by Karl Bode:This country is so rich, it's mistakes wind up feeding the poor. Have some optimism, regardless of partisan dysfunction. yea people tend to forget that the US is god awful rich compared to the rest of the world. but then again, americans like to think of themselves an awful lot anyways. I think you need to visit the UAE, and some other countries around the world. The USA isnt the richest in the world. I have visited those countries. I served in the Army for 9 years. I've been to Qatar, Germany, Japan, South Korea, Egypt, Kuwait and last but not least Iraq.They are poor. dirt poor. the smaller countries are able to hide it a lot better than the big ones. well and obviously the warzone ones.
I did some looking online and apparently your right though. I wouldn't consider UAE a country though. maybe a state. its so small its embarassing to call it a country. i mean, c'mon its the size of maine. lets not mention its only 38 years old. a lot of the people on this forum are older than that.
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sbcglobal.net speedtest result 11/11/09 - 5256kbps |
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| reply to Karl Bode
said by Karl Bode:I think everybody agrees on this. The question now is how to subsidize these deployments. Charing someone $12,500 to run some coaxial cable certainly is not the way to do it. |
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