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cdubb64

join:2009-12-30

What is this i found under the wallpaper in my kitchen?

I had some errands to run today and my wife decided to start taking down the wallpaper in our kitchen. When i came home, i found this:

A closer view:


I'm not sure what it is. it almost feels like felt. The wallpaper only goes half way up the wall. Could this be asbestos? Has anyone had experience with this?


robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1

1 edit

It looks to me like the backing from old wall paper which wasn't entirely removed. How old is your house?

[edit] If your house was built before 1980 and there was vinyl wallpaper, then it very likely could have asbestos in it.

"It is wise to treat any pre-1980s wallpaper as though it contains asbestos"


bastone0

join:2004-08-29
reply to cdubb64

I'm with robbin

Does it also by any chance smell moldy and is moist?


cdubb64

join:2009-12-30

the house was built in 1901. the kitchen is really old. If it is asbestos? what do i do now?



Jtmo
Premium
join:2001-05-20
Novato, CA
reply to cdubb64

Any wallpaper pre-1980 (even vinyl) should be treated as asbestos. Do not disturb it, call a professional as the fibers float in the air and lodge deep in the lungs for damage decades later.

Note: Pre-1980 vinyl is not high risk due to it is not very friable but a mask and as little exposure and a sealed disposal bag would be in order for vinyl.



tp0d
yabbazooie
Premium
join:2001-02-13
Carnegie, PA
kudos:5

1 recommendation

reply to cdubb64

Spray it down with a spray bottle with water in it, scrape it off the wall, and bag it.

Asbestos is the new lead, everyone is so damn afraid of it. I`ve personally watered down and removed multiple garbage bags of the stuff from old steam boilers, years ago, with absolutely no problems. And no airborne particles. Hell, the stuff is so tame you could eat it wet or dry with no ill effects. Its a natural mineral.

Have you tore out any old plaster in that house? They used asbestos as a filler/binder in plaster for ages. You probably inhaled a large chunk without knowing it.

IMHO mesothelioma (sp) was only a risk for the poor people exposed to asbestos on a daily basis, before the EPA/OSHA wised up to the effects, same as lead. If you respect it, but not fear it, you`ll be fine.

-j
--
if it aint broke, tweak it!!
currently on FiOS (kick aZZ!)



Lurch77
Premium
join:2001-11-22
Oconto, WI
kudos:4

Agree. While I still use precaution while messing with it, the danger has been hyped to sky high limits. We can thank lawyers for this.


dingo4
Premium
join:2009-02-08
kudos:1
reply to cdubb64

Spray it down with a spray bottle with water in it, scrape it off the wall, and bag it.

+1



Jtmo
Premium
join:2001-05-20
Novato, CA
reply to cdubb64

I thought this was common knowledge, but I guess not.

"Often, symptoms and lung fibrosis do not occur and are not noticed for a period of 20 years or more after the asbestos exposure."

I now suffer from tinnitus, ringing in the ears (along with Metallica's drummer), from exposure 20 years ago with loud music and noises. Now, hearing a constant 24 hours a day ringing is better than not breathing.

But, wetting it down will help, but it will spread (and stay) in the house forever. If you are 60 and live alone, go for it.



The Pig
I know you want to be me
Premium
join:2009-09-11
reply to cdubb64

Leave it alone and put plasterboard (not the ones from china) over it. and then paint it.
Asbestos is only harmful when in dust form.



whizkid3
Premium,MVM
join:2002-02-21
Queens, NY
kudos:9
reply to cdubb64

Suggest carefully taking a sample to a local construction lab. (They are all over - look in the yellow pages.) Ask them to test it for asbestos. It will probably cost about $100.

If it is not, you have nothing to worry about. If it is, you can conduct your own abatement, but it will not be easy. Instructions can be found on the web. Suffice to say, it involves wearing respirators and environmental suits. Sealing off the room and creating negative pressure (i.e. box fan in the window blowing out). This is going to cost money, but a lot less than having a professional abatement firm come in.

If you start hammering or screwing boards over it, you will create dust - dust that will be in your house forever.



aurgathor

join:2002-12-01
Lynnwood, WA
kudos:1
reply to cdubb64

I'd simply assume it's asbestos. and remove it with due care.
--
And the winner is:



The Pig
I know you want to be me
Premium
join:2009-09-11

1 edit
reply to cdubb64

You can if you feel you have to remove the Asbestos is to keep it soaking wet so spores don't float in the air.
I'd just cover over it it is not like mold that will seep through drywall or paneling.



cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7

2 recommendations

said by The Pig:

You can if you feel you have to remove the Asbestos is to keep it soaking wet so spores don't float in the air.
You got to be careful about those asbestos spores. They'll blow everywhere and when they settle, they will start to grow new asbestos.

Bobcat79
Premium
join:2001-02-04
reply to dingo4

said by dingo4:

Spray it down with a spray bottle with water in it, scrape it off the wall, and bag it.

+1
Add a little bit of soap to the water.

Bob61571

join:2008-08-08
Washington, IL
reply to cdubb64

Would advise checking with this guy:
»www.masterhandyman.com/



birdfeedr
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-11
Warwick, RI
kudos:9
reply to cdru

said by cdru:

You got to be careful about those asbestos spores. They'll blow everywhere and when they settle, they will start to grow new asbestos.
I thought spores grew up to be pods. »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasion_o···natchers

Mustang52
Premium
join:2005-06-27
Fort Lauderdale, FL

said by birdfeedr:

said by cdru:

You got to be careful about those asbestos spores. They'll blow everywhere and when they settle, they will start to grow new asbestos.
I thought spores grew up to be pods. »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasion_o···natchers
Just...don't...fall...asleep


dbennett1106

join:2000-05-28
Ukiah, CA
reply to cdubb64

That is mold. Remove and replace the sheetrock. Don't screw around with "Sprays", just get it fixed.



Mdoc
Ehh... munch munch... what's up, Doc?
Premium
join:2007-03-27
Sterling, VA
kudos:1

said by dbennett1106:

That is mold. Remove and replace the sheetrock. Don't screw around with "Sprays", just get it fixed.
mold or asbestos? We have two different opinions here!
But let's get it settled as to which it is!

itguy05

join:2005-06-17
Carlisle, PA

2 edits
reply to cdubb64

If it is Asbestos, respect it and try to limit your exposure. Call a pro if you need to.

Here's some asbestos info from the US Department of Health:

»www.hhs.gov/news/press/2001pres/···16a.html

Here's a quote:

quote:
How much asbestos causes illness?

Most people do not become ill from the asbestos they are exposed to. Asbestos exposure becomes a health concern when high concentrations of asbestos fibers are inhaled over a long time period. People who become ill from asbestos are almost always those who are exposed on a day-to-day basis in a job where they work directly with the material. As a person's exposure to fibers increases, either by breathing more fibers or by breathing fibers for a longer time, that person's risk of disease also increases. It can take anywhere from 10 to 40 years for someone to develop an asbestos-related illness after their exposure. Disease is very unlikely to result from a single, high-level exposure, or from a short period of exposure to lower levels.
Blame the Lawyers for the fear of it. It's what they need to do in order to make $$. That link someone posted about wallpaper is from www.asbestos.com which is a website by the "Peterson Firm" which as you can see at »www.petersonfirm.com/ are asbestos attorneys. Hardly an unbiased source for information.


SLD
Premium
join:2002-04-17
San Francisco, CA

1 recommendation

reply to tp0d

cdubb64 - call a professional and disregard the advice on this forum. If you are dealing with asbestos, a professional can give you the correct guidance.
Heresay from DSLR users is *not* good advice when you're dealing with risky problems. Just like asking for medical advice on the Internet isn't recommended.


eakes

join:2000-10-20
Richardson, TX
reply to cdubb64

What that looks like is the felt 'underlayment' that was used under wallpaper in the days before sheetrock. The home I was raised in (built 1937) was wallpapered and had that material under the wallpaper. My mother added a new layer of wallpaper just about every year so by the early 50's there was at least a 1/4 inch thick layer of paper on the walls. I spent most of one summer vacation peeling wallpaper off the walls finding the felt as the last layer. Once the walls were down to bare wood we started with a new layer of felt and more wallpaper.

I don't know what the 'felt' is made of, but if it were my house I would remove it if I so desired without any concern. If you are concerned, by all means have a sample tested before continuing. Once removed I would expect to find either plaster or wood lath underneath.



Noah Vail
Son made my Avatar
Premium
join:2004-12-10
Lorton, VA
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Bright House

1 recommendation

reply to SLD

said by SLD:

cdubb64 - call a professional and disregard the advice on this forum. ....
That sounds a lot like advice. I'd disregard it!

NV
--
In my perfect religion, a giant hole appears and sucks up all the lousy people.
I call it the Crapture.

8744675

join:2000-10-10
Decatur, GA
reply to cdubb64

It looks like the backing from a linoleum-like wall covering that was used in the 1950's. My parent's kitchen had it on the walls. It looked like vinyl flooring with a shiny surface. There was a 4 feet' high section from the floor up that was embossed to look like simulated pea green 4" x 4" tile. The upper half was white with an embossed garden trellis with ivy growing on it. It was easy to clean and held up very well over 25 years until they remodeled. The backing was a paper-like felt as you described, which stuck to the wall when removing it, and it was a pain to get off.

Chances are good it was made with asbestos! Homes were like toxic waste dumps back then. We had asbestos on the walls, the tile floor was asbestos, the insulation around the steam heat pipes were wrapped with asbestos insulation, the attic was full of vermiculite insulation which was found to be contaminated with long shard asbestos, and the siding shingles and roof were asbestos. They spent all summer remodeling my elementary school and used blow-on asbestos on the ceiling of the school boiler room to insulate and fireproof. Our church did the same thing, and we used to throw stuff at the ceiling and play with the asbestos balls that we knocked loose.

I should be dead by now after all that exposure!



Mdoc
Ehh... munch munch... what's up, Doc?
Premium
join:2007-03-27
Sterling, VA
kudos:1

1 edit
reply to itguy05

said by itguy05:

If it is Asbestos, respect it and try to limit your exposure. Call a pro if you need to.

You need to.


Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2
reply to 8744675

said by 8744675:

It looks like the backing from a linoleum-like wall covering that was used in the 1950's.
I agree.... was my first thought when I saw the picture too. But hey, asbestos and mold sound a lot more exciting, so let's just go with that !!


Nick_L
Premium
join:2003-01-22
Pittsburgh, PA
reply to 8744675

Asbestos is not toxic. You could live a long, happy life in an entirely asbestos covered room with no ill effects. You could lick the walls every day if you wanted to with no ill effects.

The problem is when it becomes friable, or airborne. It is aspirated into the lungs where it "sticks" for a lack of a better word. This causes the lungs to react and try to fight it off, which causes scarring.

So, don't breathe it in, don't leave the dust for others to breathe in and you should be ok. When id doubt, leave it alone.

Personally, if it was my home I would add a layer of drywall, as someone else suggested. Proper instalation of drywall shouldn't create dust (excluding the joint sanding, of course). To be on the safe side, I would NOT use a hammer and nails, but a screw gun.

Nick



The Pig
I know you want to be me
Premium
join:2009-09-11
reply to birdfeedr

said by birdfeedr:

I thought spores grew up to be pods.
Asbestos spores do grow up to be pods in your lungs!


norton

join:2005-08-03
Howard City, MI

1 edit

1 recommendation

reply to dbennett1106

mix up in a spray bottle a 20% solution of bleach and water. Spray on area - if it disappears in 20 minutes then I would assume it is mold.