dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
3463
share rss forum feed


fuziwuzi
Not born yesterday
Premium
join:2005-07-01
Atlanta, GA

1 edit

Throttling?

said by JohnInSJ:

said by fuziwuzi:

I am quite aware of what Powerboost is and isn't, I'm not an idiot.
Good, are you ready to try and fix your issue now?
quote:
And aren't you so lucky! I'm not that lucky here.
Good. Now we have established you're having a site-specific issue. I am not lucky, I am simply not having any service issues.
quote:
The Comcast technicians who have been to my location say everything is working as designed.
Were you seeing the performance issue during the tech visits? Did they reproduce the exact issue on their equipment? If not, then likely the tech was correct - as far as they could see, you were operating correctly at that moment.
THEY told me the problem is actually how the system is designed, so in effect, it is working as it is supposed to, according to them.
If all they had to go on was your description, then I would expect that would be the on-site tech's answer to why your system, which seemed to be working correctly, would experience slowdowns.

At this point all I can do is join the greek choir and suggest you start a new thread with detailed information and work with both the mass of people here and the comcast techs here to troubleshoot your issue. Because it is a service issue. Plain and simple. Really.
One technician used his own equipment to make an identical FTP file transfer as I had done and saw the exact same issue I described. He said the same thing the other two technicians told me: that is how the system works, there is nothing wrong with my equipment or line.

Now maybe it isn't supposed to be that way, but how am I, just a customer, to know that and, even further, do anything about it when the only people I have to deal with the situation tell me that's how it is supposed to be?

That's the point I've been trying to make.

BTW, a friend who is also in Atlanta, but on the far side of the city from me, is now experiencing the exact same issue now that his service has been "upgraded" to the 12/2 level (previously 6/1). His service level upgrade came a few months later than my neighborhood.

Would most people even notice this? Probably not since the vast majority of people just click and browse, so expecting vast numbers of people to complain is unlikely. Even I'm not saying Comcast is wrong or "evil" or any such thing, I'm simply saying it is happening and statements saying it isn't just aren't true.
--
***************
I think computer viruses should count as life. I think it says something about human nature that the only form of life we have created so far is purely destructive. We've created life in our own image.
- Stephen Hawking


nerdburg
Premium
join:2009-08-20
Schuylkill Haven, PA
kudos:1

1 edit

Am I supposed to know what you're talking about?
--
[Insert Comcast employee disclaimer here.]


cracker 52

join:2007-01-23
Atlanta, GA
reply to fuziwuzi

I'm not trying to berate, condescend or make ad hominem attack, but I don't have any throttling problem when making file transfers here in the Chamblee-Dunwoody part of Atlanta. My brother, who lives near Northlake, doesn't have that problem either. But I'm not saying you don't have a problem where you are. It's just that it's not happening in all parts of Atlanta.


jus10

join:2009-08-04
Sterling, VA
reply to fuziwuzi

For those confused, I believe this thread to be a continuation out of the "Congestion Mangement" thread sticked and this post in particular: »Re: Here we go again about bandwidth throttling ...

quote:
Then my node must be horribly overutilized because I can assure you if I attempt a file transfer at any time of day or night using full bandwidth my speeds will be cut within a few minutes and will remain so. If I stop the transfer and wait, speeds will return to normal. If I manually limit my transfer speeds to about 60-65% of maximum, my the transfers complete as normal.
I think AvonGauss said most of what I would say. I don't see the issue you're talking about. I have pfsense graphs which so solid/maxed out connections either direction. I do use QOS to even things out but even with that turned off, the transfer rates are pretty much maxed out (they go up and down a bit but I can tell the connection is pegged).

I'm on a DS3 connection as far as I know (channels are bonded and I appear to be 16/2 though I don't think I got a letter from Comcast). When they flipped the switch, the channel bonding made a huge difference in eliminating the up and downs in available throughput. I imagine that was caused by local congestion. That seemed to have gone away with the multiple channels. YMMV.


sortofageek
Runs from Clowns
Premium,Mod
join:2001-08-19
kudos:23

1 edit
reply to fuziwuzi

said by fuziwuzi:

One technician used his own equipment to make an identical FTP file transfer as I had done and saw the exact same issue I described.
Would you describe these FTP file transfers and provide a screenshot or two?

Please post the following information:

Answer these "6" questions first, then answer any of the following questions that are specific to your issue:

1) Your location: City and State.

2) A description of the problem.

3) Is the issue intermittent, constant or does it occur at a specific time of day?

4) Your modem make, model & firmware version. How to find firmware version: Access modem

5) Describe any home networking if applicable. (i.e. routers, hubs, adapters, etc.)

6) List any firewall and/or anti-virus software you have installed. Include what version you have.

If you have an issue with slow or fluctuating speed:

• What HSI Tier you are subscribed to: (i.e. 6000/1000, 12000/2000, etc.)

• Post a Speed Test

• Post a Tweak Test

• Post what browser/browsers you are using while running a speed test.
--
Join Team Helix * I am praying for these friends .

AVonGauss
Premium
join:2007-11-01
Boynton Beach, FL
reply to fuziwuzi

said by fuziwuzi:

One technician used his own equipment to make an identical FTP file transfer as I had done and saw the exact same issue I described. He said the same thing the other two technicians told me: that is how the system works, there is nothing wrong with my equipment or line.
Is this when downloading, uploading or both?

Is this a public site that you can identify or a private server somewhere? If possible, what does the trace route look like?

What client FTP application are you using?

Do you have any screenshots that help to illustrate the issue?


JohnInSJ
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA
reply to fuziwuzi

Again, I agree with the above posters.

Let's pretend we have no history here, and you are going to walk us through the problem.

We need to know exactly what you are seeing, what you are trying to ftp from (or to?) and all the info sortofageek asked for.

My own personal suggestion just to verify this is NOT the congestion management is a really simple test:

1) turn off your DSL modem for an hour
2) turn on your modem and as soon as you get sync, attempt the FTP transfer.

There is no way you could be flagged for high use for the next 15 minutes. If your speed is NOT your rated speed, then there is a problem somewhere.

Just as a refresher, this is the description of how congestion management works: »www.comcast.net/terms/network/update/

The Download here is the PDF describing the system:
»downloads.comcast.net/docs/Attac···ices.pdf

The key points being (pp 10)

quote:
starting point for the User Consumption Threshold is 70 percent of a subscriber’s provisioned upstream or downstream bandwidth, and that the appropriate starting point for the User Consumption Duration is 15 minutes. That is, when a subscriber uses an average of 70 percent or more of his or her provisioned upstream or downstream bandwidth over a particular 15-minute period, that user will be in an Extended High Consumption State.
And on Page 11
quote:
A user’s traffic is released from a BE state when the user’s bandwidth consumption drops below 50 percent of his or her provisioned upstream or downstream bandwidth for a period of approximately 15 minutes.
Note that even if you are in this state, your CMTS must also be in Near Congestion State. Since there is NO WAY to know if your CMTS is congested or not, we can only control your end for this test.

So for the test...

Unplugging your modem for an hour will clearly end any current BE state you might be in, since even if your machine is infected with spam spewing malware cutting the link will end all data from your modem.

Once you plug in, you have 15 minutes of grace even if your CMTS is in Near Congestion State. You should see your full bandwidth for the entire 15 minutes. If you don't, then you have an issue.

If after 15 minutes of pounding away (you need to maintain 70% or better usage up or down across the whole 15 minutes) your speed drops, then your CMTS was in Near Congestion. If it drops sooner, then you've got one of two possible problems

1) you're infected with something that is using your pipe (seems unlikely, but worth checking)
or
2) you are having signal issues with your modem, or there are other problems after your modem but in the comcast network
or
3) whatever site you are trying to access is not able to provide as much data as you can consume

Its a simple test, I'd be interested in seeing the results!
--
My place : »www.schettino.us


fuziwuzi
Not born yesterday
Premium
join:2005-07-01
Atlanta, GA

1 edit
reply to fuziwuzi

15 minutes is about right. I have not timed it exactly, but that is the ballpark figure of when I begin to see the issue and also when the technicians see the issue as well.

If the technicians say this is how the system is designed, and my observations agree, then why should I question them and my experience and believe someone in a discussion forum who keeps telling me the problem is anything but the way the system is designed to operate?

I'm through beating this dead horse.
--
***************
I think computer viruses should count as life. I think it says something about human nature that the only form of life we have created so far is purely destructive. We've created life in our own image.
- Stephen Hawking


cracker 52

join:2007-01-23
Atlanta, GA

My experience with premise technicians, here in Atlanta at least, is that generally all they are capable of doing is to measure the signal levels and inspect the cable lines to the pole. They are not network engineers or truly understand the network system/cable plant beyond the premises, in general. So when they talk about the system, they really don't understand what they are talking about. They rather say "that's the way the system is" so they can just close the ticket and move on. They are not liars, they just really don't have much expertise about the network/plant beyond the customer premises.

I believe you stated that the problem started after the upgrade in speeds. This probably occurred when your plant was upgraded to DOCSIS 3.0. So there may be a problem with your modem connection with the upgraded plant, even though D3 is supposed to be backwards compatible.

I suggest you contact CC Steve in the direct help forum to look into this matter. He'll see from your records that the premises tech already visited your place and he should escalate the matter to determine if the problem is with your modem, CMTS, plant etc. He did great work for me when my upstream channel degraded from D2 to D1.1 about a month ago, when it's obvious no premise tech could solve that issue. If a premise tech was used, I would probably get the same answer of "that's the way the system works" as you did.


AVonGauss
Premium
join:2007-11-01
Boynton Beach, FL

1 edit
reply to fuziwuzi

said by fuziwuzi:

If the technicians say this is how the system is designed, and my observations agree, then why should I question them and my experience and believe someone in a discussion forum who keeps telling me the problem is anything but the way the system is designed to operate?
Because some of the people who read this forum were involved in the design, implementation and probably know a fair amount of the code behind the actual system you are blaming? And to be clear, I am not trying to describe myself - I'm a customer, it's a thingy in my book.

said by fuziwuzi:

I'm through beating this dead horse.
That's your choice, its your connection and you're the one that has to deal with it on a regular basis. Although, to be blunt, your apparent lack of desire to provide even the most basic of details makes me doubt you were ever trying to solve the problem.


JohnInSJ
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA

1 edit
reply to fuziwuzi

said by fuziwuzi:

15 minutes is about right. I have not timed it exactly, but that is the ballpark figure of when I begin to see the issue and also when the technicians see the issue as well.
But that will ONLY happen if you are always using more then 70% of your capacity, *and* your node is saturated ALL the time.

Run the test. See what happens. You have nothing to lose at all.

Edit: change happy to happen.
--
My place : »www.schettino.us


nerdburg
Premium
join:2009-08-20
Schuylkill Haven, PA
kudos:1
reply to cracker 52

said by cracker 52:

My experience with premise technicians, here in Atlanta at least, is that generally all they are capable of doing is to measure the signal levels and inspect the cable lines to the pole....
That is correct. The guy that installs your cable and gets sent on trouble calls is an expert from the tap to the customer equipment. They are not network/engineer guys.
--
[Insert Comcast employee disclaimer here.]


Dspairl
Premium
join:2004-06-09
Norwich, CT

said by nerdburg:

That is correct. The guy that installs your cable and gets sent on trouble calls is an expert from the tap to the customer equipment. They are not network/engineer guys.
God i'd really shutter to think of that idea if they were we'd all be up the creek without a paddle...


Tordek
Make the outages go away
Premium
join:2009-09-07
Great White
kudos:2
reply to fuziwuzi

Yea i agree..

It would be like a residential electrician, working in a Nuclear Power plant.

They can do the job right? They are both electrical in nature.



EG
The wings of love
Premium
join:2006-11-18
Union, NJ
kudos:10

1 edit

Yeah, but the guy who has more knowledge may be able to say;

(quote) "I can do what you can do, but you CAN'T do what I can do"..



jlivingood
Premium,VIP
join:2007-10-28
Philadelphia, PA
kudos:2
reply to fuziwuzi

Just want to point out that very little of the info requested in »Re: Throttling? was posted by the OP here. Without that, nothing further can be done. Posting that information is relatively easy and is encouraged.
--
JL
Comcast

Expand your moderator at work


C_Chipperson
Monster Rain
Premium
join:2009-01-17
00000
kudos:3

1 edit
reply to Anon

Re: Throttling?

said by sortofageek:

said by fuziwuzi:

One technician used his own equipment to make an identical FTP file transfer as I had done and saw the exact same issue I described.
Would you describe these FTP file transfers and provide a screenshot or two?

Please post the following information:

Answer these "6" questions first, then answer any of the following questions that are specific to your issue:

1) Your location: City and State.

2) A description of the problem.

3) Is the issue intermittent, constant or does it occur at a specific time of day?

4) Your modem make, model & firmware version. How to find firmware version: Access modem

5) Describe any home networking if applicable. (i.e. routers, hubs, adapters, etc.)

6) List any firewall and/or anti-virus software you have installed. Include what version you have.

If you have an issue with slow or fluctuating speed:

• What HSI Tier you are subscribed to: (i.e. 6000/1000, 12000/2000, etc.)

• Post a Speed Test

• Post a Tweak Test

• Post what browser/browsers you are using while running a speed test.
said by fuziwuzi:

Emphasis of the fact that you still haven't answered the standard questions sortofageek See Profile posted above? Is there a reason you won't post this information?


fuziwuzi
Not born yesterday
Premium
join:2005-07-01
Atlanta, GA

said by C_Chipperson:

Emphasis of the fact that you still haven't answered the standard questions sortofageek See Profile posted above? Is there a reason you won't post this information?
See above where I write, "I'm through beating this dead horse." I'm told there is no such thing as "throttling", at least not inside the Matrix.
--
***************
I think computer viruses should count as life. I think it says something about human nature that the only form of life we have created so far is purely destructive. We've created life in our own image.
- Stephen Hawking
Expand your moderator at work


C_Chipperson
Monster Rain
Premium
join:2009-01-17
00000
kudos:3

1 edit
reply to fuziwuzi

Re: Throttling?

said by fuziwuzi :

See above where I write, "I'm through beating this dead horse." I'm told there is no such thing as "throttling", at least not inside the Matrix.
Did someone actually say there is no such thing as throttling?


JohnInSJ
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA

said by C_Chipperson:

said by fuziwuzi :

See above where I write, "I'm through beating this dead horse." I'm told there is no such thing as "throttling", at least not inside the Matrix.
Did someone actually say there is no such thing as throttling?
No, but they did say there was no way this user could blame all their service woes on QoS that might cover a brief chunk of time of their total usage in a day, in rare and unusual situations. And then this user refused to run any tests, post any signals, or otherwise provide any information to troubleshoot their connection or to determine if they were even running into a QoS engagement on their line.

So we're left where we started. No where.

Meanwhile, those of us with functioning connections continue to enjoy the speed they provide.
--
My place : »www.schettino.us
Expand your moderator at work


JohnInSJ
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA

1 edit

Re: Throttling?

Notice how another poster who thought there were stuck in BE state got a verification that their modem had NEVER been in BE state? »[Speed] Help: QoS setting stuck in BE
And then they got their actual service problem fixed?

--
My place : »www.schettino.us



jay608
Going Nucking Futs

join:2007-01-22
Chicago, IL
reply to fuziwuzi

The reason people are calling for a lock is because you are coming here complaining about an issue, but have failed to answer the simplest questions that are in the FAQ's. Even jlivingood who WORKS FOR COMCAST called for the lock because of the failure to answer those questions.

So if you are done "beating the dead horse," then don't post anymore on the thread, UNLESS it the info that is being looked for.

If this seems rude or obnoxious to the mods, then feel free to remove it.



fuziwuzi
Not born yesterday
Premium
join:2005-07-01
Atlanta, GA

I replied because I dislike having my integrity questioned and so I responded.

Given the prevailing attitude here, noticed by me and many others who have contacted me via PM, I don't see much point in seeking any assistance here. This whole issue started with me simply stating my opinion based upon my experiences, I was not asking to be grilled and demeaned. I stand by my opinion and observations.
--
***************
I think computer viruses should count as life. I think it says something about human nature that the only form of life we have created so far is purely destructive. We've created life in our own image.
- Stephen Hawking