 TzaleProud Libertarian ConservativePremium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro | reply to Hpower
Re: AT&T DSL for downloads, Comcast for gaming! said by Hpower:said by inferno:I got AT&T DSL in December just to run torrents 24/7 and I used over 800 gigs of bandwidth in 31 days and they did not say anything... While Comcast terminates you for using 250 gigs a month... Good idea. Gaming barely uses much data. This sucks for comcast peeps. I hate the whole metered billing/usage idea. 250GB is more than adequate for the vast majority of users. If you're using more than 250GB/month, you are taxing the network to an extreme (especially on a hybrid-coax network like Comcast).... If you want to send / receive 800GB/month, you should be on a different type of connection.
If Comcast set the limit at 100GB/month, I would definitely be bitching... Otherwise, this seems quite fair.
-Tzale
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They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-:-
"I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism."~Ronald Reagan
-:-
www.freestateproject.org - LIVE LIBERTY |
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 toddbs98
join:2000-07-08
North Little Rock, AR | Your argument makes no sense what so ever because if the people upgraded to a business account with a higher cap they would still be running on the same crappy hybrid network and on the same oversold nodes.
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Patriots always speak of dying for their country never killing for it. Bertrand Russell
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| reply to Tzale
said by Tzale:said by Hpower:said by inferno:I got AT&T DSL in December just to run torrents 24/7 and I used over 800 gigs of bandwidth in 31 days and they did not say anything... While Comcast terminates you for using 250 gigs a month... Good idea. Gaming barely uses much data. This sucks for comcast peeps. I hate the whole metered billing/usage idea. 250GB is more than adequate for the vast majority of users. If you're using more than 250GB/month, you are taxing the network to an extreme (especially on a hybrid-coax network like Comcast).... If you want to send / receive 800GB/month, you should be on a different type of connection. -Tzale Cool. Just point me to it, since Comcast happens to be the monopoly ISP in my area. |
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 ericn32mehPremium
join:2009-09-23
Costa Mesa, CA
 ·Time Warner Cable
| reply to toddbs98
But they do come with service-level agreements, like 95% of the advertised bandwidth and 40ms ping 95% of the time. If they can't meet it, they'll be forced by the contract to upgrade service so you get what you pay for- and they can't jack up your rate until the contract expires. |
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| said by ericn32:But they do come with service-level agreements, like 95% of the advertised bandwidth and 40ms ping 95% of the time. If they can't meet it, they'll be forced by the contract to upgrade service so you get what you pay for- and they can't jack up your rate until the contract expires. That is somewhat correct - Comcast business does NOT come with an SLA. |
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| reply to toddbs98
said by toddbs98:Your argument makes no sense what so ever because if the people upgraded to a business account with a higher cap they would still be running on the same crappy hybrid network and on the same oversold nodes. Actually, Comcast business is, supposedly, on another network.
And with Comcast Business there is no cap. |
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fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | reply to k1ll3rdr4g0n
"That is somewhat correct - Comcast business does NOT come with an SLA."
... could have fooled me.. My SLA with Comcast Business Class suits me just fine, thank you. |
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fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | reply to k1ll3rdr4g0n
said by k1ll3rdr4g0n:said by toddbs98:Your argument makes no sense what so ever because if the people upgraded to a business account with a higher cap they would still be running on the same crappy hybrid network and on the same oversold nodes. Actually, Comcast business is, supposedly, on another network. And with Comcast Business there is no cap. Where are you getting that it's no another network? It's the same network.. sorry.. |
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| reply to PapaMidnight
Comcast Business?
But then again, that's not really their problem is it? |
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| reply to fiberguy
said by fiberguy:"That is somewhat correct - Comcast business does NOT come with an SLA." ... could have fooled me.. My SLA with Comcast Business Class suits me just fine, thank you. Perhaps different markets?
But when I signed up they told me no SLA, now I am curious to see if I am getting ripped off. Do you pay extra for the SLA? |
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| reply to fiberguy
said by fiberguy:said by k1ll3rdr4g0n:said by toddbs98:Your argument makes no sense what so ever because if the people upgraded to a business account with a higher cap they would still be running on the same crappy hybrid network and on the same oversold nodes. Actually, Comcast business is, supposedly, on another network. And with Comcast Business there is no cap. Where are you getting that it's no another network? It's the same network.. sorry.. Do you have different information? Please do share. |
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 r81984Fair and BalancedPremium
join:2001-11-14
Katy, TX
 ·AT&T U-Verse
 ·AT&T DSL Service
 ·row44
| reply to Tzale
said by Tzale:250GB is more than adequate for the vast majority of users. If you're using more than 250GB/month, you are taxing the network to an extreme (especially on a hybrid-coax network like Comcast).... If you want to send / receive 800GB/month, you should be on a different type of connection. If Comcast set the limit at 100GB/month, I would definitely be bitching... Otherwise, this seems quite fair. Nope.
Normal use of the internet could be watching streaming videos/TV which could easily reach 1TB a month especially if you have a multiperson household using the connection. Just think of all the people streaming the Olympics online right now.
Also, sorry to burst your bubble, but a network is not put to the extreme by how much you download per month. It is put to the extreme by your peak speed.
If you download 200GB at 25mbps you are hitting the network just as hard as someone downloading 1TB at 25mbps. A cap does not help with capacity of the network, it only prevents you from watching competing online video services.
By your reasoning that a cap limits the problems with the network then comcast only has a 768 kbps connection based on the 250GB a month cap.
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Republicans: less fiscally conservative than that other party. |
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fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | reply to k1ll3rdr4g0n
No... I do not pay extra for the service level agreement.. it's part of the service. But, just because they may or may not offer it differently in different markets does not mean you're being "ripped off"... in order to be ripped off, you'd have to be offered something and NOT be getting it.. that's the raw definition of ripped off. This would be a case more of "Mom!!! Jimmy got a bigger piece of cake than I diiiiid...".. kinda the same as how they price HSI the same throughout the country... while some systems only had 6 meg, others had 8 for the same price... no one was getting ripped, they just sold it different in different markets.
Also, it may have something to do with your market. Here, and in other systems, they have established pretty good commercial technical divisions.. it may be that your area has yet to do that while others, like ours, have. In some markets, the residential techs still service business customers. It just takes time to re-tool a national business model is all. |
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fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3
1 edit | reply to k1ll3rdr4g0n
You've proven nothing by posting that 'in your face' chat.. sorry. 
Asking some $8 per hour chat representative a question, and getting a very VERY vague answer to a very vague question (which is much bigger to what we're talking about based on the question of what a separate network is) doesn't change things.
Just because there is a different set of IP addresses doesn't make it a "different network".. especially in the context of what we're talking about.
The "network" is the same and does not effect the available data on the node.. (you need to apply what you're talking about based on the CONTEXT of the thread, and not what you're defining as network)... Yes, business class runs on a different "network" than residential. However, both services still run through the same "pipes"..
I dunno, but if I were you, I'd not be seeking technical answers from a chat representative.. That's like trying to ask the person who rings you up at the supermarket how their entire delivery chain works. |
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TzaleProud Libertarian ConservativePremium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro | reply to toddbs98
said by toddbs98:Your argument makes no sense what so ever because if the people upgraded to a business account with a higher cap they would still be running on the same crappy hybrid network and on the same oversold nodes. Simple.
If you need a business connection, you have options... They might not be cheap, but the free market provides.
No one is forcing you to use Comcast... And 250GB+ of usage is most likely going to be piracy, thus I don't see much reason for Comcast to pump millions of dollars into their network to upgrade it to allow YOU to download / upload 24X7...
-Tzale
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They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-:-
"I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism."~Ronald Reagan
-:-
www.freestateproject.org - LIVE LIBERTY |
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TzaleProud Libertarian ConservativePremium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro | reply to r81984
said by r81984:said by Tzale:250GB is more than adequate for the vast majority of users. If you're using more than 250GB/month, you are taxing the network to an extreme (especially on a hybrid-coax network like Comcast).... If you want to send / receive 800GB/month, you should be on a different type of connection. If Comcast set the limit at 100GB/month, I would definitely be bitching... Otherwise, this seems quite fair. Nope. Normal use of the internet could be watching streaming videos/TV which could easily reach 1TB a month especially if you have a multiperson household using the connection. Just think of all the people streaming the Olympics online right now. Also, sorry to burst your bubble, but a network is not put to the extreme by how much you download per month. It is put to the extreme by your peak speed. If you download 200GB at 25mbps you are hitting the network just as hard as someone downloading 1TB at 25mbps. A cap does not help with capacity of the network, it only prevents you from watching competing online video services. By your reasoning that a cap limits the problems with the network then comcast only has a 768 kbps connection based on the 250GB a month cap. The cap doesn't 'eliminate' the problem, but it STOPS people who are using the service to an extreme. The only other option would be throttling.. This would make more sense to curb stress on the network from people downloading / uploading at a high rate for long periods of time.. However, this would punish 'general' usage since I may need to download or upload a 10GB file every now and then too!
As long as Comcast openly advertises the fact that there is a cap, I am OK with it... You have to agree to it when you sign the contract... And for the vast majority of users, 250GB is more than enough. The minority needs to either get off the network or cut back on their high usage.
-Tzale
--
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-:-
"I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism."~Ronald Reagan
-:-
www.freestateproject.org - LIVE LIBERTY |
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TzaleProud Libertarian ConservativePremium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro | reply to fiberguy
said by fiberguy:You've proven nothing by posting that 'in your face' chat.. sorry. Asking some $8 per hour chat representative a question, and getting a very VERY vague answer to a very vague question (which is much bigger to what we're talking about based on the question of what a separate network is) doesn't change things. Just because there is a different set of IP addresses doesn't make it a "different network".. especially in the context of what we're talking about. The "network" is the same and does not effect the available data on the node.. (you need to apply what you're talking about based on the CONTEXT of the thread, and not what you're defining as network)... Yes, business class runs on a different "network" than residential. However, both services still run through the same "pipes".. I dunno, but if I were you, I'd not be seeking technical answers from a chat representative.. That's like trying to ask the person who rings you up at the supermarket how their entire delivery chain works. If it is running on a different 'network,' then it is running on a different frequency and thus the 'last mile bottleneck' should be less of a problem..
Of course, if Comcast has problems further upstream where the two networks are muxed together, then there is nothing that can fix it besides an upgrade to the backbones.
-Tzale
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They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-:-
"I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism."~Ronald Reagan
-:-
www.freestateproject.org - LIVE LIBERTY |
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r81984Fair and BalancedPremium
join:2001-11-14
Katy, TX Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T DSL Service
·row44
1 edit | reply to Tzale
said by Tzale:said by r81984:said by Tzale:250GB is more than adequate for the vast majority of users. If you're using more than 250GB/month, you are taxing the network to an extreme (especially on a hybrid-coax network like Comcast).... If you want to send / receive 800GB/month, you should be on a different type of connection. If Comcast set the limit at 100GB/month, I would definitely be bitching... Otherwise, this seems quite fair. Nope. Normal use of the internet could be watching streaming videos/TV which could easily reach 1TB a month especially if you have a multiperson household using the connection. Just think of all the people streaming the Olympics online right now. Also, sorry to burst your bubble, but a network is not put to the extreme by how much you download per month. It is put to the extreme by your peak speed. If you download 200GB at 25mbps you are hitting the network just as hard as someone downloading 1TB at 25mbps. A cap does not help with capacity of the network, it only prevents you from watching competing online video services. By your reasoning that a cap limits the problems with the network then comcast only has a 768 kbps connection based on the 250GB a month cap. The cap doesn't 'eliminate' the problem, but it STOPS people who are using the service to an extreme. The only other option would be throttling.. This would make more sense to curb stress on the network from people downloading / uploading at a high rate for long periods of time.. However, this would punish 'general' usage since I may need to download or upload a 10GB file every now and then too! As long as Comcast openly advertises the fact that there is a cap, I am OK with it... You have to agree to it when you sign the contract... And for the vast majority of users, 250GB is more than enough. The minority needs to either get off the network or cut back on their high usage. How much you download is not the extreme that burdens the network.
How fast you download is the extreme that congests the network.
There is no majority, there is no minority. Everyone uses the internet for different things and thus has different downloading requirements. There is no such thing as predicting what average use will be.
All you can tell is what an individual did in the past, not what they will do in the future.
If ISP's truely have congested networks they need to slow down their speeds.
Caps are only used to prevent you or me from using online video instead of paying for cable.
I just moved to Houston and I am trying to go without using Cable TV.
I watch online streams of CNN, FOX, MSNBC, NBC, ABC, Discovery, TLC, History, and a few other channels. Any other show I want to watch I watch on Hulu or download. I also watch OTA tv.
My usage is normal for me. Just like your usage might be normal for you. But there is no way you can compare my or your usage to any other ISP customer. Everyone uses their connection for different things.
For you to say you never go over X GB a month so no one else should is pretty stupid. I bet I can find someone that only use 2GB a month and will think your usage is excessive and not normal.
Also, every time you max out your connection, even for a youtube video you are doing the same harm as someone that downloads 1TB a month and maxes out their connection.--
Republicans: less fiscally conservative than that other party. |
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Reviews:
·Frontier FiOS
1 edit | reply to k1ll3rdr4g0n
While I do not claim to know anything about Comcast's internet setup, the representative who gave you this information clearly has no concept of networking if they believe that having a static IP address means that it must be on a different network as clients who have dynamic IP addresses.
A mix of static and dynamic IP address allocations has nothing to do with whether a common network is being shared. |
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| reply to fiberguy
said by fiberguy:You've proven nothing by posting that 'in your face' chat.. sorry. Asking some $8 per hour chat representative a question, and getting a very VERY vague answer to a very vague question (which is much bigger to what we're talking about based on the question of what a separate network is) doesn't change things. Just because there is a different set of IP addresses doesn't make it a "different network".. especially in the context of what we're talking about. The "network" is the same and does not effect the available data on the node.. (you need to apply what you're talking about based on the CONTEXT of the thread, and not what you're defining as network)... Yes, business class runs on a different "network" than residential. However, both services still run through the same "pipes".. I dunno, but if I were you, I'd not be seeking technical answers from a chat representative.. That's like trying to ask the person who rings you up at the supermarket how their entire delivery chain works. Your proof is where?
I posted evidence to backup my statement and the most you can say is "your wrong because you didn't talk to the right person so therefore I'm right".
If you are going to make a claim, the least you can do is back it up, otherwise it is just a fallacy. |
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