dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
5762
share rss forum feed

warhawks

join:2010-05-15

Running two seperate routers from COAX

Click for full size
Click for full size
I saw this post from awhile back and I am essentially trying to do the same thing.

»Re: [northeast] Running two seperate routers from COAX

I followed "More Fiber's" instructions exactly and it doesn't work. In fact, the second router now shows the STB coax connects and I can no longer see my STB's on my network (on the main router).

I am using ActionTec routers for both. Attached is the network connections tab from my main router as well as My Network (you will notice that my STB's are missing now).

Also, I don't need to run any splitters since I have a direct coax run from the main outside box to the wall and that is the one I want to use as my second router. I don't intend to connect another divice off that coax line.

Any help would greatly appreciated.

warhawks

join:2010-05-15

Click for full size
Click for full size
Click for full size
Screen shots from the second ActionTech Router after "More Fibers" instructions. Router is connected to my PC via an ethernet cable and has no coax plugged into it.


More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29

2 edits
reply to warhawks

said by warhawks:

Also, I don't need to run any splitters since I have a direct coax run from the main outside box to the wall and that is the one I want to use as my second router.
I'm not clear on how your coax is connected between the ONT, the primary Actiontec, the secondary Actiontec and the STBs.
•The implication of your statement is that the second router is connected directly to the ONT (but that does not appear to be the case).
•I think you may have meant simply that the coax run to the second router connects to the main splitter (not the ONT) and that you don't need an additional splitter.

It appears you do have a coax WAN connection to the primary router, since your Network Connections page shows Broadband Connection (coax) as connected.

That page also shows that coax LAN is disconnected. That indicates that primary router can not contact any other MOCA LAN devices (STBs or second Actiontec).

The most up-to-date instructions are in this FAQ:
»Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »Can I get an ethernet connection in a room with only coax?


More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29
reply to warhawks

said by warhawks:

Router is connected to my PC via an ethernet cable and has no coax plugged into it.
To create a coax LAN bridge between the two routers, both have to be connected to the coax.

Please post a diagram of how your coax is connected between the ONT, your main splitter, both Actiontecs and the STBs.
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.

warhawks

join:2010-05-15

Click for full size
Thanks More Fiber for your help. I'll try and explain better this time.

I am not sure what ONT stands for, but I have 5 direct lines coming from the outside of my house where they all connect to a main switch. 3 of those lines run directly to STB's, 1 line runs directly to my main #1 router and the last line has nothing attached (this is the line I plan on attaching the second router to). Once again, all of these line do not have any spliters on them.

My main router sits on the top floor of my house and the computer I am trying to connect to the second router is three floors down, in my basement. Rather then attempt to use a wireless connection (which I did but was weak), I had a second ActionTech router from my pervious house. I can't run a Cat 5 cable from my main router to the computer in my basement so that is why I am trying to use the second router.

Attached is a diagram of my setup.

Thanks again, really appreciate the help.


birdfeedr
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-11
Warwick, RI
kudos:9

It's quite likely that all your coax connections go to a single splitter (what you are calling "a main switch". The input of that splitter connects to the single coax connection of the ONT. Your original hookup was three STBs and one Actiontec router. You don't need to change much of anything there.

The Actiontec in the basement is the one you need to set up like in the FAQ that MoreFiber pointed out to you.

Trust me on this one. Just follow that FAQ.


warhawks

join:2010-05-15

ok, I am going to reconnect the second Router to the coax again, try what was said in the FAQ and take some screen shots. Last time I did that I saw all the STB's on that second rounter. I was hoping I could see all connection in only Router #1 and then Router #2 would only be to connect the PC in the basement. I'll post some screen shots in about 1 hour. Thanks!



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29
reply to warhawks

said by warhawks:

I am not sure what ONT stands for, but I have 5 direct lines coming from the outside of my house where they all connect to a main switch.
ONT = Optical network Terminal

The ONT has only a single coax connector. The ONT, the STBs and the primary Actiontec normally all connect to a N-way splitter (1x6, 1x8 depending on how many coax drops are needed). I'm assuming this is what you are calling "a main switch". It is a splitter, not a switch.

Whether you have a splitter or not at the second Actiontec does not matter. It is shown in the FAQ only for illustration.

If the STBs showed up on the second Actiontec, then you did not follow the instructions to disable DHCP server in the second Actiontec BEFORE connecting it to the coax.

The FAQ has three steps that MUST be performed before connecting the secondary Actiontec to the coax:
•Change the remote router's LAN IP LAN address
•Disable the remote's coax WAN connection
•Disable the remote's DHCP server
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.

warhawks

join:2010-05-15

3 edits

@ More Fiber

I think you are correct in that I connected the COAX before I disabled DCHP. However since then I did disable DCHP on the second router. But now what? I can't see any of my STBs now on my main router.

All the screen shots in terms of what is enabled/disabled is up to date in my previous post.

EDIT: I'll try doing a hard reset on the second router and follow the steps again. But any idea on how I can get to see my STBs on my main router again?



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29

said by warhawks:

any idea on how I can get to see my STBs on my main router again?
Reboot the STBs by unplugging them.

They won't pull a DHCP address from the primary Actiontec until either the current DHCP lease expires (24 hours), or they are rebooted.
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.

warhawks

join:2010-05-15

1 edit

I spoke with a Verizon tech support rep and we couldn't get the main router to notice the STB's because the LAN COAX is not lit.

We did a hard reset on the main router and that still did not get the LAN COAX to show on the LED panel. He mentioned that I would have to get a new router that comes with a CD (verison software) and I would have to run the CD so that it resets the ONT because the ONT stores the MAC Address and router IP (according to him). So perhaps when I connected the second Actiontech it registered on the ONT? He said reseting the boxes wouldn't help because the LAN COAX was not lit on the main router.



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29

1 edit

said by warhawks:

So perhaps when I connected the second Actiontec it registered on the ONT?
That is exactly why the FAQ is very explicit about performing those three steps before connecting the second router to the coax.

Your screen shots show that your Broadband connection (coax) is connected on the primary router, so it would not appear that the second router took over the WAN connection. I would presume that the devices connected on the primary router (iPhone, laptop) can indeed get to the internet.

When you get the replacement router, you don't need to install VZ's crapware to release the MAC address of the primary router. See the following FAQ:
»Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »How do I release my DHCP lease

I just noticed something in your screen shots. Michael's-iPhone has an IP address of 192.168.1.2. The instructions state:
quote:
enter an available IP address on the same subnet as your primary router (e.g. 192.168.1.2).

I can't tell from the screen shots what IP address you assigned to the second Actiontec, however, you can't use 192.168.1.2 on the secondary Actiontec, since that IP address is already in use.

You can reserve a range of IP addresses that will not get assigned dynamically by setting the starting address for the DHCP range. To do so:
•My network
•Network Connections
•Network (H/O)
•Settings
•Start IP Address - Enter a starting IP address such as 192.168.1.10. That will allow you to assign IP addresses from 192.168.1.2 to 192.168.1.9 as static IP addresses.
•APPLY
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.

warhawks

join:2010-05-15

4 edits

I accounted for that (the .2) so I used 192.168.1.11 as the IP of the second router. Look at the URL bar in those screen shots and you will see the IP with .11

Yes, all my Internet devices connected to the main router have access. It's just that my STB's are MIA on the main router (therefore I can't get any guide information).

EDIT: Do I need to wait for the new router? Or can I just release the DHCP now? Either way, I will power down my router tonight and when I wake up I will power it back on to see if it works.

And one again thanks for your help Fiber



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29

You will need to wait for the replacement router to get the coax bridge working. In the mean time you could try swapping the two routers. You would at least have guide data until the new router arrives.
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.


warhawks

join:2010-05-15

I left my router unplugged and off all night, turned it on and same thing.

When I swap the two routers I get no Internet Access. I even reset the second router to defaults via hard reset and it doesn't work. I am using the orginal (main) router now.

Technically speaking, why is a new router required? What would the new router provide that the existing routers can't?

I'm just trying to learn and you have been very helpful, thanks.



birdfeedr
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-11
Warwick, RI
kudos:9

Sometimes you have to use the brute force method -- everything off, then start it all up again slowly.

Follow this sequence to rebuild your network from the ground up.

1. Power off all STBs by unplugging the power cord from the wall outlet.
2. Unplug power from the Actiontec that's in the basement. Also, at this time disconnect the coax from it. Remember, that's the one that is the extra router, used only to get internet at remote location.
3. Release the WAN IP address following the steps in this FAQ. »Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »How do I release my DHCP lease Verify the internet light goes from green to orange, then immediately remove power to the router.
4. Reboot the ONT following steps in this FAQ. »Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »How do I reboot the ONT?
5. Wait 1 minute.
6. Power on the primary Actiontec router. Verify internet connectivity by browsing to your favorite website [ DSLR, of course. ]
7. Power on each STB, one at a time. Once booted up, verify guide data, which will verify internet connectivity. Once all STBs are powered up and verified, then you are ready to power up the basement Actiontec.
8. Before turning on the basement Actiontec, disconnect the coax connector and go through the entire configuration, step by step as outlined here. »Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »Can I get an ethernet connection in a room with only coax? Do this even if you've done it before. Follow all steps.

You may want to print the contents of the three FAQ links mentioned, also this post. Use it as a checklist. At each point where the FAQ or this post uses the word "verify", do not continue unless you have the condition you're asked to check.



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29
reply to warhawks

said by warhawks:

Technically speaking, why is a new router required? What would the new router provide that the existing routers can't?
Since the LAN coax LED in the primary router won't come on, it would seem that the LAN coax interface in that router is broken. Since the Secondary Actiontec could see the STBs, we know the LAN coax interface in that router works.

The Actiontec routers have two coax interfaces, Broadband coax (to ONT) and LAN coax (to STBs). Both interfaces share the same coax connector.
said by warhawks:

When I swap the two routers I get no Internet Access. I even reset the second router to defaults via hard reset and it doesn't work.
Did you release the WAN DHCP lease from the primary router before swapping the routers? Unless you do that, the ONT will still have the DHCP lease for the MAC address of the original router.

»Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »How do I release my DHCP lease
Note the final step in the instructions states to immediately disconnect (or power off) the router. If you do not do that, the router will automatically attempt to acquire a new DHCP lease.
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.

warhawks

join:2010-05-15

1 edit
reply to warhawks

Thanks BirdFeedr and More Fiber.

I will try the release and then try the second router again later tonight.

My new router is schedule to arrive on Tuesday so I will have to wait until then. At that time, I will attempt to get the new router running (see steps below) and ensure that I can see all connection types (wireless/Ethernet/Coax-STBs).

Steps for new Router will be:
1. Power down/unplug all STBs
2. Using existing router release the DHCP prior via the web page admin, immediately unplug that router.
3. Connect new Router, both Coax and Ethernet - this need to be confirmed
4. Power on new Router and check for all connection types.
5. Plug in STBs, power them on one at a time.

Do these steps look correct?

BirdFeedr, I skipped the ONT reboot mostly because I am afraid I will mess something up tyring to do it.

If all goes well above I will post again and attempt to hook up the second Actiontech, this time following the directions exactly!!



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29

1 recommendation

said by warhawks:

3. Connect new Router, both Coax and Ethernet - this need to be confirmed
Not sure which ethernet connection you're referring to.

If you mean connect ethernet between the ONT and the primary Actiontec, that would only be needed if you are switching your WAN connection from coax to cat5.
»Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »Replacing the Actiontec (part 1): Coax to Ethernet

If you're referring to the LAN side ethernet connections, then yes, you would reconnect those.

There is no need to reboot the ONT unless you are unable to release the WAN DHCP lease through the admin GUI.
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.

warhawks

join:2010-05-15
reply to warhawks

Well I got my new router, followed every step and the LAN/COAX light still doesn't work. I did a DHCP release via the admin gui and I even called Verizon support and they rebooted the ONT and reset the STBs and still nothing. Internet works, but no access to my STBs. Now they feel that the problem is at the main splitter, but for some reason I can't see this as the problem since this was never an issue until I tried hooking up the second router (which is not connected anymore).



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29

said by warhawks:

Now they feel that the problem is at the main splitter, but for some reason I can't see this as the problem since this was never an issue until I tried hooking up the second router (which is not connected anymore).
Splitters can go bad. Uncommon, but it does happen.

Did you by chance replace the existing splitter with a larger one?

Or disturb any of the existing connections to the main splitter?
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.

warhawks

join:2010-05-15

Wow, I had added a splitter to the line that was feeding my router a week ago and had no issues with my STBs/guide/tv, etc. and only experience the problem when I attempted to add the second router (which at the time took control of the STBs).

I just removed that splitter and connected my main router to a coax that goes directly to the main splitter (that is located outside my house) and now I can see my STBs!!!! Man you are friggin good!

I think I am going to hold off on connecting the second router (again) until tomorrow, don't want to press my luck and get greedy, plus the wife is pissed at me so let her enjoy the tv guide for one night

So this thread will live for yet another day!



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29

Check that splitter that you removed to see if it is rated 1Ghz.

A splitter that is only rated 850Mhz will pass TV and but won't reliably pass MOCA signals which are above 1Ghz.
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.


warhawks

join:2010-05-15

It's a TERK splitter but it doesn't say what the Ghz is. I guess I will go to Radio Shack to pick one up or if you have any other suggested brands that would be great. Thanks for your dedication to providing this type of support, truly invaluable.


warhawks

join:2010-05-15
reply to warhawks

Well its done!! I am on my second computer (in the basement) and running off the second router via COAX!!

Thank you More Fiber and Birdfeedr for all your help!

I made some mistakes, but I learned alot, consider this case closed with one happy customer.



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:29

1 edit
reply to warhawks

Glad it's working for you.



dgaraffa

join:2000-10-23
Ringwood, NJ

Just for the sake of completeness...

What was the final fix? Was it the coax splitter or something else?


hubrisnxs

join:2009-12-30
Fountain Valley, CA
kudos:1
reply to warhawks

are you telling them what you are trying to do?

I am surprised they are even helping you, with that type of set up? they don't know that set up at all.


vz tech 2

join:2005-11-19
Richmond, VA
reply to warhawks

If you dont have a coax lan light stb won't be recognized take the router (the main one to another leg of coax preferably the closes one to the splitter just hook it up and see if the lan coax light comes on if it does then that leg of coax or the ends or barrel if one is present or even that leg of the splitter is not passing the moca. If it still does not light if possible take the router outside extension cord handy and if the splitter is handy remove a leg of coax from it and hook up the router there and see if it lights. If so take the runs at the splitter and switch them around take the router back to the original and see what you get. If it does not light at all you may have another issue.

As far as the two routers setup the main router first make sure all is working tv's VOD widgets guide.

Then before hooking the second router up to the coax, connect it to a computer, log into router 192.168.1.1 admin password or password1, change the ip addy to something like 192.168.25, turn off dhcp, also enable dhcp relay, and you should be good to go now the internet light on the second router will stay amber but all the other lights will be on and popping. Please remember that Verizon does not support multiple routers so you are on your own.


vz tech 2

join:2005-11-19
Richmond, VA

1 edit
reply to warhawks

opps sorry did not see the second page disregard my help or late there of wrong frequency splitters screw the system all the time.