| reply to El Quintron
Re: Canada ranked #32 in world broadband... said by El Quintron:Perhaps I was a little quick to jump the gun at 32, however you will note that speeds of at least 1 Gbps have been available since 2009 There is one obvious problem with providing real 1Gbps access though: 10Gbps carrier equipment to aggregate all those 1Gbps sessions is still ludicrously expensive so supporting full 1Gbps on a large scale with reasonably low over-subscription is not going to be economically viable for several more years.
For now, most places that have "1Gbps internet" actually have a 1-4Gbps feed shared between 500-2000 of their neighbors. |
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 El QuintronResident Mouth BreatherPremium
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| Zon is a cable service so the link is shared... there's no doubt in my mind about that.
You do get my original point though... by time affordable 100Mbps gets here, they'll be selling affordable 1Gbps.
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| said by El Quintron:You do get my original point though... by time affordable 100Mbps gets here, they'll be selling affordable 1Gbps. Affordable pseudo-1Gbps speed... North America is allergic to pseudo-speed, it is plagued with a strong sense of entitlement to 100% speed 100% of the time that does not exist in any of the high-speed record-setting countries. Meeting those unreasonable expectations drastically increases costs. |
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El QuintronResident Mouth BreatherPremium
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| said by InvalidError:Affordable pseudo-1Gbps speed... North America is allergic to pseudo-speed, it is plagued with a strong sense of entitlement to 100% speed 100% of the time that does not exist in any of the high-speed record-setting countries. Meeting those unreasonable expectations drastically increases costs. Meh... North America may be allergic to pseudo-speed but that's still what its getting, and basically that's how it should be marketed.
However, selling 1Gpbs shared still means you get way more speed that anything available here *all* of the time... making it a far better deal.
I don't have to have 1Gbps all of the time. However I would like a connection that goes up to 1Gpbs with a reasonnable expectation of getting much more than I'm getting now.
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| said by El Quintron:However, selling 1Gpbs shared still means you get way more speed that anything available here *all* of the time... Most of the time, maybe... but certainly not all.
Even in South Korea which currently sits on the #1 spot for broadband countries, average speeds top out just under 40Mbps with legitimate ISPs hogging the top-10 instead of corporate or campus entities massively inflating figures as is the case for most other countries. |
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| said by InvalidError:Most of the time, maybe... but certainly not all. Even in South Korea which currently sits on the #1 spot for broadband countries, average speeds top out just under 40Mbps with legitimate ISPs hogging the top-10 instead of corporate or campus entities massively inflating figures as is the case for most other countries. I don't know what you're trying to say here... but there is no way you can claim that Canadian internet comes close to what's being offered in Europe and in Asia.
Also if you check »www.speedtest.net/global.php#0 top countries with regards to speeds... the rankings when you ignore schools and businesses are the same.
Seriously... where's my 1Gbps internet?
Can I even buy this anywhere in Canada?
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| Go to speedtest, go browse worldwide results, select France, look at the data sets for both with and "without" schools and corporations... the "ignore schools and corporations" filter is BROKEN: universities and corporations are padding the top-10 regardless of whether or not this option is checked. For France, Ikoula (a web-hosting company) is topping off the chart at 124Mbps even if you "hide schools and corporations".
Speed tests run from datacenters and corporate networks like Ikoula are in no way representative of broadband speeds and the broken filtering from speedtest's statistics lead to grossly inflated figures... this would be like TSI running speedtests from its servers at 151 Front-Street to inflate their stats. |
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m3chen
join:2009-12-03
Toronto, ON | reply to El Quintron
I'd settle for 50 or even 25 mbps. |
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El QuintronResident Mouth BreatherPremium
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| reply to InvalidError
Fine...
So what you're really saying is that Canadian internet is fantastic, and the only reason reason Europe and Asia look better is because they're lying and our "quality of service" makes our 5 Meg internet just as good as their 100 Meg services 
Seriously... I'm trying not to be a dick here, but if I have to perform mental gymnastics to make my internets look good there's a problem somewhere.
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| reply to HiVolt
I think the point of the ranking/study is pretty clear. Trying to show how we aren't quite as far behind as it looks doesn't change the fact that there are still 31 other countries with better offerings than Canada (according to this study).
Is this the 4th study released in 2010 that shows why Canada sucks a big one for internet? |
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jfmezeiPremium
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kudos:22 | The actual ranking isn't what is important. What is important is that we are falling back, worsening our worldwide ranking.
And remember that ranking isn't just for top speed, it is also for affordability and average speed. Offering 2 terabit/s internet is neat, but if nobody can afford it and are still on dial-up, then the nation is essentially still on dialup. |
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| reply to papabri
said by papabri:Is this the 4th study released in 2010 that shows why Canada sucks a big one for internet? There hasn't been any actual studies published in 2010 yet... they are all anecdotal accounts of general statistics like those from Akamai or Speedtest.net which fail to differentiate residential usage from campus/corporate usage, nothing done on a strict scientific basis there.
If you want to see what impact (if any) new tiers introduce in Canada since late-2009 have had on Canada's position, you are going to have to wait until the 2011 OECD report which will be analyzing data from 2010... the 2010 report (which will be looking at figures from 2009) will not be pretty since nothing of significance was introduced until late-2009, too late to show up in statistics. |
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| reply to El Quintron
said by El Quintron:the only reason reason Europe and Asia look better is because they're lying and our "quality of service" I'm saying speedtest.net's filters are failing to accurately remove campuses/schools and corporations from the non-school/corporate result tables and this skews results big time when the top-10 "non-school/corporate" result table is still filled filled corporations and campuses... this makes results look much better than they should when you want to know average residential broadband speeds, not corporate/campus speeds.
said by El Quintron:but if I have to perform mental gymnastics to make my internets look good there's a problem somewhere. There is no mental gymnastics there, just digging through the raw numbers to verify that numbers mean what they mean... and for half the countries on speedtest.net, the "average speed" of a country is not representative of actual broadband speeds because non-campus/corporate tables are contaminated by large amounts of incorrectly filtered corporate and campus results.
Aggregate numbers are meaningless when the underlying data set contains (very) large amounts of erroneous data. |
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El QuintronResident Mouth BreatherPremium
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| said by InvalidError:There is no mental gymnastics there, just digging through the raw numbers to verify that numbers mean what they mean... and for half the countries on speedtest.net, the "average speed" of a country is not representative of actual broadband speeds because non-campus/corporate tables are contaminated by large amounts of incorrectly filtered corporate and campus results. Aggregate numbers are meaningless when the underlying data set contains (very) large amounts of erroneous data. To be fair... we will have to wait for the 2011 results to see what our actual speed rankings are.
I do however remain unconvinced that our performance will improve that much in "accurate" studies due to our regulator's lax position on caps and low bandwith caps.
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1 edit | I don't think IE would pretend that we have the best speeds on the planet or that these speeds are widely chosen by customers. We do have some high speed tiers available in some areas, but they aren't priced low enough to attract a lot of people... the prices will fall in time, just like they have for the last decade, but slowly. Then consumers will choose them more frequently.
The bigger point is that it is hard to accept the facts and figures from studies that use poor quality data. I could generate 1000 speed test from the corporate lan at work with excellent speeds because we have ~1Gbps connectivity. But should those be included when doing a study of residential broadband? Should even home users speedtests be seen as a truly accurate tool, given that we don't know what else is going on? At least with Samknows, their testbox/router checks to see if the user is soaking up the connection before doing a speedtest to ensure it has 100% of the line available. |
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| >I could generate 1000 speed test from the corporate lan at work with excellent speeds because we have ~1Gbps connectivity.
You could, but unless you are continuously running the speed test your little peak will only be a small blip on the test history curve like the one in Yukon until it get rolled off by the average users. With a large enough sample size, it should be immune to bad data points.
Only thing that could skew it enough is a bot net sitting on corporate fat pipe running test 24/7 to skew the data. |
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| reply to El Quintron
It's true, except asia has no purpose for that kind of internet considering 90% of the pages on the web are blocked. |
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| reply to An_Onymous
said by An_Onymous:Only thing that could skew it enough is a bot net sitting on corporate fat pipe running test 24/7 to skew the data. Normal people do not run speedtest 24/7 either. It does not take many speedtests from corporate 1-10Gbps links to skew averages up by a substantial amount.
When the objective is to get an accurate picture of residential broadband speeds, you have to ditch samples that have nothing to do with residential broadband speeds... such as campus and corporate results. Speedtest.net's filter do a very inconsistent job at it. |
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El QuintronResident Mouth BreatherPremium
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| reply to nitrogif
said by nitrogif:It's true, except asia has no purpose for that kind of internet considering 90% of the pages on the web are blocked. I think you're throwing out the baby with the bathwater on this one.
I've yet to see *any* censorship in Japan and most folks in China (the coutry most often associate with internet censorship) know how to get around those filters.
Not to mention that the stuff that get censored in China is stuff most westerners never bother looking at or learning about anyways... so I doubt you'd even notice there was censorship in China if you surfed the internet there.
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1 edit | reply to HiVolt
For the average Asian, it is more likely they have more interest for their local contents (i.e. TV, movies, video etc). A slower pipe to outside their country for speed testing does not necessarily mean their localized internet speed is that slow.
South Korea, Japan, Hong Kong do not have censorships and they have the best internet speeds so far in that corner of the world.
I think it is almost a nation pride thing that Asian countries there tend to want to be the best - having the tallest buildings, fastest internet connectivity etc.
As for us Canadians... We are still going to be top 10 among the G8 no matter how badly we failed. Yay! Go Canada. |
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