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Priit
@est.estpak.ee

Priit

Anon

[General] pap2 only works after reset with pins

Hello

Here is an odd problem with pap2 that I have not seen anyone else have yet.

We have some 20 pap2 adapters deployed for our client all powered from a single computer PSU.

After a stormy night with lots of lightning 6 of them appeared to be bricked. Power light red and network light on no matter if the enthernet cable is in or not and no tone for the telephone.

But the odd part is that if I reset the adapter shorting the reset pins on the board it boots up just fine. Even tried upgrading the firmware no problems there either. But still only boots up if I do the reset with pins.

If I just make a power reset it's back to the red power light and constant network light.

Does anyone have any ideas what to try?
mazilo
From Mazilo
Premium Member
join:2002-05-30
Lilburn, GA

mazilo

Premium Member

said by Priit :

... if I reset the adapter shorting the reset pins on the board ...
Which PAP2 and which pins are you talking about?

pende_tim
Premium Member
join:2004-01-04
Selbyville, DE

pende_tim to Priit

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to Priit
said by Priit :

Hello

st fine. Even tried upgrading the firmware no problems there either. But still only boots up if I do the reset with pins.

If I just make a power reset it's back to the red power light and constant network light.

Does anyone have any ideas what to try?
I would try Amazon ~ $49.00 free standard shipping. Sounds like they are FUBARED,

Tim
Stewart
join:2005-07-13

Stewart to Priit

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to Priit
Have you tried a problematic unit with a Linksys supply? What happens when you try to reset by unplugging the DC cable?

priithansen
@est.estpak.ee

priithansen to Priit

Anon

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These are some old pap2-na 's if I remember correctly so there is no guarantee and have already replaced them for the client just curious if somethings could be done.

The reset pins I am talking are these »www.voip-info.org/storag ··· pers.png

The testing I have done is all made with Linksys supply.
If I unplug the DC cable it reboots into the bricked mode.
Then I have to short the reset pins (see the picture) and it starts working until another power outage.
mazilo
From Mazilo
Premium Member
join:2002-05-30
Lilburn, GA

mazilo

Premium Member

said by priithansen :

If I unplug the DC cable it reboots into the bricked mode.
While unplugged, short the reset pins, plug the power cord, let the PAP2 power up, then release the reset pins to see if that will do the trick.
Dan_voip
join:2007-01-03
Saint-Hubert, QC

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said by priithansen :

The testing I have done is all made with Linksys supply.
Did you try a power supply from an working adapter?
This way you can see if the ATA or the power supply has a problem.

If I remember correctly instead or shorting the pins you can perform an IVR command from line 1 (reboot 732668 or reset 73738).

DogFace056
join:2005-12-09
Cary, NC

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I suspect your PAP2s may have corrupt configurations. If that's the case, there's a small chance that factory resetting them, when up and running normally (after the shorted pins), could correct the corruption. You can perform the factory reset either through URL "http://PAP2IP/admin/reset" (replace PAP2IP with the PAP2's actual IP address), or IVR function 73738#. If this doesn't help, I can wipe and reinitialize their configurations, which will definitely fix the issue (provided that it is due to corrupt configuration). Register as a user here, and contact me by IM if you need further help with this.
Stewart
join:2005-07-13

Stewart

Member

said by DogFace056:

I suspect your PAP2s may have corrupt configurations. If that's the case, there's a small chance that factory resetting them, when up and running normally (after the shorted pins), could correct the corruption.
I was under the impression that the jumper reset was equivalent to the normal power-up reset, but your theory implies that this is not the case. Do you know what sort of additional initializations are performed? Have you been able to recover from situations where power cycling did not help?

My suspicion (if the factory reset does not help) is that the power-up reset circuit has failed such that the processor is starting before internal voltages have stabilized. Though I know nothing about the PAP2 circuitry, you could confirm (or refute) this suspicion by triggering a 'scope on the CPU reset pin and viewing the rising input DC on another channel, when AC power is first applied. Compare a failing unit with a good one. If the reset circuit is in fact misbehaving, I would guess that an electrolytic capacitor has become nearly an open circuit. As a true WAG, perhaps it's the radial-lead cap near the reset pins. You should be able to check the part in-circuit by measuring its impedance to a small AC signal. Again, comparison with a good unit should show whether it has failed. If so, you might even have a dead ATA (that failed in a different way) from which you could scrounge a replacement part.

priithansen
@est.estpak.ee

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Anon

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mazilo: I think I tried that method without success.

The power supply can't be the issue because at first all the 20 adapter where behind one PSU and 14 of them worked fine as well all other testing was done with a separate original pap2 DC adapter and that made no difference.

After DC power cycle the unit does not have tone on the phone so cant preform IVR commands then.

After shorting the pins I have tried the IVR reset 73738 and even successfully upgrading the firmware.

What sort of a reset do the pins to anyways? Since it doesn't even erase the configurations?
Stewart
join:2005-07-13

Stewart

Member

I took a look at a PAP2 and C34 is indeed connected across the reset jumpers. Try connecting a ~10 uF electrolytic cap across the jumpers (left pin positive) and see if it will reset properly on power-up. If so, C34 is bad.

priithansen
@est.estpak.ee

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Anon

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Thank you Stewart for the advice. It really does look like it would mos likely be a simple hardware problem rather than a software glitch.

Don't have a oscilloscope at hand but definitely can try the 10uf capacitor out.
I'll be out of town for couple of days but will try that asap when I get back.

DogFace056
join:2005-12-09
Cary, NC

2 recommendations

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said by Stewart:

I was under the impression that the jumper reset was equivalent to the normal power-up reset, but your theory implies that this is not the case. Do you know what sort of additional initializations are performed? Have you been able to recover from situations where power cycling did not help?
The PAP2 uses a tiny 5 pin "reset controller" chip, located on the bottom side of the board. This chip has, besides power and ground pins, an input for an external reset (that goes to the reset switch, pull-up resistor, and the diode-capacitor circuit that asserts the reset input on initial power-up), a reset output that feeds the processor, ethernet controller and SLIC chips, and a 5th pin, which is an input that the processor writes to periodically to keep the reset controller's watchdog function from triggering a reset pulse on its output.

The PAP2's processor has a status register that identifies the cause of the last reboot. It can tell whether it was a cold (power-on) reboot (as a result of it's reset input pin having been asserted), or a warm (soft) reboot (there is a register that can be written to to cause a software reboot). On boot-up, the PAP2's code looks at this register, and depending on whether it's on a cold or warm boot, it will do or skip certain initializations (in order to speed up the boot up, if triggered by software).

With certain critical errors, it will deliberately cause a watchdog triggered reboot by ceasing updates to the reset controller's watchdog. A watchdog reset looks identical to a power-on reset, but by writing 'magic' words into a specific location in DRAM, and looking for those on boot-up, the PAP2 can distinguish between a power-on boot-up and various deliberately caused reboots via the watchdog and the soft reboot mechanism.

However, it has no way of reading the current state of the reset switch, as this is only visible to the reset controller, and furthermore, the processor does not provide any way to read the real time state of its reset pin, so there's no way for the PAP2 to do as many other devices do, that reset their configurations depending on whether one keeps a reset button depressed for an extended period of time.

If the capacitor is bad and open circuited, the reset controller will not produce a reset pulse on its output on power-up, and therefore none of the components that rely on this to initialize their states upon power-up will start up correctly, and may instead end up in hopelessly locked-up states. If the PAP2's processor starts up at all, it will likely boot up as if from a warm boot, and therefore skip a number of initialization steps, so some components (including perhaps the ethernet controller) may not be initialized correctly.

When shorting the reset pins, all components of the PAP2 are normally properly reset just like from a normal power up, which might explain why this works for the OP. However, when the PAP2 goes into a critical failure state reflected by a solid red power LED, it will not update the reset controller's watchdog, and will thus be automatically reset and rebooted after a delay of some 5 to 6 seconds. Since the watchdog reset looks exactly like a power-on reset to the processor (and the other main chips on board), the PAP2 should boot up normally after being hit by the first watchdog reset after the initial power-on boot.

If I've interpreted the OP's description right, it seems that the watchdog isn't kicking in, so it would appear that there may be more to it than just a bad power-on reset capacitor (or possibly the diode labeled D251, located just to the left of the capacitor, which may have gone poof, instead of or in addition to the capacitor), with a likely cause being the reset controller malfunctioning.

That's not to say that you haven't hit the nail on its head with your diagnosis of the capacitor as the culprit, but I would expect the watchdog to correct the situation the first time it kicks in after each initial boot-up.
Stewart
join:2005-07-13

Stewart

Member

Many thanks for the detailed explanation. It will be interesting to see what the OP finds, because none of our theories still seem plausible, given what he has already tried.
priithansen
join:2010-08-18

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Hy

Sorry for the delay but the pap2's where out of my hands for a while.

So Big thanks for Stewart replacing the c34 did the trick.

Don't know if the cause was storm + lightning or excessive heat these units clearly have been sitting in hot temperatures all the rubber legs are rubber no longer and even the plastic is brickle.

Also thank You DogFace05 for the interesting read.