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DemyDame

join:2009-07-16
Four Oaks, NC

[Satellite] Are Directv and Dish Net owned by the same company?

Are DirecTV and Dish Network under the same umbrella, or owned by the same company?


Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2

Re: [Satellite] Are Directv and Dish Net owned by the same compa

No


needforspeed59
Cruise Ship Just Passing Through

join:2001-05-02
La Place, LA
reply to DemyDame
Just curious as to why you ask this...
--
Great success! High five!


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
said by needforspeed59:

Just curious as to why you ask this...
probably owes one of them money.

DemyDame

join:2009-07-16
Four Oaks, NC
reply to DemyDame
No, I don't owe any money to any of them. I was just curious since the two are the only satellite options to choose from...


Vchat20
Landing is the REAL challenge
Premium
join:2003-09-16
Columbus, OH
said by DemyDame:

No, I don't owe any money to any of them. I was just curious since the two are the only satellite options to choose from...
Mostly because to start up a new sat provider requires a LOT of startup capital with the major cost being for designing, building, and launching satellites amongst other things and there's very little ROI until you actually get an ample amount of customers (we're talking in the millions as a good average)

Unless someone has a lot of money to burn on the prospect, it's not really financially viable in terms of trying to compete with Dish or DirecTV who have a lot of marketing and legal push not to mention are household names these days.
--
I swear, some people should have pace-makers installed to free up the resources. Breathing and heart beat taxes their whole system, all of their brain cells wasted on life support.-two bit brains, and the second bit is wasted on parity! ~head_spaz


Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2
said by Vchat20:

Unless someone has a lot of money to burn on the prospect, it's not really financially viable in terms of trying to compete with Dish or DirecTV who have a lot of marketing and legal push not to mention are household names these days.
Ask VOOM/Rainbow Communications how it worked for them ?


Vchat20
Landing is the REAL challenge
Premium
join:2003-09-16
Columbus, OH
Precisely. Unfortunately while their prospect was a great one at the time (All high quality HDTV 24/7) it was also way ahead of its time when HDTV's were still an enthusiast market with very low penetration.

In hindsight you could probably turn back the clock a year or two when HDTV was starting to become more commonplace but tv providers were still behind on content and VOOM could have probably built a financially viable niche for themselves.
--
I swear, some people should have pace-makers installed to free up the resources. Breathing and heart beat taxes their whole system, all of their brain cells wasted on life support.-two bit brains, and the second bit is wasted on parity! ~head_spaz


needforspeed59
Cruise Ship Just Passing Through

join:2001-05-02
La Place, LA
reply to DemyDame
Anyone remember Primestar?
--
Great success! High five!


pende_tim
Premium
join:2004-01-04
Andover, NJ
kudos:1
Anyone remember C band? and the free wild feeds.

Happydude32
Premium
join:2005-07-16
kudos:1
reply to needforspeed59
Yep. Anyone remember Alphastar?

Alphastar, PrimeStar, SkyVista, Sky Angel, USSB, along with Dish Network and DirecTV. I miss those days. That's when satellite TV was fun.


needforspeed59
Cruise Ship Just Passing Through

join:2001-05-02
La Place, LA
reply to DemyDame
I had Primestar back in the mid 90's as I lived in a TCI cable system with only 36 channels. Channels 30-36 were so snowy they were unwatchable. LOL. I believe Primestar was bought by Dish or DirecTV. That was after I moved.
--
Great success! High five!

Happydude32
Premium
join:2005-07-16
kudos:1
Ironically enough Primestar was owned by a group called Primestar Partners, which was a co-op of cable TV operators, TCI being one of those involved. Primestar launched in 1991 by cable companies as a way to provide TV access to those in rural areas out of reach of traditional cable TV. In June of 1994 DirecTV was born, and not quite 2 years later Echostar launched their DBS service, Dish Network in March of 1996. Primestar could just not compete. They weren’t a true DBS provider, more of a medium powered FSS DTH system. Between requiring a larger dish, the lack of core features like an interactive program guide and aggressive marketing campaigns from the competition, Primestar began to fade. On April 29, 1999 DirecTV announced they would acquire Primestar and all of their assets including the TEMPO 2 satellite which was at the 119 degree orbital location and the TEMPO 1 satellite. DirecTV slowly faded out the Primestar brand over the next two years and subscribers were converted over. Dish Network also ran specials for Primestar subscribers looking to jump ship. To give you idea of it’s popularity, Primestar, at 8 years old had 2.3 million subscribers, DirecTV, 5 years old had 4.8 million subscribers. I forget the official released number but I want to say DirecTV ended up keeping 1.7 out of those 2.3 million former P* subscribers. Could be wrong though.
--
Time Warner Cable Subscriber, Fanboy, Shill & Lover - Providing an advanced fiber network since before fiber became popular
Sprint Subscriber, Fanboy, Shill & Lover - America’s most dependable 3G network, first 4G network, best push to talk network

DemyDame

join:2009-07-16
Four Oaks, NC
reply to DemyDame
Wow, thanks for the answer, and the history lesson. Didn't know all of that since I haven't had satellite very long...


Vchat20
Landing is the REAL challenge
Premium
join:2003-09-16
Columbus, OH

1 edit
reply to DemyDame
As a further note on my original post I was just reading that the very rough estimate on the cost to build and launch a single DBS satellite is anywhere from 200 to 300 million dollars. Multiply that by the 10 in DirecTV's fleet or Dish Network's 8 (This is just counting sat's they actually own and are currently in service. There are some sats that are still floating up there but are out of service and have been replaced. They also lease space off sats owned by other companies, but this is small due to the fairly limited transponder space already on these birds. Hard to share and have a strong channel lineup. ) and they only realistically have a lifespan of ~15 years. Not to mention having licenses from the FCC for them to radiate RF back down to earth, having a specified ground station to constantly monitor and control the sats in case something goes awry. Uplink centers. Consumer receivers...

It all gets very pricey and especially with the economy these days. It's probably more a case of Dish and DirecTV are 'good enough' in lieu of what it would take to start up a third provider and what the expected ROI would be.

EDIT: I should clarify that, of course, the satellite count I mentioned above in DirecTV's and Dish's fleets is spread out over a number of years and not all done at once. But it still adds up over time. And with the channel capacity of only 1 sat, you're gonna need to at least launch 2 in a relatively short time just to have enough of a channel offering to appease customers.
--
I swear, some people should have pace-makers installed to free up the resources. Breathing and heart beat taxes their whole system, all of their brain cells wasted on life support.-two bit brains, and the second bit is wasted on parity! ~head_spaz


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1
reply to DemyDame
said by DemyDame:

No, I don't owe any money to any of them. I was just curious since the two are the only satellite options to choose from...
And actually sort of considered merging to be the one and only, but FCC wouldn't allow it but DID ALLOW Serius and XM radio to do the very thing.

Go figure.
--
»haywardm.com (Hayward's Key West)


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1
reply to Hall
said by Hall:

said by Vchat20:

Unless someone has a lot of money to burn on the prospect, it's not really financially viable in terms of trying to compete with Dish or DirecTV who have a lot of marketing and legal push not to mention are household names these days.
Ask VOOM/Rainbow Communications how it worked for them ?
And many owned birds VS leasing space if not BILLIONS and years to invest to get upo and running.
--
»haywardm.com (Hayward's Key West)


Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2
reply to Vchat20
said by Vchat20:

As a further note on my original post I was just reading that the very rough estimate on the cost to build and launch a single DBS satellite is anywhere from 200 to 300 million dollars.
$200-300 million ? That's way higher than anything I've ever heard/read. I guess if you include the design, assembly, operating, licenses, etc over it's life, maybe it gets that high.


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
reply to Hayward
said by Hayward:

said by DemyDame:

No, I don't owe any money to any of them. I was just curious since the two are the only satellite options to choose from...
And actually sort of considered merging to be the one and only, but FCC wouldn't allow it but DID ALLOW Serius and XM radio to do the very thing.

Go figure.
because satelite radio wasn't on as sound footing. The fact is without a merger BOTH companies would have gone belly-up and satelite radio would already be a footnote in history. Would you rather have one satelite radio company or NONE?


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
reply to Hall
said by Hall:

said by Vchat20:

As a further note on my original post I was just reading that the very rough estimate on the cost to build and launch a single DBS satellite is anywhere from 200 to 300 million dollars.
$200-300 million ? That's way higher than anything I've ever heard/read. I guess if you include the design, assembly, operating, licenses, etc over it's life, maybe it gets that high.
If anything that's low. Heck it's over $50 mill just to pay to get that thing launched.


cypherstream
Premium,MVM
join:2004-12-02
Reading, PA
kudos:3
reply to Hall
Since it costs that much per satellite, what's cheaper and more efficient to operate? Satellite, Hybrid-Fiber-Coax, or FTTH networks?

With Satellite you do have the advantage of lighting up new services for the whole continental US at the same exact time. With HFC or FTTH networks, it takes much longer to add new services, as theres millions of miles of plant to build and upgrade. Look how long it's taking the cable co's to upgrade to 100+ HD channels. Yeah they are getting there in many area's, but lacking in others. At least the Dish companies can uplink a new set of HD channels and go live for the entire country at once.

However, once those HFC networks are upgrade, or FTTH networks are built, the bandwidth is gigantic. Were talking 5+gbps downstream bandwidth on coax alone (38.8mbps * 135 RF Channels = 5238mbps). Massively fast internet with super low ping times are possible on HFC and FTTH networks. Satellite's latency and broad spectrum footprint makes unique 2-way data services very costly and inefficient. Also with switched digital video and IPTV, HFC and FTTH networks have more overall capacity in the long run.

But then again, it's not an apples to apples comparison. Those wireline networks require maintenance. They require repair due to storms and environmental damage. FTTH is so expensive and time consuming, that as much as I want that type of service, in this economy I will likely never see it, unless I move into an area already served. HFC networks require power supplies and active equipment, which adds to costs. How about Satellites? Solar power. Can't beat free energy.

Theres definitely advantages and disadvantages to both technologies. There's also other factors such as features, user interface and experience, equipment offerings, and of course price. The local cable company in my area has a ton of HD channels DirecTV doesn't have, such as: qvc hd, c-span hd, ewtn hd, hsn hd, trutv hd, swrv hd, cspan2 hd, tcm hd, diy hd, investigation discovery hd, the hub hd, nat geo wild hd, g4 hd, history international hd, style hd, cooking channel hd, hln hd, E! hd, and a few others.

However, DirecTV has a much nicer on screen guide, better equipment with more storage on the DVR's, programmability from the web or phone apps and real nice multiroom DVR features. Dish Network has the only true 16:9 HD user interface on the market with their new vip922 DVR. They also have better HD channels IMO than DirecTV, but compress them more and suffer from carriage disputes very often.

Too bad not a single provider out there is perfect. You have to pick one and live with it I guess. But then again, what type of network is better? HFC, FTTH, or Satellite?

davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3
FTTH. Capability for symmetrical 1Gbit/sec internet connection for each residence. You can stream multiple HD videos, while conducting multiple VOIP calls, as you monitor your swift data backup to the remote cloud storage device.


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1

1 recommendation

reply to 88615298
said by 88615298:

said by Hayward:

said by DemyDame:

No, I don't owe any money to any of them. I was just curious since the two are the only satellite options to choose from...
And actually sort of considered merging to be the one and only, but FCC wouldn't allow it but DID ALLOW Serius and XM radio to do the very thing.

Go figure.
because satelite radio wasn't on as sound footing. The fact is without a merger BOTH companies would have gone belly-up and satelite radio would already be a footnote in history. Would you rather have one satelite radio company or NONE?
Since I don't use it or have use for it I couldn't give a crap.

It is far to narrowcasted... even the supposed mix stations are annoyingly not so.
--
»haywardm.com (Hayward's Key West)

pwrsurge

join:2009-04-15
reply to pende_tim
said by pende_tim:

Anyone remember C band? and the free wild feeds.
Yes I do and C-Band is still around, including all the free wild feeds! C-band will always be in use as unlike KU-band, it does not suffer from rain fade. The only thing is that most of the programming has moved from analog to digital so a digital FTA receiver is required to receive theses. Fortunately, these receivers are relatively inexpensive so a basic standard definition can be purchased for as low as $50


CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County
But those are the huge dishes - correct? 'Bout the only place to have those is in the country (ie: farm) as most communities have banned them for the last 15-20 years.
--
Brian

"It drops into your stomach like a Abrams's tank.... driven by Rosanne Barr..." A. Bourdain


Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Germantown, OH
kudos:2
said by CylonRed:

But those are the huge dishes - correct?
I believe you can use 36" dishes nowadays.
said by CylonRed:

...as most communities have banned them for the last 15-20 years.
Where ? Homeowner's associations have rules against them but I don't know of any cities.


Vchat20
Landing is the REAL challenge
Premium
join:2003-09-16
Columbus, OH
reply to CylonRed
Pretty much the only reason the huge dishes were needed was for the major bandwidth requirements needed for the analog signals being pushed down and needing such a large surface area to get a good enough signal for it.

These days the majority, if not all, of sat broadcasts, be they commercial DBS, FTA, whathaveyou, are done digitally and don't need nearly as big of dishes due to the reduced RF bandwidth needs. You can get away with the smaller ones now.
--
I swear, some people should have pace-makers installed to free up the resources. Breathing and heart beat taxes their whole system, all of their brain cells wasted on life support.-two bit brains, and the second bit is wasted on parity! ~head_spaz