 pflogBueller? Bueller?Premium,MVM
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El Dorado Hills, CA
kudos:3 | [OC] Overclocking Question on i7 2600k I'm expecting my i7 2600k to arrive tomorrow and I can finally put together my Z68 build 
I'm curious about overclocking with these new chips. For my Q9550, I had to bump the memory frequency (FSB) up since the multiplier was locked.
These new chips don't require playing with the memory frequency at all, right? I ordered DDR3-1600, and I know the default is 1333. So I could probably run my cas 8 1600 RAM at cas 7 1333 timings? Or would it be better to leave it alone and have it run at its default of 1600?
Now regarding the CPU overclocking itself, as I understand it, I should enable speed step in the BIOS and it'll idle at 1.6 GHz and run at 3.4 GHz when there's a load, and up to 3.8 GHz on one thread and 3.5 GHz for all 4 (by default) when power boost kicks in. I have a few questions about this:
1. If I cannot get speedstep to work with this chip in FreeBSD, will it still operate properly and just idle at 3.4 GHz instead of 1.6 GHz in a lower power state?
2. When people say they are overclocking the 2600k to 4.4 or 4.5 GHz, they're talking about the turbo boost frequency, right? Is there any way to disable turbo boost or tell it to always run at the turbo boost speed? I'm just looking for the best possible single threaded performance and also the best performance when all 4 cores are in use. What happens if I have 3 processes using 100% of each of 3 cores? Does it go up to turbo boost speeds for all 3 cores? E.g. if my turboboost OC was set to 4.4 GHz, will 3 cores run at 4.4 GHz and 1 core at 3.4 GHz?
3. how quickly does powerboost kick in? E.g. if I have a CPU-intensive job but it only lasts 10 seconds, will powerboost not kick in for a second or two? I'd just want full power for the entire duration of the job.
For example, I regularly use ffmpeg to encode AVC (H264/AAC) of our family videos. If I use ffmpeg -thread 8 (or -threads 0), I want it to boost all 4 cores to 4.4 GHz the entire time, not run at 3.4 GHz for a second or two and then finally go up to 4.4 GHz. Or what if the ffmpeg encode is I/O bound and is really only using ~75% of the system (e.g. 3 cores fully used, but the threads are bouncing between cores), will it keep all 4 cores at 4.4 GHz so if a thread goes from core0 (which is at 4.4 GHz) to core1 (which is at 3.4 GHz), does it get boosted?
I guess in a nutshell, I'm wondering how I can ensure I get full performance all the time, but still idle at 1.6 GHz (assuming speedstep is supported)? Is this possible?
Sorry for the novel Thanks for any info/advice you all can provide!
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| 1 I see no reason speed step won't work with freebsd if it does not... you just will not see the power savings of lower clock speeds...
2 these new chips are made to overclock with turbo... despite what other idiots will say you DO NOT TOUCH THE BCLOCK... it overclocks EVERY bus on the board... you need to remember some things will not need that full 4.4ghz like it you are using IE... and IE can only use 2.4ghz... you may see your cpu running 2.4ghz... not 1.6 not 4.4 but 2.4, the thing can use many speeds between idle and full load... most boards (if not all) allow you to set the multis for "number of cores used", so say c1 x44 c2 x44 c3 x43 c4 x42... so what that would mean is if you are using all 4 cores you will be running 4.2ghz on all 4, 3 would run 4.3 and 2 - 1 4.4... or you can set 44 44 44 44... most people just go for the max overclock across the board on all 4 cores... you can do what you want...
It sounds sort of like you are making turbo sound like a temporary CPU state... it is not... if you overclock, leave speed step on, and run folding... it will turbo @ 4.4ghz till you shut off folding OR it hits thermal throttle...
3 powerbost? you mean turbo? right away... threads also will not switch cores... I've never seen that... see what i said about setting multis for each core the cpu does not care what core is being used just how many... but if you set it to just OC with out core multis then... it will just run that speed regardless...
pretty much you are over thinking this... it is not like a car turbo, you do not have turbo lag... you start up something and she will go to max speed... shut it down, she will drop to 1.6ghz... |
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pflogBueller? Bueller?Premium,MVM
join:2001-09-01
El Dorado Hills, CA
kudos:3 | Thanks for the response! You're exactly right with the analogy to the car turbo, that's how I was envisioning it Although I suppose even if it DID work that way, the time it would take to adjust would be in a matter of microseconds or maybe milliseconds, nothing noticeable to a mere human like me
So in my case, I can just set the turbo frequency for 1, 2, 3 and 4 cores all to whatever I want to OC to, and unless the thermal throttling happens, it'll stay there? Is there an easy way to determine which frequency I can run at 24/7 without worrying about it throttling down and killing performance? I'll be using a Corsair H60 cooler if that matters.
The reason I mentioned the threads jumping across cores is this DOES happen on FreeBSD's ULE scheduler (at least last time I checked). If I watch top while ffmpeg is running, I see the threads bouncing between cores, and I've even seen a thread go from say core 0 to core 3, where core 0 and 2 share an L2 cache and 1 and 3 share an L2 cache. So it's worse than if it were just going from core 0 to core 2, since at least the cache would remain valid and the context switching isn't as big a hit.
I'll have to check if the 8.2-RELEASE scheduler still does this. If it still does, I *think* ULE in 8.2-RELEASE has the ability to set affinity, so I can probably use a workaround and force the threads to specific cores. Even with ffmpeg -threads 0 (auto-detect # of threads) or with -threads 6, it doesn't peg all 4 cores on this Q9550. It's not disk I/O either, because I can put the input file on a ramdisk and write the output file to the ramdisk and it still shows ~80-85% utilization on all 4 cores instead of closer to 100 on all 4. But again, maybe the ULE scheduler has improved and is aware of the CPU topology now-a-days.
Anyway, thanks again for the response. Sounds like I'll just set things up to run at somewhere between 4.0 and 4.5 GHz, whatever is stable and doesn't cause thermal throttling to happen.
One other question I had was if Hyperthreading being enabled affects the maximum overclock I can expect? AFAIK, FreeBSD doesn't really benefit much from Hyperthreading (at least it didn't previously), but I'll be timing my common tasks with and without it to see which is faster for the tasks I run most.
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| Most boards I have seen (and I aint seen them all) allow overclocking off turbo for each core, the idea is you could get 1 core apps ruining like 5.3ghz with out frying the CPU... but when running 4core apps she would only run say 4.4ghz because of the huge amount of heat.
You can set it either way, I and I think most other people just set a 4core top speed and ignore that 1 2 3 core turbo stuff...
So yes in your case just set your overclock, with speed step on you will see it drop to 1.6 but once you start something that will use the cpu hard... you will see it jump to your overclock and so long as the cpu is being used she will run that speed... the best way to check, Alot of people have been saying prime95 blend for SB cpus (all other cpus it is small ffts) and intel burn test. I would use those to check stability (p95 i would do 24hours at least 12) and IBT (set it to 8 threads not auto) I would do the same...
Run something like core temp... and watch your temps... after about 20min that h60 should hit max temp (air coolers take only 1min to reach max temp).
I never really ran freebsd so in that context... i dont get why it would jump but... as far as overclocking it won't matter... it is not core 1 speed it is 1 core speed... the core does not matter 0 1 2 3, just so long as the total being used is 1.
HT will hurt your OC in that, more heat, and more voltage for the same speed. Some people set up HT on and off overclock profiles... when they need HT they restart, and when they don't need HT they restart again and turn it off...
OC depends on the chip... mine, a 875k does not care with HT on or off... I get less heat... but I need the same vcore... so I just run with it on... other people I see getting much better OC's with HT off...
All HT does it give more logic threads to run on... if freebsd and the program you are using can make full use of 8 threads you should see a performance increase... if either can only use 4, you might want to turn off HT... if you can get a higher overclock... but as said it depends on your chip... HT will always give you more heat, but it should not hurt your OC very much if at all. Just keep in mind you have water cooling... it takes time for the water temp to level out... give it about 20min (imho) from room temp before you say "this is my max temp" the water temp will slowly rise till it levels out. |
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pflogBueller? Bueller?Premium,MVM
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El Dorado Hills, CA
kudos:3 | Hmm ok, thanks. My plan is to run my benchmarking (not "benchmarking" as in synthetic benchmarks, but the actual work loads I do most often) tests with and without HT, both at the stock 3.4 GHz and turboboost set to the default, too. Then see if my workload lends itself to HTT. If it does, I'll probably bump my final OC down a couple of hundred MHz to compensate for the extra heat. If not, I'll use a more aggressive OC and keep HT off in the BIOS
Thanks again for the info/advice in this thread. I appreciate it!
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"Women. Can't live with 'em, pass the beer nuts." -Norm |
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 NanoprobeCrunching in memory of MomPremium
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| said by pflog:Hmm ok, thanks. My plan is to run my benchmarking (not "benchmarking" as in synthetic benchmarks, but the actual work loads I do most often) tests with and without HT, both at the stock 3.4 GHz and turboboost set to the default, too. Then see if my workload lends itself to HTT. If it does, I'll probably bump my final OC down a couple of hundred MHz to compensate for the extra heat. If not, I'll use a more aggressive OC and keep HT off in the BIOS
Thanks again for the info/advice in this thread. I appreciate it!
You'll need a better HSF then the one that comes with a 2600k if you plan to run @ 4.4 GHZ. The stock one is worse than awful.
As for this remark quote:
despite what other idiots will say you DO NOT TOUCH THE BCLOCK.
Pure BS. I doubt this troll even owns a 2600k. I have 3 of them so I speak from experience. Raising the BCLK will overclock the ram and such but anything under 103 will cause no harm. As for ram speeds. The default is 1333Mhz. despite what the ram says. You'll need to go into the bios to set it at 1600MHz or higher if you want. If you do raise the BCLK set your ram at 1333 to start. You can up it later if you'd like. Have fun with your new toy. 
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| wow you really just come here to troll dont you.
You overclocked your sata bus... everyone under the sun says do not touch the bclock... pretty simple, you can not test the sata bus for data corruption... not sure what is hard for you to understand... SB cpus are made to be overclocked via multi NOT bclock. My car aint made to run a turbo... I could stick one on, most people saying 3-4lb of boost is all the bottom end can take... but I can't test it... till the motor goes boom.
their is NO point of running a 3mhz OC on the bclock with the chance of causing data corruption... you will get no speed increase in your ram, maybe what 150mhz on a 4.5 ghz overclock? If you understood how overclocking works everything can take a different amount... I've seen people run 107mhz and claim no issues... and i've seen 105 and pc's not working. you just don't touch it.
Go troll else where, just because I, me, him, her, means nothing for everyone else. Gratz on having 103mhz... other people run 5ghz on air does that mean the op is hitting 5ghz cause xyz did with no problems?
O ya how do you get your car fixed... you claim I do not own a SB cpu... say I do not... your mechanic does not own every car her/she fixes... so I mean... damn they need to own everything they fix!
»www.tomshardware.com/reviews/san···3-9.html
"Unfortunately, PCI Express doesn’t like to operate very far outside of its specification, so any significant deviation beyond the new 100 MHz BCLK causes problems"
the CPU is not made to change the bclock... simple.
If you say everyone can run 103mhz why not post your OC settings so everyone can skip stress testing and just run your settings... after all they work for everyone, on every board, with every CPU...
I could put a turbo on my car, everyone says it can take 3-4 lb of boost... but, how long it will last... if I will blow out the bottom end... just like overclocking the bclock I will not know till it happened. If you want to risk data corruption... go OC the bclock something you can not test...
Just know that OP you do not oc with the bclock... the 15mhz you will get on your ram IMHO is hardly worth overclocking every other bus in the computer (sata, usb, pci-e, etc etc etc)
Some people even say if you want to go over 4.4 you need to LOWER the bclock to help in OCing(i still would not touch it) it will take less vcore and stuff dropping it a few MHZ...
That's all I am saying on that topic... GL with the OCing op! |
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pflogBueller? Bueller?Premium,MVM
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kudos:3 | reply to Nanoprobe
Yes, I have a Corsair H60 I'll be using.
So what's the ideal top-end temperature at full load after the temps have settled down (e.g. on the H60, ~15-20 minutes since it takes longer to heat up)?
I know Tcase is 72.6, so is that the temperature at which it starts throttling the CPU? Or is that the temperature at which the thing will fry like bacon?
I'm just wondering what top-end temperature I should ensure I don't exceed when overclocking this chip.
Since the ambient temperature is less than it will be in say August, I'm also going to factor in another 5-6 C to the top end. So if you guys say to keep it below 65, I'm going to keep it below 60 right now so that in August it'll be less than 65.
Roughly what 24/7 OC (e.g. top speed for ALL four cores) can I expect to get with an ambient temp of 20 C (now) to 26 C (later)?
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| said by pflog:So what's the ideal top-end temperature at full load after the temps have settled down (e.g. on the H60, ~15-20 minutes since it takes longer to heat up)?
I know Tcase is 72.6, so is that the temperature at which it starts throttling the CPU? Or is that the temperature at which the thing will fry like bacon?
I'm just wondering what top-end temperature I should ensure I don't exceed when overclocking this chip.
I rarely go over 60C with my H70 doing Prime95 blend. But it was still winter that time (Feb to early March) when I was still crazy playing with my rig.
With the stock cooler, I've seen it go over 80C and even reached 90C at some point. I'm glad I saw it, I killed the application right away. It didn't make a bacon out of it.
With regular day to day applications, like encoding videos, I doubt it will stress the CPU and RAM like Prime95 in extended periods. I'm sure you'll see peaks and valleys as far as CPU utilization is concerned. Thus, it won't get that hot even with 8 threads. Even if it reaches more than 60C, I doubt it will stay that long.
So yes, you can target a max of 60C to give a little wiggle room just in case you get something like 65C especially during the summer season.
Just make sure you have excellent airflow inside your case, and you should be fine.
Regarding BCLK, I will side at keeping it at 100.
I'd rather err on the side of caution.
Of course you can OC with BCLK, but is it worth it? That's the question. For me, no.
I tried it with 103. Windows seems sluggish. Even the mouse is not that responsive, I can feel it.
I wasn't comfortable, and the OC that it give was minute. I was OC'in with a 46 multiplier, and playing around the BCLK. The difference betwwen 4.6 and 4.738 was insignificant, the system is already screaming fast. Maybe looks good for posting in forums, but for 24x7 setup? I don't think so.
I would not mess up with the frequency that the Sandy Bridge's ring architecture is based on.
I could be wrong.
Try it for yourself. And let us know.
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1 edit | reply to noworries
said by noworries :wow you really just come here to troll dont you.
You overclocked your sata bus... everyone under the sun says do not touch the bclock... pretty simple, you can not test the sata bus for data corruption... not sure what is hard for you to understand... SB cpus are made to be overclocked via multi NOT bclock. My car aint made to run a turbo... I could stick one on, most people saying 3-4lb of boost is all the bottom end can take... but I can't test it... till the motor goes boom.
their is NO point of running a 3mhz OC on the bclock with the chance of causing data corruption... you will get no speed increase in your ram, maybe what 150mhz on a 4.5 ghz overclock? If you understood how overclocking works everything can take a different amount... I've seen people run 107mhz and claim no issues... and i've seen 105 and pc's not working. you just don't touch it.
Go troll else where, just because I, me, him, her, means nothing for everyone else. Gratz on having 103mhz... other people run 5ghz on air does that mean the op is hitting 5ghz cause xyz did with no problems?
O ya how do you get your car fixed... you claim I do not own a SB cpu... say I do not... your mechanic does not own every car her/she fixes... so I mean... damn they need to own everything they fix!
»www.tomshardware.com/reviews/san···3-9.html
"Unfortunately, PCI Express doesn’t like to operate very far outside of its specification, so any significant deviation beyond the new 100 MHz BCLK causes problems"
the CPU is not made to change the bclock... simple.
If you say everyone can run 103mhz why not post your OC settings so everyone can skip stress testing and just run your settings... after all they work for everyone, on every board, with every CPU...
I could put a turbo on my car, everyone says it can take 3-4 lb of boost... but, how long it will last... if I will blow out the bottom end... just like overclocking the bclock I will not know till it happened. If you want to risk data corruption... go OC the bclock something you can not test...
Just know that OP you do not oc with the bclock... the 15mhz you will get on your ram IMHO is hardly worth overclocking every other bus in the computer (sata, usb, pci-e, etc etc etc)
Some people even say if you want to go over 4.4 you need to LOWER the bclock to help in OCing(i still would not touch it) it will take less vcore and stuff dropping it a few MHZ...
That's all I am saying on that topic... GL with the OCing op!
If you don't have your own SB rig to run then offering your advice here is useless to someone who wants to learn. The OP has 2 choices. Listen to an unregistered troll who has no personal experience with SB giving bad advice (you) or someone who has been on this site for 8 years and has personal experience with the SB platform.(Me) Pretty simple.
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NanoprobeCrunching in memory of MomPremium
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| reply to pflog
said by pflog:Yes, I have a Corsair H60 I'll be using.
So what's the ideal top-end temperature at full load after the temps have settled down (e.g. on the H60, ~15-20 minutes since it takes longer to heat up)?
I know Tcase is 72.6, so is that the temperature at which it starts throttling the CPU? Or is that the temperature at which the thing will fry like bacon?
I'm just wondering what top-end temperature I should ensure I don't exceed when overclocking this chip.
Since the ambient temperature is less than it will be in say August, I'm also going to factor in another 5-6 C to the top end. So if you guys say to keep it below 65, I'm going to keep it below 60 right now so that in August it'll be less than 65.
Roughly what 24/7 OC (e.g. top speed for ALL four cores) can I expect to get with an ambient temp of 20 C (now) to 26 C (later)?
Throttling on SB doesn't occur until the chip gets into the 90c range. My 3 chips all run mid to upper 60s on air. They all run 24/7 @ 100% overclocked @ 4.5-4.6Ghz with HT enabled and ambient temps around 75f. If you plan on running with the H-60 your temps should not be an issue. The temps probably won't get near 60c if you plan on staying at or below 4.4GHz. I would also encourage you to use HT. It should boost the performance over non HT by about 40%. Have fun.
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pflogBueller? Bueller?Premium,MVM
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kudos:3 | reply to AlphaOne
GOD DAMNIT!
The H60 does NOT fit on this board. |
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NanoprobeCrunching in memory of MomPremium
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| said by pflog:GOD DAMNIT!
The H60 does NOT fit on this board.
Which board is it?
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pflogBueller? Bueller?Premium,MVM
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kudos:3 | ASUS P8Z68-V PRO
I tried it in all 4 possible rotations. the indentations align with the 2 screws on the back cpu socket mount, but the pins on the X do NOT align with the holes in the motherboard.
This blows.
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pflogBueller? Bueller?Premium,MVM
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kudos:3 | Wait NVM, I just noticed these pins slide up and down. I can adjust it. False alarm. Phew.
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NanoprobeCrunching in memory of MomPremium
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| reply to pflog
said by pflog:ASUS P8Z68-V PRO
I tried it in all 4 possible rotations. the indentations align with the 2 screws on the back cpu socket mount, but the pins on the X do NOT align with the holes in the motherboard.
This blows.
It should work. Did you use the 1156 holes on the mount plate?
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| reply to pflog
I told you not to drink coffee this morning just like you normally do at work .......
Um, you're working, right? You're suppose to, right?
p.s.
Did you tip the UPS guy for coming early?  |
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pflogBueller? Bueller?Premium,MVM
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kudos:3 | PFTT! Work? what work? |
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| reply to Nanoprobe
said by Nanoprobe:If you don't have your own SB rig to run then offering your advice here is useless to someone who wants to learn. The OP has 2 choices. Listen to an unregistered troll who has no personal experience with SB giving bad advice (you) or someone who has been on this site for 8 years and has personal experience with the SB platform.(Me) Pretty simple.
As I said, who fixes your car? Does the dude own the same one?
I have an account here... I choose not to use it...
"Joined: 2001-10-06
(10th year!)"
Thanks. I think I'll go with the anon troll who posts links from reputable sites as backup... vs the old guy who just says "har har I am right I own a SB cpu" I guess I win I am 10 years with BBR.
Op the CPU will throttle @ 100C... the tcase is the max temp intel says you should run... see you have 2 temps... tcase and tjunction... case is the temp at the geometric (or something) middle of the die... tj is the temps on the CORE... intel states the delta between Tc and Tj can be 30C or so... as some parts of the CPU can be hotter than others... (makes sense really). People seem to be happy with 75C TJ... as a max...
Nextly lol at HT performance... first off... I won't waste time linking... you can get LOWER performance on games with HT on... yep LOWER... not on all games, but it can be... you spent the extra cash for HT, in no way am I saying turn it off just saying... do not be like o 40% herp derp... why would I ever turn it off... the BEST you will see might be 40%... but it makes total sense... you take a app that uses 1 thread... and throw it on a HT thread... you will get lower performance because it is not a logic core thread... plain and simple...
I'mma pull a nano and not back it up... but have fun with the OC... and it takes time for your cooler to hit max temp just cause you are using water... you need to give it time to heat up the water... if you do not believe me you can check out everyones fav little canadian on youtube linus... he will spit out the same info... did a nd14 or something vs h70 i think... |
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1 edit | said by noworries :As I said, who fixes your car? Does the dude own the same one? Comparing car repairs to computers? Interesting? No. Lame? Yes. said by noworries :I have an account here... I choose not to use it...
"Joined: 2001-10-06
(10th year!)" Is that so people who know you will see that you don't have a clue when it comes to SB?
said by noworries :Nextly lol at HT performance... first off... I won't waste time linking... you can get LOWER performance on games with HT on... yep LOWER... not on all games, but it can be... you spent the extra cash for HT, in no way am I saying turn it off just saying... do not be like o 40% herp derp... why would I ever turn it off... the BEST you will see might be 40%... but it makes total sense... you take a app that uses 1 thread... and throw it on a HT thread... you will get lower performance because it is not a logic core thread... plain and simple... I was referring to video encoding, not games. Try reading the OPs first post again.
I'm done. The last shot is yours. 
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