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Mele20
Premium Member
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI

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Mele20

Premium Member

Avira Partners with Scareware and Sleazeware Vendors

Avira has partnered with Uniblue and ASK toolbar. We are hoping this terrible thing will be reversed. There are a number of threads in Avira forums about it and, even though we tried to keep it contained in Avira forums until we know if Avira will reverse their partnerships, some security related forums are already advising their members to ditch Avira. Avira has been sending emails to users of their PAID products urging them to install Registry Booster from Uniblue. They have also again started up the Notifier Ads (which had been abandoned for Avira 10 a few months ago) for the free product so they can badger users to install Registry Booster and other UniBlue products. Both the emails and the Notifier ads state that Avira's new partners are Uniblue and ASK.com.

As for ASK toolbar, when Service Pack 2 for Avira 10 is released (very soon now) free users will be able to install the Webguard module free IF they also install ASK toolbar and make ASK.com their default search engine. Until now, Avira has always detected ASK toolbar as malware as they have also detected Uniblue products until now. Enough pressure has been brought on Avira last week that an Avira employee finally posted and stated that if we didn't lke Uniblue products we could uninstall them (forget that the registry cleaner has probably hosed your computer and is extremely difficult to uninstall) and that Uniblue has a 30 day money back guarantee. The Admin who posted this seemed to not have a grasp regarding the enormity of what Avira has done. He did say that Avira was discussing the problems recently reported by users with Uniblue products they installed at Avira's urging and that no decision regarding possibly reversing the partnerships had been made as of his post last Thursday night but the possibility was still on the table.

Here's the main thread:

»forum.avira.com/wbb/inde ··· pageNo=1

dandelion
MVM
join:2003-04-29
Germantown, TN

1 recommendation

dandelion

MVM

Thanks for the information Mele20 See Profile, it looks like Avira is a product bearing close watch for now.

deke40
deke40
Premium Member
join:2003-01-23
Texas

deke40 to Mele20

Premium Member

to Mele20
Would this include Uniblue's ProcessQuickLink2 that I have used for a long time and is never picked up as malware by MalwareBytes?

heels_fan
1.20.09 The start of Socialism
Premium Member
join:2003-02-07
Columbia, TN

1 recommendation

heels_fan to Mele20

Premium Member

to Mele20
This is the same reason why I stop using Lavasoft Ad-Aware years ago.

They started excluding known malware in their scans.
King Grub
join:2011-01-26

King Grub to deke40

Member

to deke40
Uniblue's products aren't malware at all. It's their sales tactics that are debatable, and some of their products might be crap (don't know, haven't used them), but they are not malware.

Smokey Bear
veritas odium parit
Premium Member
join:2008-03-15
Annie's Pub

Smokey Bear to Mele20

Premium Member

to Mele20
said by Mele20:
some security related forums are already advising their members to ditch Avira
Can you name these 'security related forums'?

gugarci
Premium Member
join:2004-02-25
Lyndhurst, NJ

2 edits

1 recommendation

gugarci to Mele20

Premium Member

to Mele20
Thanks for head-up. I use the free version of Avast in a couple of my PC's but has been eagerly awaiting the next version of Avira to try again. I guess not. I will now wait and see how how thing proceed.

hayc59
Your a Daisy
Premium Member
join:2001-02-26

1 recommendation

hayc59 to Mele20

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to Mele20
Mele, thanks and glad you got to
post this AGAIN!!

Lagz
Premium Member
join:2000-09-03
The Rock

1 recommendation

Lagz to heels_fan

Premium Member

to heels_fan
said by heels_fan:

This is the same reason why I stop using Lavasoft Ad-Aware years ago.

They started excluding known malware in their scans.

Same here.

ZZZZZZZ
Premium Member
join:2001-05-27
PARADISE

4 recommendations

ZZZZZZZ to Mele20

Premium Member

to Mele20
Wow......the sky is falling,the sky is falling.

1st of all I haven't seen any ads from Avira in years,because you can block that process easiiy from your firewall~

And who cares what sponsors they get ,it's going to be a optional out anyway..........tons of free software apps are doing it.

Wake up and smell the roses,they're offering their program for free.........they're allowed to do anything they please.

Just cause users are too bloody stupid to not read what they install ............give me a break~
LarkB
join:2006-10-28
united state

1 edit

5 recommendations

LarkB to Mele20

Member

to Mele20
I am an administrator at a computer help forum and while we have not advised our users to ditch Avira nor rescinded our recommendation of their products, we have posted a warning about their partnership with Uniblue and the association with Ask.com. While Uniblue's registry "optimizer" may not be malware, it is scareware and unless the end user knows enough about the registry to ascertain whether a key is unneeded or important, we also advise to avoid registry cleaners for carte blanche cleaning. We have witnessed too many instances of those who have completely hosed their computers, or crippled needed programs/decreased system performance and stability to do otherwise.

Btw, those letters encouraging people to download Uniblue's registry booster are going out to freeware users as well. This means there is an even larger potential pool of users who may find themselves in trouble if they follow Avira's recommendations.

Edited to reply to the poster above: People trust their security software companies. When they find that trust has been misplaced, winning it back may be impossible. For a company such as Avira, that has worked hard for and earned a stellar reputation in the security community, an ill-advised business decision can be a financial disaster.

hayc59
Your a Daisy
Premium Member
join:2001-02-26

1 recommendation

hayc59

Premium Member

said by LarkB:

I am an administrator at a computer help forum and while we have not advised our users to ditch Avira nor rescinded our recommendation of their products, we have posted a warning about their partnership with Uniblue and the association with Ask.com. While Uniblue's registry "optimizer" may not be malware, it is scareware and unless the end user knows enough about the registry to ascertain whether a key is unneeded or important, we also advise to avoid registry cleaners for carte blanche cleaning. We have witnessed too many instances of those who have completely hosed their computers, or crippled needed programs/decreased system performance and stability to do otherwise.

Btw, those letters encouraging people to download Uniblue's registry booster are going out to freeware users as well. This means there is an even larger potential pool of users who may find themselves in trouble if they follow Avira's recommendations.

Edited to reply to the poster above: People trust their security software companies. When they find that trust has been misplaced, winning it back may be impossible. For a company such as Avira, that has worked hard for and earned a stellar reputation in the security community, an ill-advised business decision can be a financial disaster.

Here! Here!
and thank you!!

therube
join:2004-11-11
Randallstown, MD

therube to Mele20

Member

to Mele20
Uniblue & "advertising" (in general) has come up from time to time in the NoScript forums.

There was a time when NoScript used Uniblue as a potential revenue source. They do not now. Don't know the reasons? At the time, NoScript did not take issue with Uniblue being included as an advertiser.

Discussion: Are Giorgio's ads seen as endorsements?
»forums.informaction.com/ ··· 2&t=3472

---

I have not seen how advertising (Uniblue) interacts with Avira, but these days, I look at it like advertising is part & parcel of most all Internet activity. It is pervasive.

Otherwise "free" products, contain toolbars or whatnot that need to be deselected on install. Download sites regularly have (purposely?) confusing links to ad products.

You need to be aware. The unwary are often "taken".

That said, if one is unhappy because of such ads, the answer is simply, don't use the product (or visit the web site, whatever the case may be).

Triple Helix
DNA
Premium Member
join:2007-07-26
Oshawa, ON

3 edits

4 recommendations

Triple Helix to Mele20

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to Mele20
Thanks Mele20 for the info provided! And we at the Calendar of Updates will not be posting updates no longer for Avira until they get rid of the ASK Toolbar in their free version! »www.calendarofupdates.co ··· 253&st=0 and Announcement! »www.calendarofupdates.co ··· id=95954

TH

therube
join:2004-11-11
Randallstown, MD

2 edits

1 recommendation

therube to Mele20

Member

to Mele20
Click for full size
This (now) is their normal (free user) popup on (daily) update?

If that is the case, then (to me) I see no (big) difference compared to their "ad" (if you will) to their pay version.

You get the popup (ad to upgrade to pay version), you click the OK, you go on your way.

You get the popup (ad for Uniblue), you click the OK, you go on your way.

One can say advertising your own product like this, as opposed to advertising a third party product (which some may call questionable) is different.

Be interesting how Softpedia reacts to this once it is brought to their attention. (Would think they change their listing from "free" to "ad supported". They are generally sticklers for such things & will even de-listed products entirely if need be.)

Avira AntiVir Personal - Free Antivirus
»www.softpedia.com/get/An ··· on.shtml

Currently shows as: Freeware & notes the nag screen under limitations.
LarkB
join:2006-10-28
united state

4 recommendations

LarkB

Member

In our forum, we have more than a fair share of new users or those who may not be the most computer savvy. When ads like this appear or the emails arrive, you would be surprised (or maybe you wouldn't) at the people who actually pay attention and think that since a new product is recommended by their security software companies and offers something free that may help their computers, they will download that product without a second thought. There are a few who may actually post and ask first, but the majority come to us after the fact, when problems occur as a result. We tend to forget that there are neophytes coming to the world of home computing every day, or those who have never bothered or had need to educate themselves about things we take for granted.

therube
join:2004-11-11
Randallstown, MD

1 recommendation

therube

Member

quote:
When ads like this appear or the emails arrive, you would be surprised (or maybe you wouldn't) at the people who actually pay attention and think that since a new product is recommended by their security software companies and offers something free that may help their computers, they will download that product without a second thought.
I don't doubt that for a minute.

goalieskates
Premium Member
join:2004-09-12
land of big

2 recommendations

goalieskates to ZZZZZZZ

Premium Member

to ZZZZZZZ
said by ZZZZZZZ:

Wow......the sky is falling,the sky is falling.

1st of all I haven't seen any ads from Avira in years,because you can block that process easiiy from your firewall~

And who cares what sponsors they get ,it's going to be a optional out anyway..........tons of free software apps are doing it.

Wake up and smell the roses,they're offering their program for free.........they're allowed to do anything they please.

Just cause users are too bloody stupid to not read what they install ............give me a break~

It should never be opt-out. It should always be opt-in. And if it were opt-in, it wouldn't cause as much concern.

It's done this way deliberately to hook the unwary, and you calling users "bloody stupid" is uncalled for. In fact, if your argument is "tons of free software apps are doing it" you might want to check in the mirror. "Everybody's doing it" isn't an excuse for a bad business practice.

lordpuffer
Legalize It Joe!
Premium Member
join:2004-09-19
Old Town, ME

2 recommendations

lordpuffer to Mele20

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to Mele20
Thanks for the info Mele20.
Marsman
join:2004-11-10
Kelowna, BC

2 recommendations

Marsman to Mele20

Member

to Mele20
Thx very much for the heads up, Mele20!

sivran
Vive Vivaldi
Premium Member
join:2003-09-15
Irving, TX

2 recommendations

sivran to Mele20

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to Mele20
Hmm. I was already considering going back to Avast because Avira is slowing my system down, particularly when I open the start menu (though not as badly as AVG did, AVG was so bad I ended up disabling real time monitoring).

Now perhaps I have another reason to do so.

Thug21
Just Chillin'
Premium Member
join:2005-08-21

2 recommendations

Thug21 to Mele20

Premium Member

to Mele20
Mele, thanks for posting.

I probably have 6 Avira licenses and recommend it to everyone.

This definitely makes me think twice!

This reminds me of AVG, which I had many licenses for until the toolbar episode...
Kedge
join:2003-12-01
Saint Paul, MN

1 recommendation

Kedge to Mele20

Member

to Mele20
Thanks Mele. We have evals of Avira on several systems. This was the nail in the coffin. Back to NOD.
Zyrtec
join:2011-05-05
Annapolis Junction, MD

1 recommendation

Zyrtec

Member

I am quoting the user Baz Kasp's post at Wilders: (Excellent post, by the way...

"The free business model can't sustain itself indefinitely. Avira is not a charity, nor is it in the business of making security software because they are such good sports...they are a business, and a business needs to make money in order to be able to stay competitive and create new technology. Without money, there will be no Avira....and a quick and easy way for them to make money is to partner up with another software company and offer to bundle their software or advertise their services to them.
With regards to premium users being sent marketing regarding another product, they have obviously signed up to Avira marketing emails.....simple remedy will be to unsubscribe from marketing emails and you shall be bothered no more (in theory).

Simple fact of the matter is the vast majority of their user base won't really care about the toolbar and just be happy that they are getting a good security product for free (subsidized by the toolbar). Frankly, the only people kicking up a fuss are the security geeks/those supposedly in the know who frequent forums such as this one, and those that expect free products to somehow magically pay the wages of the virus analysts and developers that create security software. If you don't agree with Avira making the decision to use the toolbar as a company, you can uninstall the product and look elsewhere. "

sded
Premium Member
join:2002-11-04
San Diego, CA

2 recommendations

sded to Mele20

Premium Member

to Mele20
Mike Nash (Tall Emu CEO, ex OA owner) did a pretty good job of agonizing over the decision of whether to use the Ask toolbar in OA Free in a blog at »onlinearmorpersonalfirew ··· rly.html that is still worth reading. Especially by those who make security software.
LarkB
join:2006-10-28
united state

2 recommendations

LarkB to Zyrtec

Member

to Zyrtec
In the post I made in our forum, it was stated that there was no argument with a company's need for revenue, however when a given company chooses to affiliate themselves with products that are potentially harmful to their customers' computers, it cannot come as a surprise when their integrity is questioned. Security software vendors especially are in positions of trust due to the very nature of their products.

If Avira needs revenue that badly, why not at the very least, ally themselves with companies whose products aren' t potentially harmful or offer their freeware users modules such as Web Guard for a fee?

Offhand, I can think of more than one security vendor that has lost customers, revenue and most importantly, trust over similar business decisions. It is disheartening to see Avira going down that road.

hayc59
Your a Daisy
Premium Member
join:2001-02-26

2 edits

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hayc59 to Mele20

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to Mele20
@sded!! and thank you what a post that was!!
NOW that is integrity!!
quote:
said by Mike Nash
When the numbers look good from a financial perspective, and "everyone else is doing it" - it's easy to fall into complacently thinking that all will be fine. It's not fine for security companies to bundle someone elses toolbar. We lost sight of that for a moment and nearly did everyone a disservice.

Why did we decide not to proceed? Well, the money sure would be nice but at what cost? Bundling this bar would lead to a loss of trust... and that's something you generally only get to lose once.

I'll get the car another day.
LarkB
join:2006-10-28
united state

2 recommendations

LarkB to Mele20

Member

to Mele20
Excellent reference, sded. I hadn't seen your reply while I was (slowly) typing out mine on my cell phone.

This topic is now being discussed at Wilders'. »www.wilderssecurity.com/ ··· t1887172

Triple Helix
DNA
Premium Member
join:2007-07-26
Oshawa, ON

1 recommendation

Triple Helix

Premium Member

It grows like wildfire and it will continue through out the security community!

TH

hayc59
Your a Daisy
Premium Member
join:2001-02-26

3 recommendations

hayc59 to Mele20

Premium Member

to Mele20
@ LarkB thank you!! for this

Another great example of INTEGRITY!!
Would you like Toolbar with your Software Order?
quote:
From Owner of Winpatrol our friend Bill
I’m going to have to pass and keep WinPatrol simple and pure. There will be a new version of WinPatrol later this month and it won’t include any toolbars. Hopefully, users and editors will continue to recommend Scotty the Windows WatchDog because they love and respect WinPatrol. This may not be the best business decision I’ve ever made but I can live with myself.
»billpstudios.blogspot.co ··· our.html